So You People Want Stats?

[I*Bleed*Purple]

Here:

[b]Smith[/b]
[b]2007 Reg Season[/b]
48.6% Completion Rate, 51.6 QB Rating

[b]2008 Preseason[/b]
50.0% Completion Rate, 46.8 QB Rating


[b]Flacco[/b]
[b]2008 Preseason[/b]
52.2% Completion Rate, 68.3 QB Rating

[b]2008 Reg Season[/b]
58.5% Completion Rate, 61.9 QB Rating

I think it's very clear that NONE of these numbers are going to get you to the ProBowl, but I don't think these numbers warrant sitting Flacco and starting Smith. So please get off of the whole "Smith is better" or "Smith didn't get a shot". Cause he did. Can we let it die?

[Sam]

I sure hope so. Thanks for the stats.

[Cabinny_X]

While I agree stats give you an idea of where people are to a degree if we were to measure people by strictly numbers we would never find the Diamonds in the rough! I am not saying that Flacco should not be Quarterback I am just saying that both bring qualities to the team that should not be scorned upon. Troy does bring a certain amount of the qualities Joe has shown to the team, and like Joe he should be given a bit of leiniency as well allowing for experience. The only exp he has accrued came during the final games of a already failed season and should not be levied against him as argument material. I think that the qualities that he brings would be invaluble as well.

I think of the Ravens as my team and never really try to look at them as individuals, as we all watch the games as one person has a so so game another steps up for the most part. I would say do the same with the QB situation, they are team mates and if Joe should falter to the point where he is genuinely hurting the team then I will be happy to cheer on anyone whom replaces him irreguardless of the stats they bring to the table.

[b][size=7]GO RAVENS in 2008![/size][/b]

[I*Bleed*Purple]

[quote name='Cabinny_X' post='73269' date='Oct 5 2008, 11:59 PM']While I agree stats give you an idea of where people are to a degree if we were to measure people by strictly numbers we would never find the Diamonds in the rough! I am not saying that Flacco should not be Quarterback I am just saying that both bring qualities to the team that should not be scorned upon. Troy does bring a certain amount of the qualities Joe has shown to the team, and like Joe he should be given a bit of leiniency as well allowing for experience. The only exp he has accrued came during the final games of a already failed season and should not be levied against him as argument material. I think that the qualities that he brings would be invaluble as well.

I think of the Ravens as my team and never really try to look at them as individuals, as we all watch the games as one person has a so so game another steps up for the most part. I would say do the same with the QB situation, they are team mates and if Joe should falter to the point where he is genuinely hurting the team then I will be happy to cheer on anyone whom replaces him irreguardless of the stats they bring to the table.

[b][size=7]GO RAVENS in 2008![/size][/b][/quote]


I also think Troy should be utilized. He is a very talented athlete. I think we will see Cam using him at WR, RB, etc. because he is fast and he can throw the ball. I feel that if he were to sit on the bench it would be a HUGE waste of talent. And I think Troy will be open to this because it would make him more valuable to other teams as well. Just a thought

[ravensgirlx88]

Im also tired of hearing about this.. The answer doe's NOT just lie in our QB's hands.. I think the whole offesnive line needs to step up a bit & give this boy some decent time to get rid of the ball..

[Bobby]

Yes, we need to score more points......BUT the defense needed to just get a stop and allowed not one but two LOOOOONG drives at the end of the game to lose that one. The refs hurt us, but we looked awful down the stretch again.

[Troy SmiTH Xx]

[quote name='ravensgirlx88' post='73290' date='Oct 6 2008, 08:13 AM']Im also tired of hearing about this.. The answer doe's NOT just lie in our QB's hands.. [b]I think the whole offesnive line needs to step up[/b] a bit & give this boy some decent time to get rid of the ball..[/quote]
Our offensive line has been doing a spectacular job. Especially against two top 5 ranked defenses in back to back games. There were no sacks against Tennessee. Pittsburgh was pretty good though. But saying the O-Line needs to step up is like saying Tom Brady needed to throw more TD's last season.

[Guest Moderator8]

No, what the Ravens need is a legitimate deep threat, and for Flacco to add some "seasoning", which will only occur from him playing and gaining experience.

[Troy SmiTH Xx]

Joe Flacco still needs to learn the offense before we start throwing deep passing on occassion. We do have deep threats in Mason and Williams. Figurs can also be developed into one, we just need to help him develop into that and use his speed take advantage of the Defensive Backs.

[itlstl7]

[quote name='I*Bleed*Purple' post='73256' date='Oct 6 2008, 12:12 AM']Here:

[b]Smith[/b]
[b]2007 Reg Season[/b]
48.6% Completion Rate, 51.6 QB Rating

[b]2008 Preseason[/b]
50.0% Completion Rate, 46.8 QB Rating


[b]Flacco[/b]
[b]2008 Preseason[/b]
52.2% Completion Rate, 68.3 QB Rating

[b]2008 Reg Season[/b]
58.5% Completion Rate, 61.9 QB Rating

I think it's very clear that NONE of these numbers are going to get you to the ProBowl, but I don't think these numbers warrant sitting Flacco and starting Smith. So please get off of the whole "Smith is better" or "Smith didn't get a shot". Cause he did. Can we let it die?[/quote]

Just curious...where did you pull these stats from?? I have completely different stats for Troy check nfl.com [url="http://www.nfl.com/players/profile?id=SMI764846"]http://www.nfl.com/players/profile?id=SMI764846[/url]

Am I missing something?

[twiz42]

Flacco is our future smith had his shot and dint do crap.they need to let flacco throw a few deep balls a game . atleast give him a chance to make a play. all these damn passes to the sidelines.if he gets picked atleast it will be 30 plus yds down the field.

[neepo13]

[quote name='ravensgirlx88' post='73290' date='Oct 6 2008, 08:13 AM']Im also tired of hearing about this.. The answer doe's NOT just lie in our QB's hands.. I think the whole offesnive line needs to step up a bit & give this boy some decent time to get rid of the ball..[/quote]

Its not all on the offensive line. Some of Flacco's troubles have been simple decision making and lack of experience. On both his fumbles against Pitt, he had room to step up and get rid of the ball. A vet would do that, as we later saw Big Ben do. A rookie eventually learns thats what he has to do. And he's got to learn to simply live to play another down and just throw the ball away. He had a few opportunities to do that against the Titans but he didnt. Its a total team effort.

[foreversunny23]

I think it's a combination of Flacco making some bad throws and the way our offense is set up. Defenses know that we will run the ball or make short passes. As a result, they can stack the box and shrink the playing field. This gives Joe little room for error. I think his timing with the receivers is still developing. That is why his accuracy isn't so great. As a result, he will be more prone to throwing picks.

I don't think Troy will be any better than what Flacco is doing right now. Troy's accuracy is also questionable. Given more time to learn Cam Cameron's offense and having a deep threat, I think both QBs would be successful. With the current tools we have we won't be scoring more than 20 points very much. Demetrius Williams is our only deep option right now. If he can't get open and fight for jump balls, then both Flacco and Smith will not have much room to work with...

[CARavensFan]

[quote name='foreversunny23' post='73416' date='Oct 6 2008, 01:37 PM']I think it's a combination of Flacco making some bad throws and the way our offense is set up. Defenses know that we will run the ball or make short passes. As a result, they can stack the box and shrink the playing field. This gives Joe little room for error. I think his timing with the receivers is still developing. That is why his accuracy isn't so great. As a result, he will be more prone to throwing picks.

I don't think Troy will be any better than what Flacco is doing right now. Troy's accuracy is also questionable. Given more time to learn Cam Cameron's offense and having a deep threat, I think both QBs would be successful. With the current tools we have we won't be scoring more than 20 points very much. Demetrius Williams is our only deep option right now. If he can't get open and fight for jump balls, then both Flacco and Smith will not have much room to work with...[/quote]

I've been saying this for a bit about our offense, we're giving Cam Cameron and Brian Billick-built offense and asking him to remake it in his own image, you can't expect an OC as good as Cam to perform miracles in about 3 months (including the time since he was hired), I think so far he's done a good job with what he has to work with. But honestly other than Flacco, Neal, Marcus Smith, Ray Rice, and the rookie O-linemen we got in the draft everyone else was drafted by Billick and fit HIS scheme not Cam's so that fact that the offense still has Billick-like moments on the field shouldn't surprise anyone that much.

I'd give this offense at the minimum half the season before passing judgement on it and I wouldn't really expect them to be what we would call an elite offense until Cam has time to get more of HIS type of guys on the team. Give a little time and we'll get some really big returns (ex. San Diego under Cam )

[PuRock]

[quote name='CARavensFan' post='73429' date='Oct 6 2008, 05:09 PM']I've been saying this for a bit about our offense, we're giving Cam Cameron and Brian Billick-built offense and asking him to remake it in his own image, you can't expect an OC as good as Cam to perform miracles in about 3 months (including the time since he was hired).[/quote]

I love instant gratification as much as the next guy. But I keep my expectations in check, unlike many on here. Being 2-2, and being competitive in both games, deserves some applause. We are only 4 games into the Harbaugh/Cameron/Ryan era.

[nevermore621]

[quote name='Moderator8' post='73294' date='Oct 6 2008, 08:25 AM']No, what the Ravens need is a legitimate deep threat, and for Flacco to add some "seasoning", which will only occur from him playing and gaining experience.[/quote]
BTW thanks for the stats...they put everything in perspective.

As to a tall, deep threat receiver...the Ravens drafted a couple from free agency this last off season...they did not make the team. It would be great to get a legitimate deep threat like TO or Randy Moss, but those guys are a rarity. In the meantime, until we can get one, I was glad to see EVERYBODY steppedl up and made catches, D Mason, Clayton, Williams, Heap, etc. this last game. And that against a top 5 defense in Tennessee. So the improvements are showing all around, and I think all we need is a little more patience.

[CARavensFan]

[quote name='PuRock' post='73435' date='Oct 6 2008, 02:20 PM']I love instant gratification as much as the next guy. But I keep my expectations in check, unlike many on here. Being 2-2, and being competitive in both games, deserves some appluase. We are only 4 games into the Harbaugh/Cameron/Ryan era.[/quote]

I agree completely PuRock, they have taken a team that everyone expect to go nowhere this year and be in the midst of a "massive" rebuilding project and have beat two teams, granted two BAD teams, but also kept them close against two teams considered the top of the AFC and all this was with our defense (which is still stellar) and a slightly retooled Brian Billick-built offense, with only a few pieces that have changed from last year (QB, a FB, a RT, and a 4th round WR), so the fact that they have done this much is amazing and just hows what a difference a good gameplan and good coaching can do.

Bravo Harbaugh, Cameron, and Ryan keep it up and we'll get that dynasty yet!

[Corvus]

Why is this topic even relevant? I have seen very few people on here calling for Troy to start, and the ones who have simply have a crush on the guy.
It's Flacco's job and I think everyone can agree on that unless he really just starts doing horrible, which he hasn't been so far.

But in Troy's defense, here's another link to ESPN.com with his '07 stats...52.6% completions, and a 79.5 passer rating, so just get your facts right before trying to keep another non-existent quarterback "controversy" fueled.
[url="http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?playerId=10617"]ESPN link[/url]

And that's all I will say, this topic does not merit any further discussion.

[SickBoy]

[quote name='I*Bleed*Purple' post='73256' date='Oct 6 2008, 12:12 AM']Here:

[b]Smith[/b]
[b]2007 Reg Season[/b]
48.6% Completion Rate, 51.6 QB Rating

[b]2008 Preseason[/b]
50.0% Completion Rate, 46.8 QB Rating


[b]Flacco[/b]
[b]2008 Preseason[/b]
52.2% Completion Rate, 68.3 QB Rating

[b]2008 Reg Season[/b]
58.5% Completion Rate, 61.9 QB Rating

I think it's very clear that NONE of these numbers are going to get you to the ProBowl, but I don't think these numbers warrant sitting Flacco and starting Smith. So please get off of the whole "Smith is better" or "Smith didn't get a shot". Cause he did. Can we let it die?[/quote]
[size=4]
Completion percentage isn't losing football games. Get some turnover stats buddy!!![/size]

[neepo13]

[quote name='PuRock' post='73435' date='Oct 6 2008, 05:20 PM']I love instant gratification as much as the next guy. But I keep my expectations in check, unlike many on here. Being 2-2, and being competitive in both games, deserves some appluase. We are only 4 games into the Harbaugh/Cameron/Ryan era.[/quote]

I agree 100%. To me the playoffs would be a bonus. It hurts to lose but would you rather watch the game until the end to see them lose or turn it off at halftime and know they lost?

[neepo13]

[quote name='CARavensFan' post='73429' date='Oct 6 2008, 05:09 PM']I've been saying this for a bit about our offense, we're giving Cam Cameron and Brian Billick-built offense and asking him to remake it in his own image, you can't expect an OC as good as Cam to perform miracles in about 3 months (including the time since he was hired), I think so far he's done a good job with what he has to work with. But honestly other than Flacco, Neal, Marcus Smith, Ray Rice, and the rookie O-linemen we got in the draft everyone else was drafted by Billick and fit HIS scheme not Cam's so that fact that the offense still has Billick-like moments on the field shouldn't surprise anyone that much.

I'd give this offense at the minimum half the season before passing judgement on it and I wouldn't really expect them to be what we would call an elite offense until Cam has time to get more of HIS type of guys on the team. Give a little time and we'll get some really big returns (ex. San Diego under Cam ) [/quote]

Looking at this offense from last year, there is a HUGE improvement. I think people have just raised the bar on him. They seem to forget that this is the same offense that came one garbage time TD away from being shutout at home by Bengals defense.

[YABOY]

This troy vs joe thing is stupid why do some of you like one better then the other anway both of them have played good.last year when troy played he threw no picks & beat a team we hate the steelers & this year joe got us to start off 2-0 i don't care who the qb is it can be troy,joe, ray lewis, kobe bryant, lil wayne or even flava flav as long as the ravens can win i don't care

[bossman419]

[quote name='Troy SmiTH Xx' post='73304' date='Oct 6 2008, 08:46 AM']Joe Flacco still needs to learn the offense before we start throwing deep passing on occassion. We do have deep threats in Mason and Williams. Figurs can also be developed into one, we just need to help him develop into that and use his speed take advantage of the Defensive Backs.[/quote]
Iam as much as a deep threat as mason and figurs is a track guy wearing pads and a helmet. the jury is still out on d-will but its safe to say we need a big play WR

[raven43]

Wow, this thread is retarded, Smith deserves at least a shot.

[Troy SmiTH Xx]

[quote name='bossman419' post='73506' date='Oct 6 2008, 08:06 PM']Iam as much as a deep threat as mason and figurs is a track guy wearing pads and a helmet. the jury is still out on d-will but its safe to say we need a big play WR[/quote]


Well, I don't think we do. Thats your opinion and this is mine. Let's turn our attention to a bigger issue...

What do you think could be done about the economic crisis our country is facing right now?

[adio1988]

I like what some people are saying on here, but I always say a qb is only as good as his wr's and offensive line.

[itlstl7]

some stats....

2008 regular season Touchdown Passes:

Ronnie Brown [b]RB [/b] ----- 1
Brian Moorman [b]P[/b] ----- 1
Antwaan Randle El [b]WR[/b] ----- 1
Chester Taylor [b]RB [/b] ----- 1
JOE FLACCO [b]QB[/b] ----- 1

....Just staying on topic with the thread....

[Corvus]

[quote name='itlstl7' post='73823' date='Oct 8 2008, 11:17 AM']some stats....

2008 regular season Touchdown Passes:

Ronnie Brown [b]RB [/b] ----- 1
Brian Moorman [b]P[/b] ----- 1
Antwaan Randle El [b]WR[/b] ----- 1
Chester Taylor [b]RB [/b] ----- 1
JOE FLACCO [b]QB[/b] ----- 1

....Just staying on topic with the thread....[/quote]

very true, not sure why our coaching staff is so scared to run plays that allow Joe to use his arm strength and put the ball downfield a few times per game. This short pass semi west-coast style won't work forever (and it has been working with only moderate success so far), all of our opponents know it.

[Marc2k6]

[quote name='YABOY' post='73505' date='Oct 6 2008, 08:05 PM']This troy vs joe thing is stupid why do some of you like one better then the other anway both of them have played good.last year when troy played he threw no picks & beat a team we hate the steelers & this year joe got us to start off 2-0 i don't care who the qb is it can be troy,joe, ray lewis, kobe bryant, lil wayne or even flava flav as long as the ravens can win i don't care[/quote]


Troy Smith was so good in college a lot of people want to see him have the same type of success in the NFL. I think he can have a good run in the
NFL but I think it will be with another team.

[Byrdz]

[quote name='I*Bleed*Purple' post='73256' date='Oct 6 2008, 12:12 AM']Here:

[b]Smith[/b]
[b]2007 Reg Season[/b]
48.6% Completion Rate, 51.6 QB Rating

[b]2008 Preseason[/b]
50.0% Completion Rate, 46.8 QB Rating


[b]Flacco[/b]
[b]2008 Preseason[/b]
52.2% Completion Rate, 68.3 QB Rating

[b]2008 Reg Season[/b]
58.5% Completion Rate, 61.9 QB Rating

I think it's very clear that NONE of these numbers are going to get you to the ProBowl, but I don't think these numbers warrant sitting Flacco and starting Smith. So please get off of the whole "Smith is better" or "Smith didn't get a shot". Cause he did. Can we let it die?[/quote]
heres another stat 25.1 Qb rating