Players We Need To Re-Sign

[SpeedKills]

[quote name='SpeedKills' timestamp='1305923269' post='689018']
Firstly, you come off as a bit of Wilson hater since you're basically downplaying the HUGE impact he had on our D. So, yes, you have bashed him by selling him short, even if it wasn't intentional. Secondly, why are you trying to disprove facts? No, not by talent and recognition, he's not the best CB in the league. Not by a long shot. But he's one of the more impactful CBs in the league, especially for us.
[/quote]


[quote name='BmoreRaised' timestamp='1305923569' post='689021']
uh no im not downplaying what he did for our team i alrdy said he was our best CBlol is that scretch of games gonna make me call him a very good player in the NFL? no thats not bashing him thats my opinion. me not considering him a top 10 cb in the league>? not bashing him its an opinion, i have said plenty of times id love to have him back here and that he was our best CB i dont think thats downplaying him
[/quote]

And both are our own opinions.

[BmoreRaised]

[quote name='SpeedKills' timestamp='1305923782' post='689024']
And both are our own opinions.
[/quote]
ok, so im supposed to call Wilson a HOF PLAYER? so me wanting him back on our team and saying he was our best CB is still bashin him according to u?lol

[Bltravens]

[quote name='wayne' timestamp='1305923318' post='689019']
.....and that still makes no sense. If you 5'3 or 6'10, if you getting the job done, you getting the job done. My assesment of Wilson is that we overrate him but he's decent/good and for him to demand any type of big money from us, he would have to play more than 10 games to do so.
[/quote]
Thats what the word is and I mean we did the same thing, we brought in 2 corners this draft that are 6'0 and 6'2. If your 5'3 and you get the job done, or your 6'5 and get the job done at corner your going to take the taller guy everyday of the week. Teams are always looking to get bigger and faster its just the nature of sports.

[wayne]

[quote name='Bltravens' timestamp='1305925338' post='689031']
Thats what the word is and I mean we did the same thing, we brought in 2 corners this draft that are 6'0 and 6'2. If your 5'3 and you get the job done, or your 6'5 and get the job done at corner your going to take the taller guy everyday of the week. Teams are always looking to get bigger and faster its just the nature of sports.
[/quote]
I understand where you coming from but if those bigger and taller Cb's you bringing in gives you less production than the smaller and shorter Cb you had, pretty crazy move on your part. Obviously, it had to be more to it.

[Bltravens]

[quote name='wayne' timestamp='1305926440' post='689043']
I understand where you coming from but if those bigger and taller Cb's you bringing in gives you less production than the smaller and shorter Cb you had, pretty crazy move on your part. Obviously, it had to be more to it.
[/quote]
Ya I know what you mean, the performance should dictate who comes and goes not measurables. Maybe Carrol just wanted his own guy as the nickel? Tough to cut with Trufant, he was seen as an above average corner a couple years ago.

[-Truth-]

[quote name='BmoreRaised' timestamp='1305922438' post='689011']
Wilson is average/good at most not very good the 3 tds is good from what u mentioned the rest is average as far as the "stats" ur now mentioning,in 2008 there pass coverage was one of the worst in the nfl so i wouldnt take too much value in that hes not a very good player lol and i could care less what u thought as far as me being a Wilson hater because u seem like his cheerleader.
Yes the QB situation is quite different and the position is much more valuable than CB,so maybe Caroll saw something he liked in Charlie and figured he'd take a chance to me the position alone makes it different and especially the situation the Seahawks were in.
AND SERIOUSLY WHEN HAVE I BASHED HIM? I NEVER SAID HE SUCKED BECAUSE I DONT AGREE WITH U IM BASHING HIM?
[/quote]
To put things in perspective, in 2009, Wilson graded out twice as high as Jonathan Joseph is 2010. But obviously their entire secondary's performance falls completely on Wilson, right? I mean, he's definitely out there by himself, so if their overall rankings are low, his performance as an individual player can simply be disregarded lol Yes, I'm definitely his cheerleader, because I'm making positive remarks regarding a player and actually posting articles to support my opinion, as opposed to simply assuming and speculating. So in that sense, are you Charlie Whitehurst's cheerleader or Peter Carrol's? Just looking for a clarification. I'm defending a player I've been playing close attention to, while you're defending a QB you've likely never even seen throw a single pass, as well as a HC of whom you likely know little to nothing about. But I'm the cheerleader. Well done, sport.

[quote name='BmoreRaised' timestamp='1305798729' post='688353']
hes not a very good player
[/quote]
[quote name='BmoreRaised' timestamp='1305890256' post='688813']
Wilson is way overrated
[/quote]
[quote name='BmoreRaised' timestamp='1305798818' post='688354']
uh Didnt Wilson let up a 50 yard td pass to johnson right before Halftime and If i recall Johnson lit him up the second half
[/quote]
[quote name='BmoreRaised' timestamp='1305915922' post='688944']
what has Wilson really done in his career besides that 10 game stretch
[/quote]

No, sorry. I must've mistaken you with another member. You've never criticized him before. Don't worry. Just write your entire next post with the Caps Lock on. Everyone knows capital letters always help drive the point lol In the words of the a famous artist: U Mad?

[1/28/01]

[quote name='charchboii' timestamp='1305843866' post='688649']
Ppl forget Todd heap is a free agent
[/quote]
charchboii forgets heap is signed thru 2011

[BmoreRaised]

[quote name='-Truth-' timestamp='1305931819' post='689064']
To put things in perspective, in 2009, Wilson graded out twice as high as Jonathan Joseph is 2010. But obviously their entire secondary's performance falls completely on Wilson, right? I mean, he's definitely out there by himself, so if their overall rankings are low, his performance as an individual player can simply be disregarded lol Yes, I'm definitely his cheerleader, because I'm making positive remarks regarding a player and actually posting articles to support my opinion, as opposed to simply assuming and speculating. So in that sense, are you Charlie Whitehurst's cheerleader or Peter Carrol's? Just looking for a clarification. I'm defending a player I've been playing close attention to, while you're defending a QB you've likely never even seen throw a single pass, as well as a HC of whom you likely know little to nothing about. But I'm the cheerleader. Well done, sport.





No, sorry. I must've mistaken you with another member. You've never criticized him before. Don't worry. Just write your entire next post with the Caps Lock on. Everyone knows capital letters always help drive the point lol In the words of the a famous artist: U Mad?
[/quote]
yeah ur right im totally defending pete carroll which i think i mentioned hardly anything about him

Sayin Wilson is overrated isnt bashin him,its simply stating how i feel that people are lookin at him for this past season

Charlie Whitehurst trade doesnt compare to the Wilson trade,why are you even bringing this up? you are tryin to prove what? they had a less durable QB in Matt H. and that seems like a move of desperation to trade a 3rd,while trading away Wilson on an already poor secondary is somehow in any comparison?Bringing in someone on a spot of need and trading away ur so called "best cb" doesnt add up

Wilson has never been a good player in the league hes been decent at times, im sorry but the nfl doesnt usually trade away their best CB on a secondary which was ranked bottom two in the league the previous two years,there is something that made Wilson expandable so we will see how the "all pro wilson " in ur eyes plays or maybe u can google me some stats from websites stating otherwise haha funny

[BmoreRaised]

what Wilson has done over his career isnt special also sayin he isnt very good isnt a bash or low blow at all i said he played good this year but overall through his career ?hes been decent not a bash just the truth as your name says lol, sorry didnt mean to offend ur man crush

[Moderator 2]

Guys please chill on the female references, no use anyone getting in trouble during a lockout please and thankyou

[1/28/01]

[quote name='Moderator 2' timestamp='1305956292' post='689164']
Guys please chill on the female references, no use anyone getting in trouble during a lockout please and thankyou
[/quote]
By "guys' you clearly mean Bmoreraised, since I have made no such reference. I will, of course, continue to oblige.

Have a great night!

[BmoreRaised]

I will be the bigger person here and end this because it has gotten out of hand.Bottom line is I think Wilson played good for us but still dont consider him a very good player not based on last year.That's something you've got to earn over the course of your entire career.We are all Raven fans and want the best for our team and this goin back and forth is not really proving or settling anything.

[Rav'n Maniac]

O.K. Lets lay it all out with respect to the CB's.

[u]Foxworth[/u] 2009 stats: 16 gms / 53 Tackles / 48 Solo / 16 PD's / 4 Int's. 2010 salary: 3.2m / 2011 est. salary: 4.4m
Notes: Contributes on ST. Good starting corner who had 3rd best season in 2009. Returning from injury. Questions: Can he return to form in 2011 or does he need time to get comfortable with the knee?

[u]Carr[/u] 2010 stats: 16 gms / 61 Tackles / 54 Solo / 8 PD's / 2 Int's. 2010 salary: 2.5m / 2011 est. salary: ?
Notes: Contributes on ST. Good nickle / starting corner who had best season in 2010 (contract year). Questions: How much more money can we afford to pay a good yet situational player if he can't become a consistent starter?

[u]Wilson[/u] 2010 stats: 14 gms / 40 Tackles / 37 Solo / 14 PD's / 3 Int's. 2010 salary: 550k / 2011 est. salary: ?
Notes: Contributes on ST. Good nickle / starting corner who had best season in 2010. Questions: Does he give a "home town" discount to remain close to family members and stay a Raven?

[u]Webb[/u] 2010 stats: 15 gms / 54 Tackles / 47 Solo / 9 PD's / 2 Int's. 2010 salary: 395k / 2011 est. salary: 480k.
Notes: Contributes on ST. Possible starting corner one season removed from injury. Questions: Does he fully get over the hump of returning from the injury this season?

If one has to go, who do you choose?

Although they are all fairly close in abilitys, IMO it's Foxworth. Too many uncertainties surrounding the knee. Big hit to the salary cap when re-instituted, 100k less than Ray, 200k less than Heap. More value in retaining the other three.

[-Truth-]

lol Right. Concerning Wilson, I stand by my point. He was good, as well as underrated, as an individual player with a much lesser supporting cast, and thrived in our defense down the stretch. I've made quite a compelling argument so I won't add anything else.

[berad]

[quote name='BmoreRaised' timestamp='1305954583' post='689153']
yeah ur right im totally defending pete carroll which i think i mentioned hardly anything about him,ur 22 yrs old googling information i seriously doubt u've played a down of football in ur life, ur right i know nothing about pete carroll and him coaching the patriots and the jets also usc just of recently but i dont need to google that unlike some people who were children at that time, i dont need to google about football because unlike u since u are 22 yrs old and [b]always on a forum[/b], some of us here actually played the sport isnt that something, since ur tryin to throw some smack talkin in their.
[/quote]

You have more posts per day than him

[PWNEDbyDEANO]

[quote name='Rav'n Maniac' timestamp='1305984293' post='689208']
[u]Foxworth[/u] 2009 stats: 16 gms / 53 Tackles / 48 Solo / 16 PD's / 4 Int's. 2010 salary: 3.2m / [b]2011 est. salary: 4.4m[/b]
[/quote]

I don't know think that Foxworth will see his whole contract through, being as the team now has Smith, who will likely take over the starter position before too long, maybe even some point this season. Also taking into the fact that the team has Webb and Chykie Brown and (IMO) will likely bolster the position late in next years draft, that massive contract of Foxy's begins to make him look surplus to requirements.

If Wilson is willing to return for cheaper than Foxworth, I think that we keep hold of Wilson and cut Foxworth. The salary drop-off would be much bigger than the talent drop off.

[flynismo]

[quote name='Rav'n Maniac' timestamp='1305984293' post='689208']<br />O.K. Lets lay it all out with respect to the CB's.<br /><br /><u>Foxworth</u> 2009 stats: 16 gms / 53 Tackles / 48 Solo / 16 PD's / 4 Int's. 2010 salary: 3.2m / 2011 est. salary: 4.4m<br />Notes: Doesn't contribute on ST. Good starting corner who had 3rd best season in 2009. Returning from injury. Questions: Can he return to form in 2011 or does he need time to get comfortable with the knee?<br /><br /><u>Carr</u> 2010 stats: 16 gms / 61 Tackles / 54 Solo / 8 PD's / 2 Int's. 2010 salary: 2.5m / 2011 est. salary: ?<br />Notes: Contributes on ST. Good nickle / starting corner who had best season in 2010 (contract year). Questions: How much more money can we afford to pay a good yet situational player if he can't become a consistent starter?<br /><br /><u>Wilson</u> 2010 stats: 14 gms / 40 Tackles / 37 Solo / 14 PD's / 3 Int's. 2010 salary: 550k / 2011 est. salary: ?<br />Notes: Contributes on ST. Good nickle / starting corner who had best season in 2010. Questions: Does he give a &quot;home town&quot; discount to remain close to family members and stay a Raven?<br /><br /><u>Webb</u> 2010 stats: 15 gms / 54 Tackles / 47 Solo / 9 PD's / 2 Int's. 2010 salary: 395k / 2011 est. salary: 480k.<br />Notes: Contributes on ST. Possible starting corner one season removed from injury. Questions: Does he fully get over the hump of returning from the injury this season?<br /><br />If one has to go, who do you choose?<br /><br />Although they are all fairly close in abilitys, IMO it's Foxworth. Too many uncertainties surrounding the knee. Big hit to the salary cap when re-instituted, 100k less than Ray, 200k less than Heap. More value in retaining the other three.<br />[/quote]

if you're going to judge a CB based off stats, I dont think those are the ones to use..

[Rav'n Maniac]

[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1305999440' post='689249']
if you're going to judge a CB based off stats, I dont think those are the ones to use..
[/quote]
My intention was to show a comparison between our four CB's. Based on the info, their is basically little separation in each players' production. I am open to suggestion though. What would you use and where do you find them?

[flynismo]

[quote name='Rav'n Maniac' timestamp='1306003142' post='689256']<br />My intention was to show a comparison between our four CB's. Based on the info, their is basically little separation in each players' production. I am open to suggestion though. What would you use and where do you find them?<br />[/quote]


finding them is the tough part....one thing I hate about football is the crappy recordkeeping. I just google whatever it is I try to find and pray for the best, but there's a couple guys here who can answer that question better than I could.

As for what stats to use, I'd look at things like targets, % of targets to receptions given up, yards per attempt, yards per reception. Use that in conjuction with deflections and INT to evaluate coverage.
But again, good luck finding that stuff; it's out there, but hard to find.

[berad]

[quote name='Rav'n Maniac' timestamp='1305984293' post='689208']
O.K. Lets lay it all out with respect to the CB's.

[u]Foxworth[/u] 2009 stats: 16 gms / 53 Tackles / 48 Solo / 16 PD's / 4 Int's. 2010 salary: 3.2m / 2011 est. salary: 4.4m
Notes: Doesn't contribute on ST. Good starting corner who had 3rd best season in 2009. Returning from injury. Questions: Can he return to form in 2011 or does he need time to get comfortable with the knee?[/quote]

I've seen Foxworth play on ST. Best case scenario is he re-structures the deal but, either way, our FO will have enough cap space at the end of the day...

[Rav'n Maniac]

[quote name='berad' timestamp='1306009882' post='689282']
I've seen Foxworth play on ST. Best case scenario is he re-structures the deal but, either way, our FO will have enough cap space at the end of the day...
[/quote]
You are right about Foxworth playing ST. I found info I didn't find earlier and that is he had 5 ST tackles in 2009. Thanks for pointing that out.

[Romo Ravens]

If we lose Wilson because of Foxworth, that just wouldn't make any sense to me

[omar586]

wilson over foxy

[BloodRaven]

We should give Foxy's contract to Wilson.

[flynismo]

We should give Wilson and Foxy's contracts to Aso..

[1/28/01]

[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1306083659' post='689383']
We should give Wilson and Foxy's contracts to Aso..
[/quote]
They should give Aso's, Foxys and Wilsons's contracts to me.....

Straight owned in my Baltimore Sports and Social game today. Two picks 6's!! (But we lost 44-43!! Crap!!)

[flynismo]

,[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1306111533' post='689549']<br />They should give Aso's, Foxys and Wilsons's contracts to me.....<br /><br />Straight owned in my Baltimore Sports and Social game today.  Two picks 6's!! (But we lost 44-43!!  Crap!!)<br />[/quote]


man I'd be heated! Now I see why T.O. is the way he is haha..,,,,,,,,

[1/28/01]

[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1306116784' post='689596']
,


man I'd be heated! Now I see why T.O. is the way he is haha..,,,,,,,,
[/quote]
I should clarify....I had the two picks 6's, but we still lost. We were down 30-14 at half and turned it on the second half.