O-line: Is this the worst group we've ever had?

[Gordo52]

LT- Oher
LG- Williams
C- Birk
RG- Osemele
RT- Yanda
or
LT- Oher
LG- Williams
C- Birk
RG- Yanda
RT- Reid (Ozzie traded up for him, maybe he finally pans out? Sure hope so..) or K.O. of course.

Thats the set-ups I would prefer if Big Mac can't come back.
...Plus Oher would have to go to left again, ugghhhhhh!!!!

Boy this offensive line concerns me. BIG time.

[arnie_uk]

Oher
KO
Birk
Williams
Yanda

[Ravensfan23]

[quote name='redrum52' timestamp='1343452536' post='1104648']
I'd say even with the rookies starting it would probably be an all around improvement. The worst line we have recently had has to have been 10 when Gaither went down and we had people out of position. We got no kind push and I'm anticipating us maybe forcing some young guys into starting roles. For the most part, as bad as the offense might have been we have had a pretty damn good line throughout the franchise.



I think you need to pass the physical to practice and I'm not sure if he has.
[/quote]

But even if you don't pass the phyical, you are still with the team, just not practing. That's why i said he should have showed up, because if he's not healthy then he won't practice. But atleast the team knows exactly what's going with you, and you are not losing 30K a day.

[PurpleReign92]

Osemele looks like he is ready to go and train in the off-season.

[Bullrush]

Harewood has gotten the reps at RT so far with the #1 offense. I think he could be a really good RT, but we need to see him in the preseason first.

[Ravensfan23]

[quote name='Bullrush' timestamp='1343477067' post='1105450']
Harewood has gotten the reps at RT so far with the #1 offense. I think he could be a really good RT, but we need to see him in the preseason first.
[/quote]

I thought Harewood was still injured? I read that KO and Jack Cornell has split the 1st team reps.

[Bullrush]

Harewood is healthy, well he was.
He was inserted with the starters, rolled his ankle and got replaced by KO. I'm sure it's nothing major and he'll be out there for the next session, but the guy really needs to stay healthy at some point.

[Corvus]

The only big question mark I see is McKinnie, which means we'll likely be doing the Oher flip flop again which means there will be points this season where he struggles some which means you guys will get on here calling for his head again all because the guy's 4 seasons in the NFL will look like: RT-LT-RT-LT. How can a guy be consistent when he is being moved constantly like that? I don't wanna hear it and frankly I'm glad we have someone like Mike who WE CAN COUNT ON. Its too bad McKinnie is still the same guy after our FO showed some faith in him so if you want someone to point the finger at, look no further.

Also, starting a rookie o-lineman isn't the end of the world as some of you think. They have to get that first start at some point, we're not the only team who will be in position to start rookies on their line.

[redrum52]

Might sound stupid but I hope McKinnie and Williams go down for a while allowing us to out Reid at RT and KO at guard. I'm sick of drafting o line men who never really get to play. I've been saying, trial by fire to see at leas the potential think season guys have.

[baltravens]

[quote name='Ravenseconbeast' timestamp='1343409507' post='1104163']
This is what we have as our starting line-up as we speak:

[b]Oher(LT?)- Bobbie(another old x'ed out player) - Birk(old)- Yanda - RT(some random undrafted rookie)[/b]


McKinnie's overweight and old. (Even with losing weight he is terrible)

Jah Reid is injured, Osemele is injured (both 2nd time being injured).

Gino (as suspected) is in no man's land eating up the roster spot.



How can we possibly keep ourself on field with this group? As bad as last year's O-line was, we got much much worse from last year.

That talk about 'trying' no-huddle offense is completely out of the door. Considering how fast this offense is going to be taken out of field. So now we are back to doing the same offense scheme we are used to seeing: Killing time, run-run-throw-kick.


This is definately NOT what I was expected to see when Ozzie promised to upgrade our O-line (#1 priority)
[/quote]
The best that I can come up with bud is that the OL is a work in progress. What happens if KO gets healthy, Gino as a rookie develops quickly, and McKinnie gets his act together? What happens is that you will change your tune. You are wrong about the OL because it is by no means the worst we ever had. I am not mentioning the contributions Williams, Reid, or even Boren could possibly make.

[Yoonkeem]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1343467022' post='1104958']
Oher
KO
Birk
Williams
Yanda
[/quote]

moving yanda to RT is a good idea.

[CapoRocky]

I really don't know what will happen in the next few weeks, but I'm still not giving up on the offensive line. Yanda needs to stay at guard. I'm much rather have Williams in there than KO at this point. Oher can play LT. Birk is an injury away from retirement, so having Gradkowski ready is a great backup plan. I think the position battle will be between Osemele and Reid for RT if McKinnie can't make it. Personally, I hope that McKinnie will be back because he needs the money and the line needs chemistry.

[The Raven]

[quote name='PurpleReign92' timestamp='1343476344' post='1105443']
Osemele looks like he is ready to go and train in the off-season.
[/quote]

What? The pre season just started dude...

[quote name='redrum52' timestamp='1343493353' post='1105544']
[b]Might sound stupid[/b] but I hope McKinnie and Williams go down for a while allowing us to out Reid at RT and KO at guard. I'm sick of drafting o line men who never really get to play. I've been saying, trial by fire to see at leas the potential think season guys have.
[/quote]

Yeah, it did. That is the strategy of a rebuilding team, not of the team competing for the freakin Superbowl.

[quote name='Yoonkeem' timestamp='1343495240' post='1105556']
moving yanda to RT is a good idea.
[/quote]

No it's not. Yes, Yanda can be a fantastic RT and is definitely the best RT on the team. (Yes, better than Oher) But, he is an all pro and a pro bowler at guard. Moving an all pro guard to RT is a last resort. It's not time for a last resort. I want to try Reid and KO at RT before we even think about Yanda at RT. If Reid and KO prove to be completely incompetent to play the position, I wouldn't be against it, but starting Yanda at RT is a [u][i][b]last resort[/b][/i][/u]. I think the coaching staff would agree. It's too early in camp for desperate attempts to assemble a half way decent line.

If Reid and KO can't do it, the line proposed by Arnie would be a decent idea. However, I want Oher at LT, KO at LG, Birk at C, Yanda at RG, and Reid at RT. It's a young line with a ton of potential.

[T3hRaven]

I'm not confident in the group we have right now, but if it's going to be a problem Ozzie will find a way to take care of it. Late pre-season OL moves are something he's done before and had success with.

[PeRK82]

[quote name='ROH522155' timestamp='1343409642' post='1104165']
[b]I think it's going to be better than expected[/b]. Turn the clock back to training camp 2008 and you'd find threads identical to this one and things worked out pretty good then.
[/quote]

I agree but i still think we are in bad shape compared to other teams. How do you expect Joe to have a good yr when he won't have time to throw. Hope im wrong but it doesn't look good imo.

I still think we had a bad draft, we could have drafted an O LINEMAN or More Defensive players but no, we had to draft another RB when we have 2 Drafted RBs from last season that didn't get any play.


Still think A.Allen is the real deal and the next man up but i don't think the RAVENS see it

[RavensAllTheWay]

The guards seem to be the only stability we have on this line. While I doubt Bobbie Williams plays like Grubbs, I do expect him to be serviceable and temporarily fill the hole while KO/Reid/Boren are groomed. My concern with Birk is that because of the overall physical beating his body has taken over the years, he's always out of gas by the time the playoffs come around. I like that Gino was on the Pats/Steelers radar on draft weekend and that he'll be learning from a mutli time pro bowler and overall good guy, but my concern is that he's undersized. We'll see how that plays out.

The tackles worry me the most. Oher switching back and forth again, and now back to his weaker side of the two? It's really no wonder his overall development has been stifled since his rookie season. As for the right side, at this point, barring any moves by Ozzie, I wouldn't really object to Yanda playing on the outside and sliding KO/Reid/Boren/Cord inside. I don't think KO has the athleticism to play out in space at the pro level. He's more of a mauler.

I think I would have:

Oher-Williams-Birk-Yanda-Reid


My second option would probably be:

Oher-Osemele-Birk-Williams-Yanda


Hopefully, a darkhorse like Ramon Harewood finally stays healthy and proves something at LT. He's got frame at 6'6/340 lbs, but the 6th rounder hasn't taken a meaningful snap yet.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='RavensAllTheWay' timestamp='1343506683' post='1105721']
Hopefully, a darkhorse like Ramon Harewood finally stays healthy and proves something at LT. He's got frame at 6'6/340 lbs, but the 6th rounder hasn't taken a meaningful snap yet.
[/quote]

At this point, it would take a miracle for Harewood to stay healthy [i]and[/i] look competent at LT.

[RavensAllTheWay]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1343513586' post='1105788']
At this point, it would take a miracle for Harewood to stay healthy [i]and[/i] look competent at LT.
[/quote]

Agreed. Can't help but think the same. Although I'm not a fan of moving Oher back to the left, that's for sure.

We should at least try out McNeil, McKenzie and/or Clifton.

[redrum52]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1343497839' post='1105591']


What? The pre season just started dude...



Yeah, it did. That is the strategy of a rebuilding team, not of the team competing for the freakin Superbowl.



No it's not. Yes, Yanda can be a fantastic RT and is definitely the best RT on the team. (Yes, better than Oher) But, he is an all pro and a pro bowler at guard. Moving an all pro guard to RT is a last resort. It's not time for a last resort. I want to try Reid and KO at RT before we even think about Yanda at RT. If Reid and KO prove to be completely incompetent to play the position, I wouldn't be against it, but starting Yanda at RT is a [u][i][b]last resort[/b][/i][/u]. I think the coaching staff would agree. It's too early in camp for desperate attempts to assemble a half way decent line.

If Reid and KO can't do it, the line proposed by Arnie would be a decent idea. However, I want Oher at LT, KO at LG, Birk at C, Yanda at RG, and Reid at RT. It's a young line with a ton of potential.
[/quote]


In 07 before the injuries the team was coming off a 13-3 season and started two rookies in Grubbs and Yanda, were we rebuilding then? Didn't the Patriots just start a rookie last year? I'm guessing we had plans to start KO and Reid so why not just give them the reps now? Watch the play-off games again and see why our line might need some youth. As knowledgeable as someone might be that will not always make up for strength ala Vince versus Birk.

[The Raven]

[quote name='redrum52' timestamp='1343528059' post='1105887']
In 07 before the injuries the team was coming off a 13-3 season and started two rookies in Grubbs and Yanda, were we rebuilding then? Didn't the Patriots just start a rookie last year? I'm guessing we had plans to start KO and Reid so why not just give them the reps now? Watch the play-off games again and see why our line might need some youth. As knowledgeable as someone might be that will not always make up for strength ala Vince versus Birk.
[/quote]

In 2007 we were indeed rebuilding. We lost a few players to injury and release that year. We lost Mulitalo, who was replaced by Grubbs. We were definitely in a rebuilding stage.

Yes, youth is needed desperately. But to paraphrase what you said, we should just throw the rookies into a game to see what their capable of, which just isn't smart at all.

[Free Agent]

I'm not understanding the collective desire to move Yanda to RT. While he already would be the best RT on the team, he is an absolute stud at RG. This offensive line has been killed by the lack of continuity at nearly every position on the line (see Michael Oher). So for the sake of continuity, and just because Yanda is a monster at RG, keep him there. I'd be fine with Osemele or Reid at RT, if Oher ends up at LT because McKinnie sucks/is cut/is too fat.

[Ravensfan23]

[quote name='Free Agent' timestamp='1343699047' post='1107097']
I'm not understanding the collective desire to move Yanda to RT. While he already would be the best RT on the team, he is an absolute stud at RG. This offensive line has been killed by the lack of continuity at nearly every position on the line (see Michael Oher). So for the sake of continuity, and just because Yanda is a monster at RG, keep him there. I'd be fine with Osemele or Reid at RT, if Oher ends up at LT because McKinnie sucks/is cut/is too fat.
[/quote]

KO did a really good job at RT today in practice. The guy is big strong and quick. The Ravens worked on a lot of short yardage situations today in practice and KO-Yanda-Gino-Williams-Oher did a really strong job against the 1st team defense. Yea Ellerbe and McBean/.Hall took the place of Ray and Ngata, but those guys still did a really good job of creating space in short yardage situations.

KO and Yanda are nasty together on that right side. The both come off the ball with such force and usualy don't stop until their guy is on the ground. KO also did a good job of handling the speed of Kruger and Kindle off the edge. You hear Harbs say the guy could come right in and start, and today I saw why.

I think McKinnie will get healthy and be our LT, pushes Oher back to RT. However if McKinnie can't make it back, I think we're in good hands with Oher and KO at the bookends.

[The Raven]

[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1343699673' post='1107105']
KO did a really good job at RT today in practice. The guy is big strong and quick. The Ravens worked on a lot of short yardage situations today in practice and KO-Yanda-Gino-Williams-Oher did a really strong job against the 1st team defense. Yea Ellerbe and McBean/.Hall took the place of Ray and Ngata, but those guys still did a really good job of creating space in short yardage situations.

KO and Yanda are nasty together on that right side. The both come off the ball with such force and usualy don't stop until their guy is on the ground. KO also did a good job of handling the speed of Kruger and Kindle off the edge. You hear Harbs say the guy could come right in and start, and today I saw why.

I think McKinnie will get healthy and be our LT, pushes Oher back to RT. However if McKinnie can't make it back, I think we're in good hands with Oher and KO at the bookends.
[/quote]

How do you think Gino did? Did he do well against Cody?

[wayne]

[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1343699673' post='1107105']
KO did a really good job at RT today in practice. The guy is big strong and quick. The Ravens worked on a lot of short yardage situations today in practice and KO-Yanda-Gino-Williams-Oher did a really strong job against the 1st team defense. Yea Ellerbe and McBean/.Hall took the place of Ray and Ngata, but those guys still did a really good job of creating space in short yardage situations.

KO and Yanda are nasty together on that right side. The both come off the ball with such force and usualy don't stop until their guy is on the ground. [b]KO also did a good job of handling the speed of [u]Kruger[/u] and [u]Kindle[/u] off the edge. [/b]You hear Harbs say the guy could come right in and start, and today I saw why.

I think McKinnie will get healthy and be our LT, pushes Oher back to RT. However if McKinnie can't make it back, I think we're in good hands with Oher and KO at the bookends.
[/quote]

Now, if the underlined names would have been Suggs/Kruger....Suggs/Upshaw then I would be sold,lol.

[ravefan52]

I really wouldnt mind Marcus McNeill out there competing for both tackle spots

[ravefan52]

[quote name='Free Agent' timestamp='1343699047' post='1107097']
I'm not understanding the collective desire to move Yanda to RT. While he already would be the best RT on the team, he is an absolute stud at RG. This offensive line has been killed by the lack of continuity at nearly every position on the line (see Michael Oher). So for the sake of continuity, and just because Yanda is a monster at RG, keep him there. I'd be fine with Osemele or Reid at RT, if Oher ends up at LT because McKinnie sucks/is cut/is too fat.
[/quote]
This next draft we need to get one or two lineman in the early rounds that will secure us for the future. The changing of the line every year is hurting us and some familiarity would help a lot. Preferably we draft a tackle so we can put Oher on one side and keep him there. Hopefully KO works out at left guard. I think Gino will do fine at center and Yanda is a lock at RG(and we should keep him there). This year however, i think it will be mckinnie, williams, birk, yanda, and oher. Hopefully mckinnie will hold up

[ravefan52]

[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1343699673' post='1107105']
KO did a really good job at RT today in practice. The guy is big strong and quick. The Ravens worked on a lot of short yardage situations today in practice and KO-Yanda-Gino-Williams-Oher did a really strong job against the 1st team defense. Yea Ellerbe and McBean/.Hall took the place of Ray and Ngata, but those guys still did a really good job of creating space in short yardage situations.

KO and Yanda are nasty together on that right side. The both come off the ball with such force and usualy don't stop until their guy is on the ground. KO also did a good job of handling the speed of Kruger and Kindle off the edge. You hear Harbs say the guy could come right in and start, and today I saw why.

I think McKinnie will get healthy and be our LT, pushes Oher back to RT. However if McKinnie can't make it back, I think we're in good hands with Oher and KO at the bookends.
[/quote]
How is KO looking at LG?

[Jabara]

It's our coaches job to make sure this isn't the worst line ever and I trust them.

[wayne]

[quote name='ravefan52' timestamp='1343714510' post='1107178']
[b]This next draft we need to get one or two lineman in the early rounds that will secure us for the future. The changing of the line every year is hurting us and some familiarity would help a lot. [/b]Preferably we draft a tackle so we can put Oher on one side and keep him there. Hopefully KO works out at left guard. I think Gino will do fine at center and Yanda is a lock at RG(and we should keep him there). This year however, i think it will be mckinnie, williams, birk, yanda, and oher. Hopefully mckinnie will hold up
[/quote]

Will make no difference when the time comes to sign that player to a contract and we let them walk ( Brown, Grubbs ). If we retained the lineman we did draft in the early rounds, we would be in great shape but we let offensive lineman walk that last name isn't Ogden.

[Ravenslifer]

This line is, to me, a mix of too old and a bit too young. Yanda is the only vet that has shown consistency and is not over 30. Bobby Williams and Matt Birk are stopgaps and we know it - we drafted guys in KO, Gradkowski, etc. that should take their spots eventually if things pan out. The issue is the future at tackle - I thought Oher would be the right tackle, but now they're moving him back to left and IDK what he'll do there. Maybe he and Reid will surprise us, or McKinnie. In any case, the bottom line is right now the linemen of the future are all young, and most have very little to no experience. To call them the best or worst of anything is subjective IMO. We'll probably have growing pains, but if KO and Gino pan out we'll be looking good in a year or two. You can't rush building any part of your team, the NFL just doesn't work that way.