Why Did We Back Out Of The 1St Round?

[Ravens Fan in Ontario]

Glenn won't get past the Rams (I don't think) which puts us in a position to trade back a few more spots and pick up some more picks.

[Yatagarasu]

Courtney Upshaw is in for a long drop if the Ravens don't take him at 35.

33. Rams
34. Colts
35. Ravens
36. Broncos (Suspected Trade up Spot for 3-4 Team)
37. Browns (Trade down spot for Ravens)
38. Jaguars
39. Rams (Suspected Trade up Spot for 3-4 Team)
40. Panthers
41. Bills
42. Dolphins (Targeted Draft Spot)

I think we have a chance to drop back 3-5 more spots and still end up with Upshaw, unless a team trades up to get him.

We can trade with the Browns so they can get Cordy Glenn or a WR.

We can either swap our 6th (198) for their 5th (160)

We still got a lot of targeted solid players available.

Cordy Glenn
Courtney Upshaw
Peter Konz
Stephen Hill
Devon Still
Kendall Reyes

[Hardbaugh]

IIRC with the new CBA a team can control a player one year extra in comparison to a second rounder if that's the case at this point it looks like a stupid move. If the Ravens can parlay both picks to players that are able to make significant contributions than obviously it works out. If all picks turn out to be role player types like the last time they traded out of the first round then the move stinks and a trade up would have served the team better....

[arnie_uk]

[quote name='Corvus Amplus' timestamp='1335528595' post='1060124']
35th: C[b]ordy Glenn - I don't know why he's dropping,[/b] but the man is a beast.

Come on we don't want all our divisional opponents taking all the guards (DeCastro, Zeitler)

However, there has to be a reason why he's dropping.

Maybe he's not a good fit for our zone block scheme.

If we pass on him, I can tell the Browns are going to complete the trifecta of the first three guards going to the AFC North.
[/quote]hes not dropping anywhere, DeCosta said he is a 2nd round guy, i bet alot of teams think so as well. Just another case of the Media hyping a combine warrior, as in the case with hill.

[Kwothdaraven]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1335529570' post='1060149']
hes not dropping anywhere, DeCosta said he is a 2nd round guy, i bet alot of teams think so as well. Just another case of the Media hyping a combine warrior, as in the case with hill.
[/quote]

Well according to prestin, the ravens really like hill

[52Strong]

[quote name='BOLDnPurPnBlacK' timestamp='1335499482' post='1059781']
Man I'd love to package our late 2nd round pick with our original 4th rd pick to get another top 10 2nd rd pick. That'd mean in theory we gave the Vikings our 29th pick for two 1st rounders and switch picks with the vikings in the 4th rd (jumping from the end of the 4th to the third pick).

That's nothing to complain about, that's brilliance.
[/quote]

Got a feeling thats exactly whats going to happen! I don't think we ever intended to make a pick, unless C.J or Decastro were available. For what its worth I think this was plan A, and this is right where Oz wants to be...

IN OZZIE WE TRUST!

[usmccharles]

i bet upshaw/hill goes to the colts,

I really like that we traded back, there is still alot of value on the board. I wouldnt mind getting randle

[cobrajet]

I think the Rams take Glenn to and get their big DT in the first and someone to protect Bradford in the second.
No way Pagano (the blitz happy guy he is) passes on Upshaw and picks the TE using the first two picks on offense.

If that happpens, will you be happy with Martin or Konz at 35?

[usmccharles]

[quote name='cobrajet' timestamp='1335532096' post='1060215']
I think the Rams take Glenn to and get their big DT in the first and someone to protect Bradford in the second.
No way Pagano (the blitz happy guy he is) passes on Upshaw and picks the TE using the first two picks on offense.

If that happpens, will you be happy with Martin or Konz at 35?
[/quote]

No, but i agree that pagano isnt passing on upshaw, wich makes me the opposite of happy. Someone mentioned it above..id really like to package our original 2nd round pick (60th) and a 4th or 5th to move up in the early second, so have like the 35 and 39 or something, to grab upshaw if colts dont take him and then pickup hill or randle. i think that would be huge. Two impact players right away

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='cobrajet' timestamp='1335532096' post='1060215']
I think the Rams take Glenn to and get their big DT in the first and someone to protect Bradford in the second.
No way Pagano (the blitz happy guy he is) passes on Upshaw and picks the TE using the first two picks on offense.

If that happpens, will you be happy with Martin or Konz at 35?
[/quote]

I like them both - I'd prefer Martin because I think he has a shot to be a starting caliber left tackle. But the biggest problem by far on this team last year was that offensive line - if Konz can be a solid answer somewhere for 10+ seasons, why wouldn't we take him? Yeah it's not a sexy pick, but I remember fans on here crying about taking a "developmental quarterback" and a "small scat-back" with the first and second picks of the '08 draft. How's that working out for us?

[truthistold2u]

[quote name='Kwothdaraven' timestamp='1335526271' post='1060068']
If we can land upshaw and then hill/jeffry, id be estatic. I really really dont see glenn getting past the rams
[/quote]

Rams have so many needs though. Could take a WR

[truthistold2u]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1335532684' post='1060236']
I like them both - I'd prefer Martin because I think he has a shot to be a starting caliber left tackle. But the biggest problem by far on this team last year was that offensive line - if Konz can be a solid answer somewhere for 10+ seasons, why wouldn't we take him?
[/quote]

Better O-lineman available, serious injury issues, physically weak

He's not the BPA or fill the biggest need

[truthistold2u]

[quote name='cobrajet' timestamp='1335532096' post='1060215']
I think the Rams take Glenn to and get their big DT in the first and someone to protect Bradford in the second.
No way Pagano (the blitz happy guy he is) passes on Upshaw and picks the TE using the first two picks on offense.

If that happpens, will you be happy with Martin or Konz at 35?
[/quote]

TE would make Luck Happy though.

I would not be happy with Martin or Konz at 35. Why? Ravens have shot at better players

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='truthistold2u' timestamp='1335532785' post='1060241']
Better O-lineman available, serious injury issues, physically weak

He's not the BPA or fill the biggest need
[/quote]

To you or me maybe, but to the Ravens front office maybe he is. I'm only saying if they take him, I wouldn't be pouting about it because I trust their judgement.

[usmccharles]

didnt konz have serious injury issues...i thought someone said on the forums that hes never finished a full season since high school?

[truthistold2u]

[quote name='Corvus Amplus' timestamp='1335528595' post='1060124']
35th: Cordy Glenn - I don't know why he's dropping, but the man is a beast.

Come on we don't want all our divisional opponents taking all the guards (DeCastro, Zeitler)

However, there has to be a reason why he's dropping.

Maybe he's not a good fit for our zone block scheme.

If we pass on him, I can tell the Browns are going to complete the trifecta of the first three guards going to the AFC North.
[/quote]

Scouting report has Glenn as most athletic Guard best suited for zone blocking. Could be why he fell as not a lot of teams zone block. Would be a great pick up for Ravens though

[truthistold2u]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1335533039' post='1060248']
To you or me maybe, but to the Ravens front office maybe he is. I'm only saying if they take him, I wouldn't be pouting about it because I trust their judgement.
[/quote]

Every report I've read says Ravens aren't that High on Konz. With top players falling I doubt Konz is the guy they have their eye on

[Clutch Ravens]

[quote name='PurpleandBlackBlood' timestamp='1335509669' post='1059989']
Jason LaCanfora just said on twitter that were [b]targeting upshaw[/b] so expect us to get him then go after hill
[/quote]

I love us targeting Upshaw, but I'd rather we tried to trade back up for Martin, if he's there.

[EdAInWestOC]

OK...I get it that there are good players available in the 2nd - 7th rounds and that trading back is not the end of the world but there are two approaches to this drafting thing.

You can sit by and play it safe by consulting with your board and staff. This may sound lke the reasonable thing and it is reasonable but there's a catch.

To be really good at something you have to sometimes let it all hang out and go for the thing you want. This is definately not reasonable and those who subscribe to the patient and prescribed approach will not like the "go for it" approach. But like I said there is a catch.

It order to win that elusive championship you have to sometimes forget the prescribed approach and play by your gut. This is very often what seperates the people who win it all from those who are regular winners but just fall short. Sometimes you have to take a shot and play by your gut and that includes the NFL draft.

I don't know if Hightower was the heir apparent to Ray Lewis or whether he would have been that one spark to drive us over that elusive edge and to another Super Bowl win but we will never know because we played it safe last night.

Playing it safe makes us look prudent and like an organization that knows its priorities but that may be all we end up with after the 2012 campaign. Its a good organization that plays by its rules...I hope those rules don't leave us outside looking in at another Super Bowl this year.

The real rub is that this team is so dammed close. There is just one more thing that needs to happen, one more player or one more play. If we do end up this year like we did last year I am sure we will al be asking why the hell didn't we take that chance?

I do not want an organization like they run down by DC. That is way too much "by the seat of your pants" and its gotten them very little in return. I just have the feeling that we let an opportunity go that may have been the right thing to do. If we would have made the trade to get Hightower we could be hoisting another Lombardi trophy. Or not.

That's the thing that drives you crazy about this stuff. Personally I would have made the deal and taken the chance on Hightower. He looks like the right guy and it seems to be the right time. But we will never know.

Ed

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='EdAInWestOC' timestamp='1335534248' post='1060290']
OK...I get it thst there are good players available in the 2nd - 7th rounds and that trading back is not the end of the world but there are two approaches to this drafting thing.

You can sit by and play it safe by consulting with your board and staff. This may sound lke the reasonable thing and it is reasonable but there's a catch.

To be really good at something you have to sometimes let it all hang out and go for the thing you want. This is definately not reasonable and those who subscribe to the patient and prescribed approach will not like the "go for it" approach. But there is a catch.

It order to win that elusive championship you have to sometimes forget the prescribed approach and play by your gut. This is very often what seperates the people who win it all from those who are regular winners but just fall short. Sometimes you have to take a shot and play by your gut and that includes the NFL draft.

I don't know if Hightower was the heir apparent to Ray Lewis or whether he would have been that one spark to drive us over that elusive edge and to another Super Bowl win but we will never know because we played it safe last night.

Playing it safe makes us look prudent and like an organization that knows its priorities but that may be all we end up with after the 2012 campaign. Its a good organization that plays by its rules...I hope those rules don't leave us outside looking in at another Super Bowl this year.

The real rub is that this team is so dammed close. There is just one more thing that needs to happen, one more player or one more play. If we do end up this year like we did last year I am sure we will al be asking why the hell didn't we take that chance?

I do not want an organization like they run down by DC. That is way too much "by the seat of your pants" and its gotten them very little in return. I just have the feeling that we let an opportunity go that may have been the right thing to do. If we would have made the trade to get Hightower we could be hoisting another Lombardi trophy. Or not.

That's the thing that drives you crazy about this stuff. Personally I would have made the deal and taken the chance on Hightower. He looks like the right guy and it seems to be the right time. But we will never know.

Ed
[/quote]

Here's where I would disagree. Hightower is an inside linebacker. When was the last time an inside linebacker made an impact on a team? Run defense is not as important as it was 10 years ago. You can get by with average to above average run defenders, because it's all about passing D and passing O now. If we get Upshaw and he turns into a great compliment to Sizzle, I think it's worth WAY more than an elite run defender.

[truthistold2u]

If it's about Passing O, Ravens can't live without proper protection. Need to get Glenn. Fixes a major hole and helps Flacco and opens holes for Ray Rice. A Zone blocker who is big and strong. Gives Flacco time to throw. Ravens already have Pass Rushers and had 50 sacks last year and should improve there just by having JJ off the field

Glenn is a top 15 prospect who can fill the Ravens biggest need

[jdynamite]

I completely understand why Ozzie traded back with a number of quality prospects still on the board.
However, watching the draft last night gave me the same feeling as 2 years ago when Dez Bryant was right there for the Ravens and the cowboys pulled the trigger jumped ahead of us picked Bryant then Ravens traded out of 1st round.

The prospects I wanted most were Decastro and Hightower....

[Fang]

[quote name='Crabcakes&Football' timestamp='1335496753' post='1059549']
The fallout from the previous 28 picks left a lot of highly rated guys left on the board. They probably had at least 4 guys they would have been thrilled with left on the board and pick up an early 4th on the way. With the way the last 4 picks of round 1 turned out, I think it was a gutsy call that will work out fine.
[/quote]

Sounds like the most likely scenario to me.

[Bltravens]

This is what I don't understand, if the Ravens had a top 15 grade on Glenn why wouldn't they take him at #29? That's outstanding value. Why risk losing him in the next 6 picks for a 4th round pick? When Jimmy Smith was available they looked to trade down 1 spot because they knew who the Bears wanted. They didn't trade down 6.

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='Bltravens' timestamp='1335536213' post='1060356']
This is what I don't understand, if the Ravens had a top 15 grade on Glenn why wouldn't they take him at #29? That's outstanding value. Why risk losing him in the next 6 picks for a 4th round pick? When Jimmy Smith was available they looked to trade down 1 spot because they knew who the Bears wanted. They didn't trade down 6.
[/quote]

Well either they didn't have that grade on him or else there's 3 top 15 or 20 Raven prospects that fell. The way DeCosta put it in his interview, it sounds like if there is a player on the board they grade out to be significantly higher than the rest of the talent pool, they take him, otherwise they trade back.

[Bltravens]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1335536341' post='1060365']
Well either they didn't have that grade on him or else there's 3 top 15 or 20 Raven prospects that fell. The way DeCosta put it in his interview, it sounds like if there is a player on the board they grade out to be significantly higher than the rest of the talent pool, they take him, otherwise they trade back.
[/quote]
Ahhh ok, so theres multiple guys with relatively the same grades on them then?

[usmccharles]

[quote name='Bltravens' timestamp='1335536213' post='1060356']
This is what I don't understand, if the Ravens had a top 15 grade on Glenn why wouldn't they take him at #29? That's outstanding value. Why risk losing him in the next 6 picks for a 4th round pick? When Jimmy Smith was available they looked to trade down 1 spot because they knew who the Bears wanted. They didn't trade down 6.
[/quote]

say they gave glenn, upshaw and hill top 15 status...they all are still there right? well no matter what happens they can still get one of them...and now we have an extra pick. Most likely thats the scenario...

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='Bltravens' timestamp='1335536475' post='1060370']
Ahhh ok, so theres multiple guys with relatively the same grades on them then?
[/quote]

That's what DeCosta explained in his interview. He said the theory is that if there are a clump of players where you pick that you grade out around the same, and you have an idea of who the teams behind you want, usually you can trade back, get extra picks, and still get the guy you want. The way I see it, the receiver and runningbacks taken at the end of the 1st round would NOT have been first round talents by Raven standards. I think the Ravens knew something like that would happen, and figured it meant at least 3 first round talents the Ravens would have taken would be there in the second round, so they made a move.

[PurpleReign92]

I don't care who the player is I just want D-line or OLB/DE hybrid...

[truthistold2u]

[quote name='Bltravens' timestamp='1335536213' post='1060356']
This is what I don't understand, if the Ravens had a top 15 grade on Glenn why wouldn't they take him at #29? That's outstanding value. Why risk losing him in the next 6 picks for a 4th round pick? When Jimmy Smith was available they looked to trade down 1 spot because they knew who the Bears wanted. They didn't trade down 6.
[/quote]

Because they can still get him at 35 or another top 15 guy and added a pick. If there wasn't multiple guys available at 29 they wouldn't have traded back