Anyone think our secondary is overrated?

[Cville-Raven]

[quote name='dhstandard' timestamp='1345307858' post='1123170']
I didn't see anything alarming at all. Most of those yards given up were because Cary thought he had help and it was Sean Considine, not Ed Reed on the coverage. Before that it was great. All the yards after that drive the starters weren't even in.

Wait till the season opener when the starters play 4 quarters and tell me how our secondary is.

Would you say our secondary is bad when the Colts blew us up on their final drive after not breaking 100 yards because the starters were benched? I didn't think so.
[/quote]
Exactly Considine is a complete scrub. We better develop Thompson fast.

[kassaiscool]

[quote name='dhstandard' timestamp='1345307858' post='1123170']
I didn't see anything alarming at all. Most of those yards given up were because Cary thought he had help and it was Sean Considine, not Ed Reed on the coverage. Before that it was great. All the yards after that drive the starters weren't even in.

Wait till the season opener when the starters play 4 quarters and tell me how our secondary is.

Would you say our secondary is bad when the Colts blew us up on their final drive after not breaking 100 yards because the starters were benched? I didn't think so.
[/quote]

Our defense was Great in the beginning of the game because our offense was on the field so much. We did stop them early on some plays. But I'm not buying the theory that just because Ed Reed is on the field every big play that the other team makes will go away when he plays. If that's the case where was Ed when the SD Wide outs was burning us last year and some other games. Ed Reed is a beast, but he can't help Jimmy and Cary at the same time. I think Jimmy will probably get better as his career moves along, but Cary was a 7th round draft pick for a reason.

[Cville-Raven]

[quote name='kassaiscool' timestamp='1345309907' post='1123195']
Our defense was Great in the beginning of the game because our offense was on the field so much. We did stop them early on some plays. But I'm not buying the theory that just because Ed Reed is on the field every big play that the other team makes will go away when he plays. If that's the case where was Ed when the SD Wide outs was burning us last year and some other games. Ed Reed is a beast, but he can't help Jimmy and Cary at the same time. I think Jimmy will probably get better as his career moves along, but Cary was a 7th round draft pick for a reason.
[/quote]
Yeah and we don't face those type of Wideouts very much this season.

[kassaiscool]

[quote name='Cville-Raven' timestamp='1345310031' post='1123196']
Yeah and we don't face those type of Wideouts very much this season.
[/quote]

A.J Green, Desean Jackson, Maclin from the eagles, gronkowski and hernandez, Dwyane Bowe, Dez Bryant, Miles Austin. That's just some through the first six weeks. I didn't even name them all.

[gabefergy]

[quote name='Cville-Raven' timestamp='1345309737' post='1123193']
Exactly Considine is a complete scrub. We better develop Thompson fast.
[/quote]
Omar Brown!!

[Cville-Raven]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1345311724' post='1123219']
Omar Brown!!
[/quote]
haha yeah

[display name]

I do have to admit we did just face Calvin Johnson.

[Cville-Raven]

[quote name='kassaiscool' timestamp='1345310368' post='1123200']
A.J Green, Desean Jackson, Maclin from the eagles, gronkowski and hernandez, Dwyane Bowe, Dez Bryant, Miles Austin. That's just some through the first six weeks. I didn't even name them all.
[/quote]
Yes but none of them are big tall and fast. Sure Bowe is big but he's slow and we shut him down with scrub corners in the playoffs two years ago. I would say Dez Bryant is the only one that fits those requirements. We also play Hakeem Nicks and Victor cruz, but they aren't very big either.

[kassaiscool]

We will see..

[atlravensfan]

I think the pass rush covered up for our lack of depth behind Webb. Over rated is a stretch. They are right where they need to be.

I too hate the arguement that "just because is X Wr that is an excuse to play poorly". If you look at our schedule we have a lot of good deep Wr Cores with pro bowl Qbs.

Dont worry Kass all the people who are calling you opinion stupid also said we should keep Cundiff on other threads after someone started a thread saying that giving him the deal wasn't smart :-)

[arnie_uk]

It was a horrible play call,or else horrible play by the safety. Cary was playing tight on cj at the Los with no help over the top on probably the most physically gifted guy in the league? Silly

[kassaiscool]

[quote name='atlravensfan' timestamp='1345321572' post='1123363']
I think the pass rush covered up for our lack of depth behind Webb. Over rated is a stretch. They are right where they need to be.

I too hate the arguement that "just because is X Wr that is an excuse to play poorly". If you look at our schedule we have a lot of good deep Wr Cores with pro bowl Qbs.

Dont worry Kass all the people who are calling you opinion stupid also said we should keep Cundiff on other threads after someone started a thread saying that giving him the deal wasn't smart :-)
[/quote]

thx at least I know some ppl are open to others opinions.

[hawkprey]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1345322927' post='1123375']
It was a horrible play call,or else horrible play by the safety. Cary was playing tight on cj at the Los with no help over the top on probably the most physically gifted guy in the league? Silly
[/quote]
Yes it was horrible safety play. You never leave CJ on an island with anyone and that's exactly what our safeties did. Stafford recognized it immediately, Johnson recognized it immediately, and that's why he blew right by Cary (who doesn't know what route he'll have to defend). On top of that, since Stafford knows where he can go with the ball the entire play, he has time to deliver a nice pass. If it wasn't so obvious that Cary was left alone that play probably wouldn't have happened.

It's like two years ago versus Carolina. Some no-name backup is playing QB and Josh Wilson gets beat for a 90+ yard TD in single coverage on a nice pass. It happens when you take a chance leaving a guy alone like that.

As far as I'm concerned, Webb (against non-elite receivers) is the only CB on our team who can be left alone like that.

[ravefan52]

Pass rush gets going then so will the secondary. The opposing QB's have time to pass and look comfortable because we can't get to him. Also if we can't get some pressure we have to send extra guys in which take away from guys in coverage. I'm worried about our pass rush a bit, but if we get it going then so will everything else on the defense.

[PeRK82]

I want to see our Front, get their Hands up when they see the QB throwing. A lot of times they end up tipping it and we usually get an int.

I m sure they practice it in practice but i want to see more of it from the new guys in game, Ngata does it all the time

[The Raven]

[quote name='kassaiscool' timestamp='1345324096' post='1123383']
thx at least I know some ppl are open to others opinions.
[/quote]

We're open to opinions, but that doesn't mean we'll make them our own beliefs. I think your overreacting a wee bit. In both games, it was only ONE wide receiver that gave us problems in each game. Calvin Johnson, and Julio Jones. Against Cary Williams and Jimmy Smith. Two of the best wide receivers in the game against two CB's who are not among the best in the game. Shaking my head! Calvin is arguably the BEST WR in the league. Jimmy and Cary are slightly above average!

Will our secondary be as good as some fans make it out to be? NO! But it will be much better than what you make it out to be.

[atlravensfan]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1345389083' post='1123711']
We're open to opinions, but that doesn't mean we'll make them our own beliefs. I think your overreacting a wee bit. In both games, it was only ONE wide receiver that gave us problems in each game. Calvin Johnson, and Julio Jones. Against Cary Williams and Jimmy Smith. Two of the best wide receivers in the game against two CB's who are not among the best in the game. Shaking my head! Calvin is arguably the BEST WR in the league. Jimmy and Cary are slightly above average!

Will our secondary be as good as some fans make it out to be? NO! But it will be much better than what you make it out to be.
[/quote]

I will agree over rated is a stretch. But the excuse that X Wr is good so it is cool if Jimmy and Cary suck that game is an under reaction. Have you looked at our schedule. We have like 8 out of the 15 best Wr in the NFL and 14 Pro Bowl Qbs on our schedule.

[The Raven]

[quote name='atlravensfan' timestamp='1345390776' post='1123722']
I will agree over rated is a stretch. But the excuse that X Wr is good so it is cool if Jimmy and Cary suck that game is an under reaction. Have you looked at our schedule. We have like 8 out of the 15 best Wr in the NFL and 14 Pro Bowl Qbs on our schedule.
[/quote]

I'm not saying that it would be [u]cool[/u] if they sucked; I'm saying that it would be quite [u]understandable[/u] if a wide receiver of Calvin's caliber gives Cary or Jimmy fits.

[jdynamite]

[quote name='D-Rey' timestamp='1345306067' post='1123148']
What has made Jimmy Smith seem cocky. Nothing I've seen at all. Cary Williams had tight coverage most of the night, just needs to get his head around. All of our CBs are physical.
[/quote]

Cocky as in he has a certain arrogance based around his own belief in himself, commonly called swag now. But I'm referring to some snaps last season it was more of rookie cb going through simple groaning pains.. His arrogance last season stemmed from his college success at man to man coverage he believed even as a rookie he could cover any wideout man to man tight coverage part of that is why the double moves worked him... being cocky, arrogant, or having swag isn't a bad thing a player has too believe himself.

About Cary I wasn't really talking about the preseason game. I was talking about the regular season last year, but even in the preseason game after he gave up a pass over top in when he was in position to make a play on the next few passes he gave up 8 yards of space and Jones then got a bubble screen.. I'm not being nit-picky just examples of what a mean.. Happens all time to every CB in the league at some point..

[D-Rey]

[quote name='jdynamite' timestamp='1345409422' post='1123886']
Cocky as in he has a certain arrogance based around his own belief in himself, commonly called swag now. But I'm referring to some snaps last season it was more of rookie cb going through simple groaning pains.. His arrogance last season stemmed from his college success at man to man coverage he believed even as a rookie he could cover any wideout man to man tight coverage part of that is why the double moves worked him... being cocky, arrogant, or having swag isn't a bad thing a player has too believe himself.
[/quote]Ya, I disagree that he was cocky and arrogant with his play. And those aren't good traits lol. Those and confidence are way different things. And swag doesn't actually mean what people think it does lol.

[jimmypowder]

The secondary has looked bad because we have a Suggsless pass rush !

[justifythegame]

[quote name='kassaiscool' timestamp='1344955624' post='1118793']
I think our db's are a overrated by the media, fans, and players this year. I still think they will be very good, but I do not trust Cary Williams to stop getting beat deep.If hes not getting beat deep he gives Wr's like 8 yards of cushion on the line of scrimmage so he can get beat underneath. Webb will be solid as usual, Ed is getting older, Pollard is known for hitting not coverage, and Jimmy smith isn't proven. I like Danny Gorrer in the slot but I don't think our pass rush will be nearly as good as last year, which will cost our cb's even moRe.

Thoughts?
[/quote]

How well your secondary plays depends on how well you pressure the QB. We didn't give QBs time to look down the field and forced some bad throws last year and our secondary capatalized on it. They are the same more or less as they have always been the last few years. The difference is we don't have Pagano anymore, we have a guy who was so bad he got fired from being DC of the patriots who don't typically expect a lot from their DCs. Its not the secondary thats the issue imo.

[wayne]

[quote name='justifythegame' timestamp='1345416348' post='1123984']
How well your secondary plays depends on how well you pressure the QB. We didn't give QBs time to look down the field and forced some bad throws last year and our secondary capatalized on it. They are the same more or less as they have always been the last few years. The difference is we don't have Pagano anymore, [b]we have a guy who was so bad he got fired from being DC of the patriots [/b]who don't typically expect a lot from their DCs. Its not the secondary thats the issue imo.
[/quote]

Damn, another guy that has canned Pees after 2 [b]PRESEASON[/b] games, great.

[Purple Nurple]

[quote name='wayne' timestamp='1345425179' post='1124138']


Damn, another guy that has canned Pees after 2 [b]PRESEASON[/b] games, great.
[/quote]

I know. It makes zero sense. Give the guy 4-5 regular season games before forming an opinion on him.

[The Raven]

[quote name='justifythegame' timestamp='1345416348' post='1123984']
How well your secondary plays depends on how well you pressure the QB. We didn't give QBs time to look down the field and forced some bad throws last year and our secondary capatalized on it. They are the same more or less as they have always been the last few years. The difference is we don't have Pagano anymore, we have a guy who was so bad he got fired from being DC of the patriots who don't typically expect a lot from their DCs. Its not the secondary thats the issue imo.
[/quote]

If he could turn some of those 2000 New England defenses into Top 10 defenses, he must be good.....

And he wasn't even fired... According to wikipedia (which I admit isn't always reliable) he left them.

[ThePurpleWall]

[quote name='Purple Nurple' timestamp='1345425305' post='1124139']
I know. It makes zero sense. Give the guy 4-5 regular season games before forming an opinion on him.
[/quote]

there is no point in having a discussion with the people that are like that.

[ravens rule]

Jimmy has to stop making the same mistakse and play with better technique cuz we drafted him to cover the Aj Greens of the world right.

[PolishRifle]

Asa Jackson looked pretty good in the second pre-season game, just sayin'.

[D-Rey]

If Jimmy Smith can get better at tracking the ball, he'll be great. Fortunately that is a coachable thing and easily fixed through practice.

[Runnin Raven]

Harbs talked about the lack of a gameplan and no "rolling over coverage" on guys like Jones/Megatron. Our guys got exposed by great wideouts in 1 and 1 matchups - not too unusual. That said I expect much better things from Jimmy.