Why Do We Argue Over Flacco?

[scrock]

All I'll say is this, for all the Flacco haters and bashers, get used to him because he's about to get paid big money and be our franchise QB for years to come

He's getting his new deal sometime after this season...and he will be a Baltimore Raven

[mhead66]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1314116841' post='760991']

i dig all of this!

however, my view of preseason gameplay is different from most. while the games played themselves "don't count" the game play of the personnel does imo! based upon how these cats perform in the preseason will determine who makes the squad and who gets cut. right? of course! therefore, with that being said....preseason is the time for any team to see what they are working with. sure, i understand that a 4-0 preseason team may be a bust in the regular season and a 0-4 preseason team may end up winning the SB. i get all of that! my point in all of this is the same! we've watched 2 games so far and i am still waiting to see improvements in various parts of our offense but mostly with Joe's leadership and his connection with the WRs/TEs to the degree that he can smoothly and convincingly march the Ravens offense down the field and "pass" for TDs while he is in with the 1st team. hopefully, i will see that thursday night!

~Mili
[/quote]
I agree with you. Preseason IS valuable for watching individual players, to see how they play against the competition. Two things, though: First, take LaQuan Williams - I think he has a LOT of potential, but he's only been on the field in the 3rd + 4th quarters. Torrey Smith has faced the #1 defenses, so people shouldn't expect Torrey to accomplish what LaQuan has - they haven't faced the same level of competition.

It's the same thing as Flacco - Tyrod has faced second + third string defenses so far, Joe 1st string... We have to take that into consideration.

One more thing - if everyone looks at Flacco's stats from last season, and remembers what he's capable of...

Flacco was the 7th rated QB in the NFL last year - 24 teams' starters were rated lower.
Peyton Manning & Drew Brees were rated lower.

Flacco's TD:Interception ratio was outstanding - he had 25 TDs and only 10 Interceptions.
Aaron Rodgers had the same TD:Int %.
Phillip Rivers, Peyton Manning, Drew Brees... and Matt Ryan were worse.

Joe IS developing into a franchise QB. He's not there yet, but let's give him a break. He's taken us to the playoffs every year, and put up very good statistical numbers. He's just has to get comfortable with his new teammates, but he's not there yet.

Let's give him time.

[Militant X 1]

[quote name='mhead66' timestamp='1314128904' post='761230']
I agree with you. Preseason IS valuable for watching individual players, to see how they play against the competition. Two things, though: First, take LaQuan Williams - I think he has a LOT of potential, but he's only been on the field in the 3rd + 4th quarters. Torrey Smith has faced the #1 defenses, so people shouldn't expect Torrey to accomplish what LaQuan has - they haven't faced the same level of competition.

It's the same thing as Flacco - [b]Tyrod has faced second + third string defenses so far, Joe 1st string... We have to take that into consideration.[/b]

One more thing - if everyone looks at Flacco's stats from last season, and remembers what he's capable of...

Flacco was the 7th rated QB in the NFL last year - 24 teams' starters were rated lower.
Peyton Manning & Drew Brees were rated lower.

Flacco's TD:Interception ratio was outstanding - he had 25 TDs and only 10 Interceptions.
Aaron Rodgers had the same TD:Int %.
Phillip Rivers, Peyton Manning, Drew Brees... and Matt Ryan were worse.

Joe IS developing into a franchise QB. He's not there yet, but let's give him a break. He's taken us to the playoffs every year, and put up very good statistical numbers. He's just has to get comfortable with his new teammates, but he's not there yet.

Let's give him time.
[/quote]

i hear you, however Joe is a 1st string QB not Tyrod! i EXPECT Joe (who is going into his 4th season as the "starter") to know how to handle the pressures of 1st team defenses. he's been doing that for 3 years now.

you cats that are so quick to defend Flacco against those of us who bring up his flaws listen up. just because i am focused on his lack of TD passes in 2 preseason games doesn't mean that i am unaware of his stats from last season or preseason or that i don't want him to do well. i do! i really do! he is our QB. and i am glad that he is. but, i want him to demonstrate....on the field...what he said in a recent interview; [b][i]"I think that i am pretty damn good!" [/i][/b]is that so? ok...then show us! show us! stop looking like garbage at times and show us that you can consistently play smooth and crisp games and take total command of the offensive first team (against 1st team defenses) while you are in the game and march down the field convincingly and "throw" for TDs to your WRs and TEs as well as your HBs running for them. hopefully he can do that a few times before he goes out of the game thursday night!

~Mili

[Ravensstrike4424]

[quote name='scrock' timestamp='1314118771' post='761041']
All I'll say is this, for all the Flacco haters and bashers, get used to him because he's about to get paid big money and be our franchise QB for years to come

He's getting his new deal sometime after this season...and he will be a Baltimore Raven
[/quote]

very true,though the flacco haters and bashers arnt really fans

[SackinU]

The fans of Carolina, Seattle, Oakland, Detroit, Cleveland, Cincinati, Buffalo, Washington, ect ect all would love to have our Bashed and pathetic QB.

I am one fan of Joe Flacco who is glad he is here and we are not pinning our hopes on John Beck, or Jason Campbell this year.

I argue for him, because he is a RAVEN and he is good, that is enough for me.

[ravensdfan]

I argue for him because despite some flaws, he is the best and most consistent QB this organization has seen. I remember too well the years before Harbaugh. Also, because someone has to stand up for the kid when the haters and bashers start up.

[Guest RBates]

Flacco needs work, but he has all the tools to be one of the best in the league. Im drafting him in fantasy early.

[1/28/01]

[quote name='RBates' timestamp='1314198339' post='762367']
Flacco needs work, but he has all the tools to be one of the best in the league.  Im drafting him in fantasy early.
[/quote]

RBates, is that you?  Say what now?  (just playin')

[Guest RBates]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1314198397' post='762372']
RBates, is that you? Say what now? (just playin')
[/quote]
I love Flacco you have me confused i just recognize when he's not playing well and ill put him on blast. I said that this kid will be one of the best to play in this league and i stand by that he just needs work.

[1/28/01]

[quote name='RBates' timestamp='1314198813' post='762386']
I love Flacco you have me confused i just recognize when he's not playing well and ill put him on blast. I said that this kid will be one of the best to play in this league and i stand by that he just needs work.
[/quote]

No, I don't have you confused. I recall most of our conversations. You just have a way of posting that can ruffle feathers. I do too, so I don't mean anything by that. We should see drastic improvement from Flacco this year. If we don't, then I will jump on the concerned bandwagon as well!

[Militant X 1]

[quote name='RBates' timestamp='1314198813' post='762386']
I love Flacco you have me confused[b] i just recognize when he's not playing well and ill put him on blast.[/b] I said that this kid will be one of the best to play in this league and i stand by that [b]he just needs work[/b].
[/quote]

i agree!

i am glad that Flacco is our QB, however, he's got to step up his game in a huge way. my thing is that i love his confidence in saying; [i][b]"I think that i am pretty damn good!" [/b][/i]i'm cool with that! but its been 3 seasons (playoff seasons) with him as a starter. therefore, the excuse making for him is getting thin and old. now it is the time for him to step his game up and "show us!" c'mon Joe! thursday night, you may be playing 3 qrtrs. show us!

~Mili

[colljb9]

Joe Montana first 3 seasons: 15-9, 35 TDs, 21 INTS-- 1 playoff appearence
Joe Namath first 3 season: 16-16-4, 63 TDS, 70 INTS-- 1 playoff appearence
Joe Flacco first 3 seasons: 32-16, 60 TDS, 34 INTS -- 3 playoff appearences

Just saying, the next great Joe?

[ravensfan...mostly lewis]

Joe flacco = Peyton Manning
Tandon Doss = Reggie Wayne
Torrey Smith = Marvin Harrison
Dennis Pitta = Dallas Clark

No?

[Alexir]

[url="http://espn.go.com/nfl/preview11/story/_/id/6898795/from-tom-brady-andy-dalton-espn-john-clayton-ranks-nfl-starting-qbs"]http://espn.go.com/nfl/preview11/story/_/id/6898795/from-tom-brady-andy-dalton-espn-john-clayton-ranks-nfl-starting-qbs[/url]

ESPN has Flacco as a top 11 QB which im fine with. I don't know how you call 13 starting QBs out of 32 elite but whatever.

I think only half of those 13 are elite ending with Rivers.

[chesapeakeaviator]

I say wait until you see him with Lee Evans before anyone makes a real analysis of where he's at. We finally have a real, honest-to-goodness elite-caliber deep threat like that to go along with Boldin. Joe has a cannon. I watched him play at Delaware a couple of times and he made people look SILLY when he was unleashed. We've always had aging receivers. Let this guy sling it around the field and he will show you what he's got. The article seems to say exactly that.

Liked the list but I do believe Joe is FAR more promising than chronic fumbler Tony Romo. Lord knows the media will never call him out on it, though [img]http://content.boards.baltimoreravens.com//public/style_emoticons/default/eyes.gif[/img]

I agree that the list stops at Rivers, too. If Ryan has another good year, he's a candidate to be on there. I think Joe would have to have a serious breakout year and lead the team at least to the AFC Championship to be considered truly "elite"

[Natty Boh]

I feel people argue about Joe Flacco because he has struggled against the Steelers. If he had some staple performances against the Steelers these past few years and won more of those games...people would relax on him. Even if the Ravens still didn't win Super Bowls those years, just beat the Steelers is all he has to do.

[Alexir]

My thing about the Clayton analysis is that he put way too many people in a prestigious category. This is how I look at it.

Elite-Hall of Famer, Annual Pro Bowler, MVP/SB MVP, House Hold name
Great- Pro Bowler, Performs in playoffs
Above Average-TD:Int Ratio very good, wins games in the fray
Average-Chad Pennington Division
Below Average-Back up QB's who are starting but should be number 2's on other teams

Yes, Donovan McNabb could be considered Elite earlier in his career but even though he is playing rather Average these days, I still believe you would want to put him in the Great category.

Flacco, even though he hasn't been to a pro bowl (even though he was invited as a back up), is on the cusp of Great. Like his foot is in that door and he should prove it this year.

I just have a hard time putting someone in an Elite Category when those guys who are there deserve it much, much more and have worked their butts off to get where they are.

Subaru WRXs are great, fast cars but you don't put them next to a group of Ferraris like they are the same thing.

[mhead66]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1314836632' post='772105']
[url="http://espn.go.com/nfl/preview11/story/_/id/6898795/from-tom-brady-andy-dalton-espn-john-clayton-ranks-nfl-starting-qbs"]http://espn.go.com/n...fl-starting-qbs[/url]

ESPN has Flacco as a top 11 QB which im fine with. I don't know how you call 13 starting QBs out of 32 elite but whatever.

I think only half of those 13 are elite ending with Rivers.
[/quote]
I agree, 11 seems about right for Flacco right now... but some of the QBs above Flacco - like Eli and Vick - are ranked more due to their "fame" than their success or talent as a QB.

What's amusing about Pro-Bowls is that Vince Young has been to more Pro-Bowls than Roethlisberger and Flacco combined...

[FerrariFan87]

[quote name='Natty Boh' timestamp='1314879784' post='772392']
I feel people argue about Joe Flacco because he has struggled against the Steelers. If he had some staple performances against the Steelers these past few years and won more of those games...people would relax on him. Even if the Ravens still didn't win Super Bowls those years, just beat the Steelers is all he has to do.
[/quote]

I agree. I think most of the angst is due to his 0-6 record against Big Ben, and yes, I understand he plays the Steelers defense, but the records don't lie. He needs to win Week 1. Period.

[True]

Quite honestly I've been avoiding Joe Flacco threads often. It just feels too much like talking about US politics where the two extreme sides of supporters and haters are constantly arguing over him and you can barely hear the middle ground.

You have Flacco Lovers where he can do nothing wrong and has to be constantly defended and compared to every other QB in the NFL and how he gets no respect. Then you have the Flacco Haters where everything wrong with the Ravens is his fault and how he will never win a big game or improve even though he is quite young.

I try to be subjective and look at both points of views. I see a lot of good posts that both compliment and criticize Joe Flacco with some good breakdowns. But all that gets lost in the arguing between two sides that only see it one way and not another and it just gets boring after the same information is regurgitated over and over. Everything has to be in black and white instead of shades of grey and then the conversations lose any sense of real depth.

I like Joe Flacco. He is excellent in the shotgun with great accuracy, has a big arm with long ball ability for deep passes, is as tough as nails despite a weak OL, and has shown flashes in games of being able to carry this team. However he isn't perfect and has to improve on making quicker reads and going through his progressions, working on the 3-5 drop and hitting his receivers in tight spaces, reading defenses and making adjustments, and show leadership ability.

This is the 4th year and he has command of the offense and he has to prove that he can put the team on his back and lead them to victory with a passing game that is built off their strong running ability. In 10 days he will face the roadblock on the Ravens path to success and show he can lead them past the Steelers in victory. I believe he can do it and will be prepared to both compliment and criticize his performance.