Ray Rice

[jimmysmith3]

So Ray Rice and the whole Baltimore running game seemed to take a step back in 2010 after a great year in 2011. What do you think went wrong and how can we fix it?

[shawn ny]

Offensive line difficulties mixed with Cam's terrible play calling mixed in with my opinion that ray rice is not an every down back. It seems like he is most effective after the bruiser back has softened up that D....But thats just my opinion.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

In a perfect world Gaither would come back in shape and be sensible enough to realize you dont demand a big contract after coming off of contributing nothing unless you are a time tested and proven entity. That would mean oher goes back to right tackle and yanda back to guard, with grubbs rehabbing completely. Cam cameron would mix up his play calling instead of run, run , pass. he stretches the field vertically with a four wide set wet with ray rice in the back field, or three wide with heap on the line. Either way exploit all areas of the field and actually give them a reason to fear the deep ball, and the nahd it off to rice so running lanes are there because they cant stack the box and run 2 deep safeties.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

but that is in a perfect world and everything goes the right way btu I doubt it so who knows how it will shake out.

[AwakenTheDemon]

The reason, in my mind, for Rice's dip in statistics is largely based upon the mangled and injured offensive line. Gaither was gone, so Yanda slid out to tackle, while Chester and Moll tried to plug that hole, while Birk was battling a leg injury all season. Sure, Cam's playcalling didn't help, but without the offensive line to sustain gaps for Rice to get through, he could only do so much. It should be noted how well he played despite having such a shoddy line in front of him, so I can only hope Gaither returns and the line stays healthy this year.

[-Truth-]

I'd say the difficulties with our Offensive Line certainly brought about a number of issues with the run game. There were a select few members who've criticized Rice for a lack of explosion. But our entire three-headed monster saw a significant decline in their YPC. Rice did seem hesitant at times, but it looked as if he didn't trust what was in front of him, not as if he was regressed in terms of his physical abilities. If we can shore up the OL, specifically the right side, I think we'll be in really good shape.

[Crabcakes&Football]

The offensive line definitely. If you noticed it was like trying to run through a brick wall most games, there were no holes opened up. If not for Gaither's injury he definitely would have had a stellar season. There is no sure fix to the O-line, but the closest thing to that is to re-sign Gaither and move him back to LT. They won't do that because they are intent on Michael Oher having that spot, and Rosenhaus will likely ask for more money than they want to pay. So hopefully we can find the answer in FA, I don't think either Reid or Harewood would be ready to start.

[SpeedKills]

Methinks it's a combination of Cam Cameron's questionable playcalling and the mediocrity of the o-line. We all know Rice has the tools - we just need to put, and maintain, the wall up in front of him.

[MagicianCamille]

The offensive line last year was our biggest Achilles heel, no doubt. Pretty much all of our offensive problems last year can be traced back to poor blocking by the O-Line.

[D_UP]

O-line don't care who you having at running back if there is no holes and your oline is being pushed around you won't get many yards.

[izvoodoo]

did no one notice the slide matt birk went on?

[SpeedKills]

[quote name='izvoodoo' timestamp='1305506819' post='686774']
did no one notice the slide matt birk went on?
[/quote]

That fall under the category of O-line problems....

[izvoodoo]

[quote name='SpeedKills' timestamp='1305506939' post='686777']
That fall under the category of O-line problems....
[/quote]

I just feel like it's been an understated problem.

[Militant X 1]

this topic has been discussed over and over and over again.

~Mili

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='izvoodoo' timestamp='1305506819' post='686774']
did no one notice the slide matt birk went on?
[/quote]

It was difficult not to notice his struggles. The interior o-line rarely generated movement and he was as guilty for that as Chester.

I wasn't surprised when I read Birk had played most of the season with a knee injury.

If he can stay healthier next season, Grubbs' ankle doesn't cause him trouble, Yanda is re-signed and the tackle spot Oher isn't manning is solidified, Rice should go back to efficiently running the ball.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

just out of curiousity does anybody understand the reasoning for trading Jason Brown, if memory serves he was a good ball player that was young that we traded for an old, still good, but old center when we could have had Brow for the next ten years.

[berad]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1305520773' post='686888']
just out of curiousity does anybody understand the reasoning for trading Jason Brown, if memory serves he was a good ball player that was young that we traded for an old, still good, but old center when we could have had Brow for the next ten years.
[/quote]

We didn't trade him, he left for greener [i](richer)[/i] pastures. He became the highest paid center in the league and I don't think the Ravens wanted to give that cash to a center when they knew they had contracts for Suggs and Lewis on the horizon.

[gabefergy]

Rice still put up a ton of yards with very poor offensive line play. If the line and play-calling can get better, I see no reason why Rice cant have a 1500 yard season with another 500 yards receiving. Ray Rice is a special talent that too many fans fail to fully appreciate.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='berad' timestamp='1305520954' post='686891']
We didn't trade him, he left for greener [i](richer)[/i] pastures. He became the highest paid center in the league and I don't think the Ravens wanted to give that cash to a center when they knew they had contracts for Suggs and Lewis on the horizon.
[/quote]
sorry when I said trading I meant why did we trade talented youth for talented old guy. Sorry but i mean locking him up would have made more sense and we still could have made cap space with some wiggling, and now we would not being worried about center, we would be an OLB/DE away from a team with no holes in it if we resign gaither. Just think it makes more sense than putting a band aid line together.

[1/28/01]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1305509001' post='686806']
this topic has been discussed over and over and over again.

~Mili
[/quote]
Yup, and it never changes.....O-line issues/O-line health. Done!

[-Truth-]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1305521183' post='686896']
sorry when I said trading I meant why did we trade talented youth for talented old guy. Sorry but i mean locking him up would have made more sense and we still could have made cap space with some wiggling, and now we would not being worried about center, we would be an OLB/DE away from a team with no holes in it if we resign gaither. Just think it makes more sense than putting a band aid line together.
[/quote]
I'm not sure how good of a move it would've been. To quote PFF.com, "For those wondering where Jason Brown is, he’s our 2nd lowest ranked center and looks nothing like the guy we saw in his final year in Baltimore." I do understand your confusion about letting go of a rising player for a much older one though.

[Free Agent]

I just couldn't understand how the Ravens offensive line struggled so badly with just the loss of Jared Gaither, and the Steelers offensive line was plagued with injuries yet Mendenhall and Roethlisberger barely had any problems in the running game and the passing game.

[RavensAllAroundTheWorld]

Watching Rice run, I noticed teams may have just found new ways to stop him. After his second and third time around teams learned that you have to stay in your lane being Rice is small and hard to find. He was once able to go in and out of wholes as defenders all swarmed to him. Now if you notice they don't swarm him as much. They try to take lanes and wait on him to dart to another whole. Still, Rice is going to have a shot this season to do great things and I know he will be a star for us.

[Rav'n Maniac]

There's no doubt it was the line. But I blame the FO as much because they had plenty of time to address the problem before the season started and chose not to do so.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Free Agent' timestamp='1305543225' post='686933']
I just couldn't understand how the Ravens offensive line struggled so badly with just the loss of Jared Gaither, and the Steelers offensive line was plagued with injuries yet Mendenhall and Roethlisberger barely had any problems in the running game and the passing game.
[/quote]

It's isn't hard to figure out. Gaither's injury had a ripple effect on the line. Oher played LT, a position he obviously isn't as strong at. The same could be applied to Yanda at RT. Birk was hurt most of the season. And Chester showed why he isn't starting material on a weekly basis.

As for Pittsburgh, Mendenhall actually averaged .1 less than Rice so he wasn't more efficient pounding the rock.

Ben was sacked less than Joe but you have to wonder how many sacks he eluded on his own.

[Suggs Package]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1305563319' post='687004']
It's isn't hard to figure out. Gaither's injury had a ripple effect on the line. Oher played LT, a position he obviously isn't as strong at. The same could be applied to Yanda at RT. Birk was hurt most of the season. And Chester showed why he isn't starting material on a weekly basis.

As for Pittsburgh, Mendenhall actually averaged .1 less than Rice so he wasn't more efficient pounding the rock.

Ben was sacked less than Joe but you have to wonder how many sacks he eluded on his own.
[/quote]

I will respectfully disagree to some extent. Gaither's ripple effect was evident, but Oher and Yanda were two of the best run blocking tackles in the NFL last year. http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol. Yanda probably was top 5. Our interior is where we really sucked. They help blocks, but didn't get to the 2nd level. This, combined with Cam's unwillingness to run Rice on the outsides (60% of our runs were between Guard and Center), where our strengths are at OL, contributed to Rice's decline. We averaged well over 5 yards per carry on Yanda's side, why not run there more?

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Rav'n Maniac' timestamp='1305547929' post='686940']
There's no doubt it was the line. But I blame the FO as much because they had plenty of time to address the problem before the season started and chose not to do so.
[/quote]

I can't believe there wasn't a single serviceable tackle walking the streets before training camp last year but I doubt the team banked on both Gaither and Harewood going down either.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Suggs Package' timestamp='1305564070' post='687011']
I will respectfully disagree to some extent. Gaither's ripple effect was evident, but Oher and Yanda were two of the best run blocking tackles in the NFL last year. http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol. Yanda probably was top 5. Our interior is where we really sucked. They help blocks, but didn't get to the 2nd level. This, combined with Cam's unwillingness to run Rice on the outsides (60% of our runs were between Guard and Center), where our strengths are at OL, contributed to Rice's decline. We averaged well over 5 yards per carry on Yanda's side, why not run there more?
[/quote]

This topic concerns Rice and his decline but I also factored in the line's issues in pass pro as Free Agent brought up Ben.

I noticed opposing teams started overloading Grubbs' and Oher's side relatively early in the season. The only reason I can think of why Cam didn't run to the right more is because hes didn't trust Chester to consistently make good blocks.

[63bru]

The line was most of the problem, but towards the end of the year, I noticed that Ray Rice just kind of lowered his head and ran into the biggest pile he could find. It seemed like he kind of gave up on getting blocking, so he just gave up on looking for a hole. The play calling also was a big factor. I don't have any numbers, but it seemed like almost every first down was a dive up the middle. Predictability doesn't cut it in the NFL. So basically, it was everything, including Ray himself. I expect things to be better this year, though.

[PWNEDbyDEANO]

[quote name='Suggs Package' timestamp='1305564070' post='687011']
I will respectfully disagree to some extent. Gaither's ripple effect was evident, but Oher and Yanda were two of the best run blocking tackles in the NFL last year. http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol. Yanda probably was top 5. [b]Our interior is where we really sucked.[/b] They help blocks, but didn't get to the 2nd level. This, combined with Cam's unwillingness to run Rice on the outsides (60% of our runs were between Guard and Center), where our strengths are at OL, contributed to Rice's decline. We averaged well over 5 yards per carry on Yanda's side, why not run there more?
[/quote]

That's exactly right. The fact that it's the interior part of the OL which carries the most significance for the running game makes it all the worse. I saw Chester losing ground to good DTs on a regular basis. I even remember once when I saw Woodley run straight over him, putting him on the ground.

Hopefully, if Gaither is re-signed, we can establish our power running game again through a combination of Rice and (again, hopefully) McClain having more efficient, ruthless blocking from Yanda and Oher on the right side, where they're both very high caliber players.