NFL Top 100

[hawkprey]

[quote name='T3hRaven' timestamp='1338442528' post='1084373']
You can't put Manning on this list when he didn't play. This cheapens the entire rankings system, well that and the fact that Tebow was on there. I understood the Manning for MVP argument. His team went from Super Bowl contender to worst in the league without him, but you can't rank him as a player for a year he didn't play.
[/quote]
He's going to play this year, isn't he?

[arnie_uk]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1338470653' post='1084431']


Well, the title says Top 100 Players of [i]2012[/i]. I always assumed it was the best players going into the next season.
[/quote]They always talk about it being based on last year

[hawkprey]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1338493072' post='1084614']
They always talk about it being based on last year
[/quote]
It's based on last year because it's a projection for this year. You would expect that the best indicator of this year's performance is how you did last year. But for Peyton Manning, last year clearly isn't a good indicator because he won't be injured like he was - or at least, we're pretty sure he won't.

[The Raven]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1338493072' post='1084614']
They always talk about it being based on last year
[/quote]

They have to take last year into account, but for guys like Manning, Jake Long, etc you can't keep them off a Top 100 list because of injuries.

[Pino]

with the top 10's being release next week, it's pretty easy to tell now who's there, right?
Ware, Revis, Ngata, Brady, Rodgers, Calvin Johnson, Willis,... that's all I can think of right now. maybe Joe Thomas? then i'm missing one, at it's probably obvious but i can't think of it.. ok, Drew Brees. but if not Thomas, than who else...

[gabefergy]

[quote name='Pino' timestamp='1340419075' post='1092693']
with the top 10's being release next week, it's pretty easy to tell now who's there, right?
Ware, Revis, Ngata, Brady, Rodgers, Calvin Johnson, Willis,... that's all I can think of right now. maybe Joe Thomas? then i'm missing one, at it's probably obvious but i can't think of it.. ok, Drew Brees. but if not Thomas, than who else...
[/quote]
Larry Fitzgerald...Joe Thomas is number 82 which is so wrong.

[Malkavian Raven]

[i][font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif]I just had a chance to get caught back up on the Top 100 episodes, and I have to say -- Suggs, Reed, Lewis, Rice... Totally got snubbed. Found it funny how the voice-over was more-less creating excuses as to Reed & Lewis' drops in the lists.[/font][/i]

[i][font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif]Lewis should still be a Top 5, easy! Reed, Top 10. Suggs, Top 10. Rice, Top 20.[/font][/i]

[i][font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif]It'll be interested to see who the Top 10 will be, even though you can guess the majority of them. But if I had to choose between Patrick Willis & Ray Lewis... I'm taking Ray Lewis 100 out of 100 times.[/font][/i]

[i][font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif]~ Malkavian Raven[/font][/i]

[berad]

[quote name='Pino' timestamp='1340419075' post='1092693']
with the top 10's being release next week, it's pretty easy to tell now who's there, right?
Ware, Revis, Ngata, Brady, Rodgers, Calvin Johnson, Willis,... that's all I can think of right now. maybe Joe Thomas? then i'm missing one, at it's probably obvious but i can't think of it.. ok, Drew Brees. but if not Thomas, than who else...
[/quote]

Was Peterson already put up? He, along with Fitzgerald and Brees, would make 10

[hawkprey]

[quote name='Malkavian Raven' timestamp='1340493669' post='1092820']
[i][font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif]I just had a chance to get caught back up on the Top 100 episodes, and I have to say -- Suggs, Reed, Lewis, Rice... Totally got snubbed. Found it funny how the voice-over was more-less creating excuses as to Reed & Lewis' drops in the lists.[/font][/i]

[i][font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif]Lewis should still be a Top 5, easy! Reed, Top 10. Suggs, Top 10. Rice, Top 20.[/font][/i]

[i][font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif]It'll be interested to see who the Top 10 will be, even though you can guess the majority of them. But if I had to choose between Patrick Willis & Ray Lewis... I'm taking Ray Lewis 100 out of 100 times.[/font][/i]

[i][font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif]~ Malkavian Raven[/font][/i]
[/quote]
They can call him overrated now, but what are they gonna say the moment Ray retires? They're gonna say Ravens defense will drop off! Seemed like it was a big story when Ray missed 4 games due to injury. Analysts sure liked to jump on the 49ers bandwagon Thanksgiving week after the news broke that he had turf toe. But I guess he can carry the defense AND be overrated. Isn't that great? When he's there, he's overrated. When he's not there, the Ravens defense isn't good. Haters get to have it both ways.

Just like when Suggs got injured. Last year it was "Ray and Ed are old, and Sizzle isn't getting any younger..." 12 months later and we're apparently doomed without him.

[Clutch Ravens]

[quote name='hawkprey' timestamp='1340510755' post='1092852']
They can call him overrated now, but what are they gonna say the moment Ray retires? They're gonna say Ravens defense will drop off! Seemed like it was a big story when Ray missed 4 games due to injury. Analysts sure liked to jump on the 49ers bandwagon Thanksgiving week after the news broke that he had turf toe. But I guess he can carry the defense AND be overrated. Isn't that great? When he's there, he's overrated. When he's not there, the Ravens defense isn't good. Haters get to have it both ways.

Just like when Suggs got injured. Last year it was "Ray and Ed are old, and Sizzle isn't getting any younger..." 12 months later and we're apparently doomed without him.
[/quote]

Haters gon' hate.

Ware above Suggs is a joke - Ware may be the better pass rusher, but he can't even hold Suggs' jock when it comes to coverage and run support.

[Reed_Fence_20]

This list I have agreed with a bit but there are some ridiculous things. Webb being of the list, Mcfadden at 60 despite being out most of season, Patrick Peterson at 50 good young player but not 50, Tim Tebow even on the list? And John Kuhn on it too? Also terrel suggs should be in top ten he is better than ware that is why he is dpoy.

[Pino]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1340489279' post='1092805']
Larry Fitzgerald...Joe Thomas is number 82 which is so wrong.
[/quote]oops. you're right. and so is the other guy about peterson. i do'nt think i saw him. so fitz and peterson are the other two

[JO_75]

So what you all think of the Top 10? Aaron Rodgers comes in at # 1, Brees second, Calvin Johnson at 3 and Tom Brady at 4. Revis at 5. Demarcus Ware, Fitzgerald, AP, Ngata comes in at 9 and Patrick Willis rounds out the top 10.

Wow.. so looking at the whole over and under rated thing it is a joke. Calvin Johnson is listed as over rated, Ngata as over rated, Aaron Rodgers is over rated, Brees is under rated at number 2, man there are some dumb people voting on NFL.com. No way Rodgers is over rated, I mean I wouldn't have put him at, I probably put Brees as # 1 but Rodgers is deserving of the top five. Anyone who thinks Calvin Johnson is over rated doesn't know football and is not a true football fan, or just a bunch of unhappy Bears, Packers and Vikings fans. Ngata is about right at 9 and Revis is way OVERRATED at number five.

[hawkprey]

"Sometimes he holds, sometimes he doesn't" -Joe Flacco on Revis.

See? Joe knows.

[RavensAllTheWay]

[quote name='JO_75' timestamp='1341011936' post='1094421']
So what you all think of the Top 10? Aaron Rodgers comes in at # 1, Brees second, Calvin Johnson at 3 and Tom Brady at 4. Revis at 5. Demarcus Ware, Fitzgerald, AP, Ngata comes in at 9 and Patrick Willis rounds out the top 10.

Wow.. so looking at the whole over and under rated thing it is a joke. Calvin Johnson is listed as over rated, Ngata as over rated, Aaron Rodgers is over rated, Brees is under rated at number 2, man there are some dumb people voting on NFL.com. No way Rodgers is over rated, I mean I wouldn't have put him at, I probably put Brees as # 1 but Rodgers is deserving of the top five. [b]Anyone who thinks Calvin Johnson is over rated [/b]doesn't know football and[b] is not a true football fan,[/b] or just a bunch of unhappy Bears, Packers and Vikings fans. Ngata is about right at 9 and Revis is way OVERRATED at number five.
[/quote]

I don't know why people go as far as saying stuff like that.

But I agree that he is definitely not overrated. The whole overrated/underrated thing is a joke really. After the first 60 (100-40) were revealed, I looked at the list and saw that 50 guys were listed as under and 10 as over. How can more than 83 percent of the list be underrated? Makes no sense.

They really screwed that up. They should've had an option to list a player as NEITHER. That way, if there are 100 people, the vast majority of them should not be underrated.

[T3hRaven]

[quote name='Reed_Fence_20' timestamp='1340552292' post='1092895']
This list I have agreed with a bit but there are some ridiculous things. Webb being of the list, Mcfadden at 60 despite being out most of season, Patrick Peterson at 50 good young player but not 50, Tim Tebow even on the list? And John Kuhn on it too? Also terrel suggs should be in top ten he is better than ware that is why he is dpoy.
[/quote]

Suggs is a more rounded player than Ware, but Ware is the best pass rusher in the league. When you get the glamour stats, you get more popularity in the league. And if this is a projection of next year, as many people have stated, Suggs shouldn't even be on it because he's not going to play in all likelihood. But really, any top 100 list including Tim Tebow discredits itself. Once they announced that I stopped caring.

[Dubs]

[quote name='hawkprey' timestamp='1341013250' post='1094423']
"Sometimes he holds, sometimes he doesn't" -Joe Flacco on Revis.

See? Joe knows.
[/quote]

The way he said was priceless - gotta love Joe, hopefully the stache is updated in Madden 13

[raybaby]

[quote name='hawkprey' timestamp='1341013250' post='1094423']
"Sometimes he holds, sometimes he doesn't" -Joe Flacco on Revis.

See? Joe knows.
[/quote]

Lol Joe would say that.

[Ravenslifer]

Just like to point something out:

Quarterbacks on the top 100 list:

Tebow, Romo, Joe, Vick, Rivers, Peyton, Stafford, Newton, Eli, Roethlisberger, Brady, Brees, Rodgers

Their receivers in the top 100:

Eli - Nicks and Cruz

Rodgers - Jennings and Nelson

Newton - Steve Smith

Roethlisberger - Wallace

Brady - Welker

Vick - Jackson

Stafford - Johnson

Tight Ends

Brees - Jimmy Graham

Brady - Gronkowski

Romo - Jason Witten

So Tebow, Peyton, and Rivers are the only guys besides Joe WITHOUT an elite receiver or tight end - not to mention I'm sure if you went to the top 150, Miles Austin, Dez Bryant, and Santonio Holmes would be there. I could MAYBE see Q in the top 150, but more than likely not. So Flacco has to play the toughest schedule (at 9 games vs what were top 15 passing defenses last year) with fewer weapons (projected, lets hope Torrey busts out) than almost any of the other quarterbacks.

[The Raven]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1341188933' post='1094783']
Just like to point something out:

Quarterbacks on the top 100 list:

Tebow, Romo, Joe, Vick, Rivers, Peyton, Stafford, Newton, Eli, Roethlisberger, Brady, Brees, Rodgers

Their receivers in the top 100:

Eli - Nicks and Cruz

Rodgers - Jennings and Nelson

Newton - Steve Smith

Roethlisberger - Wallace

Brady - Welker

Vick - Jackson

Stafford - Johnson

Tight Ends

Brees - Jimmy Graham

Brady - Gronkowski

Romo - Jason Witten

So Tebow, Peyton, and Rivers are the only guys besides Joe WITHOUT an elite receiver or tight end - not to mention I'm sure if you went to the top 150, Miles Austin, Dez Bryant, and Santonio Holmes would be there. I could MAYBE see Q in the top 150, but more than likely not. So Flacco has to play the toughest schedule (at 9 games vs what were top 15 passing defenses last year) with fewer weapons (projected, lets hope Torrey busts out) than almost any of the other quarterbacks.
[/quote]

Great point. I love Joe. My high school coach often uses an expression that goes "Well, this is a team that's really good at making chicken salad out of chicken ****." I think Joe has been like that as well. He hasn't had much support around him catching the ball or blocking for him but he's made the most of it.

[hawkprey]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1341188933' post='1094783']
Just like to point something out:

Quarterbacks on the top 100 list:

Tebow, Romo, Joe, Vick, Rivers, Peyton, Stafford, Newton, Eli, Roethlisberger, Brady, Brees, Rodgers

Their receivers in the top 100:
Eli - Nicks and Cruz
Rodgers - Jennings and Nelson
Newton - Steve Smith
Roethlisberger - Wallace
Brady - Welker
Vick - Jackson
Stafford - Johnson

Tight Ends
Brees - Jimmy Graham
Brady - Gronkowski
Romo - Jason Witten
So Tebow, Peyton, and Rivers are the only guys besides Joe WITHOUT an elite receiver or tight end - not to mention I'm sure if you went to the top 150, Miles Austin, Dez Bryant, and Santonio Holmes would be there. I could MAYBE see Q in the top 150, but more than likely not. So Flacco has to play the toughest schedule ([b]at 9 games vs what were top 15 passing defenses last year[/b]) with fewer weapons (projected, lets hope Torrey busts out) than almost any of the other quarterbacks.
[/quote]
It was 11 of 16 games against top 10 passing defenses. I remember doing the numbers based on OPP QB rating and Joe's opponents averaged 8-9 points lower than that of Rodgers (used as the control group), and gave up 3% fewer passes than the average (that is, if Joe had a neutral schedule he'd have a 60+ completion percentage).

We all know Tebow shouldn't be on the list. Tebow was just traded for a 4th rounder. There were 100 ROOKIES worth more than the pick he was traded for. Peyton Manning made the list, but his receivers had Orlovsky and Painter lobbing the ball their way. If Peyton had played, he'd have brought Austin Collie and Reggie Wayne into the top 100 as well.

Flacco is the only QB who really has no top receivers at his disposal. But you can also look at it the other way - do good QBs put their receivers on the map (as I suggested with P. Manning) or vice versa?

[raybaby]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1341188933' post='1094783']
Just like to point something out:

Quarterbacks on the top 100 list:

Tebow, Romo, Joe, Vick, Rivers, Peyton, Stafford, Newton, Eli, Roethlisberger, Brady, Brees, Rodgers

Their receivers in the top 100:

Eli - Nicks and Cruz

Rodgers - Jennings and Nelson

Newton - Steve Smith

Roethlisberger - Wallace

Brady - Welker

Vick - Jackson

Stafford - Johnson

Tight Ends

Brees - Jimmy Graham

Brady - Gronkowski

Romo - Jason Witten

So Tebow, Peyton, and Rivers are the only guys besides Joe WITHOUT an elite receiver or tight end - not to mention I'm sure if you went to the top 150, Miles Austin, Dez Bryant, and Santonio Holmes would be there. I could MAYBE see Q in the top 150, but more than likely not. So Flacco has to play the toughest schedule (at 9 games vs what were top 15 passing defenses last year) with fewer weapons (projected, lets hope Torrey busts out) than almost any of the other quarterbacks.
[/quote]


But on his top 100 video one players says... but he has Boldin... and Rice lol

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='hawkprey' timestamp='1341268800' post='1094985']
[b]It was 11 of 16 games against top 10 passing defenses.[/b] I remember doing the numbers based on OPP QB rating and Joe's opponents averaged 8-9 points lower than that of Rodgers (used as the control group), and gave up 3% fewer passes than the average (that is, if Joe had a neutral schedule he'd have a 60+ completion percentage).

We all know Tebow shouldn't be on the list. Tebow was just traded for a 4th rounder. There were 100 ROOKIES worth more than the pick he was traded for. Peyton Manning made the list, but his receivers had Orlovsky and Painter lobbing the ball their way. If Peyton had played, he'd have brought Austin Collie and Reggie Wayne into the top 100 as well.

Flacco is the only QB who really has no top receivers at his disposal. But you can also look at it the other way - do good QBs put their receivers on the map (as I suggested with P. Manning) or vice versa?
[/quote]

Should have made it more clear, but the 9-16 was for 2012, since this is the top 100 projected for 2012 - we play 9 games in 2012 against teams who were ranked in the top 15 in passing defense in 2011 (I think, I only took a minute to glance things over so the number might be wrong), 6 games in our own division, Philadelphia, KC, Houston, Washington, and San Diego - okay that's 11, none ranked worse than 13th last year. Point being that IMO going forward, no matter what happens with the scheduling Flacco will always have to play against top passing defenses in many of his games during the season, and will do it most likely with less explosive weapons than the likes of Brady, Rodgers, etc.

[hawkprey]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1341315581' post='1095046']
Should have made it more clear, but the 9-16 was for 2012, since this is the top 100 projected for 2012 - we play 9 games in 2012 against teams who were ranked in the top 15 in passing defense in 2011 (I think, I only took a minute to glance things over so the number might be wrong), 6 games in our own division, Philadelphia, KC, Houston, Washington, and San Diego - okay that's 11, none ranked worse than 13th last year. Point being that IMO going forward, no matter what happens with the scheduling Flacco will always have to play against top passing defenses in many of his games during the season, and will do it most likely with less explosive weapons than the likes of Brady, Rodgers, etc.
[/quote]
You said it was the "toughest schedule". That's why I thought you meant last year. 9 in the top 15 is pretty average. Keep in mind that 8 in the top 16 would be dead average.

[arnie_uk]

[quote name='hawkprey' timestamp='1341321838' post='1095053']
You said it was the "toughest schedule". That's why I thought you meant last year. 9 in the top 15 is pretty average. Keep in mind that 8 in the top 16 would be dead average.
[/quote]Not exactly.. you could play defenses 1-8, 17-24, while someone else could play 9-16, 24-32, While they both have 8 in the top 16, they arent the same.. Cant just look at it as 8 in top 16 is average...

[hawkprey]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1341405811' post='1095359']
Not exactly.. you could play defenses 1-8, 17-24, while someone else could play 9-16, 24-32, While they both have 8 in the top 16, they arent the same.. Cant just look at it as 8 in top 16 is average...
[/quote]
That's true, but I assumed Ravenslifer would want to make it sound like our schedule is tough, so why just say 8 in the top 16 when you could say, for example, 8 in the top 8?

I think our schedule is going to have a lot of tough defenses yet again, starting in our own division and carrying over to the NFC East, San Diego, Houston, and maybe Kansas City as they get their players back from injury. Who has a top defense that we won't be playing this year? San Francisco and the Jets. Maybe Seattle. Everyone else is on our schedule. Too bad no one looks at schedule when deciding how good your quarterback is...