Sexy Rexy Or Harbaugh?

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='wayne' timestamp='1309300045' post='701880']
Neva said he didn't understand defensive concepts and offensive schemes and neva said he couldn't draw up plays, just explaining the difference between HC's and I feel Harbaugh fits the " managing " category, not the Rex/ Payton category. Hell, we, the hardcore fans understand defensive concepts and offensive schemes but the key is getting that to work within your team. I don't think Harbaugh has drawn up any plays or schemes during his tenture here, he relies on his coordinators which is very understandable but to me the great coaches can at any time with the incompetence of the O or D coordinator, take over the play calling duties with success and that has yet to be seen with Harbaugh.
[/quote]

Fair enough. We certainly haven't seen him calling plays like the aforementioned HCs but I won't speculate on whether he's ever drawn up plays considering I haven't been in any team meetings. To me, it seems pretty far-fetched to suggest he hasn't done it at all on defense or special teams in the three years he's coached this team considering his coaching experience.

To your last point, do you think Rex has ever taken over the offensive play-calling during his time with the Jets?

[wayne]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1309302009' post='701897']
Fair enough. We certainly haven't seen him calling plays like the aforementioned HCs but I won't speculate on whether he's ever drawn up plays considering I haven't been in any team meetings. To me, it seems pretty far-fetched to suggest he hasn't done it at all on defense or special teams in the three years he's coached this team considering his coaching experience.

To your last point, do you think Rex has ever taken over the offensive play-calling during his time with the Jets?
[/quote]
He has taken over the defensive play calling and its either or for me on that, not nescassarily that the coach has to be able to take over both but atleast one. Also, special teams is important but I don't factor that in, I'm talking about ether O or D. Each coach specialize in something ( most either use to be O or D coordinator ) so of course we are only talking about them taking over in what their strength is. I understand Harbaugh was a special teams coach but I'm talking about O or D and I don't mean any disrespect to special teams but a coach taking over special teams duties compared to a coach that either takes over O or D responsibilities is in another league.

I'm sure he has a lot of input in the designing of schemes and playcalling but I'm talking about him literally designing schemes or calling plays him self and I doubt he has done that.

[Corvus]

I've been reading some of these arguments and am baffled by the conception that I've seen a couple of times of Rex taking over a "4-12" loser, trying to compare that to Harbs taking over our 5-11 team. The Jets went 10-6 in '06, 4-12 in '07, and 9-7 in '08. I seem to recall that team barely missing the postseason due to Favre's injury getting their offense into tons of turnover trouble down the stretch. So again, how did Rex take over for a rebuilding team that only truly needed to "rebuild" the QB position? Harbs inherited some great players as we know but Rex inherited a rock solid o-line, a consistent poweful RB in Jones with Tony Richardson to block for him, a talented young tight end in Keller and a do it all weapon in Brad Smith, Revis on the cusp of super-stardom, a still healthy Kris Jenkins; an up and coming David Harris.Obviously its my opinion but I think the '08 Jets were much better established than the '07 Ravens.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='wayne' timestamp='1309303929' post='701908']
He has taken over the defensive play calling and its either or for me on that, not nescassarily that the coach has to be able to take over both but atleast one. Also, special teams is important but I don't factor that in, I'm talking about ether O or D. Each coach specialize in something ( most either use to be O or D coordinator ) so of course we are only talking about them taking over in what their strength is. I understand Harbaugh was a special teams coach but I'm talking about O or D and I don't mean any disrespect to special teams but a coach taking over special teams duties compared to a coach that either takes over O or D responsibilities is in another league.
[b]
I'm sure he has a lot of input in the designing of schemes and playcalling but I'm talking about him literally designing schemes or calling plays him self and I doubt he has done that.[/b]
[/quote]

I can believe he hasn't done it offensively but I just can't believe he hasn't done it defensively in the three years he's been here. If he's had input, it'd make little sense for him not to design some schemes or occasionally call a play.

[Gordo52]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1309290094' post='701786']
How would the defense have remained elite? The front office would still have had to address the QB, tackle and WR positions even if Rex had been hired. I highly doubt Ozzie would have made some the short-term moves Tannenbaum has made either. So again, how would the defense have been remained elite?

And what players do you know that don't want to play for Harbaugh? I ask because Rex-supporters frequently talk about players wanting to play for him like it's a meaningful advantage he has over other coaches. I don't see people spouting these claims about McCarthy, Payton and Tomlin, so why have they won it all in recent years?

The Jets haven't been noticeably worse than the Ravens the past two season. In fact, they've been better in a number of areas.

If Bart was re-signed, either Ray or Suggs would have had to have been let go. It amazes that some people still don't understand this.

Rex is a better defensive coach than John. As a head coach, it really isn't "flat out" who's better.
[/quote]
I was never aware that if we resigned bart then we would have to let Ray or Suggs go. I thought we offered Bart a contract but he denied it because Ryan left. The reason are defense would remain "elite" is because even though how good our D has been the last few years you and I both know it would have been better and considered elite (because of how good we were) with Rex. Look @ the numbers and compare them. And players want to go to a team that has such a cool coach like Rex. One who is confident and willing to put everything on line because he trust his team that much. John is a GREAT HC. But I wish he could be more like Ryan. Sure their both different but Rex is one of a kind. And who knows where we would be right now. Johns been doing great with us. But Rex is doing better with the Jets. Even though they both dont have a ring and it doesnt matter who got further. I still think Rex would have been better option.Flat

[flynismo]

[quote name='Ravens.3' timestamp='1309316742' post='701984']<br />I was never aware that if we resigned bart then we would have to let Ray or Suggs go. I thought we offered Bart a contract but he denied it because Ryan left. The reason are defense would remain &quot;elite&quot; is because even though how good our D has been the last few years you and I both know it would have been better and considered elite (because of how good we were) with Rex. Look @ the numbers and compare them. And players want to go to a team that has such a cool coach like Rex. One who is confident and willing to put everything on line because he trust his team that much. John is a GREAT HC. But I wish he could be more like Ryan. Sure their both different but Rex is one of a kind. And who knows where we would be right now. Johns been doing great with us. But Rex is doing better with the Jets. Even though they both dont have a ring and it doesnt matter who got further. I still think Rex would have been better option.Flat<br />[/quote]


who says our defense would be better with Rex? I would LOVE to see what he could do without CMac, Rolle, Adalius Thomas, Trevor Pryce and Kelley Gregg in his prime to make him look so great. Mattison didn't have those guys like Rex did, and STILL took us to #3 overall in 2009 and top 10 last year.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Ravens<3' timestamp='1309316742' post='701984']
I was never aware that if we resigned bart then we would have to let Ray or Suggs go. I thought we offered Bart a contract but he denied it because Ryan left. The reason are defense would remain "elite" is because even though how good our D has been the last few years you and I both know it would have been better and considered elite (because of how good we were) with Rex. Look @ the numbers and compare them. And players want to go to a team that has such a cool coach like Rex. One who is confident and willing to put everything on line because he trust his team that much. John is a GREAT HC. But I wish he could be more like Ryan. Sure their both different but Rex is one of a kind. And who knows where we would be right now. Johns been doing great with us. But Rex is doing better with the Jets. Even though they both dont have a ring and it doesnt matter who got further. I still think Rex would have been better option.Flat
[/quote]

Ray was still testing the market when the Ravens made Bart an offer. The only way Scott would have stayed was to accept a smaller contract than the one he got in New York. The same goes Jim Leonhard.

What kind of reasoning is that? The numbers you speak aren't only a reflection of Rex but the players as well. The players Rex had at his disposal during most of his time as DC from '05 to '08 were better than players Mattison coached during his tenure.

Guys also like getting paid. We'll see how much players love playing for Rex when free agency opens and people start getting prioritized.

Rex can stay "cool" and be one of a kind. I'd rather have Harbaugh as my head coach.

[1/28/01]

[quote name='Ravens<3' timestamp='1309316742' post='701984']
I was never aware that if we resigned bart then we would have to let Ray or Suggs go.
[/quote]
Really?????? This explains a lot then.

[Gordo52]

All I know is that both Rex and John are great. Im happy with Harbs and im happy for Rex. Every defensive player wants to play with Rex. Reed,Lewis,Suggs for ex. I think when its all said and done I think Harbs was right choice and will bring us multiple superbowls. But I still think if we had Ryan are defense would be better. Therefore making us elite because we are already there really. Elite defense last year may have got us past steelers and not let up the points we did. or 3rd & 19. Or franchise low in sacks. All Im saying. Thank you. Good day. ....I say good day!

[Alexir]

John Harbaugh has been to 1 AFC Championship Round which was carried by our defense.
Rex Ryan has been to 3 Straight, 2 as Jets Head Coach and 1 as the Defensive Mastermind mentioned above.

Hmm.....

I personally wanted Rex at the time and the players wanted Rex but I think promising a Superbowl every year would get old.

They are both Top 10 Coaches right now and I think John working with the Offense and Pagano taking over for Mattison (thank god he is gone), we will be able to finally win the division for the first time since 2006.

[edreedfromtheu]

[quote name='gilgamesh' timestamp='1309299306' post='701873']
Rexy didn't coach their 08 team, which are not a bunch of losers by the way. They had a monster OL and a good D. Thomas Jones was also a monster and had a battering ram in Tony Richardson to run behind. They lost late in the season because Favre likes to throw to the other team.

Rex inherited a decent O, just like Harbs. Both were run first teams, but Rex had a better OL, a great feature back, a two good change of pace backs. Flacco was better than Sanchez, so our receivers obviously did better than theirs, but both passing games were more of an afterthought than a feature. But for the record, you forgot their 2 best pass catchers in Cotchery and Keller.

You are not giving enough credit to the D Rex inherited. Revis, Harris, and Ellis are the big names, but there are other good defensive players that you didn't mention: Scott, Leonard, Rhodes, and Pace. 7-11 starters are good to great, along with a good rotation of DL and they really only had 2 positions that were lacking.

I'm not saying I don't like Rex, but this reasoning you have is a bit flawed since both inherited good personnel, but Jets had more success the prior season.
[/quote]

You, as well of the many others, had no idea who Darelle Revis was... until Rex Ryan came to the Jets. You people get on here and say that the Ravens system is what made people like Adalius Thomas and Bart Scott which is why they were expendable. Well, then you have to use the same argument for Revis. He was in the league before Rex came to the Jets. But nobody knew of him until Rex Ryan got there.

[gilgamesh]

[quote name='edreedfromtheu' timestamp='1309369493' post='702194']
You, as well of the many others, had no idea who Darelle Revis was... until Rex Ryan came to the Jets. You people get on here and say that the Ravens system is what made people like Adalius Thomas and Bart Scott which is why they were expendable. Well, then you have to use the same argument for Revis. He was in the league before Rex came to the Jets. But nobody knew of him until Rex Ryan got there.
[/quote]
Yes I did, considering he got that ludicrous rookie contract, I've been keeping an eye on him. Looking at Jets forums back then in 07-08, here is the gist of what they thought: Revis = new Asomugha, Rhodes= new Reed, Harris is gonna be a beast soon if he isn't already, D'Brick is a beast.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='edreedfromtheu' timestamp='1309369493' post='702194']
[b]You, as well of the many others, had no idea who Darelle Revis was...[/b] until Rex Ryan came to the Jets. You people get on here and say that the Ravens system is what made people like Adalius Thomas and Bart Scott which is why they were expendable. Well, then you have to use the same argument for Revis. He was in the league before Rex came to the Jets. [b]But nobody knew of him until Rex Ryan got there.[/b]
[/quote]

Maybe you didn't know of him but I'd say a lot of people were aware of the 14th overall pick in the '07 draft. Personally, I didn't pay much attention to him in '07 but I knew he was on the rise during the '08 season.

[-Truth-]

[quote name='edreedfromtheu' timestamp='1309369493' post='702194']
You, as well of the many others, had no idea who Darelle Revis was... until Rex Ryan came to the Jets. You people get on here and say that the Ravens system is what made people like Adalius Thomas and Bart Scott which is why they were expendable. Well, then you have to use the same argument for Revis. He was in the league before Rex came to the Jets. [b]But nobody knew of him until Rex Ryan got there.[/b]
[/quote]
What is this based off of? Darrell Revis was a Pro-Bowler before the Ryan days, so he was regarded among the best. Yes, his popularity sky rocketed after Rex became their HC, but that's because their defense improved as a whole, becoming the #1 ranked defense in the league. Rex himself marveled at how Revis could simply be left in man coverage and shut down half of the field. So claiming that Revis is a mere product of the system just isn't a realistic argument.

[Militant X 1]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1309151386' post='701252']
[b]I'll go ahead and be the first one (and after all the negs probably the last) but I would rather have rex ryan. [/b] [/quote]

why are sooo many of you cats in here concerned with other people negative repping you? smh! be true to yourself and speak your minds...I DO and ALWAYS WILL.

i like Harbs, but i love Rex's bravado! give the man his dues! Rex had our Ravens defense foaming at the mouth in this game and laid the foundation for their defense to be one of the best in the game!

now....he takes over the Jets and those cats are in the playoffs back to back....like the Ravens are. love him or hate him....Rex is a bad boy! and that is why many of our Ravens players speak well of him even though we fans (who don't know him personally) may not!

~Mili

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1309375677' post='702251']
why are sooo many of you cats in here concerned with other people negative repping you? smh! be true to yourself and speak your minds...I DO and ALWAYS WILL.

i like Harbs, but i love Rex's bravado! give the man his dues! Rex had our Ravens defense foaming at the mouth in this game and laid the foundation for their defense to be one of the best in the game!

now....he takes over the Jets and those cats are in the playoffs back to back....like the Ravens are. love him or hate him....Rex is a bad boy! and that is why many of our Ravens players speak well of him even though we fans (who don't know him personally) may not!

~Mili
[/quote]

I wasnt concerned which is why I said it. I just thought that id would be decidedly one sided, turns out I'm not the only cat on the block who likes Rex. And dont worry I will ALWAYS speak my mind.lol

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1309375677' post='702251']
why are sooo many of you cats in here concerned with other people negative repping you? smh! be true to yourself and speak your minds...I DO and ALWAYS WILL.

i like Harbs, but i love Rex's bravado! give the man his dues! Rex had our Ravens defense foaming at the mouth in this game and [b]laid the foundation for their defense to be one of the best in the game![/b]

now....he takes over the Jets and those cats are in the playoffs back to back....like the Ravens are. love him or hate him....Rex is a bad boy! and that is why many of our Ravens players speak well of him even though we fans (who don't know him personally) may not!

~Mili
[/quote]

Pretty sure Marvin and Nolan laid that foundation. Not to say the D didn't amass more talent after Rex became the DC but Ray, Ed, Suggs, C-Mac and Gregg were already on the roster when he took over.

[Militant X 1]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1309389568' post='702381']
[b]Pretty sure Marvin and Nolan laid that foundation.[/b] Not to say the D didn't amass more talent after Rex became the DC but Ray, Ed, Suggs, C-Mac and Gregg were already on the roster when he took over.
[/quote]

Marvin and Nolan? lol! so, Rex implimented nothing? he contributed nothing to this D? why are you cats always trying to deminish Rex's impact on these Ravens players Ed? it's a shame! smh!

Ed Reed just emphatically said that he would play anywhere for Rex! not Marvin or Nolan! Rex! Pryce left and mentioned his love for and desire to be reunited with Rex in NJ! Bart left and Leonard left both mentioning their love and desire to play for Rex!

these "Players" (not fans) actually love this guy and are expressing how much he "really" means and meant to them! give the man his props!

~Mili

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1309389970' post='702386']
Marvin, Nolan? lol! why are you cats always trying to deminish Rex's impact on these Ravens players Ed? it's a shame! smh! Ed Reed just emphatically said that he would play anywhere for Rex! not Marvin or Nolan! Rex! Pryce left and mentioned his love for and desire to be reunited with Rex in NJ! Bart left and Leonard left both mentioning their love and desire to play for Rex!

these "Players" (not fans) actually love this guy and are expressing how much he "really" means and meant to them! give the man his props!

~Mili
[/quote]

You're blowing what I wrote out of proportion. All I said was the foundation of the D had already been laid [i]before[/i] Rex got here. That can't be denied. I clearly wrote that talent was amassed during his time here and I'll now add we saw players develop as well but in terms of the foundation, Rex didn't build it.

Like I said in a previous post, the promise of more dough and a starting job were also reasons Bart and Jim followed Rex to New York.

[Militant X 1]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1309390378' post='702388']
You're blowing what I wrote out of proportion. [b]All I said was the foundation of the D had already been laid [i]before[/i] Rex got here. That can't be denied. [/b]I clearly wrote that talent was amassed during his time here and I'll now add we saw players develop as well [b]but in terms of the foundation, Rex didn't build it. [/b]
Like I said in a previous post, [b]the promise of more dough and a starting job were also reasons Bart and Jim followed Rex to New York.[/b][/quote]

You are too technical!

i know what role Marvin, Nolan played on this D Ed. however, they began to take on more of Rex's personality when he became the D.C., thus, laying the foundation for what we've witnessed under his (Rex's) direct leadership over the past few years. and that can't be denied. that is what was meant by my [i]" Rex laid the foundation"[/i] statement bruh!

and of course, Bart and Leonard would go play where they were offered more money...but...Rex and their love for him was a major part of that as well. just ask Pryce!

~Mili

[flynismo]

,[quote name='edreedfromtheu' timestamp='1309369493' post='702194']<br />You, as well of the many others, had no idea who Darelle Revis was... until Rex Ryan came to the Jets.  You people get on here and say that the Ravens system is what made people like Adalius Thomas and Bart Scott which is why they were expendable.  Well, then you have to use the same argument for Revis.  He was in the league before Rex came to the Jets.  But nobody knew of him until Rex Ryan got there.<br />[/quote]

how long was Revis in the league before 2009 when Ryan got there? Exactly.


Did the Ravens make AD and Scott? Perhaps. If so, playing side by side with Ray Lewis and Terrell Suggs would seem to make their jobs easier, no?,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1309391270' post='702398']
You are too technical!

i know what role Marvin, Nolan played on this D Ed. however, they began to take on more of Rex's personality when he became the D.C., thus, laying the foundation for what we've witnessed under his (Rex's) direct leadership over the past few years. and that can't be denied. that is what was meant by my [i]" Rex laid the foundation"[/i] statement bruh!

and of course, Bart and Leonard would go play where they were offered more money...but...Rex and their love for him was a major part of that as well. just ask Pryce!

~Mili
[/quote]

Fair enough. The D had a swagger well before Rex was the DC but there's no point in dragging this out.

[1/28/01]

Rex continued and improved upon what was already here....

[Militant X 1]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1309391440' post='702401']
Fair enough. [b]The D had a swagger well before Rex was the DC [/b]but there's no point in dragging this out.
[/quote]

and Rex added more fuel to the fire bruh! now i am done! lol

~Mili

[Militant X 1]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1309391908' post='702402']
Rex continued and [b]improved upon [/b][u][/u]what was already here....
[/quote]

agreed!

and if so, then give the man his props is all i saying!

~Mili

[dpatrickguy]

Much like if the two were to compete in a foot race, I have to take Harbaugh in this one. (For a few different reasons....)

[flynismo]

[quote name='dpatrickguy' timestamp='1309401817' post='702461']<br />Much like if the two were to compete in a foot race, I have to take Harbaugh in this one. (For a few different reasons....)<br />[/quote]


would be a close race. I think Harbs would only win by a couple feet, as long as he got his footwork down from launch.

[dpatrickguy]

[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1309402099' post='702462']
would be a close race. I think Harbs would only win by a couple feet, as long as he got his footwork down from launch.
[/quote]
I don't know man. I don't think "Sexy Rexy" would make it past the first few sexy feet of the race before he couldn't take it any longer.

[flynismo]

[quote name='dpatrickguy' timestamp='1309402302' post='702465']
I don't know man. I don't think "Sexy Rexy" would make it past the first few sexy feet of the race before he couldn't take it any longer.
[/quote]

True, it would be a heck of a feat if Ryan even finished a foot race.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

Ok I have said I would rather have rex several time in this thread and stated my reasoning, but after much debate..... I still haven't changed my mind. However what did happen was I realized exactly how simple this answer was for me when I boiled it down to the nuts and bolts. My Conclusion is that this regime is SOFT. I hate that and can't stand the thought of us turning into a finesse and "classy" franchise (even though I think even when we were hitting people in the mouth we still did it with style and class). I like that Rex is a physical, take no prisoners, and walk up main street and punch you in the mouth kind of guy. Harbs is clearly not. He has no killer instinct he wont go for the jugular, either that or he is incompetent (which I doubt), I like Rex's style is what I am saying.