Cary Williams

[3-4ravdef509]

[quote name='BMORElegacy' timestamp='1349428023' post='1177275']
It's the defensive scheme. They're being told to stay off their men and prevent the big play. I don't know if that has always been Pees philosophy or if it's just because we don't have a pass rush.

If you're not getting to the quarterback and playing press you're just asking to be beat for a bomb deep. I think the defense will play to its potential once Suggs comes back. With Suggs, Ngata, and a guy like Cody all demanding double teams it allows a guy like Kruger or Upshaw a better chance to get a clean shot at the passer.
[/quote]

At the same time, the space that we give the receivers allows most quarterbacks to get the ball out quickly on short slants and hitches, which just wears out our pass rush. I feel like pees doesn't mix it up enough. I know press coverage can be exposed sleep, but just constantly playing back isn't the answer.

[BMORElegacy]

[quote name='3-4ravdef509' timestamp='1349456601' post='1177396']
At the same time, the space that we give the receivers allows most quarterbacks to get the ball out quickly on short slants and hitches, which just wears out our pass rush. I feel like pees doesn't mix it up enough. I know press coverage can be exposed sleep, but just constantly playing back isn't the answer.
[/quote]I agree with you. I'm not saying I condone the new strategy, I'm just saying that's what's going on lol

[3-4ravdef509]

Gotcha.

[PeRK82]

[quote name='Bltravens' timestamp='1349455681' post='1177389']
JSmith certainly hasn't progressed as quickly as hoped but that second statement just can't be right. I don't know if you're basing it off of actual data or what, but just observing games its plainly obvious that Williams is targeted the most by opposing QBs and gives up the most yardage.
[/quote]

Ummm, wouldn't you when you have Webb on the other side. Thts pretty obvious.

[Bltravens]

[quote name='PeRK82' timestamp='1349475979' post='1177557']
Ummm, wouldn't you when you have Webb on the other side. Thts pretty obvious.
[/quote]
Obviously but that doesn't mean you have to allow the majority of the other teams offense, especially when Pees knows they'll come at you so he gives you safety help the majority of the plays. That's just being a mediocre corner.

I wasn't trying to be petty, hence why I asked if you had data. But it's obvious Williams has been struggling in coverage. It's not like he has really good coverage on wide outs most of the time. He's getting beat two steps off the line alot. Prime example is the play Reed got fined on for drilling Branch. Williams is in up on the line but never touches him and lets Branch dance his way into being open, it makes no sense.

[redlobster]

Cary got abused and torched today but has the nerve to run his mouth , especially when he had no outcome on the dropped 2 pt conversion attempt , so happy he didn't sign that deal offered.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/10/14/cary-williams-dez-bryant-needs-to-step-up-and-be-a-man/

[jaege]

Yeah this guy doesn't seem to be cutting it. He not only lets his man catch the ball he is not much of a tackler either. Does he know what position he is playing? Where is the CB coach?

[display name]

Despite all the picks, Cary sucks, and the scary thing is, with Webb out, HE is our #1 corner.
Brace yourselves.

[Yum Chickens]

He may not be the best. But I'm glad we have this guy at this point, our secondary could be a lot worse right now

[D-Rey]

[quote name='Yum Chickens' timestamp='1352071723' post='1210429']
He may not be the best. But I'm glad we have this guy at this point, our secondary could be a lot worse right now
[/quote]It could be a lot better. He made one great play and many bad ones.

[K-Dog]

[quote name='Yum Chickens' timestamp='1352071723' post='1210429']
He may not be the best. But I'm glad we have this guy at this point, our secondary could be a lot worse right now
[/quote]

I cant stand the fact that this is true.

YES he got a crucial pick for us AGAIN, but he allows WAY too many completed passes. I dont think we have any one better though.

[EricH]

Anyone see Smith today? Cary was awesome compared to him!

[RavensAllTheWay]

[quote name='EricH' timestamp='1352072240' post='1210450']
Anyone see Smith today? Cary was awesome compared to him!
[/quote]

Perk, is that you?

[K-Dog]

[quote name='EricH' timestamp='1352072240' post='1210450']
Anyone see Smith today? Cary was awesome compared to him!
[/quote]
disagree.
Cary was targeted for more.
Granted Smith was far for good too. But in my opinion Cary was worse.

[Yum Chickens]

[quote name='D-Rey' timestamp='1352071886' post='1210436']
It could be a lot better. He made one great play and many bad ones.
[/quote]

But alas. I'd still rather have him at this point. As much as it pains me to say it

[D-Rey]

[quote name='Yum Chickens' timestamp='1352072634' post='1210473']
But alas. I'd still rather have him at this point. As much as it pains me to say it
[/quote]True

[beasy2487]

[quote name='D-Rey' timestamp='1352071886' post='1210436']
It could be a lot better. He made one great play and many bad ones.
[/quote]

We could also at least pretend to rush the passer. Pees' blitzes are downright awful. There is absolutely no movement at the line, we just line up and either bunch the line and or Ellerbe sprint from 5 yards back. The Ellerbe up the gut sprint is the new Webb corner blitz... competent coordinators must ROFL when they watch us on tape.

But I digress. Cary and Jimmy would be OK if we had any semblance of a pass rush. Cary would still need to go and Jimmy would still need to make major improvements, but with a pass rush this secondary is fine for a play off team. The problems with this team, maddeningly enough, start and end with the coordinators.

[UMDan]

I'm glad he keeps coming up with picks, but he and Jimmy are just not even close to Webb in terms of execution.

[Militant X 1]

[quote name='3-4ravdef509' timestamp='1349456601' post='1177396']
At the same time, the space that we give the receivers allows most quarterbacks to get the ball out quickly on short slants and hitches, which just wears out our pass rush. I feel like pees doesn't mix it up enough. I know press coverage can be exposed sleep, [u][b]but just constantly playing back isn't the answer.[/b][/u]
[/quote]

you right....it's not the answer! they need to be in the receivers faces jamming them up and throwing them off their routes and messing with the QB's timing.

~Mili

[Ravenseconbeast]

Give props to where its due. Cary is making a good amount of mistakes, but so far his been more than servicable.


Jimmy Smith in the other hand, needs to seriously get better. Well both of them do, but Jimmy more. It is what it is. Both of them are technically in '2nd year' as a starter and they're going to have their up and downs. You just have to pray that they get better as we getting further into playoff mode.

[black blood purple passion]

hey...at least it's not Frank Walker....

[PeRK82]

Please close this Thread, its a Joke.

How bout we talk about CB that really sucks, J.SMITH. He was supposed to be a shut down CB.

Don't want to hear how he is still new either. He is in his 2ND Yr and making mistakes that a LB that was converted to a CB would make. Its not like he hasn't been playing CB his whole college and N.F.L career.

[RavensAllTheWay]

[quote name='PeRK82' timestamp='1352095749' post='1211007']
Please close this Thread, its a Joke.

How bout we talk about CB that really sucks, J.SMITH. He was supposed to be a shut down CB.

Don't want to hear how he is still new either. He is in his 2ND Yr and making mistakes that a LB that was converted to a CB would make. Its not like he hasn't been playing CB his whole college and N.F.L career.
[/quote]

2nd year players are fully developed all the time??? There's no such thing as a learning curve, and experience doesn't matter at al?!?!?! People who make that assumption are just plain wrong.

Webb gave up a lot of big plays his 2nd year, but became better for it his third year. Jimmy has to get the mental game down. He has to turn for the ball quicker, and don't bite so badly on the double moves, etc....

Do you honestly believe that those aspects of the game can't be coached up? Come on Perk, it's clear as day you're holding a grudge, and people are going to keep calling you out for it.

[1/28/01]

I know this is a CW thread, but my Lord JSmith cannot tackle. It pains me seeing him one on one against any defender!

[3-4ravdef509]

I still say give him the rest if this year and into next year, if Jimmy doesn't catch on then its time to look.elsewhere. Cary is becoming more of a ballhawk then a cover corner. So he might get burned some but he is on pace for about 8 or 9 picks do that does redeem his value.

[3-4ravdef509]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1352092934' post='1210983']


you right....it's not the answer! they need to be in the receivers faces jamming them up and throwing them off their routes and messing with the QB's timing.

~Mili
[/quote]

And its confusing, because we have big physical corners who you think would thrive playing press. And we are getting burned playing back, so we might as well get burned for being physical,which we have both said, will also disrupt the timing of plays and help our pass rush. It should also wear the receivers out having that much contact play in and play out.

[jdynamite]

[quote name='PeRK82' timestamp='1352095749' post='1211007']
Please close this Thread, its a Joke.

How bout we talk about CB that really sucks, J.SMITH. He was supposed to be a shut down CB.

Don't want to hear how he is still new either. He is in his 2ND Yr and making mistakes that a LB that was converted to a CB would make. Its not like he hasn't been playing CB his whole college and N.F.L career.
[/quote]

Jimmy has frustrated me too this year, but people are overreacting he is a young player ( and we don't have any QB pressure ).
Plenty of young corners go through their struggles, Patrick Peterson has been targeted some this year and I think he will develop into a stud, a couple years ago Mike Jenkins looked great as a Rookie and has seemingly regressed since, so has McKelvin of the bills. Jimmy is playing at similar level to many corners in their first 3 years. Devin Mccourtney great rookie year but 2nd year wasn't nearly as consistent in coverage.

Basically looking back at CBs drafted in the first round the last 3 years most of them have been inconsistent, with Joe Haden performing the best overall.

[jdynamite]

It should be interesting to see if a couple of interceptions give Cary Williams value again, since he has not played nearly as well as last season coverage wise, some of that could be lack of pass rush on opposing QBs and some just bad play recognition by Cary and Jimmy.

[jazz1988]

[quote name='jdynamite' timestamp='1352128968' post='1211161']
Jimmy has frustrated me too this year, but people are overreacting he is a young player ( and we don't have any QB pressure ).
Plenty of young corners go through their struggles, Patrick Peterson has been targeted some this year and I think he will develop into a stud, a couple years ago Mike Jenkins looked great as a Rookie and has seemingly regressed since, so has McKelvin of the bills. Jimmy is playing at similar level to many corners in their first 3 years. D[b]evin Courty rookie year but 2nd year wasn't nearly as consistent in coverage.[/b]

Basically looking back at CBs drafted in the first round the last 3 years most of them have been inconsistent, with Joe Haden performing the best overall.
[/quote]

And Devin Mccourtney now is playing strong safety not sure if it because he suck at cornerback or not

[jazz1988]

[quote name='PeRK82' timestamp='1352095749' post='1211007']
Please close this Thread, its a Joke.

How bout we talk about CB that really sucks, J.SMITH. He was supposed to be a shut down CB.

Don't want to hear how he is still new either. He is in his 2ND Yr and making mistakes that a LB that was converted to a CB would make. Its not like he hasn't been playing CB his whole college and N.F.L career.
[/quote]

Jimmy Smith is only in his second year i dont think no one should had expected him to be a shut down cornerback in his second year as a raven. Ladarius Webb didn't really step up his game until his third season in the nfl and the same thing can be said about Darrelle Revis. Jimmy Smith look good last year but you have to account for the fact that the pass rush was alot better last year,he had a more aggressive/ different defensive coordinator, and he's honestly getting more responsiblities now that he's step up to be the #2 cornerback .

I think all the mistakes Jimmy Smith is making now is something he can definately grow from and it sucks that he's making these mistakes but i expect him to get better