Ed Reed Injured Also?

[rlh445]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1350535705' post='1194015']
I never said they were all on Reed, but he's a contributor! We'll have to agree to disagree on Reed.

I agree though; I think we'll see an improved defense form this point on. The injuries may inspire the players to play better.
[/quote]

Dude, what you're saying is ridiculous and I think you know it. We don't have Ed Reed out there to make tackles, we have him out there to run the defensive backfield and ball hawk. Sorry, I'm not trusting the rest of our seasons chances to Ihedigbo because of an injury that only has an effect on the part of Reed's game that has the least amount of importance.

[K-Dog]

[quote name='BloodRaven' timestamp='1350576374' post='1194230']
It's funny because I don't remember all our best defensive players on the cover of Madden.
[/quote]

Funny.

[black blood purple passion]

Theres probably a shorter list of healthy players at this point.....we finally get our offence "SLIGHTLY" on track and the defence drops off like Mariana's trench.

[The Raven]

[quote name='rlh445' timestamp='1350578571' post='1194248']
Dude, what you're saying is ridiculous and I think you know it. We don't have Ed Reed out there to make tackles, we have him out there to run the defensive backfield and ball hawk. Sorry, I'm not trusting the rest of our seasons chances to Ihedigbo because of an injury that only has an effect on the part of Reed's game that has the[b] least amount of importance.[/b]
[/quote]

So what you're telling me is that tackling is not an important aspect of defense.

Sorry, if you can't tackle, you're playing bad defense. The main objective of defense is to tackle the guy with the ball. If you can't do that reliably, you are a liability in my opinion.

Am I the only one that thinks tackling is of far greater importance than ball hawking ability?

[Ngata Chance]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1350586616' post='1194343']


So what you're telling me is that tackling is not an important aspect of defense.

Sorry, if you can't tackle, you're playing bad defense. The main objective of defense is to tackle the guy with the ball. If you can't do that reliably, you are a liability in my opinion.

Am I the only one that thinks tackling is of far greater importance than ball hawking ability?
[/quote]

Soooooo.... Cary Williams letting the receiver catch the ball then tackling him, or Ed Reed picking the ball out of the air?

Give me the pick any day.

[BenMir]

[quote name='Ngata Chance' timestamp='1350598065' post='1194488']
Soooooo.... Cary Williams letting the receiver catch the ball then tackling him, or Ed Reed picking the ball out of the air?

Give me the pick any day.
[/quote]
Yeah, because that attitude helped us past couple games

[Ngata Chance]

[quote name='BenMir' timestamp='1350603743' post='1194547']

Yeah, because that attitude helped us past couple games
[/quote]

I'm used to better of both, but being a glass is half full kind of guy, the wins are of more importance than number of tackles.

I firmly believe it will work itself out.

[RavensAllTheWay]

Don't underestimate the importance of tackling. It's arguably the most basic fundamental in being a defensive player. Especially since Ed is a safety or so called "last line of defense," he MUST tackle in case the other ten guys let someone behind them make a play. If your last line of defense is having a difficult time tackling, your setting yourself up to fail.

I'm not saying I want Ed off the field because we would miss his leadership and ball hawking skills. His tackling issues, honestly, are overblown in my opinion. Most of his misses seem to be bad technique, like going for a big hit instead of wrapping. I think if he's more discipline and does wrap up, this will be a much smaller issue. However, of course tackling is the most important capability in a defensive player, even more important than ball hawking. Don't question that. How in the hell could it possibly be not that important? Lol.

[Alexir]

Ed Reed over the last 2 seasons has been very underwhelming. Injuries happen but if you aren't going to play with all you got or if you are scared to tackle, get off the field.

I was actually grateful that Ozzie didn't give him an extension. 8 missed tackles?! and the tackles he does make is pushing a guy out of bounds lol. When he does whiff on a play, he will act like he is injured on the ground.

I used to be the biggest Ed Reed fan in the world but his off the field contract complaining/retirement drama and now his on the field play has made me really not like him. Ray is older than him and plays with 110% and never whines about injuries or retirement.

[The Raven]

[quote name='Ngata Chance' timestamp='1350598065' post='1194488']
Soooooo.... Cary Williams letting the receiver catch the ball then tackling him, or Ed Reed picking the ball out of the air?

Give me the pick any day.
[/quote]

That reasoning would only be accepted if there was a legitimate chance of Reed picking the ball on most plays.

Sorry. My defensive mindset is much more focused on fundamentals like tackling instead of sometimes reckless ballhawking. Sue me.

[The Raven]

[quote name='RavensAllTheWay' timestamp='1350611562' post='1194775']
Don't underestimate the importance of tackling. It's arguably the most basic fundamental in being a defensive player. Especially since Ed is a safety or so called "last line of defense," he MUST tackle in case the other ten guys let someone behind them make a play. If your last line of defense is having a difficult time tackling, your setting yourself up to fail.

I'm not saying I want Ed off the field because we would miss his leadership and ball hawking skills. His tackling issues, honestly, are overblown in my opinion. Most of his misses seem to be bad technique, like going for a big hit instead of wrapping. I think if he's more discipline and does wrap up, this will be a much smaller issue. However, of course tackling is the most important capability in a defensive player, even more important than ball hawking. Don't question that. How in the hell could it possibly be not that important? Lol.
[/quote]
[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1350618296' post='1194887']
Ed Reed over the last 2 seasons has been very underwhelming. Injuries happen but if you aren't going to play with all you got or if you are scared to tackle, get off the field.

I was actually grateful that Ozzie didn't give him an extension. 8 missed tackles?! and the tackles he does make is pushing a guy out of bounds lol. When he does whiff on a play, he will act like he is injured on the ground.

I used to be the biggest Ed Reed fan in the world but his off the field contract complaining/retirement drama and now his on the field play has made me really not like him. Ray is older than him and plays with 110% and never whines about injuries or retirement.
[/quote]

Good to know that I'm not[i] completely[/i] insane...

[rlh445]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1350586616' post='1194343']
So what you're telling me is that tackling is not an important aspect of defense.

Sorry, if you can't tackle, you're playing bad defense. The main objective of defense is to tackle the guy with the ball. If you can't do that reliably, you are a liability in my opinion.

Am I the only one that thinks tackling is of far greater importance than ball hawking ability?
[/quote]

Ahh, you forgot to bold the entire sentence there guy. I said the least important part of REED'S game.

[quote name='rlh445' timestamp='1350578571' post='1194248']
....[b]part of Reed's game that has the least amount of importance.[/b]
[/quote]

Never in there did I say tackling wasn't important generally, but speaking specifically about Reed, I think it's pretty safe to say that Reed's tackling (or lack thereof, if you listen to The Raven) isn't why he's considered a future HOFer. If you want to call Ed Reed a liability, be my guest. I'd personally think you haven't actually watched the guy play for any stretch of time, but hey think that all you want. If you think a backup free safety would do a better job than Ed Reed at this point, I've got some nice beach property located in New York City and I think you'd fall in love with it at first blush. Let's start the bidding at one million dollars.

[The Raven]

[quote name='rlh445' timestamp='1350621026' post='1194905']
Ahh, you forgot to bold the entire sentence there guy. I said the least important part of REED'S game.



Never in there did I say tackling wasn't important generally, but speaking specifically about Reed, I think it's pretty safe to say that Reed's tackling (or lack thereof, if you listen to The Raven) isn't why he's considered a future HOFer. If you want to call Ed Reed a liability, be my guest. I'd personally think you haven't actually watched the guy play for any stretch of time, but hey think that all you want. If you think a backup free safety would do a better job than Ed Reed at this point, I've got some nice beach property located in New York City and I think you'd fall in love with it at first blush. Let's start the bidding at one million dollars.
[/quote]

I've watched him play for a long time, and I have no doubt he's a future HOFer. Throughout these years, I've seen his skills diminish. Yes, he is still a threat in coverage. His ballhawk ability is still great! However, his role as a safety, as RavensAllTheWay pointed out, is to be the last line of defense; this is a job which requires you to be a reliable tackler. Would you say Reed is a reliable tackler?

In my opinion, tackling is not Reed's least important responsibility. He's a defender and a safety. A defenders first job is to make tackles. That's the basic job requirement.

It really comes down to our own individual football philosophies so it can't be debated much further. I like safeties who can be relied upon to make simple tackles; you like safeties who may lack in the tackling department but can ballhawk extremely well. It's a matter of our own taste at this point.

[rlh445]

We HAVE a safety who is supposed to be the reliable tackle, and that's our strong safety..and his tackling has been just as bad as of late. So what's your point beyond that? Reed is the guy you want back there when you NEED a big play and Pollard is the guy you want back there when you just have to get a stop and want the ball carrier to get plastered. We have both, and both are playing poorly. I would call neither Reed nor Pollard a 'liability' and sure as heck wouldn't want either benched in favor of their backup counterparts. So the only way our philosophies differ apparently is that you're in favor of benching someone because they're tackling has looked suspect regardless of what else they bring to the table (even if what they bring to the table IS tackling) and mine is to look at the big picture and see that sometimes you take the good with the bad because when it comes to Reed, the good entirely outweighs the bad at this point in time during the season.

[The Raven]

[quote name='rlh445' timestamp='1350762109' post='1195692']
We HAVE a safety who is supposed to be the reliable tackle, and that's our strong safety..and his tackling has been just as bad as of late. So what's your point beyond that? Reed is the guy you want back there when you NEED a big play and Pollard is the guy you want back there when you just have to get a stop and want the ball carrier to get plastered. We have both, and both are playing poorly. I would call neither Reed nor Pollard a 'liability' and sure as heck wouldn't want either benched in favor of their backup counterparts. So the only way our philosophies differ apparently is that you're in favor of benching someone because they're tackling has looked suspect regardless of what else they bring to the table (even if what they bring to the table IS tackling) and mine is to look at the big picture and see that sometimes you take the good with the bad because when it comes to Reed, the good entirely outweighs the bad at this point in time during the season.
[/quote]

You completely misunderstood what I said about philosophy, and it's kind of baffling that you missed it. I prefer safeties that are reliable tacklers. You're okay with an inconsistent tackler as long as he can make plays on the back end.

In my opinion, all 11 defenders should be reliable tacklers. The primary job of a defender is to [u][b]make tackles[/b][/u]. Where did you miss that part? On what planet is that not their primary job?