Trade Ray Rice?

[3-4ravdef509]

Ray Rice is good. Will he still be good next year? Two years from now? After that? Not worth risking that much money to find out.

[Dfence4champs2052]

[quote name='usmccharles' timestamp='1337840363' post='1081719']
honestly its not that bad of an idea, but you run into some problems:

- Rbs are not as important as they used to be, getting something that we think is fair prolly wouldnt happen.
- who would you trade him for? to throw the idea out you should at least have some names to throw out there, even if its just for fun
- RR was responsible for 35% i think of our offense (saw something on espn today actually) and has led the league since 09 in total yards from scrimage. you cant just replace that, so to plug in benson for this year, we would see a huge drop off in production for the offense unless we got an elite wr and thats not happening.
-say we trade for someone, then that guy just flat out fails...ie a lee evans situation. what would you be saying then?


Im a RR supported and think he should get his money, 4/40mill would be fine by me. Alot of people make the arguement hes not that great of a "runner" yet he was second in the nfl in yards. I think why hes so great is because hes a dual threat, even if hes not the best runner, he makes up for that in the passing game, id much rather have a dual threat thats great at both then just a pure runner. Regauardless, this topic will get beat to death...again. I want to keep RR, i think his next two years will be his biggest, with us expanding the passing game just opens our offense up even more, especially for him. It will be a huge mistake if we get rid of him...Book It.
[/quote]

I agree with this. I can also see from the other perspective if we can't sign him then trade him. But then again like you said how can we get back 35 plus percent of our offense? No one is going to give us a first rounder (he was only a 2nd rounder to begin with) because he's a RB and has a bit of mileage. So many snags I can't really see this happening. Plus we'd end up sending him to a crappy team because most of the good teams have no cap space except ugh Cincy.

[CapoRocky]

I really don't think we should even think about trading Ray Rice unless it's for a guy like Mike Wallace who could make a difference in the vanilla offense of Slam Cameron. Even the Squeel-billies aren't that dumb to trade him. If we could get a high first rounder before the draft next year, then I'd listen to offers if Allen and Pierce show anything in the meanwhile. Let's get real here, we couldn't sign Grubbs for an extra $5M to get him to stay, so how will we be able to afford Flacco and Rice?

[Ravenseconbeast]

Have you seen what our game is like w/o a run game? Obviously you must've loved the +50 passing game in jaguars to justify your thought on getting rid of rice.

I don't know what kind of game you have been watching last season. But our passing game is a joke. Rice is a top 5 back uncontended. You get rid of rice for '1st round and some' and you would be replacing the best RB Ravens have ever had.

It's a good thing this is a internet forum and none of your opinion has any weight as how our organization is run.

[Suggs Package]

Its funny seeing all of these people thinking we can get players like Jake Long! Seriously, Jake Long! No owner in their right mind would trade their bookend LT for a running back. LTs are far more valuable than RBs, and Long is one of the top 5 in the league. But if you were to throw out a LT who we could possibly trade Ray Rice for, think Doug Free, not Jake Long.

The only time you trade someone like a Ray Rice is that he's disgruntled to the point that he's not going to play for your team. You're almost certain not to get equal value back.

Also, some people already mentioned this, but no one's gonna trade a 1st round pick for a RB who wants big money. If Rice was still on his rookie contract, I could see it, but no team wants to pay a lot and give up a 1st rounder unless they're Oakland, or they're trading for a QB. Best case scenario is that we get a 2nd or two 3rds, or somewhere along that value. I'm basing this on recent trades by players with similar salaries to the one Rice wants.

We should only trade Rice is we seriously have no other choice. Otherwise, we're losing a lot of production that we can't make up.

[BloodRaven]

Ray Rice is a dynamic and durable 3rd down back we've successfully disguised as an elite every down back. The trio of Grubbs, Yanda and Leach was arguably the best in the league.. [i]was[/i].

[The Raven]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1337921326' post='1082202']
No. Who are you talking to because I don't see anyone saying he should be paid that kind of money.
[/quote]

Just saying it in general; twas directed at all the fools clamoring to "pay the man!"

[raybaby]

[quote name='Ravenseconbeast' timestamp='1337956835' post='1082282']
Have you seen what our game is like w/o a run game? Obviously you must've loved the +50 passing game in jaguars to justify your thought on getting rid of rice.

I don't know what kind of game you have been watching last season. But our passing game is a joke. Rice is a top 5 back uncontended. You get rid of rice for '1st round and some' and you would be replacing the best RB Ravens have ever had.

It's a good thing this is a internet forum and none of your opinion has any weight as how our organization is run.
[/quote]

Love Ray Rice. Don't want us to trade him but lets stop making it that Ray Rice needs to get his carries for us to win. This past season has made that seem like a reality because our offense was young & inconsistent. Would you be saying this after the 2010 season? No. The Ravens have won many games with Rice getting under 20 carries and games with him getting under 10 in the three seasons he was a starter. The 2010 he only had two games where he got 100 yards or more and we still won 12 games.

Does our offense run smoother when its balanced? Yes that is how our offensive scheme works. It doesn't matter who is carrying the rock. It goes alllll the way back to San Diego when Cam was the OC there. Granted they had LT but they ran a lot while the quarterbacks got conservative attempts. They also checked down a lot with LT being 1st or 2nd in receptions except for 1 season. Cam loves uses backs like him. What makes Rice special is the mismatches he brings because of who he is as a receiver and that should be appreciated but this Ray Rice needs over 20 carries for us to win perception is not a fact.

[TheRavenouseD2008]

fairweather fans same people on other team boards running backs will always be important Rice is a special type because he can be shifted into reciever slots he has great hands catching and has that nifty 3rd wheel . Rice deserves to be paid he is actualy only looking at about 5-6 for this year alone guarenteed which is less then his 7.7 tag even if he has a 10 mill which includes performance bonuses in playoff games which is one of the rumors thats about 6 mill off cap and the rest is bonuses that only a portion of that maybe 750k gets counted we come in under cap and under tag price . you people need to stop wanting to trade people because you dont see they are trying to help the team this year by asking for LESS not more .

[gabefergy]

[quote name='TheRavenouseD2008' timestamp='1337968280' post='1082396']
fairweather fans same people on other team boards running backs will always be important Rice is a special type because he can be shifted into reciever slots he has great hands catching and has that nifty 3rd wheel . Rice deserves to be paid he is actualy only looking at about 5-6 for this year alone guarenteed which is less then his 7.7 tag even if he has a 10 mill which includes performance bonuses in playoff games which is one of the rumors thats about 6 mill off cap and the rest is bonuses that only a portion of that maybe 750k gets counted we come in under cap and under tag price . you people need to stop wanting to trade people because you dont see they are trying to help the team this year by asking for LESS not more .
[/quote]
You are just making up numbers here. You have no clue what Rice is asking for and you have no clue how the salary cap works. Most repuatable sources indicate Rice is looking to get around 30M guaranteed while the Ravens probably want to pay around 20M. That is a big difference.

[wayne]

I actually think its a mixture of both as far as what you are paying a player for. Of course you are paying a player for what he has done and the players that has done a lot will most likely get a lot and the ones that has done very little won't be offered that much. Now, of course you have to factor in age, health, etc..... but to say a player is strictly getting paid for what he can do for the team is only half the story b/c he's also getting paid for their past performance.

[cursona pirate]

[quote name='Grapple Raven' timestamp='1337890986' post='1082036']
[i]Don't get me wrong, I appreciate what Ray Rice has done for the Ravens, but the bottom line in contract negoiations is you aren't paying a player for what he has done, you pay a player based on his future potential worth to the team.[/i]

[i]Agents are a necessary evil I guess. The public relations game was in place and Rice played it well during the season, saying and doing the right things in public, and he still is. The Stacey Keibler promo is a classic example. Rice and his PR people are shrewd, make no mistake about it! They have done a great job keeping him in the public's eye even in the off-season with a positive spin. [i]This past season, in his contract year, Rice got ALOT of attention right or wrongfully so and I think that has somewhat inflated his feeling of self-worth as a player, and his value to the team, you could see it in his attitude on the field...the SF game comes to mind first. That attitude may be the underlying pervasive factor currently at play with the negoiations, and it is a shame is has to come down to that because I really feel that isn't the real Ray Rice. Leaks concerning contract negoiations whether true and valid or not, never serve a positive end. This is a matter best done in private. Money doesn't always bring out the best side in people unfortunately. The best we can hope for is fairness on both sides and no colateral damage to team morale. [/i][/i]
[i][i](Just my two cents on a different perspective.)[/i][/i]
[/quote]
Yes this people!!!
Agents do all the talking which sometimes can make the player look bad. Rice always says on twitter how much he loves to be a Raven and stuff like that. I think the agent is more to blame than Rice here.

[ghost1986]

All this goes over my head, but I really hope we don't trade him. I'm with cursona. I think the agents have more to do with all this than the players, but I'm just an average joe who doesn't know much about this business. I just wish we could get it done so he could get back to work. I think he should smallow his pride, get some reat and come back to worky work so we can work on bringing the Lombardi back to Baltimore.

[BMOREHAWAII]

[color=#0000ff][i]According to CBS Sports' Jason La Canfora, the Ravens are in communication with unsigned franchise player Ray Rice.[/i][/color]

[color=#0000ff][i]ESPN's Sal Paolantonio reported Wednesday that the sides have not had contact, but La Canfora is more optimistic. "I think that one gets sorted out, I really do," La Canfora said. "They're talking, there's some constructive dialogue going on." Per La Canfora, "it's pretty clear" Rice will receive something between $20M and $25M guaranteed. La Canfora estimated that the contract will be worth $8.5M a year, with "$22 million, something like that, guaranteed." [/i][/color]

[color=#000000]I like La Confora optimism. Thats seems like a happy medium for both sides. [/color]
That salary is right around what an average QB should make, so it makes sense to pay the better player.

[color=#000000]G[/color][color=#000000]et a hard working player like Ray Rice[/color] the contract he earned, and keep the Ray Rice haters at bay because for some reason some people think we can win without him even though he is our BEST offensive player, and won us a lot of games.

Im sure the Ravens FO aren't as timid as a lot of fans, and want Ray to be in Baltimore and will find a way..

[BMOREHAWAII]

[quote name='cursona pirate' timestamp='1337996049' post='1082578']
Yes this people!!!
Agents do all the talking which sometimes can make the player look bad. Rice always says on twitter how much he loves to be a Raven and stuff like that. I think the agent is more to blame than Rice here.
[/quote]
I agree. Player agents are the worst people in the business. Not only do they implant that they need [i]MORE [/i]money for the players, but they themselves leech more than they are worth.

[CalvinSmoke]

[quote name='BMOREHAWAII' timestamp='1337997292' post='1082591']
I agree. Player agents are the worst people in the business. Not only do they implant that they need [i]MORE [/i]money for the players, but they themselves leech more than they are worth.
[/quote]

Yes, the agents are the serpents in this wonderful garden of ours.

[AsianRice]

[quote name='BMOREHAWAII' timestamp='1337997153' post='1082588']
[color=#0000FF][i]According to CBS Sports' Jason La Canfora, the Ravens are in communication with unsigned franchise player Ray Rice.[/i][/color]

[color=#0000FF][i]ESPN's Sal Paolantonio reported Wednesday that the sides have not had contact, but La Canfora is more optimistic. "I think that one gets sorted out, I really do," La Canfora said. "They're talking, there's some constructive dialogue going on." Per La Canfora, "it's pretty clear" Rice will receive something between $20M and $25M guaranteed. La Canfora estimated that the contract will be worth $8.5M a year, with "$22 million, something like that, guaranteed." [/i][/color]

[color=#000000]I like La Confora optimism. Thats seems like a happy medium for both sides. [/color]
That salary is right around what an average QB should make, so it makes sense to pay the better player.

[color=#000000]G[/color][color=#000000]et a hard working player like Ray Rice[/color] the contract he earned, and keep the Ray Rice haters at bay because for some reason some people think we can win without him even though he is our BEST offensive player, and won us a lot of games.

Im sure the Ravens FO aren't as timid as a lot of fans, and want Ray to be in Baltimore and will find a way..
[/quote]
22mil guar is really good deal for Rice if both sides agree; I always think Rice is deserved to get big pay day. 22mil is pretty logical and affordable deal for us if he agrees. Not the 30mil though, a bit more than Foster and McCoy is logical and makable deal.

Hopefully, let get this deal over with so we all can focus on the training camp....

PS: Joe will be next, and lets get him locked up too......

[BMOREHAWAII]

[quote name='AsianRice' timestamp='1337999394' post='1082604']
22mil guar is really good deal for Rice if both sides agree; I always think Rice is deserved to get big pay day. 22mil is pretty logical and affordable deal for us if he agrees. Not the 30mil though, a bit more than Foster and McCoy is logical and makable deal.

Hopefully, let get this deal over with so we all can focus on the training camp....

PS: Joe will be next, and lets get him locked up too......
[/quote]
I dont think any RB is worth AP/CJ2K money, but that's how it's done.

IF a RB would deserve that type of money (which none does), Ray Rice does IMO. It wont happen in Baltimore, obviously.

-Ray is younger than CJ and AP.
-Has been more consistent in ALL AROUND YDS.
-Hardly drops the rock.
-Rarely is he out of games/less injury prone
-Is relied upon on offense more than most players on offense in the NFL.
etc.etc.etc.etc

[baltravens]

[quote name='T3hRaven' timestamp='1337839186' post='1081716']
By all accounts, Ray Rice contract talks are not going well. The FO has stated that if he wants AP type money he isn't getting it. If it doesn't get done before July 16th, I think it's safe to assume that Rice is gone after this season. The team can't afford to pay him what he wants if he wants to get Flacco. As controversial as he is, it is almost impossible to find a guy who can give you consistent play at the quarterback position. With the multiple running backs that are essential to today's league, it is quite easy to get an adequate amount of running production. Taking this into account, if we can't keep Rice why not get some value out of him?

Ray Rice has put up regular season numbers. He is arguably the best pass catching back in the league who adds a dynamic piece to an offense. There are a lot of teams who would give up quite a bit to get Rice in the hopes that he will be the same guy in their system. We might be able to snag a first round pick or a quality player paired with another high pick for him (perhaps a pass rusher). This trade could help bolster an area of weakness to help us get over the hump this year with the possibility of keeping us in it more in the future. We have holes coming up that need to be filled on the defense with the imminent departure of Ray Lewis and Ed Reed in addition to LT and WR.

This would leave a hole at running back as Allen and Pierce probably aren't ready. Thus, this scenario hinges on one player: Cedric Benson. Regardless of who we get in a trade, Benson can be had as Rice's replacement for this season. As a runner, Benson figured it out in Cincy and saved his career. For my money, I would rather have him on the team than Ray Rice anyway. He's what you want from your running back in Cam's system. He's a pure power runner who can consistently move the chains, as opposed to Ray Rice who might give you one big play along with 15 of nothing. He's YPC isn't elite, but overall Cincy has a weaker line than us. He can still get you 1000 yards a season, and he'll do it in a fashion that better fits this offensive system. Less no gains will put Flacco in better position, and I think our three and outs would decrease since we won't have to rely on the big play in the running game. Some might say his style is what Pierce's is, but Pierce is a one cut and run runner a la Arian Foster more than a power back from what I can find. Regardless, the market for running backs, especially one with the off the field issues like Benson, is thinning. He'll come cheap, on a team like this he will be placed into the best position for him to stay clean so to speak, and on this team he would be a top 15 running back again.

Despite the logic, I await the firestorm. This topic was not made to insult Rice. He's a good football player, he's entertaining, and I like him. I just think that we can get more value from him this way to help the team. Adding picks could help us address our needs and the move saves cap space to sign other players we like, such as Flacco. The move makes sense. Do I think it will happen? Probably not. I still think it's a good idea.
[/quote]
Would you change something that works? Would you, honestly, take Ray Rice out of the equation? I do not change things that work; I just keep doing the same things successfully over and over again.

[Stevie Boy]

Relax, the Ravens will sign Rice, about two hours before the deadline in July.

BTW...Rice is playing in Lardarius Webb's charity softball game next weekend. Ask him how the contract negotiations are going :-)

[url="http://www.livingsocial.com/cities/529-annapolis/deals/359098-ticket-to-the-lardarius-webb-charity-softball-game"]http://www.livingsocial.com/cities/529-annapolis/deals/359098-ticket-to-the-lardarius-webb-charity-softball-game[/url]

[usoutpost31]

No, the Ravens should not trade Ray Rice.

He just turned 25 in January. There is still ample tread on those tires.

Ray Rice does account for 35% of the Ravens offense. So did Marshall Faulk in St. Louis.

Now Rice is not Faulk but he's as close as you can hope to get. And like Faulk with the Rams, the Ravens are a good team when he touches the ball.

11-3 in 100 yard games and 20-4 when he carries 20+ times.

Now they won't pay him 10 million/year(nor should they); but neither will anyone else. Rice will come to realize this, common sense will prevail and it will all be good.

[baltravens]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1338042664' post='1082697']
if you knew you werent going to be able to use the same peice of machinery you've been using that has worked, would you rather let it go for free or try and sell it and get what you can?

Thats all he is saying... if we cant reach an agreement, would you rather trade him. how do people miss the whole point
[/quote]
Those of you overseas, learn to stay with a person, place, or thing that works like we do on the North American continent. CASE CLOSED.

[GrimCoconut]

Would I trade Rice? Yes, I would. It depends on the situation, though. With my limited knowledge on the team, it would currently be foolish to trade Rice when he is both a receiver and a RB. He is a very good weapon for us, and Cam's offense does need a RB who can be a receiving threat. With that said, this is the only scenario at this time I can envision where we can trade Ray Rice.

1. OL takes a big step forward, blocking and protecting. If Oseleme, McKinnie, Birk, Yanda and Oher put it together and dominate teams at the line then our run game should be improved. With an improved OL we can use a lesser experienced back like Allen or Pierce comfortably since we have a good line and FB blocking and making holes for them. This part is critical.
2. We sign LT. Some may not agree and say he is done and I believe he is as a RB; however, LT is very familiar with the Cam Offense. He is still a good receiving target. He is, I am sure, still hoping for a ring and would sign cheap, too. With an improved line, it should help him run if necessary, too. Leach will help.
3. Our WRs need to get open more for Joe and need to hold onto the ball better. They also need to do better on blocking, because that will help a weaker OL or a less experience RB.
4. Joe Flacco must take another step forward, which I believe he will.
5. We need to improve our special teams to make for less field to travel for the offense. This will reduce the pressure on the offense and specifically the run game.
6. We need a reliable kicker.

If those six factors are fulfilled, we can trade Rice without the fear of losing his production in my eyes.

As for his value, I say he would be worth multiple picks. Rice may not be the best runner, but he is the NFL's best receiving RB. The Bucs, Jets, Pats, 9ers, Bears, Packers are teams where Rice would fit well. The Bucs just got Martin, so that does put a wrinkle there.

Please remember I am not saying we should or even that we shouldn't trade Rice. I am just saying if these six factors fell into place I believe we would be OK without Rice. As of this moment with our current team, it would be a huge risk to trade Rice. For the right price, though, Rice can go.

[PeRK82]

Honestly , i wouldn't mind trading him for a great wr.

First WR that comes to mind is , Larry Fitz.

I think alot of people would like that trade but i dont think the Cards would trade him, they would be stupid if they did.

Larry Fitz would make an immediate impact on this Offense and i truly believe we would be unstoppable. Rbs can always be replaced , even Ray Rice but Great Wrers are a diamond in the Rough.

[Slim]

I would trade him if he wants AP's money. And i'm not afraid to say it. But only for a first round pick, which could allow us to get two first rounders next year which could include another back. Marcus Lattimore ?

[JohnJohnson]

We have a lot of good players whose value is inflated by the fact that we're a well rounded team. We have to be selective about where we spend our money. Flacco has to be extended, Torrey Smith will have to be extended (he's going to be great), and of course we can expect defensive stars to emerge.

I want Ray Rice to be extended, but the better option for the team is to franchise him for two seasons in a row. I know that would make him angry, and some would talk negatively about our FO. And it seems unfair that you can use the franchise tag on the same player more than once, the player should be able to hit the market. The salary cap increase should help give us some room to extend him if possible.

[JohnJohnson]

[quote name='Slim' timestamp='1338062333' post='1082775']
I would trade him if he wants AP's money. And i'm not afraid to say it. But only for a first round pick, which could allow us to get two first rounders next year which could include another back. Marcus Lattimore ?
[/quote]

The difference is you would be paying him less money, although there is some value to the fact that Ray Rice knows our offense and will produce immediately for at least the next couple of seasons.

[gregreid5]

I dont think we should trade RR but one thing to consider is the mileage schiano put on rice at rutgers. He had over 1000 college attempts, probably double the carries richardson got at alabama

[gregreid5]

[quote name='Slim' timestamp='1338062333' post='1082775']
I would trade him if he wants AP's money. And i'm not afraid to say it. But only for a first round pick, which could allow us to get two first rounders next year which could include another back. Marcus Lattimore ?
[/quote]

We will never go RB round 1. Not in todays league. With 2 1st rounders we would get a top WR and a top defensive player and open up the offense more

[jaege]

[quote name='usmccharles' timestamp='1337840363' post='1081719']
honestly its not that bad of an idea, but you run into some problems:

- Rbs are not as important as they used to be, getting something that we think is fair prolly wouldnt happen.
- who would you trade him for? to throw the idea out you should at least have some names to throw out there, even if its just for fun
- RR was responsible for 35% i think of our offense (saw something on espn today actually) and has led the league since 09 in total yards from scrimage. you cant just replace that, so to plug in benson for this year, we would see a huge drop off in production for the offense unless we got an elite wr and thats not happening.
-say we trade for someone, then that guy just flat out fails...ie a lee evans situation. what would you be saying then?


Im a RR supported and think he should get his money, 4/40mill would be fine by me. Alot of people make the arguement hes not that great of a "runner" yet he was second in the nfl in yards. I think why hes so great is because hes a dual threat, even if hes not the best runner, he makes up for that in the passing game, id much rather have a dual threat thats great at both then just a pure runner. Regauardless, this topic will get beat to death...again. I want to keep RR, i think his next two years will be his biggest, with us expanding the passing game just opens our offense up even more, especially for him. It will be a huge mistake if we get rid of him...Book It.
[/quote]


I love Rice. I am a huge Rice fan, but I am an even bigger Raven's fan, and any combo that pays him 10M a year would put this team in a huge hole. We cannot afford to pay him that kind of money, plain and simple, whether he is worth it or not.