The Ravens, The Refs, And The Rest

[FerrariFan87]

As a Ravens fan, I have observed and experienced an extreme lack of respect for both our team, and this city ever since our inauguration in 1996. For one, when the Browns moved from Cleveland to Baltimore, the Commissioner at the time, Paul Tagliabue, made certain that ALL of the Browns records remained in Cleveland. This is very interesting because if I am not mistaken, the Baltimore Colts up and left in the middle of the night some 20-odd years ago and, what do you know, all of the records achieved by the BALTIMORE COLTS were now considered INDIANAPOLIS COLTS' records. Where is the justice in that? Why didn't the Commissioner afford Baltimore that same privilege and respect? This fact is probably one of the most upsetting to me, and I wasn't even born when the Colts left us.

On to officiating bias. Now, I assure you that every fan believes the refs are out to get their team. This, however, is certainly NOT the case. Too many Sundays I have witnessed the Steelers, Cowboys, Pats, Colts and other NFL darlings enjoy a fairly penalty-free game or a game when the refs don't screw them (ask the Chargers); the most glaring disparities in "fair and un-biased" refereeing occurs when the Ravens play these teams. Now, I may be paranoid, and I probably am blinded by my devotion to this team, but it seems that way too often we are getting bombarded with holdings, blocks in the back, etc. when we play these teams that they aren't getting called for when it is blatantly obvious to everyone else!

Suffice it to say that I believe the NFL just doesn't like this team for whatever reason, and I just don't get it considering we are the 10th most valuable franchise in the whole league! I hope under Commissioner Goodell this changes, but right now, we seem to be the odd team out when it comes to the NFL appreciating us or highlighting our accomplishments and work in the community, which is just as important.... Oh, and this lack of respect extends to the media-at-large as well, but I don't have the time to dive into that.

So, am I crazy?

[bossman419]

tabli boo boo told us to build a muesem, well we will do even better! we will erect a statue to him sitting on a toilet wondering why he gave carolina a franchise before baltimore

[thewarden86]

[quote name='FerrariFan87' post='66713' date='Sep 17 2008, 05:18 PM']As a Ravens fan, I have observed and experienced an extreme lack of respect for both our team, and this city ever since our inauguration in 1996. For one, when the Browns moved from Cleveland to Baltimore, the Commissioner at the time, Paul Tagliabue, made certain that ALL of the Browns records remained in Cleveland. This is very interesting because if I am not mistaken, the Baltimore Colts up and left in the middle of the night some 20-odd years ago and, what do you know, all of the records achieved by the BALTIMORE COLTS were now considered INDIANAPOLIS COLTS' records. Where is the justice in that? Why didn't the Commissioner afford Baltimore that same privilege and respect? This fact is probably one of the most upsetting to me, and I wasn't even born when the Colts left us.[/quote]

The Colts didn't have to ask permission to move back then..., and they remained "The Colts."
One of the conditions of Modell moving the Browns was that he could not take the name or the records. Pretty fair since soon after leaving Cleveland, that same Browns team (which was nearly a finished product) finally one a Super Bowl.., but for the people of Baltimore. In any event, the policy has changed.


[quote name='FerrariFan87' post='66713' date='Sep 17 2008, 05:18 PM']On to officiating bias. Now, I assure you that every fan believes the refs are out to get their team. This, however, is certainly NOT the case. Too many Sundays I have witnessed the Steelers, Cowboys, Pats, Colts and other NFL darlings enjoy a fairly penalty-free game or a game when the refs don't screw them (ask the Chargers); the most glaring disparities in "fair and un-biased" refereeing occurs when the Ravens play these teams. Now, I may be paranoid, and I probably am blinded by my devotion to this team, but it seems that way too often we are getting bombarded with holdings, blocks in the back, etc. when we play these teams that they aren't getting called for when it is blatantly obvious to everyone else![/quote]

I can't speak for all, but I know the Steelers the other night had some phantom calls thrown thier way, whereas the Browns had none. Still, I don't believe it to be anything unusual. There will always be mistakes by the Refs, and there will always be fans that will scream conspiracy. If you look at those who are doing the screaming, they tend to be bandwagoneers (See New England Patriots Fans).

[quote name='FerrariFan87' post='66713' date='Sep 17 2008, 05:18 PM']Suffice it to say that I believe the NFL just doesn't like this team for whatever reason, and I just don't get it considering we are the 10th most valuable franchise in the whole league! I hope under Commissioner Goodell this changes, but right now, we seem to be the odd team out when it comes to the NFL appreciating us or highlighting our accomplishments and work in the community, which is just as important.... Oh, and this lack of respect extends to the media-at-large as well, but I don't have the time to dive into that.

So, am I crazy? [/quote]

I wouldn't call you crazy, but I don't agree that the Ravens are "disliked" by anyone but thier rivals. As far as respect and appreciation, ask any Giants fan about that. The Super Bowl Champs weren't even picked to be in the top half of their own division. THAT is a lack of respect.

[#1 D]

nice post, warden. thats true, but ravens fans can't help but notice how lopsidedly in favor the refs are of the other team than the ravens. i.e. the ravens-lions game a couple of years ago, the ravens committed like 21 penalties and an ejection from Suggs. I remember there was one play where our qb was getting sacked and he threw the ball awkwardly. the refs called it a fumble, whereas clearly it was a forward pass and an incompletion. the more annoying part was that we were in a pos. to score. the refs, after looking at a replay after a challange, bull****ted the call towards their favor. i seriously think sometimes that the refs bet on games, like that NBA dude, its just that the NFL hasnt recognized it yet.

[mhead66]

[quote name='FerrariFan87' post='66713' date='Sep 17 2008, 06:18 PM']As a Ravens fan, I have observed and experienced an extreme lack of respect for both our team, and this city ever since our inauguration in 1996. For one, when the Browns moved from Cleveland to Baltimore, the Commissioner at the time, Paul Tagliabue, made certain that ALL of the Browns records remained in Cleveland. This is very interesting because if I am not mistaken, the Baltimore Colts up and left in the middle of the night some 20-odd years ago and, what do you know, all of the records achieved by the BALTIMORE COLTS were now considered INDIANAPOLIS COLTS' records. Where is the justice in that? Why didn't the Commissioner afford Baltimore that same privilege and respect? This fact is probably one of the most upsetting to me, and I wasn't even born when the Colts left us.

On to officiating bias. Now, I assure you that every fan believes the refs are out to get their team. This, however, is certainly NOT the case. Too many Sundays I have witnessed the Steelers, Cowboys, Pats, Colts and other NFL darlings enjoy a fairly penalty-free game or a game when the refs don't screw them (ask the Chargers); the most glaring disparities in "fair and un-biased" refereeing occurs when the Ravens play these teams. Now, I may be paranoid, and I probably am blinded by my devotion to this team, but it seems that way too often we are getting bombarded with holdings, blocks in the back, etc. when we play these teams that they aren't getting called for when it is blatantly obvious to everyone else!

Suffice it to say that I believe the NFL just doesn't like this team for whatever reason, and I just don't get it considering we are the 10th most valuable franchise in the whole league! I hope under Commissioner Goodell this changes, but right now, we seem to be the odd team out when it comes to the NFL appreciating us or highlighting our accomplishments and work in the community, which is just as important.... Oh, and this lack of respect extends to the media-at-large as well, but I don't have the time to dive into that.

So, am I crazy? [/quote]

Over the last four years, the Ravens have been 29th, 32nd, 27th and 26th in the league in penalties. Is this because the NFL hates Baltimore, or is the team at fault?

My grandfather was a die-hard Steelers fan, and I remember him shouting at the TV, that the refs all hated the Steelers. The Browns' forum is full of disillusioned fans, blaming Crennel, Savage... and even, yes, the refs. EVERYONE thinks the refs are "out to get them" - but I think the truth is, disciplined teams are penalized less than undisciplined ones, period. When players are drilled, in training camp, to stop when the QB releases the ball, they don't get penalized as much. Choosing not to make a block, instead of blocking in the back on punts, must be constantly reiterated. Moving your feet to get in front of a defender, instead of reaching out and grabbing him on a running play... lots of examples.

Besides, if the NFL bigwigs truly don't like the Ravens, it will be much sweeter when they win... smile in the face of the devil, eh?

[Moderator 2]

That was called Superbowl xxxv

[quote]Besides, if the NFL bigwigs truly don't like the Ravens, it will be much sweeter when they win... [b]smile in the face of the devil, eh[/b]?[/quote]

[PuRock]

[quote name='thewarden86' post='66716' date='Sep 17 2008, 05:39 PM']I wouldn't call you crazy, but I don't agree that the Ravens are "disliked" by anyone but thier rivals. As far as respect and appreciation, ask any Giants fan about that. The Super Bowl Champs weren't even picked to be in the top half of their own division. THAT is a lack of respect.[/quote]

I second that opinion. Nobody really hates us besides our rivals and their fans. The Refs do the jobs that they are paid to do. It's not like they have a secret society to make phantom calls against certain teams. They make mistakes, just like I make mistakes at my job. I've seen plenty of calls go our way, buts its always the ones against us that leaves that sour taste in out mouth, so that we can turn around and say "look at how they slight us!". And it isn't like Rodger Goodell sits at his desks and calls a meeting to see how he can disgrace ours and other football teams.

There is only one way to gain respect and that is to win and be professional about it. And if that doesn't gain their respect, than who cares about those people. See "New York Giants".

Really the perception of who has respect is not through the NFL, but through the media. ESPN, CBS, NBC, et al. They sell entertainment. So whoever is the hot ticket at the moment, gets all the praise. Our offense doesn't excite anyone. Our story lines aren't compeling. They are to us and we do not understand why others do not see it.

I feel certain that we are treated as fairly as can be by the NFL. And if we have to blame bad calls for a losing season, than we are far from winning a superbowl.

[ravensgirlx88]

[quote name='FerrariFan87' post='66713' date='Sep 17 2008, 06:18 PM']As a Ravens fan, I have observed and experienced an extreme lack of respect for both our team, and this city ever since our inauguration in 1996. For one, when the Browns moved from Cleveland to Baltimore, the Commissioner at the time, Paul Tagliabue, made certain that ALL of the Browns records remained in Cleveland. This is very interesting because if I am not mistaken, the Baltimore Colts up and left in the middle of the night some 20-odd years ago and, what do you know, all of the records achieved by the BALTIMORE COLTS were now considered INDIANAPOLIS COLTS' records. Where is the justice in that? Why didn't the Commissioner afford Baltimore that same privilege and respect? This fact is probably one of the most upsetting to me, and I wasn't even born when the Colts left us.

On to officiating bias. Now, I assure you that every fan believes the refs are out to get their team. This, however, is certainly NOT the case. Too many Sundays I have witnessed the Steelers, Cowboys, Pats, Colts and other NFL darlings enjoy a fairly penalty-free game or a game when the refs don't screw them (ask the Chargers); the most glaring disparities in "fair and un-biased" refereeing occurs when the Ravens play these teams. Now, I may be paranoid, and I probably am blinded by my devotion to this team, but it seems that way too often we are getting bombarded with holdings, blocks in the back, etc. when we play these teams that they aren't getting called for when it is blatantly obvious to everyone else!

Suffice it to say that I believe the NFL just doesn't like this team for whatever reason, and I just don't get it considering we are the 10th most valuable franchise in the whole league! I hope under Commissioner Goodell this changes, but right now, we seem to be the odd team out when it comes to the NFL appreciating us or highlighting our accomplishments and work in the community, which is just as important.... Oh, and this lack of respect extends to the media-at-large as well, but I don't have the time to dive into that.

So, am I crazy? [/quote]



NO! your not crazy! this annoys me to no END.. i hate how we are always picked to lose games.. and how we never get the respect we deserve even when we win.. its like if we lose they talk more about it and say how pitiful we look, if we win theres like a min. run thru of the game and thats it.. it does seem like officiating always goes to the other teams benefits(PATRIOTS GAME?!!!) also.. how comes teams like new england get the EASIEST scheduele and we get a pretty hard one?.. its like they dont want us to go anywhere.. i like being under the radar but its annoying to constantly hear other teams say that the ravens arent talented and arent going anywhere... sooo many people are saying the browns are gunna beat us!!.. WHATEVER i mean i know they are hungry for a win coming off a 2 week loss but we are coming off a bye week.. @ HOME!!!!!!!! come ON people

[Guest Moderator8]

[quote name='thewarden86' post='66716' date='Sep 17 2008, 06:39 PM']One of the conditions of Modell moving the Browns was that he could not take the name or the records. Pretty fair since soon after leaving Cleveland, that same Browns team (which was nearly a finished product) finally one a Super Bowl.., but for the people of Baltimore. In any event, the policy has changed.[/quote]


I have to disagree with the statement that the Ravens were nearly a finished product coming over from Cleveland. By the time the Ravens won SB XXXV....if my memory serves me...their were only about 4 maybe 5 players left on the team that had ever played in Cleveland. Webster, Stover, the punter Richardson(?) and maybe one or two others at the most.

The rest had been cut, traded, or left via F/A.

Matt Stover is the lone current Raven on the Roster that ever played in Cleveland as an original Brown.

[theFRANCHISE]

[quote name='Moderator8' post='66724' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:05 PM']I have to disagree with the statement that the Ravens were nearly a finished product coming over from Cleveland. By the time the Ravens won SB XXXV....if my memory serves me...their were only about 4 maybe 5 players left on the team that had ever played in Cleveland. Webster, Stover, the punter Richardson(?) and maybe one or two others at the most.

The rest had been cut, traded, or left via F/A.

Matt Stover is the lone current Raven on the Roster that ever played in Cleveland as an original Brown.[/quote]

I believe you're correct about the Ravens' Super Bowl XXXV roster having only a couple of players from the Cleveland Browns era. And if you want to extend it to the front office, only a couple of personnel members were around during the Cleveland days, most notably Ozzie Newsome.

[thewarden86]

[quote name='Moderator8' post='66724' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:05 PM']I have to disagree with the statement that the Ravens were nearly a finished product coming over from Cleveland. By the time the Ravens won SB XXXV....if my memory serves me...their were only about 4 maybe 5 players left on the team that had ever played in Cleveland. Webster, Stover, the punter Richardson(?) and maybe one or two others at the most.

The rest had been cut, traded, or left via F/A.

Matt Stover is the lone current Raven on the Roster that ever played in Cleveland as an original Brown.[/quote]


Hmmm, you may be right. I thought Ray Lewis was a Brown, but I guess not. That was a long time ago and I have a crappy memory. Still, the Brownies waited, and waited..., and waited. Lost thier team and then saw that team win it all within 4 years. That's GOT to hurt.

[thewarden86]

[quote name='ravensgirlx88' post='66723' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:01 PM']NO! your not crazy! this annoys me to no END.. i hate how we are always picked to lose games.. and how we never get the respect we deserve even when we win.. its like if we lose they talk more about it and say how pitiful we look, if we win theres like a min. run thru of the game and thats it.. it does seem like officiating always goes to the other teams benefits(PATRIOTS GAME?!!!) also.. [b]how comes teams like new england get the EASIEST scheduele and we get a pretty hard one?[/b].. its like they dont want us to go anywhere.. i like being under the radar but its annoying to constantly hear other teams say that the ravens arent talented and arent going anywhere... sooo many people are saying the browns are gunna beat us!!.. WHATEVER i mean i know they are hungry for a win coming off a 2 week loss but we are coming off a bye week.. @ HOME!!!!!!!! come ON people[/quote]


For the most part, that's predetermined with the exception of two games.

[PuRock]

[quote name='thewarden86' post='66727' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:13 PM']Hmmm, you may be right. I thought Ray Lewis was a Brown, but I guess not. That was a long time ago and I have a crappy memory. Still, the Brownies waited, and waited..., and waited. Lost thier team and then saw that team win it all within 4 years. That's GOT to hurt.[/quote]

He was drafted in our inagural season 1996

[BrownsFan]

Ferrari,

I'm curious do you think there's some sort of conspiracy then when it comes to officiating? I mean why does the NFL "hate" the Ravens more than other NFL teams in your opinion? I see penalties called all the time no matter what game I'm watching.

As far as the whole Browns move touched on that topic way too many times, not going there LOL.

[bossman419]

[quote name='thewarden86' post='66727' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:13 PM']Hmmm, you may be right. I thought Ray Lewis was a Brown, but I guess not. That was a long time ago and I have a crappy memory. Still, the Brownies waited, and waited..., and waited. Lost thier team and then saw that team win it all within 4 years. That's GOT to hurt.[/quote]
is that any different to the colts fans who had to see johnny u go in as a indanapolis colt and every time the ravens play them we have to see his number hanging from thier roof?

the least they could do is give baltimore its entitled history. without johnny u and the colts the NFL would not be what it is today

[bossman419]

[quote name='ravensgirlx88' post='66723' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:01 PM']NO! your not crazy! this annoys me to no END.. i hate how we are always picked to lose games.. and how we never get the respect we deserve even when we win.. its like if we lose they talk more about it and say how pitiful we look, if we win theres like a min. run thru of the game and thats it.. it does seem like officiating always goes to the other teams benefits(PATRIOTS GAME?!!!) also.. how comes teams like new england get the EASIEST scheduele and we get a pretty hard one?.. its like they dont want us to go anywhere.. i like being under the radar but its annoying to constantly hear other teams say that the ravens arent talented and arent going anywhere... sooo many people are saying the browns are gunna beat us!!.. WHATEVER i mean i know they are hungry for a win coming off a 2 week loss but we are coming off a bye week.. @ HOME!!!!!!!! come ON people[/quote]
this kinda of bias has to do with how the media changes their content to appease the masses. if the ravens had the biggest fanbase, made the most money, and had the kind of tradition as some of the other teams we would get more respect

[PuRock]

Look at Los Angeles, they have a huge media market. And they are going now 14? seasons without a team. That is a top tier city.

I'm just happy we have a team in Baltimore again. As far as the referees bad calls, I can live with that. Living without a team, is something I cannot.

[bossman419]

[quote name='PuRock' post='66737' date='Sep 17 2008, 06:37 PM']Look at Los Angeles, they have a huge media market. And they are going now 14? seasons without a team. That is a top tier city.

I'm just happy we have a team in Baltimore again. As far as the referees bad calls, I can live with that. Living without a team, is something I cannot.[/quote]
i think that in LA there is too much going on. NBA, MLB, 2 big NCAA teams. i dont see why LA would want another sports team

[bossman419]

[quote name='thewarden86' post='66716' date='Sep 17 2008, 05:39 PM']The Colts didn't have to ask permission to move back then..., and they remained "The Colts."
One of the conditions of Modell moving the Browns was that he could not take the name or the records. Pretty fair since soon after leaving Cleveland, that same Browns team (which was nearly a finished product) finally one a Super Bowl.., but for the people of Baltimore. In any event, the policy has changed.[/quote]

hate to burst your bubble bud there were only like 3 players from the browns on the championship team

[Moderator 2]

[quote name='PuRock' post='66737' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:37 PM']Look at Los Angeles, they have a huge media market. And they are going now 14? seasons without a team. That is a top tier city.

I'm just happy we have a team in Baltimore again. As far as the referees bad calls, I can live with that. Living without a team, is something I cannot.[/quote]Agreed. The dark days sucked royally. I was still thrilled to sit in the monsoons watching the team get beat up last year, it was better then no team, and I know the management here is committed to putting a winner of the field. That will help if this team struggles behind the rookie QB this year.

[FerrariFan87]

[quote name='BrownsFan' post='66731' date='Sep 17 2008, 06:21 PM']Ferrari,

I'm curious do you think there's some sort of conspiracy then when it comes to officiating? I mean why does the NFL "hate" the Ravens more than other NFL teams in your opinion? I see penalties called all the time no matter what game I'm watching.

As far as the whole Browns move touched on that topic way too many times, not going there LOL.[/quote]

Haha, of course not, but it just seems that IF there was a team in the league that is just not as well "liked" in the league by the refs, et al. it is us. Maybe our guys talk too much trash during the game or complain, who knows? But, even when we DESTROYED New York in Super Bowl XXXV, it didn't seem like we were given accolades or had a lot of excitement from the media and the league about our performance. I dunno, it just seems that when ESPN and the rest do our highlights, it is more of a chore and never focused on how WE did but how BAD the other team was (like after our Week 1 throttling of the Bungles)

[Redreed]

Yet another 'The refs are against us' thread.

Over the years the Ravens have been one of the worst teams when it comes to penalties, and it isn't because of referee bias. The fact that this thread should even be written less than a week after the best official in the NFL, IMO, blew a call that cost the SD the game is just ridiculous to me.

The league recognizes the calls that cost teams games, and makes appropriations to ensure the integrity of the game, and the ability of the officials to do the best they can and remain as transparent as possible.

Officials are human and do the best they can every time the take the field, and their job depends on it.

Fans --much like officials, are human. The difference is their job is to cheer for one side and boo another. They are bias by nature, and not held to any sort of standard for their performance in the way they see a call.

Use your common sense. Who is more likely to see a call in a bias fashion? There is a very powerful Us v. Them thing going on between fans and the rest of the league. Just because you may bleed purple (or in Warden's case; Black and piss, or in Brownsfan's case; baby**** brown) doesn't mean you should see purple.

[BrownsFan]

[quote name='FerrariFan87' post='66742' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:45 PM']I dunno, it just seems that when ESPN and the rest do our highlights[/quote]

There's your mistake right there, ESPN doesn't care unless you're the Colts or Patriots. =]

[Moderator 2]

NFLN is usually kind.

[FerrariFan87]

[quote name='Redreed' post='66743' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:56 PM']Yet another 'The refs are against us' thread.

Over the years the Ravens have been one of the worst teams when it comes to penalties, and it isn't because of referee bias. The fact that this thread should even be written less than a week after the best official in the NFL, IMO, blew a call that cost the SD the game is just ridiculous to me.

The league recognizes the calls that cost teams games, and makes appropriations to ensure the integrity of the game, and the ability of the officials to do the best they can and remain as transparent as possible.

Officials are human and do the best they can every time the take the field, and their job depends on it.

Fans --much like officials, are human. The difference is their job is to cheer for one side and boo another. They are bias by nature, and not held to any sort of standard for their performance in the way they see a call.

Use your common sense. Who is more likely to see a call in a bias fashion? There is a very powerful Us v. Them thing going on between fans and the rest of the league. Just because you may bleed purple (or in Warden's case; Black and piss, or in Brownsfan's case; baby**** brown) doesn't mean you should see purple.[/quote]

I see your point, but this thread wasn't started solely to claim the refs are against us, but that the overall treatment by the league and media in regards to this team and this city is not up to par with some of the others, such as any team in New York, New England, or PA... and it has been this way since we have come on the scene. I feel they view us as a thug team, not "classy" like Tom Terrific's SpyPats or Peyton's Colts.

Tell me this, were the RAVENS accused and punished for spying on teams, do you think it would have been swept under the rug like it has been? I think not, we would have been vilified and crucified mercilessly by the media to this day. At least in my humble opinion.

[FerrariFan87]

[quote name='Moderator 2' post='66745' date='Sep 17 2008, 08:09 PM']NFLN is usually kind.[/quote]

Insert Rod Woodson or Deion Sanders' name for NFLN and you would be correct

[thewarden86]

[quote name='bossman419' post='66739' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:43 PM']hate to burst your bubble bud there were only like 3 players from the browns on the championship team[/quote]

This has already been addressed "Bud:"

[quote name='thewarden86' post='66727' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:13 PM']Hmmm, you may be right. I thought Ray Lewis was a Brown, but I guess not. That was a long time ago and I have a crappy memory. Still, the Brownies waited, and waited..., and waited. Lost thier team and then saw that team win it all within 4 years. That's GOT to hurt.[/quote]


and how would it be bursting [b]my[/b] bubble???

[Jesse Conroy]

I agree with everything you said, I dont think that that the Refs are fair with us at all... Everyone who watches a Ravens game says the same thing.

[PuRock]

[quote name='FerrariFan87' post='66746' date='Sep 17 2008, 08:11 PM']I see your point, but this thread wasn't started solely to claim the refs are against us, but that the overall treatment by the league and media in regards to this team and this city is not up to par with some of the others, such as any team in New York, New England, or PA... and it has been this way since we have come on the scene. I feel they view us as a thug team, not "classy" like Tom Terrific's SpyPats or Peyton's Colts.

Tell me this, were the RAVENS accused and punished for spying on teams, do you think it would have been swept under the rug like it has been? I think not, we would have been vilified and crucified mercilessly by the media to this day. At least in my humble opinion.[/quote]

That's because we aren't offensively sexy like Peyton or Tom. They throw touchdowns like I love belgian waffles. When you are a defensive team, you can't help to be considered of the "thug" variety. When our offense starts scaring people and we throw 60 yard fade passes, come talk to me then. I'm sure we'll be less "thugish" and more "classy".

On spygate:
I actually believe that if spygate happened to anyone BUT the New England Patriots, it wouldn't have been as big of a deal. It was a big deal because its the Multi-Super Bowl winner Patriots. That's the price you pay for being on top. Media had a field day. If it had been San Fransico or Tampa Bay, it would have been brushed under the table. "Every team does it" sort of deal. It all depends on the level you play at.

[Redreed]

[quote name='FerrariFan87' post='66746' date='Sep 17 2008, 07:11 PM']Tell me this, were the RAVENS accused and punished for spying on teams, do you think it would have been swept under the rug like it has been? I think not, we would have been vilified and crucified mercilessly by the media to this day. At least in my humble opinion.[/quote]
Tell me this; were the Ravens in 5 of the last 6 Superbowls, winning 3 of them?

There is a reason why the Pats are always in the news. It's because they always win, Colt's too. When was the last time either of those teams didn't win 10 games? Didn't go to the post season? That's a story right there. That's media.

The last time the Ravens won 10 games, or made the playoffs we pulled a 1-and-done to the afore mentioned Colts. That's not news worthy.

We won a Superbowl 8 years ago, and aside from that season (in which, by the way, we were 9-7 and a wildcard) we have had some decent years and some bad years. That doesn't warrant the admiration of anyone in the media. It makes sense to me that the teams that are perennial contenders get the headlines. I mean, what is so strange about that?

Not only that, but the Ravens have been the exact same team seemingly forever. We have been a great defensive team with no quaterback and a slow and steady run game. That's not a story.

We have been a team that rarely scores more than 20 points. Defense may win championships but touchdowns grab headlines. We're not a team with any sort of underlying story to follow other than injuries hurting our chances or another another INT costing us a game. Again, not a story.

You can't really expect the Ravens to get the attention of the media on the level of the Pats or Colts until we start winning. And by winning I don't mean winning a game or two, I mean +10; every year, division winners; every year, playoffs; every year, and at least AFC championship or Superbowl appearances every year, and then you will see the media cover us like the teams that do this.