The Spot Next To Ray

[The Raven]

Who will be the starter next to Ray?

McClain is coming off a solid season where he received the majority of the snaps. He performed very well.

Ellerbe did very well in the playoffs two years ago, but his lack of maturity and work ethic may cost him a job.

Gooden has all the athleticism, but can he stay healthy? Can he be a physicaly, aggressive linebacker? Physicality and health are the only things holding him back.

Or will we sign an undrafted free agent? The LB I'm mst interested in is Mario Harvey. He had a rediculous senior campaign, logging 144 tackles and 6 sacks, off the top of my head. But why did he fall?

Who do you think will start? My vote goes to McClain.

[deathbird52]

I think its Mcclain's job. He will only be supplanted by another LB if they cosistantly out perform him.

[T-ray]

Or you could do like I do in Franchise mode on Madden.... trade for Patrick Willis!! LOL

No seriously, I believe it'll be McClain. The dude is improving every year, and he's hungry for the spot, unlike Ellerbe or Gooden. Ellerbe has the ability to do so, but mentally, he's just not fit for the job. Gooden has injury issues and is not aggressive enough to take over the spot.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

Who I think it will be and who it should be are two different people.

I think it should be Ellerbe, no disrespect to McClain I just think Ellerbe is the better athlete and has more of an upside than any of the ones that we have.

I think it will be McClain though due to the short off season and him being in the coaches good graces, as well as he is a hard worker.

[Militant X 1]

Ellerbe

~Mili

[AwakenTheDemon]

McClain should have the second inside spot locked up. He had a good season last year and is head and shoulders above Ellerbe and Gooden. Barring an injury or some huge step backs in his development, he'll get the start. Ellerbe and Gooden should still see some time though, although I don't really have much faith in Phillips, too slow for my taste. As for an UDFA, I really don't think we'll sign one this year. Most likely it'll be addressed in next year's draft.

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1310226679' post='705320']
Who I think it will be and who it should be are two different people.

[b]I think it should be Ellerbe, no disrespect to McClain I just think Ellerbe is the better athlete and has more of an upside than any of the ones that we have.
[/b]
I think it will be McClain though due to the short off season and him being in the coaches good graces, as well as he is a hard worker.
[/quote]

I really don't see Ellerbe as the "better athlete" between the two. The problem with our second inside backers are that each of them excel at different aspects of the position. McClain is good at the run, Ellerbe at rushing the passer, and Gooden is best in coverage. None of them are truly "complete".

[Alexir]

Jason Phillips will be a roster bubble guy this year. Special teams is great and all but there are better UDFA options out there for our 53 man roster and our practice squad.

[Romo Ravens]

If it's not Ellerbe, I'll be sad

[Ed_Reed20]

I think it's going to be McClain based on last season, and the work he's reportedly put in this off-season. It would be great if Ellerbe could truly battle him when camp opens and possibly reclaim his starting position though.

I don't see Gooden winning the job at all, but I'm hoping he's utilized on mores blitzes.

[CapoRocky]

I think it's time to get someone for the future while Ray is still here to train them. FA!

[wayne]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1310226679' post='705320']
Who I think it will be and who it should be are two different people.

I think it should be Ellerbe, no disrespect to McClain I just think Ellerbe is the better athlete and has more of an upside than any of the ones that we have.

I think it will be McClain though due to the short off season and him being in the coaches good graces, as well as he is a hard worker.
[/quote]
I also would like Ellerbe to be in the starting 2nd MLB spot but its McClains spot to lose. I also see Ellerbe with more of an upside for making bigger plays and I just feel that McClain just will be solid for us which isn't a bad thing. McClain will not do anything that will WOW you ( I hope I'm wrong on that ) but he will stay discipline as far as maintaining his gaps and playing solid in man and zone coverage and things of that nature which is just fine ( like a Bart Scott ). I just didn't see McClain making a lot of huge plays for us last season and while I know its not all about flash and you need those players that put in the dirty work while their play is going under the radar, I just feel Ellerbe sort of can give us that and more.

Ellerbe though seems like he just could make more bigger plays for us along when also being solid and that's just my opinion. Ellerbe seems like he can be a game changer.

It would be amazing if we could trade for Pat Willis when Ray retires but that's really a dream. We have to get us someone that's destined for greatness at the MLB spot in the draft, just can't imagine us without Ray with a mediocre MLB for his replacement.

[CapoRocky]

Patrick Willis had 128 tackles and 6 sacks last year for the 49ers. Not too shabby.

[George70]

Based solely on the evidence at hand, I have to cast my vote for McClain. This is primarily due to his being a hard worker and also to the belief in himself. He may just start this season next to Ray, and I believe he will.

[Ravensfan23]

I think the better question, at least for me is, Can Ellerbe hold down the ILB spot once Ray is gone?

Wayne I think both you and Army had some good points in the break down of the two young ILBs. The coaches will love McClain for his consistency and hard working nature. Reports are he's working to make himself a more complete ILB this year and that's great.

Ellerbe is more of a flashy play maker imo. Not saying he's a flashy player, but it's just whenever he makes a play it seems to be in the open field and a solo play. So it stands out more, if that makes any sense. Ellerbe is more of a thumper and is so aggressive when blitzing. He has a Ray Lewis style of play. No, I would never place Ray Lewis expectations or that label on Ellerbe, but he's that type of ILB that will be all over the field.

I actually think the coaches are so hard on Ellerbe because they see the same potential we fans see, but right now he seemingly either doesn't work hard enough to maximize it, or he just doesn't see it himself. I watch the way veteran players like Suggs get so pumped up when Ellerbe makes a play, almost like... see I told you that you were a beast, just go out and play like it all the time.

I actually think that Ellerbe and McClain complaint each other really well. Unfortunately for them, Ray is still playing at a high level and only missed 5 snaps last season. So they have to split time instead of being on the field together more often.

I've advocated the Ravens drafting Manti Te'o next season to take over that ILB position after Ray. However I do strongly think that if Ellerbe can reach his full potential, that he could hold down that spot in a couple years once Ray is gone.

Our undrafted duo in the middle would be an interesting storyline. But more then just an interesting story, I think Ellerbe and McClain and get the job done together.

[The Raven]

I deifinitely see McClain as the better overall player, being able to stop the run, and blitz. With him working on his agility in the offseason, his coverage should improve. That would make him a more complete LB.

However I do see Ellerbe as a better "playmaker". He's a highlight reel player, while McClain is the under-rated "do-your-job" player, sorta like JJ. I think when Ray retires, and *if* Ellerbe gets his head on straight, they could be a great tandom together. Having a playmaker of Ellerbe's potential, and a player like McClain, our defense would be solid.

However, we can't get too hung up on the potential of a player. As my coach always says "Potential is defined by what you haven't done yet." So we'll see how this goes.

[Free Agent]

I hope its Ellerbe. He seems like a better/more-aggressive MLB than McClain or Gooden.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='AwakenTheDemon' timestamp='1310232765' post='705359']
McClain should have the second inside spot locked up. He had a good season last year and is head and shoulders above Ellerbe and Gooden. Barring an injury or some huge step backs in his development, he'll get the start. Ellerbe and Gooden should still see some time though, although I don't really have much faith in Phillips, too slow for my taste. As for an UDFA, I really don't think we'll sign one this year. Most likely it'll be addressed in next year's draft.



I really don't see Ellerbe as the "better athlete" between the two. The problem with our second inside backers are that each of them excel at different aspects of the position. McClain is good at the run, Ellerbe at rushing the passer, and Gooden is best in coverage. None of them are truly "complete".
[/quote]


Other than Ray i don;t see anybody that is head and shoulder's above Ellerbe. you said that none of them are truly complete so if that is the case I would have to say that Ellerbe has made the most of his opportunities when they were given to him. He had a lot of good plays that made people stand up and take notice. I think he has also loafed on a couple of plays and that is what really hurt him, but that being said and being benched for his lack of effort I think that he is going to come to camp like a man possessed and is going to make the coaches rethink their position on exactly who will start for us day one.

It definitely is going to be McClain's spot to lose, but eventually the consistency that he display's will be a virtue that is taken on by those chomping at the bit behind him, once that happens he may be relegated to the bench until Ray hangs them up provided we don;t seek help in the draft (hopefully Te'o)

[Ravens1991]

Ellerbe has the most natural talent. His instincts are great. Always around the ball. But his issue is his attitude. I remember reading the other day in the paper that he would sleep during meetings, not take notes and actually showed up late for a home game. We cant give a guy like that a starting spot. I think it will be McClain who is a guy who can be solid at everything but great at nothing. A focused Ellerbe has impact starter potential I hope he realizes it and gets his head outta his butt.

[AwakenTheDemon]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1310441311' post='706265']
Other than Ray i don;t see anybody that is head and shoulder's above Ellerbe. [b]you said that none of them are truly complete so if that is the case I would have to say that Ellerbe has made the most of his opportunities when they were given to him. He had a lot of good plays that made people stand up and take notice. I think he has also loafed on a couple of plays and that is what really hurt him, but that being said and being benched for his lack of effort I think that he is going to come to camp like a man possessed and is going to make the coaches rethink their position on exactly who will start for us day one.[/b]

It definitely is going to be McClain's spot to lose, but eventually the consistency that he display's will be a virtue that is taken on by those chomping at the bit behind him, once that happens he may be relegated to the bench until Ray hangs them up provided we don;t seek help in the draft (hopefully Te'o)
[/quote]

Ellerbe's made plays that were noticeable and exciting, and then slacked off on others. McClain's been the most consistent of the group, even if he hasn't made those exciting plays that Dannell has. If Gooden wasn't injured every other week, he may even be in consideration, the ability is there. The point about none of them being complete ultimately leads back to who has been the most consistent, which would be McClain, even if it's just by a margin.

Shouldn't he have played "like a man possessed" last year though? I'm sorry, I like Ellerbe as much as anyone else, but if he was that dedicated to really earning that spot back he should have been working his butt off since McClain took over. What I will say though, is Ellerbe is much more of an inside linebacker than Jameel, whose natural position is on the outside, not the inside.

[quote name='Ravens1991' timestamp='1310444830' post='706288']
Ellerbe has the most natural talent. His instincts are great. Always around the ball. But his issue is his attitude. I remember reading the other day in the paper that he would sleep during meetings, not take notes and actually showed up late for a home game. We cant give a guy like that a starting spot. I think it will be McClain who is a guy who can be solid at everything but great at nothing. [b]A focused Ellerbe has impact starter potential I hope he realizes it and gets his head outta his butt.[/b]
[/quote]

Sorry, but we haven't seen nearly enough of Ellerbe in a starting capacity to say that. Most players with decent playtime make you take notice, but not all of them are going to play to that level at the starting level. And if that is Ellerbe's attitude, then he's never going to show us and the team what he can bring to the table as a starter, as we all know how much Harbs values work ethic and a healthy, good attitude.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='AwakenTheDemon' timestamp='1310445336' post='706291']
Ellerbe's made plays that were noticeable and exciting, and then slacked off on others. McClain's been the most consistent of the group, even if he hasn't made those exciting plays that Dannell has. If Gooden wasn't injured every other week, he may even be in consideration, the ability is there. The point about none of them being complete ultimately leads back to who has been the most consistent, which would be McClain, even if it's just by a margin.

[b]Shouldn't he have played "like a man possessed" last year though? I'm sorry, I like Ellerbe as much as anyone else, but if he was that dedicated to really earning that spot back he should have been working his butt off since McClain took over. What I will say though, is Ellerbe is much more of an inside linebacker than Jameel, whose natural position is on the outside, not the inside.[/b]



Sorry, but we haven't seen nearly enough of Ellerbe in a starting capacity to say that. Most players with decent playtime make you take notice, but not all of them are going to play to that level at the starting level. And if that is Ellerbe's attitude, then he's never going to show us and the team what he can bring to the table as a starter, as we all know how much Harbs values work ethic and a healthy, good attitude.
[/quote]


I think that will be the reasoning behind his comeback though. He realizes how stupid it was to squander an opportunity and realizes with as much hypes as McClain's getting this might be his last chance so his back is against the wall. I believe he will rise to the occasion in flying style.

[justifythegame]

Ellerbe be has much more potential to be the better MLB behind ray, but it seems he is in harbs doghouse after his preseason antics last year. He seems to know where the ball is going alot of the time and able to make to try and get there quickly. Its McClain's job to lose since he put up good "stats" with limited playing time. But i think the MLB position is more than just stats...watching Ray the last decade i've noticed the instincts for the position are much more important, playing in coverage, deflecting passes, forcing fumbles and intimidating people. I've seen a bunch of ILBs record a 100 tackles but i've thought many of them were overrated based on their stats. I always thought McClain had the natural instincts of a pass rusher though, i think he might've even developed him into a really good one if we gave him the chance to play LOLB.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='justifythegame' timestamp='1310509712' post='706661']
Ellerbe be has much more potential to be the better MLB behind ray, but [b]it seems he is in harbs doghouse after his preseason antics last year.[/b] He seems to know where the ball is going alot of the time and able to make to try and get there quickly. Its McClain's job to lose since he put up good "stats" with limited playing time. But i think the MLB position is more than just stats...watching Ray the last decade i've noticed the instincts for the position are much more important, playing in coverage, deflecting passes, forcing fumbles and intimidating people. I've seen a bunch of ILBs record a 100 tackles but i've thought many of them were overrated based on their stats. I always thought McClain had the natural instincts of a pass rusher though, i think he might've even developed him into a really good one if we gave him the chance to play LOLB.
[/quote]

For the millionth time, him showboating didn't land him in the doghouse.

[BMOREHAWAII]

McClain will be starting next to Ray Ray, with the usual carousel with Ellerbe in the mix. That's until we trade up next draft for Vontaze Burfict...

[gabefergy]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1310511342' post='706675']
For the millionth time, him showboating didn't land him in the doghouse.
[/quote]
It doesn't matter how many times you post it, some people don't seem to understand. Ellerbe played a pretty significant role in the playoffs, but no one seems to think Harbs will give him a chance.

I'm really looking forward to training camp to see how LB situation shakes out. McClain seems to be the favorite going in, but if Ellerbe puts in the work its going to be interesting.

[Bullrush]

All of the guys are pretty much average so it doesn't really make any difference. I think McClain will continue to start, I'd hope Gooden makes it though, or Ellerbe. McClain should move back to OLB, he struggles a bit against the run. Gooden is the best guy of the bunch but he can't stay healthy. Ellerbe is the best run stopper in my opinion, but he hasn't made much of an impact last season as a backup. Philips shouldn't even be in the conversation.

We need to bring in somebody via the draft in the 1st or 2nd round for sure. And then pick up a free agent veteran a la Spikes.

[gabefergy]

[quote name='Bullrush' timestamp='1310565586' post='706934']
All of the guys are pretty much average so it doesn't really make any difference. I think McClain will continue to start, I'd hope Gooden makes it though, or Ellerbe. McClain should move back to OLB, he struggles a bit against the run. Gooden is the best guy of the bunch but he can't stay healthy. Ellerbe is the best run stopper in my opinion, but he hasn't made much of an impact last season as a backup. Philips shouldn't even be in the conversation.

We need to bring in somebody via the draft in the 1st or 2nd round for sure. And then pick up a free agent veteran a la Spikes.
[/quote]
I'm not sure why you think Gooden is the best of our young LBs. I haven't seen him make one impactful play in 3 seasons. He has always had potential but he needs to be able to get on the field consistently.

[Corvus]

A former UDFA issued a 2nd round RFA tender, coming off a solid season where he held the spot in question down for 15 of 16 games, I don't see how it wouldn't be McClain's job to lose.

[Ravensfan23]

Last season Ellerbe lost his hold on the starting job during mini camps. The coaches just didn't think he handled his offseason well and didn't take that immediate step once he came back.

There are no mini camps this year and the Ravens will look to hit the ground running because of the time lost. With that said, McClain will be the starter and Ellerbe will have to prove he's worthy of having a larger role then last season. But I don't think he'll get a chance to compete for that job in camp.

But if for whatever reason McClain just falls off, Ellerbe will be in the starting spot on Sept. 11

[Free Agent]

[quote name='Corvus' timestamp='1310567562' post='706949']
A former UDFA issued a 2nd round RFA tender, coming off a solid season where he held the spot in question down for 15 of 16 games, I don't see how it wouldn't be McClain's job to lose.
[/quote]

Unfortunately you are right. However, I hope that if Ellerbe performs in training camp up to his abilities, he would earn himself the spot next to Ray.

[shawn ny]

I thought McClain played real well last season especially @ the begining when alot of other folks were missing tackles (patriots game comes to mind). Even if he isnt the greatest in coverage, at least he is one heck of a good tackler.