Flacco's Time In The Pocket

[jimmypowder]

After watching the Super Bowl, I'm just amazed as how much time typically Manning
and Brady had to throw the ball. At one point Brady could have had a snack near the goal line
before throwing a td pass.

Is Joe really getting this amount of time to throw the ball? Brady's not that mobile.

[EdReedFTW]

Basically no. The only time joe has that much time from the snap is when its a designed rollout. This season the o line was getting good blocking from the interior but the tackles couldnt hold up on the outside. As the season progressed Birk started to break down so we started getting pressure in the middle too.

[Ravenslifer]

No, Joe doesn't have that kind of time in the pocket. It's to be somewhat expected, because the Steelers have excellent pass rushers, and the Browns and Bengals aren't slouches on defense either. And you have to remember that the Patriots just drafted a new left tackle and the Giants have a very good tackle, while we're still searching for one. However, there are things you can do to either give your quarterback more time or maximize the time he does have - I just don't see this offense doing a whole lot of it.

[flynismo]

Now you understand how badly the deck is stacked against Flacco. A OL that doesn't protect him, and WR who can't get open (and would probably drop the ball even if they did).

[dirtybird10]

[quote name='jimmypowder' timestamp='1328540763' post='986844']
After watching the Super Bowl, I'm just amazed as how much time typically Manning
and Brady had to throw the ball. At one point Brady could have had a snack near the goal line
before throwing a td pass.

Is Joe really getting this amount of time to throw the ball? Brady's not that mobile.
[/quote]
Yea we were talking about that during the game. It was just crazy how much time they had, especially Brady. On that touchdown pass he threw to Edelman (I think it was him) he had over 5 seconds. Thats why its so important to invest in a great O line. Something the Ravens really need to work on. Flacco is lucky when he can get over 3 seconds, think about what he could do with alittle more time.

[dirtybird10]

[quote name='EdReedFTW' timestamp='1328541376' post='986853']
Basically no. The only time joe has that much time from the snap is when its a designed rollout. This season the o line was getting good blocking from the interior but the tackles couldnt hold up on the outside. As the season progressed Birk started to break down so we started getting pressure in the middle too.
[/quote]

Which was really working well, especially against the Pats. Probably because 90% of their pass rush was coming from big Vince right up the gut. I wish we would do more designed rollout plays. Flacco was looking really good when he had an extra second or two.

[CapoRocky]

We have 6 months to discuss the O-line. The big issue is going to be if Birk retires in 2 weeks. Not having a center that is familiar with the playbook can hurt the offense. Next thing is whether or not we re-sign or tag Grubbs. Everyone else is pretty much set in the lineup baring injury.

[ratedr]

Nope. The same for a for Big Ben as well, as much as I can't stand him.

[jimmypowder]

[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1328541485' post='986857']Now you understand how badly the deck is stacked against Flacco. A OL that doesn't protect him, and WR who can't get open (and would probably drop the ball even if they did).[/quote]

Yeah did the Giants receivers have a single drop in the game? I don't recall. The Patriots had a couple,a critical drop by Welker that likely
Cost them the game.If you drop critical play passes your gonna lose .Just ask Evans.

[codizzle]

Wait so a thread defending Joe? Well that's a breath of fresh air

[CapoRocky]

I can't criticize Joe. Try standing in the pocket while being charged by angry men trying to knock you down while throwing a ball between several defenders to a moving receiver. The job is much harder than it looks on TV. He is thinking, running, ducking, and throwing. On top of that, he has Cameron calling the wrong plays 2 out of 10 times.

[Ozzsome]

[quote name='CapoRocky' timestamp='1328542972' post='986888']
I can't criticize Joe. Try standing in the pocket while being charged by angry men trying to knock you down while throwing a ball between several defenders to a moving receiver. The job is much harder than it looks on TV. He is thinking, running, ducking, and throwing. On top of that, he has Cameron calling the wrong plays 2 out of 10 times.
[/quote]
You mean calling the right plays 2 out of 10 times, don't you?

[CapoRocky]

[quote name='Ray The Day' timestamp='1328543834' post='986895']
You mean calling the right plays 2 out of 10 times, don't you?
[/quote]

Either way, we are stuck with Cam for another year.

[Smoke]

The offense line will be a priority this off season. If you give Joe Flacco the time Brandy & Manning have he will become an elite quarterback. Ozzie said it right need to address the offensive line, wide receiver and pass rush.
If we believe in Ozzie and he gets this done, the limit of this team will be unlimited.Looking forward to off season

[CalvinSmoke]

Well at the beginning of the season we essentially had 2 brand new tackles that had quite a bit of a learning curve. And then when they finally got on board, our center started wearing down (it's understandble Birk, much respect for ya). Joe is one or two more seasons from being a top 3 QB in the league. Especially if Peyton hangs em up.

[Romo Ravens]

Kind of hard to do much as a QB when your offensive line can't pass protect in the Air Coryell. That's such a [profanity deleted]ty system

[K-Dog]

I would be a good QB behind Toms O-line.

Okay maybe that is streching things A LOT, but a good O-line will make a world of difference in any QB

[jimmypowder]

[quote name='K-Dog' timestamp='1328551306' post='987020']
I would be a good QB behind Toms O-line.

Okay maybe that is streching things A LOT, but a good O-line will make a world of difference in any QB
[/quote]
So your saying our o-line is pretty weak ? If so,I agree .Did you see how the Giants o-line handled Wilfork! I we had
played like that against Wilfork,we would have won it all.

[Suggs Package]

I don't know what games you guys are watching, but Flacco has more time in the pocket than the majority of QBs in the league, even when facing some of the toughest defenses and being blitzed more than most QBs. Flacco usually gets blitzed on 50% of plays, which is ridiculous and watching the games I can see that. Brady and Eli usually get blitzed around 35% of the time, which is a big difference. Brady and Eli simply don't get blitzed as often because they've proven that they can beat the blitz consistently, Flacco hasn't.

Flacco does still hold the ball longer than most QBs too, maybe because of play design, WRs not getting open, or just not getting the reads.

We have 3 Pro Bowl caliber interior linemen and McKinnie held his own this year. Our OL deserves so much more respect. Yeah Flacco gets pressured, but don't blame it on the OL.

[dirtybird10]

[quote name='Suggs Package' timestamp='1328551753' post='987034']
[b]I don't know what games you guys are watching,[/b] but Flacco has more time in the pocket than the majority of QBs in the league, even when facing some of the toughest defenses and being blitzed more than most QBs. Flacco usually gets blitzed on 50% of plays, which is ridiculous and watching the games I can see that. Brady and Eli usually get blitzed around 35% of the time, which is a big difference. Brady and Eli simply don't get blitzed as often because they've proven that they can beat the blitz consistently, Flacco hasn't.

Flacco does still hold the ball longer than most QBs too, maybe because of play design, WRs not getting open, or just not getting the reads.

We have 3 Pro Bowl caliber interior linemen and McKinnie held his own this year. Our OL deserves so much more respect. Yeah Flacco gets pressured, but don't blame it on the OL.
[/quote]
Well Houston and New England come to mind. Hell New England was blasting through our line on 3 and 4 man rushes. Our offense was complete crap until the second half when we adjusted and gave Flacco plays where he could extend the time by rolling out.

[scrock]

The Ravens need to upgrade their OL at the Center position and are probably going to have to replace Grubbs...also Bryant McKinnie isnt getting younger, he was solid for us this year and probably has a few years left? maybe...

the game is won and lost at the point of attack, the trenches, the OL/DL

[callahan09]

[quote name='Suggs Package' timestamp='1328551753' post='987034']
We have 3 Pro Bowl caliber interior linemen and McKinnie held his own this year. Our OL deserves so much more respect. Yeah Flacco gets pressured, but don't blame it on the OL.
[/quote]

What? It's the OL that gives up pressure, how do you not blame the OL? You make it seem like the offensive line is perfect and every time Flacco has ever been under pressure it's because he held on to the ball for 5 seconds or more. No. He is often under duress within 2 to 3 seconds, that's not a lot of time. Sure, some of the blame for what happens after 3 seconds is on Cam's route design and play calls and the receivers ability to get open, but that same system can work for other teams which have better OLs that can protect for more than 3 seconds to allow a play to develop, and the Ravens OL is definitely not up to that task.

[RedFire]

[quote name='Suggs Package' timestamp='1328551753' post='987034']
I don't know what games you guys are watching, but Flacco has more time in the pocket than the majority of QBs in the league, even when facing some of the toughest defenses and being blitzed more than most QBs. Flacco usually gets blitzed on 50% of plays, which is ridiculous and watching the games I can see that. Brady and Eli usually get blitzed around 35% of the time, which is a big difference. Brady and Eli simply don't get blitzed as often because they've proven that they can beat the blitz consistently, Flacco hasn't.

Flacco does still hold the ball longer than most QBs too, maybe because of play design, WRs not getting open, or just not getting the reads.

We have 3 Pro Bowl caliber interior linemen and McKinnie held his own this year. Our OL deserves so much more respect. Yeah Flacco gets pressured, but don't blame it on the OL.
[/quote]

Zone blitz is used against good running teams like the ravens. What If we run the draw or hand it off...other teams would get burned by not zone blitzing. Teams zone blitz to stop our run...and if we pass joe will have less time. If the o-line can hold up better against zone blitz teams will have to play regular zone which should get ray rice off...which usually happen in games where our line does well.

[RedFire]

[quote name='RedFire' timestamp='1328556732' post='987144']


Zone blitz is used against good running teams like the ravens. What If we run the draw or hand it off...other teams would get burned against the run by not zone bliting. Teams zone blitz to stop our run...and if we pass joe will have less time. If the o-line can hold up better against zone blitz teams will have to play regular zone which should get ray rice off...which usually happen in games where our line does well.
[/quote]


Yessir.

[Suggs Package]

[quote name='dirtybird10' timestamp='1328553460' post='987069']
Well Houston and New England come to mind. Hell New England was blasting through our line on 3 and 4 man rushes. Our offense was complete crap until the second half when we adjusted and gave Flacco plays where he could extend the time by rolling out.
[/quote]

You're right, the OL had their hands full those two games, J.J. Watt in particular, but I'm speaking about the OL over the entire season.

In the Texans game, everyone besides Oher did a relatively good job in pass pro, but Oher was getting schooled all game.

In the Pats game, Oher was getting dominated again in both run and pass situations, hence the rollouts.
Dare I say it: McKinnie was the most consistent lineman for us during these playoffs.

So looking at those two games, Oher gave up 4 or the 7 sacks as well as most of the pressures. The whole line wasn't bad in pass pro, it was just Oher.

[da#1ravensfan]

Flacco don't nearly get that much time nor his recievers don't get open nearly as fast as most teams recievers are that is why he holds the ball longer or throw checkdowns to rice or get sacked. If we had recievers that can separate and get catch the ball when we need it most then we could see us hoisting that Lombardi at the end.

[Suggs Package]

[quote name='callahan09' timestamp='1328556304' post='987126']

What? It's the OL that gives up pressure, how do you not blame the OL? You make it seem like the offensive line is perfect and every time Flacco has ever been under pressure it's because he held on to the ball for 5 seconds or more. No. He is often under duress within 2 to 3 seconds, that's not a lot of time. Sure, some of the blame for what happens after 3 seconds is on Cam's route design and play calls and the receivers ability to get open, but that same system can work for other teams which have better OLs that can protect for more than 3 seconds to allow a play to develop, and the Ravens OL is definitely not up to that task.
[/quote]

I'm not saying the line is perfect, but they are one of the best units in the NFL. I'm just trying to say generally, Joe gets blitzed more than any QB in the NFL, and with that amount of duress, the OL do a great job overall of protecting Joe. I would say getting sacked less than 6% of the time while getting blitzed every other play is the mark of a really good OL. I never said anything about 5 seconds, but its impossible to prevent a pass rush after a certain amount of time. And three seconds is plenty of time in the NFL.

[raybaby]

The OL peaked when Grubbs came back... but as the season went on... there were some struggles.... probably because they were playing the better Ds throughout the season... and it started taking a toll. Maybe it has to do with conditioning? Idk. But it carried into the playoffs... again. They are obviously more comfortable with the run & even that they were struggling with. But they seem 'good' to decent in the regular season and then playoffs come around & they get manhandled by 3 man rushes & struggle to open holes. I don't remember a time in the playoffs in the Flacco era were our O line played well other than with the run in 09 against the Pats. Yes we had two probowlers... but the OL is a unit... it is only as strong as it's weakest link.

[CalvinSmoke]

[quote name='Suggs Package' timestamp='1328557280' post='987166']

I'm not saying the line is perfect, but they are one of the best units in the NFL. I'm just trying to say generally, Joe gets blitzed more than any QB in the NFL, and with that amount of duress, the OL do a great job overall of protecting Joe. I would say getting sacked less than 6% of the time while getting blitzed every other play is the mark of a really good OL. I never said anything about 5 seconds, but its impossible to prevent a pass rush after a certain amount of time. And three seconds is plenty of time in the NFL.
[/quote]
Im going to start off by saying that i respect that your are willing to go against the grain with your opinion. And i agree with you to an extent. In most common offenses 2 or 3 seconds is enough time to get rid of the ball, but we are a team that runs a lot of downfield plays. And there is often times where there are only 3 recieving options on the field (including Ray Rice) so in those situations sometimes the offense really does do a good job but there just aren't enough option, but our o line was manhandled this year when it came to power situations. (Goal line situations, short yardage situations, big nose guards etc)

[raybaby]

[quote name='CalvinSmoke' timestamp='1328562714' post='987295']
but our o line was manhandled this year when it came to power situations. (Goal line situations, short yardage situations, big nose guards etc)
[/quote]

Very very true. In the regular season & post season.