Cary williams declines offer

[-Truth-]

[quote name='Ray Ray Ravens' timestamp='1345785166' post='1128006']
LOL at spelling corrections with your troll face. Maybe Laquan for a 3rd round would have made more sense but you said 1st. So in all one overstatement was way out there when the other was a lot closer to reality. So it makes no sense to think that your 2 overstatements are even close to the same thing.
[/quote]

Oh, yes. I'm sure that my avatar somehow negates the fact that you misspelled a rather simple word while attempting to have an intelligent debate. So you've admitted that both are overstatements. Terrific. Please refer me to the part wherein I argued the disparity between the two, instead of simply placing the same label on both scenarios. You can't? Even better. You see, given that I used the phrase, "For example," and followed it with an example of an overstatement, one that was well in line with the definition, your argument lost any shred of validity it could've possibly had. Had I attempted to correlate the two directly or touched upon the level of severity of these overstatements, this unnecessary bickering of yours would've at least came equipped with a sense of logic. Now I don't know what the reasoning was behind your scornful remark, nor should it be of my concern, as the comment you originally quoted was written with no ill will or bad intention. There's little reason for us to continue entertaining this. But please feel free to continue your senseless ramblings, if you wish.

[The Raven]

[quote name='-Truth-' timestamp='1345799953' post='1128109']
Oh, yes. I'm sure that my avatar somehow negates the fact that you misspelled a rather simple word while attempting to have an intelligent debate. So you've admitted that both are overstatements. Terrific. Please refer me to the part wherein I argued the disparity between the two, instead of simply placing the same label on both scenarios. You can't? Even better. You see, given that I used the phrase, "For example," and followed it with an example of an overstatement, one that was well in line with the definition, your argument lost any shred of validity it could've possibly had. Had I attempted to correlate the two directly or touched upon the level of severity of these overstatements, this unnecessary bickering of yours would've at least came equipped with a sense of logic. Now I don't know what the reasoning was behind your scornful remark, nor should it be of my concern, as the comment you originally quoted was written with no ill will or bad intention. There's little reason for us to continue entertaining this. But please feel free to continue your senseless ramblings, if you wish.
[/quote]

Let me just take a minute to commend you; this was a very well written paragraph. Lol.

[-Truth-]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1345820234' post='1128394']
Let me just take a minute to commend you; this was a very well written paragraph. Lol.
[/quote]

lol Much appreciated, thank you. I try to put in a valiant effort into each argument.

[Ray Ray Ravens]

The argument is bad. You think Cary Williams is a stretch for a 2nd rounder. He was a starter on a unit that was one of the best last year in the pass. I said that Laquan for a 1st is never going to happen with his production thus far. So yes the Laquan statement was a overstatement not the Cary statement. Through out this league we have seen so many jaw droppers when it comes to teams trading away picks that Cary for a 2nd is feasible. Just last year Carson Palmer on the decline was traded for a 1st and a conditional 2nd. Just because your name is the truth doesnt mean everything you type is just that.

[-Truth-]

[quote name='Ray Ray Ravens' timestamp='1345841136' post='1128864']
The argument is bad. You think Cary Williams is a stretch for a 2nd rounder. He was a starter on a unit that was one of the best last year in the pass. I said that Laquan for a 1st is never going to happen with his production thus far. So yes the Laquan statement was a overstatement not the Cary statement. Through out this league we have seen so many jaw droppers when it comes to teams trading away picks that Cary for a 2nd is feasible. Just last year Carson Palmer on the decline was traded for a 1st and a conditional 2nd. Just because your name is the truth doesnt mean everything you type is just that.
[/quote]

First off, the Cary Williams scenario involved a 2nd and a 3rd/4th, which is beyond a stretch. Contrary to your belief, you have no argument. As you've already admitted, both scenarios are overstatements. That was [i]the[/i] only point that was made initially, until yours truly appeared to randomly squabble over the differences between each situation. Is the LaQuan Williams example a significantly bigger overstatement? Of course it is. But once again, the disparity between the two is irrelevant, because my example was given as only that, an example. Are you familiar with the saying, "If all of your friends jumped off of a bridge, would you?" Is the purpose of this saying for one to attempt to relate the severity of this hypothetical circumstance to their own real life situation? No. Because chances are, the real life situation will be far less severe than the example. The purpose, however, is merely to take into account the point behind the example, something you are clearly failing to do.

Carson Palmer's position helped dictate his trade value. A CB's trade value is nowhere near that of a signal caller's. Remember the Kevin Kolb trade? One wherein not only did the Cardinals part with a 2nd rounder, but their former 1st round selection, ex-Pro Bowler, Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie? Can you name a CB in recent memory who was traded for higher than a 3rd? The last swap that I can recall involved Josh Wilson, who after a solid season as a starter, was given away for a mere conditional 5th rounder. Our secondary was ranked very highly, and on good reason. No doubt. But does this automatically make Cary a better player? Let's break down the numbers, shall we? The group of Ed Reed, Bernard Pollard, Lardarius Webb and Jimmy Smith averaged an opposing QB rating of 58.0 when tested in coverage. They also allowed just 5 combined TDs, while accounting for 16 INTs. Cary Williams? Allowed a QB rating of 88.4, giving up 4 TDs alone, while accounting for 0 INTs. In addition, among all CB's with 75% of defensive snaps, Cary's ranked among the worst 10 in opposing QB rating, TDs allowed, yards allowed and yards allowed per completion. It's no surprise that he finished the lowest coverage grade in our secondary according to PFF.com. At best, Cary had an up and down season in 2011. He obviously has a chance to turn things around. But he's now struggled through the pre-season and will be 28 by the end of the season, all of this coupled with the past immaturity issues and recent health concerns. With that being said, are you honestly willing to argue that a 2nd and 3rd/4th for him would be anywhere near feasible? Is it possible? Most certainly. Anything is. But the extreme unlikeliness of it occurring was the reason it was labeled as an overstatement. Which once again furthers my case. It's unfortunate that common sense is no longer as common as its name implies. I'm growing tired of having to continuously dismantle an argument that had no point to begin with. If you would like to resume the battle for the last word, you have the floor. Enjoy your night.

[Ray Ray Ravens]

[quote name='-Truth-' timestamp='1345784442' post='1127991']
Appreciate the sarcasm. Both are examples of overstatements. That was the only point of my post. Cary isn't worth anywhere near a 2nd. LaQuan isn't worth anywhere near a 1st. Thanks for the insightful input though.
[/quote] No where in that statement do you say Cary is worth a 2nd and ?. You said not even worth a 2nd. Which isnt even whats being reported right now or around our own forums. You then bring in Cary isnt worth a 2nd and or 4th which I wasnt even talking about. What you have heard since Wilson has left is this is a passing league now. DBs are more coveted with the pass game on the rise. In turn means that they are worth more and teams are looking for starters. Ray Lewis went as far this year to lose a few pounds so he can cover. I wont go to PFF.com and look up stats for hours to try and disprove you but the Carson Palmer deal was a bust and I can see amongst others that Cary is worth a 2nd in the NFL right now. He had a 2nd round tender to keep him safe before the draft but maybe someone didnt think that a draft pick would be taken before they got him or they just didnt perform. Its all opinions anyway and you seem way to angry.

[-Truth-]

[quote name='Ray Ray Ravens' timestamp='1345855673' post='1129073']
No where in that statement do you say Cary is worth a 2nd and ?. You said not even worth a 2nd. Which isnt even whats being reported right now or around our own forums. You then bring in Cary isnt worth a 2nd and or 4th which I wasnt even talking about. What you have heard since Wilson has left is this is a passing league now. DBs are more coveted with the pass game on the rise. In turn means that they are worth more and teams are looking for starters. Ray Lewis went as far this year to lose a few pounds so he can cover. I wont go to PFF.com and look up stats for hours to try and disprove you but the Carson Palmer deal was a bust and I can see amongst others that Cary is worth a 2nd in the NFL right now. He had a 2nd round tender to keep him safe before the draft but maybe someone didnt think that a draft pick would be taken before they got him or they just didnt perform. Its all opinions anyway and you seem way to angry.
[/quote]

I hate to break my own word, but given that you were mistaken once again, I just wanted to step in to offer some clarification. Here's the original post that I replied to, one that brought about the scenario.

[quote name='indianstick' timestamp='1345770272' post='1127226']
but a [b]second pick and possibly a 3rd or 4th[/b] might be tempting
[/quote]

Instead of simply assuming that I randomly came up with the said scenario, you could've made the effort of looking up a few posts. You know, in order to avoid looking both careless and ignorant? Oh, so did anyone bite on the tender? Dannell Ellerbe was tendered with a 2nd round selection. Is he worth a 2nd as well? Despite the detailed description of his performance last season, and the recent history of traded CBs, he's still worth a 2nd round selection in your eyes. The logic of that comment is astounding. I'm angry? Interesting. Apparently I was the one who blindly decided to insult a neutral post that had absolutely no relation to me whatsoever. Well played. It's been a pleasure.

[Ray Ray Ravens]

Your words exactly are Cary isn't worth anywhere near a 2nd.

[indianstick]

[quote name='-Truth-' timestamp='1345858358' post='1129146']
I hate to break my own word, but given that you were mistaken once again, I just wanted to step in to offer some clarification. Here's the original post that I replied to, one that brought about the scenario.



Instead of simply assuming that I randomly came up with the said scenario, you could've made the effort of looking up a few posts. You know, in order to avoid looking both careless and ignorant? Oh, so did anyone bite on the tender? Dannell Ellerbe was tendered with a 2nd round selection. Is he worth a 2nd as well? Despite the detailed description of his performance last season, and the recent history of traded CBs, he's still worth a 2nd round selection in your eyes. The logic of that comment is astounding. I'm angry? Interesting. Apparently I was the one who blindly decided to insult a neutral post that had absolutely no relation to me whatsoever. Well played. It's been a pleasure.
[/quote]

woah why do u have to pull me back into this whole thing

(haha i'm joking, you don't have to write a well written grammatically correct reply explaining why you quoted my comment)

[arnie_uk]

Was Cary Williams not given a second round rfa tender?

Yes

Did anyone trade for him?

No.

Ok then

[-Truth-]

[quote name='indianstick' timestamp='1345859997' post='1129165']
woah why do u have to pull me back into this whole thing

(haha i'm joking, you don't have to write a well written grammatically correct reply explaining why you quoted my comment)
[/quote]

Sorry. I'm just referencing the post that began it all. I don't mean to keep bringing you into this debate lol But I'll take the last comment as a complement.

[-Truth-]

[quote name='Ray Ray Ravens' timestamp='1345859475' post='1129157']
Your words exactly are Cary isn't worth anywhere near a 2nd.
[/quote]

[quote name='-Truth-' timestamp='1345770453' post='1127237']
I strongly doubt we'd get anything close to a 2nd, nevermind a 3rd or 4th along with it. On that note, I don't see the FO trading him away. I was just a little surprised by the article.
[/quote]

These were my exact words after the mention of a 2nd and 3rd/4th. You would've seen these words for yourself had you bothered to even glance at the original posts. Therein I stated that I found a 2nd just as unlikely as a 2nd and 3rd/4th, which is precisely why I referred to a 2nd rounder from then on and not the original amount.