Anyone think our secondary is overrated?

[kassaiscool]

I think our db's are a overrated by the media, fans, and players this year. I still think they will be very good, but I do not trust Cary Williams to stop getting beat deep.If hes not getting beat deep he gives Wr's like 8 yards of cushion on the line of scrimmage so he can get beat underneath. Webb will be solid as usual, Ed is getting older, Pollard is known for hitting not coverage, and Jimmy smith isn't proven. I like Danny Gorrer in the slot but I don't think our pass rush will be nearly as good as last year, which will cost our cb's even moRe.

Thoughts?

[baltravens]

We looked pretty suspect against the Falcons, and where was Cary? Granted, it was the first preaseason game.

[edreedfromtheu]

[quote name='kassaiscool' timestamp='1344955624' post='1118793']
I think our db's are a overrated by the media, fans, and players this year. I still think they will be very good, but I do not trust Cary Williams to stop getting beat deep.If hes not getting beat deep he gives Wr's like 8 yards of cushion on the line of scrimmage so he can get beat underneath. Webb will be solid as usual, Ed is getting older, Pollard is known for hitting not coverage, and Jimmy smith isn't proven. I like Danny Gorrer in the slot but I don't think our pass rush will be nearly as good as last year, which will cost our cb's even moRe.

Thoughts?
[/quote]

I think the lack of pass rush the past few years(even when Suggs was out there) has been vastly underrated. And so far this season, it seems to have put more attention on the secondary. Of course, once teams/defenses are finally allowed to start really sending pressure, hopefully that changes.

But I think the QB is much more overrated at this point, than the secondary. If the defense is still getting torched in the 3rd preseason game like they did in the first drive of this last game... then I'll worry. Why? Because they've actually proven to me they can play. The offense... not so much, which is why they should be taking every opportunity they have to prove themselves.

[Free Agent]

[quote name='baltravens' timestamp='1344955910' post='1118796']
We looked pretty suspect against the Falcons, [b]and where was Cary?[/b] Granted, it was the first preaseason game.
[/quote]

He was the guy getting torched by Julio Jones.

[BirdWatcher]

Not yet. Ask me on August 24th.

[Purple Nurple]

[quote name='Moderator 3' timestamp='1344956330' post='1118801']
Not yet. Ask me on August 24th.
[/quote]

Agreed 100%

Where are we getting our sample from? One preseason game??? Silly.

[hawkprey]

Ed's getting older? That's your reasoning? Wow. He's still the best safety in the game.
Pollard isn't known for coverage - what strong safety is?
Jimmy Smith isn't proven? Except having a great rookie year and projecting to start over Cary Williams?

And how does a limited pass rush mean we have a worse secondary? The front 7 and secondary are two different groups. What are you trying to say? Suggs isn't there, so now Webb and Cary aren't as good of players?

Okay, so the secondary didn't look great against Atlanta. And Rodgers has a 0.0 passer rating so far. What's your point?

[display name]

Cary Williams is overrated. Otherwise, my answer is no.

[kassaiscool]

[quote name='Purple Nurple' timestamp='1344956756' post='1118802']
Agreed 100%

Where are we getting our sample from? One preseason game??? Silly.
[/quote]
[quote name='Purple Nurple' timestamp='1344956756' post='1118802']
Agreed 100%

Where are we getting our sample from? One preseason game??? Silly.
[/quote]

No, actually last year Jimmy smith and Cary Williams got burnt one too many times for my liking. Jerome Simpson from the bengals took Cary to the woodshed, and if I remember correctly Jimmy Smith got beat in that game as well. They were many other games were they were getting picked on. SD game comes to mind, I just don't trust them and don't understand why suddenly everyone claims our Db group to be the best. We are also playing the NFC east this year... not the NFC west where we played kolb from AZ, Jackson from SEA, Bradford from stl, and Alex smith.

[AsianRice]

[quote name='kassaiscool' timestamp='1344957451' post='1118811']
No, actually [b]last year [/b]Jimmy smith and Cary Williams got burnt one too many times for my liking. Jerome Simpson from the bengals took Cary to the woodshed, and if I remember correctly Jimmy Smith got beat in that game as well. They were many other games were they were getting picked on. SD game comes to mind, I just don't trust them and don't understand why suddenly everyone claims our Db group to be the best. We are also playing the NFC east this year... not the NFC west where we played kolb from AZ, Jackson from SEA, Bradford from stl, and Alex smith.
[/quote]
Well, there is your answer; that's last year we're talking about.....the year before last year Webb got burned in playoff against the Steelers which wasn't concluding him the worse CB all the time.....

All 4 preseason games will tell who are our starters; however, lack of pass rush will kill any group of elite CBs.

[kassaiscool]

[quote name='hawkprey' timestamp='1344957152' post='1118807']
Ed's getting older? That's your reasoning? Wow. He's still the best safety in the game.
Pollard isn't known for coverage - what strong safety is?
Jimmy Smith isn't proven? Except having a great rookie year and projecting to start over Cary Williams?

And how does a limited pass rush mean we have a worse secondary? The front 7 and secondary are two different groups. What are you trying to say? Suggs isn't there, so now Webb and Cary aren't as good of players?

Okay, so the secondary didn't look great against Atlanta. And Rodgers has a 0.0 passer rating so far. What's your point?
[/quote]
[quote name='hawkprey' timestamp='1344957152' post='1118807']
Ed's getting older? That's your reasoning? Wow. He's still the best safety in the game.
Pollard isn't known for coverage - what strong safety is?
Jimmy Smith isn't proven? Except having a great rookie year and projecting to start over Cary Williams?

And how does a limited pass rush mean we have a worse secondary? The front 7 and secondary are two different groups. What are you trying to say? Suggs isn't there, so now Webb and Cary aren't as good of players?

Okay, so the secondary didn't look great against Atlanta. And Rodgers has a 0.0 passer rating so far. What's your point?
[/quote]

With Ed's injuries every year and his age being 34 when the season starts, It would be hopeful wishing to think your gonna get a vintage Ed Reed. Yes, I know Pollard is SS, but that's my point he won't be good in coverage. Jimmy smith have a "great rookie year" are you sure about that? He made some nice plays, but got beat deep on plenty of enough plays. Now I'm confused, so our pass rush has no correlation to our secondary? They actually go hand in hand. A good pass rush covers deficiency on the back end. Just watch the Giants win super bowls with an ok secondary.

[Purple Nurple]

[quote name='kassaiscool' timestamp='1344957451' post='1118811']
No, actually last year Jimmy smith and Cary Williams got burnt one too many times for my liking. Jerome Simpson from the bengals took Cary to the woodshed, and if I remember correctly Jimmy Smith got beat in that game as well. They were many other games were they were getting picked on. SD game comes to mind, I just don't trust them and don't understand why suddenly everyone claims our Db group to be the best. We are also playing the NFC east this year... not the NFC west where we played kolb from AZ, Jackson from SEA, Bradford from stl, and Alex smith.
[/quote]

Well theres your issue. Using last year as your proof. Again......silly. Now, they may turn out to be over-rated still, but using last season as a debate tool for this seasons production is just....well....silly.

[kassaiscool]

I don't think its silly, its called a track record. Good teams attack our secondary a lot and succeed.Even if it was our first preseason game falcons shouldn't go deep that much. We were lucky to play a bunch of bad passing teams last season, but as soon as we played someone decent we would get torched or get passed on enough to effect the game. Go look at the stats last year when we played a good offense its really telling. I still like our secondary just being realistic with all the hype.

[gabefergy]

[quote name='display name' timestamp='1344957289' post='1118808']
Cary Williams is overrated. Otherwise, my answer is no.
[/quote]
This. Jimmy should be starting though. Cary is fine as the nickel.,

[YYZ66]

Too early to panic. Let's wait 'til the regular season and see how things go.

[Ravensfan23]

you guys do know that the ATL game was Cary's first game action since his surgery right? I don't care how minor a Surgery is, players still have to get comfortable playing with that body part again.

The Ravens basically just went through the motions on defense. Did they want to give up so many yards? Of course not, but it wasn't a cause for concern imo.

Jones beat Webb for a huge gain, does that make Webby overracted too? No, If the Ravens had game planed for that offense things would have been vastly different.

[ravensfan2430]

I think it will be the strength of our defense. The only way I see them not living up to my expectations this year is if the d-line gets no rush.

[codizzle]

U know if u can remember every time ur secondary got burnt in a season they must have been doing something right

[1/28/01]

[quote name='Purple Nurple' timestamp='1344956756' post='1118802']


Agreed 100%

Where are we getting our sample from? One preseason game??? Silly.
[/quote]
This....10 times over!

[jus'_crAzy]

I'll pit our secondary against any other DB corps in the league. What other secondary would you rather have?

[kassaiscool]

I am hoping for the best but lets see this year with all those offensive teams we will be playing.

[flynismo]

[quote name='kassaiscool' timestamp='1344959116' post='1118829']
Good teams attack our secondary a lot and succeed.
[/quote]

wow....now, that is a silly thing to say.

[url="http://www.nfl.com/stats/team?seasonId=2011&seasonType=REG&Submit=Go"]http://www.nfl.com/s...e=REG&Submit=Go[/url]


As far as "good teams" go, we stuffed PIT twice, shut HOU down twice, made Brady our **** in the playoffs.
The ONLY good offense that torched us was SD.

[Ed_Reed20]

I'm not going to call the entire unit "overrated" based on a little more than a quarter.

[codizzle]

Hooray random threads which are supported by no facts starting already an it's only August 14th...

[Ngata92NT]

Hold on, you mean to tell me that there were occasions last year where RECEIVERS GOT PAST OUR CORNERS AND CAUGHT PASSES? My god, this has to be corrected immediately!

Seriously, you think our secondary is overrated? I'd say we have the second best secondary in the NFL (besides Seattle). Webb didn't allow a TD pass all season and was an INT machine. Cary was extremely solid last year and had a ton of pass deflection. Smith, for all his talent, is still a rookie who missed the first six games. Reed and Pollard were exceptional and provide an extremely potent tandem at Safety. Gorrer has shown some talent and Corey Graham adds even more depth. The only weakness seems to be our reserves at Safety. All in all we have an elite secondary.

Really, the only poor performance from our secondary last year came against San Diego, where there was no pass rush at all and no help from the offense or the team as a whole. That game was simply atrocious from all standpoints. What about the dominant performance in the playoffs against the Texans and Patriots? The great games in the regular season were too numerous to mention.

Overrated? More like a huge overreaction after a preseason game. Cary and Smith aren't elite corners, though Smith has the potential to become one. Maybe some people overrate our secondary, but we're still top 5 in the league unquestionably, with only Seattle and San Francisco challenging us.

Julio Jones is a freak athlete and an incredible receiver. Cary Williams is coming off surgery. Its a preseason game. Cary had good coverage but didn't play the ball. Its PRESEASON. Ryan was willing to make throws that maybe he would think twice about during the regular season. We didn't do any gameplanning, didn't disguise our coverages, and didn't get much pressure. At least wait until the regular season starts to make these judgments.

I hope Calvin doesn't go off on us on Friday or there will be posts calling for Cary's head on a platter. ITS PRESEASON.

[kassaiscool]

If you guys want stats, look at the majority of the teams we played last year. Most of them were bottom half of offensive stats last year. Besides the steelers being 12th and the texans being 13th look at the rest of them. I didn't say we have a bad secondary just a little hyped by everyone. Look at the bottom of the rankings and look how many teams the ravens played last year, and look at the top 10 and see if the ravens played any team from there.

[url="http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&offensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&conference=ALL&role=TM&season=2011&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=TOTAL_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=2&d-447263-n=1"]http://www.nfl.com/s...=2&d-447263-n=1[/url]

[kassaiscool]

One thing I will say is our offense will be much better this year. The ravens are gonna put up points. Which will help our defense, but this is just my opinion. We all will see this year. lets gO raveNs!!

[Gordo52]

Underrated.

[BirdWatcher]

We had a darn good secondary last year with a group of guys who hadn't really played much together. Now that they know each other's strengths and weaknesses, you expect them to be worse?

[kassaiscool]

People don't listen to me for some reason lols. I don't think they are going to be worse I think they had a schedule with teams that weren't good offensively. Compare that schedule of teams in 2011 to this season of 2012 with a lesser pass rush for the ravens, and you will really see how good this secondary is.