Ray Rice Potential Holdout

[Hardbaugh]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1333561653' post='1042110']
True, but from what I understand, we've offered him Arian Foster money, and he doesn't want it. He wants Adrian Peterson money and at this point seems unwilling to budge. Now I love Rice, but Adrian Peterson is not worth Adrian Peterson's contract, and Rice is not Adrian Peterson.
[/quote]

I'm a huge Ray Rice fan and believe he should be taken care of before Flacco but if the Ravens offered him dollars in the neighborhood of Arian Foster and he didn't take it I don't blame the Ravens for moving on and franchising him.

[arnie_uk]

[quote name='Hardbaugh' timestamp='1333629473' post='1042743']
I'm a huge Ray Rice fan and believe he should be taken care of before Flacco but if the Ravens offered him dollars in the neighborhood of Arian Foster and he didn't take it I don't blame the Ravens for moving on and franchising him.
[/quote]so youd rather have a RB for 4/5 years than a franchise QB for 8-10 more years is how im interpreting this?

[Hardbaugh]

[quote name='arnie_uk' timestamp='1333629565' post='1042744']
so youd rather have a RB for 4/5 years than a franchise QB for 8-10 more years is how im interpreting this?
[/quote]
If the Ravens had a franchise quarterback I'd say get him signed . Franchise quarterbacks don't put up pedestrian numbers, caretakers do and that's what the Ravens have.

[raybaby]

[quote name='Hardbaugh' timestamp='1333629762' post='1042750']
If the Ravens had a franchise quarterback I'd say get him signed . Franchise quarterbacks don't put up pedestrian numbers, caretakers do and that's what the Ravens have.
[/quote] lol wow

[codizzle]

[quote name='Hardbaugh' timestamp='1333629762' post='1042750']

If the Ravens had a franchise quarterback I'd say get him signed . Franchise quarterbacks don't put up pedestrian numbers, caretakers do and that's what the Ravens have.
[/quote]
Smh some people just never satisfied

[Ravensfanspls]

[quote name='Hardbaugh' timestamp='1333629762' post='1042750']
If the Ravens had a franchise quarterback I'd say get him signed . Franchise quarterbacks don't put up pedestrian numbers, caretakers do and that's what the Ravens have.
[/quote] How can someone not be happy with Joe I don't understand people...Convert to a packers fan please..

[The Raven]

[quote name='Ravensfanspls' timestamp='1333663589' post='1043475']
How can someone not be happy with Joe I don't understand people...Convert to a packers fan please..
[/quote]

Nah, let him convert to an Miami, Oakland, or Cleveland fan so he can understand how good we have it and how lucky we are to have a guy like Joe.

[codizzle]

[quote name='The Raven' timestamp='1333666598' post='1043572']


Nah, let him convert to an Miami, Oakland, or Cleveland fan so he can understand how good we have it and how lucky we are to have a guy like Joe.
[/quote]
JETS

[The Raven]

[quote name='codizzle' timestamp='1333666868' post='1043578']
JETS
[/quote]

Even better!!! How did I not think of that?! Lol!

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='Ravensfanspls' timestamp='1333663589' post='1043475']
How can someone not be happy with Joe I don't understand people...Convert to a packers fan please..
[/quote]

Simple. Joe doesn't put up numbers that can win you a fantasy league title, therefore by definition he must suck.

[GrimCoconut]

I was curious about what WalterFootball wrote about us re-signing Lardarius Webb. I went to their site and found something interesting as I looked at Lardarius in their Free Agent section.

[b]Lardarius Webb[/b]: 6 years, $50 million; $10 million guaranteed (actually 5 year extension for $50 million, but whatever) $10M a year average.
[b]Brandon Carr[/b]: 5 years, $50.1 million. $10M a year average.
[b]Cortland Finnegan[/b]: 5 years, $50 million. $10M a year average.
[b]Carlos Rogers[/b]: 4 years, $29.3 million. $7.325M a year average.
[b]Terrel Thomas[/b]: 4 years, $28 million. $7M a year average.
[b]Stanford Routt[/b]: 3 years, $19.6 million. $6.53M a year average.

I think the biggest reason this deal was done is because if you look at it, two other guys were done that were very close to Webb in production last year. I think that made this negotiation easier in addition to the obvious fact that we wanted Webb back. Webb’s deal is right there with the top CBs. I didn’t include all of the numbers because that would just be ridiculous. I just put the biggest earners in here.

This would also explain why Flacco and Rice’s contracts have stalled.
[b]Peyton Manning[/b]: 5 years, $96 million. $19.2M a year average.
[b]Mark Sanchez[/b]: 5 year extension, $58.25 million. $11.65M a year average.
[b]Matt Flynn[/b]: 3 years, $26 million. $8.66M a year average.
[b]Alex Smith[/b]: 3 year, $24 million. $8M a year average.

I mean, Joe Flacco is clearly above Flynn, Smith, & Sanchez in my eyes. He is below Manning as well. So where does that put Joe? In a range of 11.65M-19.2M a year. Kind of hard to figure out where to put him.

[b]Arian Foster[/b]: 5 years, $43.5 million. $8.7M a year average.
[b]Marshawn Lynch[/b]: 4 years, $32 million. $8M a year average.
[b]Michael Bush[/b]: 4 years, $14 million. $3.5M a year average.

The other guys aren’t worth mentioning. I mean, this would explain why Ray Rice still remains unsigned, because none of them are as good as Rice except Foster. Foster is close to Rice but isn’t as good as him. Lynch had a good year this year, but hasn’t been what he was supposed to be until now. It explains why Forte & Rice still remain franchised by their respective clubs.

I really hope Forte gets his contract signed soon. Once he signs, we will have a better picture of Rice’s contract and better negotiating leverage. Rice and Forte are very close to each other in terms of production and meaning to their clubs. I can really see their contracts being the same.

[Militant X 1]

i just saw on the NFL Network that Steve Wyche reports that Ray Rice [u][b]WILL NOT [/b][/u]join the team for "voluntary" workouts on Monday. voluntary means just that, they have a choice to do so or not. what's your viewpoint?

~Mili

[Clutch Ravens]

It's not a big deal, but will get blown completely out of proportion by the media because Rice isn't happy about being tagged.

[BMORElegacy]

Reports are that he won't show up to training camp either. I started a thread about Rice's possible holdout weeks ago.

[BMORElegacy]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1333669075' post='1043624']
Simple. Joe doesn't put up numbers that can win you a fantasy league title, therefore by definition he must suck.
[/quote] It's a sad truth. People neglect to look at the fact that all he does is win football games and secure playoff berths.

[berad]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1334348449' post='1048180']
i just saw on the NFL Network that Steve Wyche reports that Ray Rice [u][b]WILL NOT [/b][/u]join the team for "voluntary" workouts on Monday. voluntary means just that, they have a choice to do so or not. what's your viewpoint?

~Mili
[/quote]

It's his prerogative - they're voluntary workouts but we all know that "voluntary" time is still valuable to the coaches. I don't think it matters too much, you know he'll be in shape, but he's not earning any extra points with the organization or in my book.

[PWNEDbyDEANO]

At least with Rice you can safely assume that him holding out won't result in him being out of shape.

Maybe with him not showing up for the workouts the coaches will get a better idea about how much faith they can place in Allen and Berry.

[Militant X 1]

[quote name='berad' timestamp='1334349582' post='1048200']
It's his prerogative - they're voluntary workouts but [u][b]we all know that "voluntary" time is still valuable to the coaches[/b][/u]. I don't think it matters too much, you know he'll be in shape, [u][b]but he's not earning any extra points with the organization or in my book.[/b][/u]
[/quote]

true berad! but i definitely understand Rice's viewpoint of wanting a long term deal. i just absolutely hate seeing our key players unhappy about their contracts playing out in the media bruh! [img]http://content.boards.baltimoreravens.com//public/style_emoticons/default/th_consoling2.gif[/img]

~Mili

[BMORElegacy]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1334352288' post='1048222']
true berad! but i definitely understand Rice's viewpoint of wanting a long term deal. i just absolutely hate seeing our key players unhappy about their contracts playing out in the media bruh! [img]http://content.boards.baltimoreravens.com//public/style_emoticons/default/th_consoling2.gif[/img]

~Mili
[/quote] These cats should keep their unhappiness in-house.

[BMOREHAWAII]

As a huge Ray Rice fan i usually got his back in some say. But this diva stuff is getting out of hand.
CJ2K had a less than mediocre season last year, and i really hope that doesn't happen to my boy Ray.
I never thought i'd ever say this about one of my favorite people/players in the NFL, but if Ray doesn't accept a legit offer from Baltimore and wants to walk, let him go. Who the cap fits, let them wear it.
We have a bunch of capable RB's to fill his role....

BUT PLEASE RICE, JUST SIGN ALREADY!!

[BMOREHAWAII]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1334348449' post='1048180']
i just saw on the NFL Network that Steve Wyche reports that Ray Rice [u][b]WILL NOT [/b][/u]join the team for "voluntary" workouts on Monday. voluntary means just that, they have a choice to do so or not. what's your viewpoint?

~Mili
[/quote]
Right, voluntary is the key word.
If i recall players like Big Ray, Ngata, Ed Reed, Suggs didn't show up to voluntaries in 2010. So maybe Rice wants to take the time to concentrate on his signing.

[JO_75]

[quote name='BMOREHAWAII' timestamp='1334365742' post='1048331']
Right, voluntary is the key word.
If i recall players like Big Ray, Ngata, Ed Reed, Suggs didn't show up to voluntaries in 2010. So maybe Rice wants to take the time to concentrate on his signing.
[/quote]

Yeah no need to freak out over a player missing VOLUNTARY workouts. If these were mandatory workouts and Training Camp and he was missing time, then we could panic but right now nothing to worry about.

[Natty Boh]

I don't know what kind of contracts Ozzie has been floating Ray Rice's way but he should accept something close to but less than what Arian Foster got, assuming that it has been offered to him. If he is holding out for more than that...good luck. If he refuses to sign a long term deal and worse comes to worse and he has to be franchised 2 years in a row, that just hurts him. He'll get $7.7 million for this year and I believe the franchise tag price for a RB next season would be around $9 million. Good money either way but after those 2 years, his value will decline dramatically as he will be closer to 30 years old. Sign sooner rather than later Ray, it's in your best financial interest.

[AsianRice]

[quote name='Natty Boh' timestamp='1334448840' post='1048685']
I don't know what kind of contracts Ozzie has been floating Ray Rice's way but he should accept something close to but less than what Arian Foster got, assuming that it has been offered to him. If he is holding out for more than that...good luck. If he refuses to sign a long term deal and worse comes to worse and he has to be franchised 2 years in a row, that just hurts him. He'll get $7.7 million for this year and I believe the franchise tag price for a RB next season would be around $9 million. Good money either way [b]but after those 2 years, his value will decline dramatically as he will be closer to 30 years old.[/b] Sign sooner rather than later Ray, it's in your best financial interest.
[/quote]
I think his agent knows that and I'm pretty sure Rice and his agent will go panic mode if they waited for the 2nd franchise tag; RBs have short life span in football....

I think he'll sign before the mandatory training camp.....

[Natty Boh]

[quote name='AsianRice' timestamp='1334449697' post='1048693']
I think his agent knows that and I'm pretty sure Rice and his agent will go panic mode if they waited for the 2nd franchise tag; RBs have short life span in football....

I think he'll sign before the mandatory training camp.....
[/quote]

I'm also hopeful of hearing about a deal getting done before camp.

[Bltravens]

Don't Suggs and Reed miss these "voluntary" work outs all the time?

I'd miss them if I was an NFL player lol.

[The Raven]

Ray Lewis does his own workouts every year and always shows up in the best shape. Voluntary team workouts are not essential. There are plenty of other gyms, and trainers that can offer the same or possibly even better strength and conditioning programs. As long as Rice continues to work in his own program and improve upon his already solid foundation I have no major concern.

However, I want him signed as soon as possible. I'd like for this contract to at least be close in negotiations, but I have heard that it is not, which gives me concern. I really hope that he doesn't hold out and miss mandatory workouts, that could force us to waste a pick of make a signing that would ultimately be unnecesary. I really don't want to have to spend a pick on a runningback, regardless of round.

[B-more Ravor]

[quote name='BMORElegacy' timestamp='1334349051' post='1048194']
Reports are that he won't show up to training camp either. I started a thread about Rice's possible holdout weeks ago.
[/quote]

FWIW, if Rice doesn't show up to Training Camp, he will not be "holding out" because he's not under contract. Under the CBA, he's perfectly within his rights to not show up, as long as he's hasn't yet signed his franchise tender.

If he were to carry it into the season (which I doubt), he's still within his rights, but the CBA does delineate some consequences if he's not signed by a certain time (ie he loses a year of service time).

[B-more Ravor]

[quote name='K-Dog' timestamp='1333587047' post='1042524']
I am not sure how you can say a team with a mere 1.7 m. left in the bank is frugal.

I think I read today we have the second or third smallest cap space left.
[/quote]

Exactly. They always spend to the Cap and are just in a position to not be able to retain guys like Grubbs, JJ, etc. That's what happens when you draft well and have a good team - there are going to be times when you have to make tough decisions and let guys walk.

[CapoRocky]

[quote name='B-more Ravor' timestamp='1334586233' post='1049402']


Exactly. They always spend to the Cap and are just in a position to not be able to retain guys like Grubbs, JJ, etc. That's what happens when you draft well and have a good team - there are going to be times when you have to make tough decisions and let guys walk.
[/quote]

I'm sure they are sweating the cap right now knowing that someone will need to go after the draft just to have enough money to sign our picks.