Ray Lewis Gets "Picked On" In Coverage?

[JohnnyBoy8102]

[quote name='52Kia Kaha92' timestamp='1325112377' post='925415']
stats are fun and all but if you watch games its rather obvious ray is a liability in pass coverage, and this is coming from a guy who worships ray like he is god..
[/quote]

Awesome post.

[1/28/01]

[quote name='52Kia Kaha92' timestamp='1325112377' post='925415']
stats are fun and all but if you watch games its rather obvious ray is a liability in pass coverage, and this is coming from a guy who worships ray like he is god..
[/quote]
Stats are fact and this (/\) is opinion.

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='JohnnyBoy8102' timestamp='1325105187' post='925319']

Same type of deal with Ray. In his 11 games played he would be on pace for these numbers in16 games:

128 tackles, 3 sacks, 2 int, 3 Forced Fumbles, 6 Stuffs, & 9 PD

But since he missed 4 games people tend to think his "lower" numbers are due to not playing well or making plays.

He will finish the season this week with nearly 100 tackles & 15+ splash plays in just a dozen games.
[/quote]

Do they have a number on Ed's targets vs. passes completed, like they do the corners?

[JohnnyBoy8102]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1325119605' post='925528']

[b]Do they have a number on Ed's targets vs. passes completed, like they do the corners?[/b]
[/quote]

17/27, 63%, 224 Yards, 58 YAC, 1 TD, 3 INT, 8 PD, 61.9 QB Rating, 570 coverage snaps

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='JohnnyBoy8102' timestamp='1325127291' post='925612']

17/27, 63%, 224 Yards, 58 YAC, 1 TD, 3 INT, 8 PD, 61.9 QB Rating, 570 coverage snaps
[/quote]

Figures. Less than 2 times a game. And people were questioning why his INTs dropped this year.

[1/28/01]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1325128241' post='925621']

Figures.  Less than 2 times a game.  And people were questioning why his INTs dropped this year.
[/quote]
To really put in prospective, I wonder what his target to completion % was last year. Although, he certainly gets picks when he's not the DB being targeted by the books definition.

[Militant X 1]

this was just Ray's 2nd game back AFTER sitting out for 4 weeks. sure, he is a lil' older and it takes the body a few reps and games to get back into the swing of things. it is nowhere near time to put him out to pasture yet. sheesh!

~Mili

[JohnnyBoy8102]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1325130842' post='925631']
this was just Ray's 2nd game back AFTER sitting out for 4 weeks. sure, he is a lil' older and it takes the body a few reps and games to get back into the swing of things. it is nowhere near time to put him out to pasture yet. sheesh!

~Mili
[/quote]

Which is what my data seems to conclude.

He may be slower and visibly "look" slower but this is a results business and the bottom line (no reference to Ray) is that his numbers when targeted are just as good if not better than any other notable ILB in the NFL.

[JohnnyBoy8102]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1325128563' post='925622']
To really put in prospective, I wonder what his target to completion % was last year. Although, he certainly gets picks when he's not the DB being targeted by the books definition.
[/quote]

2010 Ed Reed (Playoff Games included):

14/30, 46.7%, 220 Yards, 50 YAC, 4 TD, 8 INT, 16 PD, 71.5 QB Rating

In the playoffs last season he was 1/2, 4 yards, PD vs KC & Pitt.

His 4 TDs given up were too Roddy White (Week 10), Jacoby Jones & Andre Johnson (Week 14), and Lance Moore (Week 15).

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='JohnnyBoy8102' timestamp='1325131365' post='925635']

2010 Ed Reed (Playoff Games included):

14/30, 46.7%, 220 Yards, 50 YAC, 4 TD, 8 INT, 16 PD, 71.5 QB Rating

In the playoffs last season he was 1/2, 4 yards, PD vs KC & Pitt.

His 4 TDs given up were too Roddy White (Week 10), Jacoby Jones & Andre Johnson (Week 14), and Lance Moore (Week 15).
[/quote]

So 3 times a game. Getting those 8 picks was more ridiculous than I thought. But the opposing qb rating vs. Reed this season seems to have dropped 10 percent. Which tells me that he was phenomenal last year, and is phenomenal this year.

[1/28/01]

[quote name='JohnnyBoy8102' timestamp='1325131365' post='925635']

2010 Ed Reed (Playoff Games included):

14/30, 46.7%, 220 Yards, 50 YAC, 4 TD, 8 INT, 16 PD, 71.5 QB Rating

In the playoffs last season he was 1/2, 4 yards, PD vs KC & Pitt.

His 4 TDs given up were too Roddy White (Week 10), Jacoby Jones & Andre Johnson (Week 14), and Lance Moore (Week 15).
[/quote]
Thats what I suspected. He was targeted more last year (3 times a game compared to less than 2 this). Thanks for the info!!

[JohnnyBoy8102]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1325131816' post='925643']
Thats what I suspected. He was targeted more last year (3 times a game compared to less than 2 this). Thanks for the info!!
[/quote]

No Problem man.

[DMH_in_WA]

[quote name='BenDufusberger' timestamp='1325106865' post='925337']

OK , thanks. I'm always hoping some freebie sites will pop up with this kind of info.
[/quote]

The best free stats sites I've gone to so far is [url="http://hosted.stats.com/fb"]http://hosted.stats.com/fb[/url] ... I'm sure their pay service is probably more robust, but I don't argue with free. [img]http://content.boards.baltimoreravens.com//public/style_emoticons/default/smile.png[/img]

[BenDufusberger]

[quote name='DMH_in_WA' timestamp='1325132227' post='925647']

The best free stats sites I've gone to so far is [url="http://hosted.stats.com/fb"]http://hosted.stats.com/fb[/url] ... I'm sure their pay service is probably more robust, but I don't argue with free. [img]http://content.boards.baltimoreravens.com//public/style_emoticons/default/smile.png[/img]
[/quote]

Yeah , I use that site a lot too , but thanks anyway. If it ain't free , it ain't for me. Ha!

This site has some useful stuff also :

[url="http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/team-stats/"]http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/team-stats/[/url]

This one is handy for looking up penalties , by team or by player , and has other stats as well :

[url="http://www.footballdb.com/penalty-differential.html"]http://www.footballdb.com/penalty-differential.html[/url]

The Ravens are second-best in net penalty differential , at + 314 yds. for the season. Only GB is better , at + 326. The Steelers are way back , at - 80 yds.

[BloodRaven]

[quote name='JohnnyBoy8102' timestamp='1325106531' post='925332']

I buckled down and paid the yearly subscription fee to pro football focus to get numbers like snap counts, targets, drops, etc.
[/quote]

Sharing is caring bro.

[BenDufusberger]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1325131600' post='925640']

So 3 times a game. [b]Getting those 8 picks was more ridiculous than I thought.[/b] But the opposing qb rating vs. Reed this season seems to have dropped 10 percent. Which tells me that he was phenomenal last year, and is phenomenal this year.
[/quote]

Even more ridiculous : If Reed can pick off 8 of 30 pass attempts thrown to a receiver in his general vicinity , how is it possible for Lee Evans to have only 4 receptions out of 24 attempts of balls thrown to him [u]intentionally[/u] ?

It's mind boggling.

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='BenDufusberger' timestamp='1325138607' post='925744'] Even more ridiculous : If Reed can pick off 8 of 30 pass attempts thrown to a receiver in his general vicinity , [b]how is it possible[/b] for Lee Evans to have only 4 receptions out of 24 attempts of balls thrown to him [u]intentionally[/u] ? It's mind boggling.[/quote]

Gimpy leg? It's all I've got. Wait, so 20 of Joe's incompletions are on Lee Evans? Because I've seen a ton of highlights where he should have made the catch and flat out missed it or didn't try for it.

[BenDufusberger]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1325139007' post='925745']

Gimpy leg? It's all I've got. Wait, so 20 of Joe's incompletions are on Lee Evans? Because I've seen a ton of highlights where he should have made the catch and flat out missed it or didn't try for it.
[/quote]

It's pretty clear to me that Joe's [b]effective[/b] completion percentage is over 60% this year , just like in prior years. Give him another 20 or so completions because of the excessive drops and the "force field" around Evans and that would do it.

[-Truth-]

[quote name='BenDufusberger' timestamp='1325138607' post='925744']

Even more ridiculous : If Reed can pick off 8 of 30 pass attempts thrown to a receiver in his general vicinity , how is it possible for Lee Evans to have only 4 receptions out of 24 attempts of balls thrown to him [u]intentionally[/u] ?

It's mind boggling.
[/quote]
According to PFF, only 5 of them were catchable balls. The 5th catchable one was a drop.

[BenDufusberger]

[quote name='-Truth-' timestamp='1325144089' post='925767']
According to PFF, only 5 of them were catchable balls. The 5th catchable one was a drop.
[/quote]

Wow. That's pretty bad.

One thing's for sure - those numbers have to get better or Evans will be sitting more , even if it's not mostly his fault. For a while , at least , I'd like to see them target Evans on more short-range , high-percentage stuff to get his and Joe's confidence up , rather than throwing him difficult sideline passes and such that are tougher catches and typically not Joe's best passes. With the playoffs looming , though , we probably don't have that luxury.

[Ravensstrike4424]

the opposing offensive's are scared to go across the middle,because of Ray Lewis

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='BenDufusberger' timestamp='1325145260' post='925771']

Wow. That's pretty bad.

One thing's for sure - those numbers have to get better or Evans will be sitting more , even if it's not mostly his fault. For a while , at least , I'd like to see them target Evans on more short-range , high-percentage stuff to get his and Joe's confidence up , rather than throwing him difficult sideline passes and such that are tougher catches and typically not Joe's best passes. With the playoffs looming , though , we probably don't have that luxury.
[/quote]

They should be doing that more with every receiver in general. Do you know the biggest problem with this offense, IMO? According to ESPN splits, Joe has thrown 75 passes a distance of 20 or more yards (they have a better breakdown on the site, just to lazy to type it all out) and completed 19 of them. So somewhere around 25 percent. Conversely, at a shorter distance, he is completing somewhere around 60 percent. Drew Brees has only thrown 57 of his passes that distance, and he has 99 more pass attempts than Joe. And a greater percentage of Brees throws are in the 20-30 range, while Joe has thrown (and missed) a lot of 30+ yard passes. Idk how people can call him "the check down king" when he's throwing more deep passes than guys like Rodgers, Brees, and Brady. And all of those incompletions are really hurting his stats. So long, difficult incompletions + ridiculous amount of drops = Joe's numbers this season, IMO.

[CapoRocky]

[quote name='BenDufusberger' timestamp='1325145260' post='925771']

Wow. That's pretty bad.

One thing's for sure - those numbers have to get better or Evans will be sitting more , even if it's not mostly his fault. For a while , at least , I'd like to see them target Evans on more short-range , high-percentage stuff to get his and Joe's confidence up , rather than throwing him difficult sideline passes and such that are tougher catches and typically not Joe's best passes. With the playoffs looming , though , we probably don't have that luxury.
[/quote]

I agree. He needs to study tape of how other receivers fake the deep route and cut back to the sidelines. The key is to sell the deep route to draw in the safety and to get in front of the CB to prevent a pick. Mason was good at this type of route. I'd love to see them use Smith across the middle, too. He has the burst of speed to catch and run. Hopefully, Doss will get a few catches. The most painful part of the Browns game was zero catches for Evans and Doss.

[-Truth-]

[quote name='CapoRocky' timestamp='1325169118' post='925851']

I agree. He needs to study tape of how other receivers fake the deep route and cut back to the sidelines. The key is to sell the deep route to draw in the safety and to get in front of the CB to prevent a pick. Mason was good at this type of route. I'd love to see them use Smith across the middle, too. He has the burst of speed to catch and run. Hopefully, Doss will get a few catches. The most painful part of the Browns game was zero catches for Evans and Doss.
[/quote]
I believe step one would be actually having our play calling utilize those routes first. Out of every WR with over 20 targets, Lee Evans and Torrey Smith are 1st and 2nd in highest percentage of targets being on deep throws. Definitely a little much, in my opinion.

[CapoRocky]

Boldin had a few long passes come his way before he was injured. I'm not sure which offense will show up on Sunday. Hopefully, it is the one that beat the Bengals last time with 2 rushing and 2 passing TDs. The old saying goes, "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me." I don't think the same old "bombs away" approach will work this time. We need to get creative and manufacture a drive built on running the ball and short passes. It all hinges on the defense coming out there with a "lights out" attitude.

[BaltimoreBean]

Jamison Hensley says an unnamed coach states that Ray's toe is not ready to play.

http://espn.go.com/blog/afcnorth/post/_/id/39193/wake-up-hillis-believes-in-madden-curse

[Raven Hammer]

Good Post Totally surprised Never would have thought it I have been thinking Ray should retire Guess i was wrong Thanks

[JohnnyBoy8102]

[quote name='BaltimoreBean' timestamp='1325248938' post='926737']
Jamison Hensley says an unnamed coach states that Ray's toe is not ready to play.

[url="http://espn.go.com/blog/afcnorth/post/_/id/39193/wake-up-hillis-believes-in-madden-curse"]http://espn.go.com/b...in-madden-curse[/url]
[/quote]

He was quoting Michael Preston's report from the Baltimore Sun.

I don't buy it though. Preston can't get any players from the Ravens to talk to him, let alone an opposing teams' coach.

Preston tried to say that Ray's worst game of his career when the Ravens played the Seahawks when Ray graded out at a +1.9 on Pro Football Focus.

He is just an uneducated fan with no football knowledge and who doesn't have any league connections. He just so happens to be the "Beat Writer" for the Ravens.

[Bltravens]

Still dont know why Lewis played last week, I realize when Lewis says he's playing then he's playing but damn.

[ravens rule]

I love Ray but he has definitely been a liability in pass coverage. The chargers motioned their rb out couple weeks they had success and then the browns tried that last week and got a first down. They talk about this on nfl.com playbook.
[url="http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-playbook/09000d5d8258c660/Playbook-Ravens-vs-Bengals?module=HP11_content_stream"]http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-playbook/09000d5d8258c660/Playbook-Ravens-vs-Bengals?module=HP11_content_stream[/url]