Cary Williams

[ravensdfan]

[quote name='T3hRaven' timestamp='1348505847' post='1165522']
But Cary wasn't this bad last year. I really think the scheme is hampering him, and wasn't he injured coming into the season? I'm not trying to defend him, his play has been horrendous, but after a decent season last year I thought he looked like an alright number 2 corner. He needs to step it up though, Jimmy continues to improve and we've already seen plenty of flashes from him.

The bottom line is that our corners need to play a lot more press man, that's what we have those bigger corners for.
[/quote]

I agree we definitely need more press coverage. We still may get burned from time to time but we are so much more effective than in zone. Yet, Pees continues to have us in zone with no real pressure on the QB. Cary benefited immensely from our front pressure last season. He still had trouble knowing where the ball was or remembering to turn around and even look for it. I can't believe no one has tried to school him on this at this point.

[gabefergy]

[quote name='T3hRaven' timestamp='1348505847' post='1165522']


But Cary wasn't this bad last year. I really think the scheme is hampering him, and wasn't he injured coming into the season? I'm not trying to defend him, his play has been horrendous, but after a decent season last year I thought he looked like an alright number 2 corner. He needs to step it up though, Jimmy continues to improve and we've already seen plenty of flashes from him.

The bottom line is that our corners need to play a lot more press man, that's what we have those bigger corners for.
[/quote]
He really wasnt very good last year either, but his poor play was masked by a superior pass rush and scheme.

[AsianRice]

Well, we all know Cary was trying his best so he can get much bigger contract (greedy but who wasn't lol); however, he got a fireback and his agent doesn't know crap about football. A change of DC is a huge change which either affects you negatively or positively. In this case, he got exposed terribly and horribly which may push him back to the PS which he was used to be.

He has his opportunity to take a good pay in long term or walk away with some good cash instead he might end up playing for CFL.

His attitude didn't help too; everytime he got beat, he looked all pissed off, blaming for the PI or holding. He needs to man up and accept his ballskills are suck and then try to improve on it.

Right now, he is so dispensable.....

[Blex64]

[quote name='Twistidfunk' timestamp='1348504722' post='1165488']
Not sure what the team can do about Cary. He is still starting so the team obviously thinks he is the best we got.

We know what he is. He is aCB who really depends on the pass rush. He gets burned sure, but not more than other CB's in the league I think. A lot of the plays last night he was right there, just didn't get his head around to make a play on the ball. That is the part of his game that gets me. How has he not tried to improve on this since last season? It is kind of late to expect any improvement from him
[/quote]

That's been the criticism of him, PFF has been calling him out on that since last year. For whatever reason he plays a couple yards off the ball. I have no idea why. He has the anticipation and the athleticism, he just stays off. I really don't get it, its mind boggling.

[quote name='Token' timestamp='1348500356' post='1165357']
PFF put up a article on press coverage this morning, and guess who was in the bottom 5?

Cary has pressed his WR a grand total of 4 times so far this season. I just don't know why.. I'm not sure if it's his decision, or if he's being told to do it, but I think we should try and see how he does with it at least once this season.
[/quote]

To be fair, yeah, we don't know what's being called out there. I have a feeling they're not telling him to press, since we seemed to struggle getting Jimmy into press coverage last year as well. Just misusing personnel...

[Gordo52]

I agree with Arnie, let him pay man. He may get beat deep sometimes but atleast it's not all the time when he plays zone and gives up 10 yards every play. I don't know why we didn't vs the Pats last night. Brady has the best short throw game in the league. Our defense is really missing Suggs and Redding, but if we play a little more man coverage we would probably have more sacks.

I also agree that he was facing Tom Brady who is one of the most accurate QBs of all time. Some of the throws were ridiculous and undefendable. I remember one specifically, it was a back shoulder throw for a huge gain. Cary just simply couldn't defend it. Maybe if he played press he would have a better shot of stop these quick passes. We need to just match him up with recievers that have around the same speed as him and let him play his game. We should always have our safety backing him up though whenever he does play man.

[rlh445]

Why do people keep clamoring for press man? We can't reliably do press every down (especially with Cary) because YES he's big and physical but his coverage skills are average and even when we're playing [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]zone and he's five or seven yards off the ball he's still getting beat and *almost* torched. What do you think would happen if we let him press his man with the pass-rush we have going right now[/font][/color]? That 15 yard strike Brady just threw would turn into an easy TD.

I also can't believe people are saying they're 'okay' with getting beaten like a drum deep 'some of the time'. C'mon guys, let's be real: it wouldn't be 'some of the time', it would be like it was last night with the QB targeting Cary, Cary getting torched for double the yardage or a TD and we'd REALLY be complaining.

[PlayLikeAFan]

Now every team in the league knows to pick on Cary after seeing what Brady did to him, this is not good. Glad he turned down the contract extension.

[DoctorBondurs]

1 Asante Samuel ATL 3 75 4.00%
2 Cary Williams BLT 4 78 5.13%


Thats pretty bad, Cary should be pressing more than 5% of the time. Thats ridiculous.

Tho he gets burnt when he does press, he also gets burnt when he plays 15 yards off, so idk what to think for him.

[gabefergy]

[quote name='DoctorBondurs' timestamp='1348512619' post='1165693']
1 Asante Samuel ATL 3 75 4.00%
2 Cary Williams BLT 4 78 5.13%


Thats pretty bad, Cary should be pressing more than 5% of the time. Thats ridiculous.

Tho he gets burnt when he does press, he also gets burnt when he plays 15 yards off, so idk what to think for him.
[/quote]

Just curious...how often is Jimmy or Webb used in press?

[PurpleCityLights]

We have other Corners Asa Jackson (I think that's his name) C. Brown, they just need to get better so we can cut Mr Carry.

[PurpleCityLights]

Wonder what his excuse will be if he gets burned by Brandon Weedon Thrusday .......

[display name]

Corey Ivy, Frank Walker, Fabian Washington, Domonique Foxworth, Cary Williams.

[display name]

Our defense wouldn't be all that bad if we had someone only a little less than half better than Cary.

[RavensWin09]

its a combination of pees of he and pees for his play. the scheme sucks but the scheme won't help you turn your head around.

[Suggs Package]

Cary Williams is built like a prototypical press corner, and yet [url="https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/09/22/press-coverage/"]he plays off the ball more than any CB in the NFL not named Asante Samue[/url]l. We don't play a ton of zone in the backend so I'm curious about that. Does he get beat in press situations so much that's its too risky to have him press?

He's also in good position a lot of the times, but he doesn't do a good job of redirecting the receivers or making plays on the ball. Part of the reason he gets picked on is because of these things, but another part is that Webb is so good that QBs don't test him anymore. He benefitted a lot from Suggs last year because QBs rarely throw to the same side as the pass rush, but with our lack of pass rush, he's starting to be exposed.

[Blex64]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1348513267' post='1165705']
Just curious...how often is Jimmy or Webb used in press?
[/quote]

You'll have to pay for a subscription to get that, if they even offer it. The article just gives a look at a few different stats regarding press coverage. Snaps, efficiency, etc. for a top and bottom 5 players.

[DoctorBondurs]

Yeah Sorry I dont have a sub. got it off the homepage of pff

[Tiz]

Coverage or lack of trust in what he sees aside
Immalso concerned with how hot headed Cary plays. He easily gets picked on to start fights with and I'm concerned that'll end up with a personal foul even when he make a agreat play

[display name]

[quote name='PurpleCityLights' timestamp='1348518407' post='1165846']
Wonder what his excuse will be if he gets burned by Brandon Weedon Thrusday .......
[/quote]
I think it will be more the board's excuses. Some people here will defend #29 to death no matter how bad he does.

[DoctorBondurs]

should cut him a little slack. any corner will have it tough playing opposite Webb who has been thrown at all of maybe 4 or 5 times this year.

[Gordo52]

[quote name='display name' timestamp='1348519409' post='1165865']
Our defense wouldn't be all that bad if we had someone only a little less than half better than Cary.
[/quote]
Or how about being able to pressure the QB without blitzing?
[quote name='DoctorBondurs' timestamp='1348525721' post='1165980']
should cut him a little slack. any corner will have it tough playing opposite Webb who has been thrown at all of maybe 4 or 5 times this year.
[/quote]
Good point. Also while facing Tom Brady.

[cookiedood]

I watched the same game as everyone else, and I too was furious watching Brady pick Williams apart. After calming down and just thankful for the win, I have come to the conclusion that Dean Pees is the problem. We all saw Cary play last year and he was awesome. In fact he was so good, that our number one draft pick couldn't crack the starting lineup when he returned from injury. The defensive schemes that the Ravens have played this year under Pees are absolutely awful. Maybe he is trying to compensate for the lack of pass rush due to the loss of Suggs, and Johnson, by playing the dbs soft so as not to get beat deep. Whatever the reason, it is clear that Harbs has made a huge mistake with Pees. Remember, Bellichick dumped him for a reason. Where are the stunts and blitzes this year? I'm just sayin.

[K-Dog]

Almost every series in the third quarter and some of the fourth.
The pats play call was run, run, pass to Cary. After I picked up on it, it was five times in a row.
Run, run, pass to Cary first down. Run Run pass to Cary first down.

[The King]

You'd think with all that he gets targeted he would at least turn his head around for one pass. He just doesn't look back to the ball, and considering his size he plays with a huge cushion. That makes it possible for good QBs to pick on him easily, knowing that they'll be able to make the completion and get the first down even if they're not getting much after the catch. Any WR playing against Cary Williams is an instant safety net.

[display name]

[quote name='Ravens<3' timestamp='1348526408' post='1165992']
[b]Or how about being able to pressure the QB without blitzing?[/b]

Good point. Also while facing Tom Brady.
[/quote]
That would help, but anyway you look at it, Cary almost cost us the game.
He also did a not-so great job last year.
I will also point out that their are theories that he was more of a product of the system last year when he did play well.'
I don't know why he can't simply turn around.
Also, the chirping. He gets in everybody's face. At least he should be able to back it up with, umm, decent play.
Jimmy Smith wasn't targeted so much. It was Cary. Cary, you know the good solid guy who provides great depth, the guy who only gave up four scores last year, the guy who some people on these boards will defend to the death no matter how horrid his play...
Yeah we need pass rush, but the excuses have to stop. With how bad Cary was playing, you would have thought Harbs would maybe give Corey Graham a shot.

[HoldingCall]

[quote name='cookiedood' timestamp='1348531560' post='1166090']
I watched the same game as everyone else, and I too was furious watching Brady pick Williams apart. After calming down and just thankful for the win, I have come to the conclusion that Dean Pees is the problem. We all saw Cary play last year and he was awesome. In fact he was so good, that our number one draft pick couldn't crack the starting lineup when he returned from injury. The defensive schemes that the Ravens have played this year under Pees are absolutely awful. Maybe he is trying to compensate for the lack of pass rush due to the loss of Suggs, and Johnson, by playing the dbs soft so as not to get beat deep. Whatever the reason, it is clear that Harbs has made a huge mistake with Pees. Remember, Bellichick dumped him for a reason. Where are the stunts and blitzes this year? I'm just sayin.
[/quote]

Was he dumped by New England? So, where are all of the young NFL minds that should be growing in numbers?

[Dfence4champs2052]

[quote name='jdynamite' timestamp='1348459916' post='1164355']
I didn't really want beat on Cary Williams because on some of the passes there was little to no pressure on the QB, but Cary bites on too many double moves..... It seems like he gave up about 10 first downs alone.
I'm just baffled by his play thus far considering he turned down a contract and is in midst of trying to earn a better offer/deal.

Jimmy smith played much better today, I'm hoping jimmy continues and takes over the starting spot soon.
[/quote]

Agreed with all the above, especially Jimmy starting. Cary refuses to turn his head around when he's in coverage to locate the ball. They'll eventually get rid of him just like Foxworth, Washington, WALKER, and even McAllister when the time came. Just hope it doesn't cost us while we're waiting.

[GrimCoconut]

[quote name='display name' timestamp='1348532720' post='1166115']
That would help, but anyway you look at it, Cary almost cost us the game.
He also did a not-so great job last year.
I will also point out that their are[b] theories that he was more of a product of the system last year when he did play well[/b].'
I don't know why he can't simply turn around.
Also, the chirping. He gets in everybody's face. At least he should be able to back it up with, umm, decent play.
Jimmy Smith wasn't targeted so much. It was Cary. Cary, you know the good solid guy who provides great depth, the guy who only gave up four scores last year, the guy who some people on these boards will defend to the death no matter how horrid his play...
Yeah we need pass rush, but the excuses have to stop. With how bad Cary was playing, you would have thought Harbs would maybe give Corey Graham a shot.
[/quote]
I believe this is true. 100%. I was very worried when Pagano left that we would see a drop off from Cary. It always struck me odd that he went from practice squad to starter the way he did. I'm not saying he is bad, but he just fit the system Pagano had and so he was good there. I think Cary made himself too expensive.

[Dfence4champs2052]

[quote name='PurpleCityLights' timestamp='1348518407' post='1165846']
Wonder what his excuse will be if he gets burned by Brandon Weedon Thrusday .......
[/quote]

Dude if he gets beat by Weeden and the WEAKEST WR Corps in the NFL, it's the nail in the coffin. Their guys drop more passes than anyone practically. He'd better show up or I hope they do something.

[PuRock]

[quote name='Tiz' timestamp='1348525339' post='1165973']
Coverage or lack of trust in what he sees aside
Immalso concerned with how hot headed Cary plays. He easily gets picked on to start fights with and I'm concerned that'll end up with a personal foul even when he make a agreat play
[/quote]

That is what drives me insane. He's one of those players where his head tells him that he's a beast and he talks such a game on the field. It will cost us eventually, its just a matter when.

[quote name='DoctorBondurs' timestamp='1348525721' post='1165980']
should cut him a little slack. any corner will have it tough playing opposite Webb who has been thrown at all of maybe 4 or 5 times this year.
[/quote]

I would cut him some slack if I could see some evidence of decent coverage skills. Yesterday he was always a step behind the receivers, never knew where the ball was, had to initiate contact after 5 yards just to keep up with WR cuts. He is constantly getting burned which is putting an X on his back.