37 replies to this topic

[raybaby]

Limited circumstances.......... regarding Lee Evans... you know because he was injured and then when he got healthy we was rarely on the field....... can you really say that he wasn't?? We did not use Lee much in 3 WR sets. Pitta was used more than Lee was. What games were you watching? Please give me an estimated number of snaps you think Lee Evans was in for.

Someone who watches game film for a living said our receivers ran the same routes over and over again... that it is very predictable and Cam does nothing to help them get open... that Lee Evans was in for only a select number of snaps. Just because the receivers aren't the best at getting separation doesn't mean none of the blame falls on Cam.... as an offensive coordinator it is your responsibility to keep defenses on their toes... make game time adjustments if the offense stalls.... you can't keep running the same thing over and over again when it is not working and expect for the outcome to be different.... if your receivers aren't getting open... then do something about it.

Because guess what we have the receivers that we have... this is not going to change any time soon. So Cam should be game planning around them. Period. If Boldin is good in the slot than he should be in the slot more often than not. It doesn't matter the reason why he is. Because if he starts getting a lot production than the defense will have to adjust for him which will then help the other receivers get open. Play to your players strengths. And don't tell Cam uses him in the slot enough. That is far from true.

Edited by raybaby, 07 February 2012 - 09:21 PM.

[flynismo]

The Raven, on 07 February 2012 - 09:16 PM, said:

Yep. He's much better than believed to be. I just made a post in the Cam thread going into a bit of detail about this sorta thing, if you're interested.

I saw it; question posted!

[flynismo]

raybaby, on 07 February 2012 - 09:17 PM, said:

Limited circumstances.......... regarding Lee Evans... you know because he was injured and then when he got healthy we was rarely on the field....... can you really say that he wasn't?? We did not use Lee much in 3 WR sets. Pitta was used more than Lee was. What games were you watching? Please give me an estimated number of snaps you think Lee Evans was in for.

Someone who watches game film for a living said our receivers ran the same routes over and over again... that it is very predictable and Cam does nothing to help them get open... that Lee Evans was in for only a select number of snaps. Just because the receivers aren't the best at getting separation doesn't mean none of the blame falls on Cam.... as an offensive coordinator it is your responsibility to keep defenses on their toes... make game time adjustments if the offense stalls.... you can't keep running the same thing over and over again when it is not working and except for the outcome to be different.... if your receivers aren't getting open... then do something about it.

Because guess what we have the receivers that we have... this is not going to change any time soon. So Cam should be game planning around them. Period. If Boldin is good in the slot than he should be in the slot more often than not. It doesn't matter the reason why he is. Because if he starts getting a lot production than the defense will have to adjust for him which will then help the other receivers get open. Play to your players strengths. And don't tell Cam uses him in the slot enough. That is far from true.

Nobody said Cam is God's gift to OC. He is part of the problem.

But it is tiring, and honestly quite annoying, to listen to people blaming him for WR not being able to beat single coverage -- which is the whole friggin' goal when you call a pass play -- and not acknowledge that many, many drops have ruined otherwise fantastic play calls.

[atlravensfan]

flynismo, on 07 February 2012 - 09:11 PM, said:

Did she call which gap Rice would hit, and what routes the recievers and TE would run?

Or was it, "Ray Rice to the left" or "Flacco passing the ball".

The latter isn't exactly "calling out the plays"; so if that's what she did, it's not very impressive.


Either way, it doesn't really matter. My point is, no matter what he does, Cam will not get any credit for anything, but will take all the heat when a WR drops a ball or can't do his job and beat one on one coverage.

LOL I agree with you but its still funny(kinda you had to be there on your 5th beer to appreciate it). It was like she was like short pass to Ray Rice. Run left run right. dude it was funny. Still We had guys calling routes and stuff. Like I later found out we had a lot of guys who played ball in some way. I think Its everyones fault. Win as a team lose as one.

[atlravensfan]

flynismo, on 07 February 2012 - 09:22 PM, said:

Nobody said Cam is God's gift to OC. He is part of the problem.

But it is tiring, and honestly quite annoying, to listen to people blaming him for WR not being able to beat single coverage -- which is the whole friggin' goal when you call a pass play -- and not acknowledge that many, many drops have ruined otherwise fantastic play calls.

Put when you call plays to players that is not their strength then it is a problem. Boldin Running go routes is a joke.

[flynismo]

atlravensfan, on 07 February 2012 - 09:22 PM, said:

LOL I agree with you but its still funny(kinda you had to be there on your 5th beer to appreciate it). It was like she was like short pass to Ray Rice. Run left run right. dude it was funny. Still We had guys calling routes and stuff. Like I later found out we had a lot of guys who played ball in some way. I think Its everyones fault. Win as a team lose as one.

I think it's humorous too, considering the criticism that Cam gets for being predictable.

But bottom line is exactly what you said -- win as a team, lose as a team.

[raybaby]

This was not even suppose to be a Cam hate thread. I'm not saying Cam doesn't have a good offensive mind at times. But it is a known fact that he is very stubborn and arrogant. Quoted from ex players that played for him. And I'm one of the people who might not like him but get why he is staying.

This was about Lee getting another chance on the team. Because he was not on the field much even when he got healthy and he has a lot of upside and this season isn't a fair assessment of what he can do for the team. And realistically for what we are trying to do this off season there would not be a better quality receiver that would want to be our # 3... and if we some how do get another FA receiver don't complain when we don't get much out of them their first year here either.

[flynismo]

atlravensfan, on 07 February 2012 - 09:24 PM, said:

Put when you call plays to players that is not their strength then it is a problem. Boldin Running go routes is a joke.

True, but how often does that actually happen? Not very often this season, since now we actually have the proper players to run the deep routes.

Like I said, Cam is definitely part of the reason for our offense's problems. But far from the only one.

[flynismo]

raybaby, on 07 February 2012 - 09:28 PM, said:

This was not even suppose to be a Cam hate thread. I'm not saying Cam doesn't have a good offensive mind at times. But it is a known fact that he is very stubborn and arrogant. Quoted from ex players that played for him. And I'm one of the people who might not like him but get why he is staying.

This was about Lee getting another chance on the team. Because he was not on the field much even when he got healthy and he has a lot of upside and this season isn't a fair assessment of what he can do for the team. And realistically for what we are trying to do this off season there would not be a better quality receiver that would want to be our # 3... and if we some how do get another FA receiver don't complain when we don't get much out of them their first year here either.

Lee can have another chance, if the money is right. The guy is getting up there in age (will be 32 next month), and now is becoming an injury concern.

He has one, maybe two more years before his speed leaves him, and then he becomes an undersized possession receiver. I'd rather spend that time developing a long term solution to replace Boldin once he is gone than wasting time on a 32 year old backup.

Edited by flynismo, 07 February 2012 - 09:33 PM.

[cobrajet]

Call me crazy but I would like to free up some cap space for a proven #1 WR free agent. Maybe Cam can shock me and use our WR's more effectively. Of course that is contingent on us upgrading at Center to improve our line.

I know that means cutting ties with some of our FA's, but Joe has sold me on his passing ability.

However, I am pretty sure we won't be signing Colston, Bowe, or VJax.

[Ngata92NT]

A proven #1 WR free agent that's not Colston, Bowe, or Jackson? Who are we talking about exactly?

The only shot we have at a true #1 WR is if we draft one or one of our guys develops as a player and becomes truly dominant (I'm looking at you, Torrey).

Lee Evans deserves another shot, but not getting paid that kind of dough. Take a pay cut, he stays. Keep him at the same price and you run the risk of another Foxworth or Carr type situation where you're paying big bucks for no production. No one pays big money to retain a #3 WR, at least no teams that maintain a defensive element as strong as ours.

As far as Cam goes, I'd love to see Brady in there running all Cam's plays by the book against the Steelers or Texans. Total meltdown in T-minus 3... 2... 1...

[Ravenslifer]

raybaby, on 07 February 2012 - 05:31 PM, said:

Okay I know the draft is fun because fans get to debate who the Ravens could pick up
but I'd like to give a rational point of view about receivers.

First, Joe needs consistency with his WRs... he can't keep getting new WRs every other year... that is not going to help him or the offense grow. Consistency is very important for a team as a whole. Ask the Giants owner when he referred to us as successful franchise for that reason.

Second, we all should know that with Cam as our OC... plugging in a different receiver is not going to make much of a difference... unless it is an extremely tall physical proven receiver like Megatron or Fitz who can literally catch anything and everything... which lets be real we aren't getting either of them.

Third, we need to give Evans some slack..... if we give Joe slack because of Cam... then we should have the same courtesy for our WRs... of course minus the drops. Cam rarely used 3 WRs sets... and when he did Pitta was usually the 3rd receiver... so really Evans was barely on the field... kind of hard to make an impact when you are only apart of limited snaps.

He is big, fast & showed he can make some incredible catches when he got the opportunity. Yes there were times that they tried to force it to him at the end of the regular season & turnovers happened and of course the fact that he relaxed on the biggest catch of his life... but I think he can be successful here with a full offseason compared to anyone else who would want to be our 3rd receiver. He will probably be the most motivated player on the field to help us get back to the ultimate goal.

He just needs to be apart of the game plan... you know actually be on the field to do some damage.

I still think Torrey & Evans on the sides & Boldin in the slot would be a deadly combination. Maybe Cam has his reasons why he didn't use that this season but I'm hoping he gets his head out of his [profanity deleted] & actually does it.

Sorry if there is another thread about this or if I repeated anyone... just wanted to get my opinion out there about it

Evans? He's 5'10". Not to nitpick, but he's not a big receiver, which means that he can't shield out a cornerback like say a Colston or a Jackson. Not that it's a problem he just has to be used differently than they are. But I agree if he's back with the team next year I think he will play much better, provided he stays healthy.

Edited by Ravenslifer, 07 February 2012 - 11:58 PM.

[BMORElegacy]

Lee is anything but a big-bodied WR.

[stan]

He's everything but a big bodied WR.

[raybaby]

Sigh... 'Big' doesn't have to mean 'tall'. I get why you would want a tall receiver though. Honestly we need receivers that will be the best fit in Cam's offense because he doesn't work around receivers abilities... so really fast receivers would be ideal. Obviously a tall fast receiver would be the most ideal.

[raybaby]

He is bigger bodied than Torrey. He has a similar body to Boldin IMO except of course not as tall.

Edited by raybaby, 08 February 2012 - 05:23 AM.

[Ravenslifer]

raybaby, on 08 February 2012 - 05:02 AM, said:

He is bigger bodied than Torrey. He has a similar body to Boldin IMO except of course not as tall.

Yeah, I meant tall, like 6'3"+, the receivers San Diego uses. That's what fits best in the system, so why not look for a guy like that somewhere? I really think Cam is the kind of coordinator that emphasizes system over skill - he designs plays to fit a certain style and then tries to get his players to adapt, rather than the other way around. To me that means a guy who is less talented but fits the system will perform better than a talented guy who doesn't. For example, Wes Welker is a top-5 NFL receiver, but I would take Malcolm Floyd over him. Why, because what Cam designs would not play to Welker's strengths, but they would play to Floyd's - I really believe a bigger guy like Floyd would "look" better with Cam than Welker would, simply because Cam's plays suit the bigger guy.

Edited by Ravenslifer, 08 February 2012 - 10:13 AM.

[Rivera]

The only real upgrade we can do in our WR cops is a top 5 WR and we don't have to do that. Drops happens (Wes Welker can drop the ball too) and another medium calliber receiver would not be an upgrade. So let's give more attention to our real need OL