Harbaugh's Dog House

[BloodRaven]

[quote name='berad' timestamp='1305180417' post='685470']
I don't think any player left the Ravens for the Jets for any reason except money. Pryce may say he jumped at the opportunity to play with Rex but he was looking for a job, he knew his return to the Ravens would probably be unlikely.
[/quote]

It goes beyond money, Ryan knows how to bond with his players and he did it while he was here.

I'm gonna use Ellerbe/McClain as an example where Harbaugh chose to discipline Ellerbe and start McClain who is the inferior linebacker.

[Corvus]

I think its a weak and extremely presumptuous argument that Harbs doesn't "know how to bond" with his players "like Rex Ryan." Just because you SEE and HEAR Rex more than Harbs, that means he is the more sociable and players' coach? Please. Just because you don't hear about it doesn't make Harbaugh not a players' coach. I think Ed_Reed20's example of the Oregon bet he lost with Ngata and Dickson is a great example of Harbs being the same thing Rex is credited with being. You don't think he, Ngata, and Dickson weren't having fun with that? All of the important Ravens will go to bat for Harbs the same as Jets would for Ryan. The fact that he has helped lead this team to 32 wins in 3 seasons should point out well enough to anyone doubting that the Ravens players have bought into what he is selling and putting their best on the field for him.

[Bltravens]

[quote name='BloodRaven' timestamp='1305187182' post='685477']
It goes beyond money, Ryan knows how to bond with his players and he did it while he was here.

I'm gonna use Ellerbe/McClain as an example where Harbaugh chose to discipline Ellerbe and start McClain who is the inferior linebacker.
[/quote]
Belichick is the polar opposite of Rex and he has been successful. Really to me Im not worried about Harbaugh becoming their best friend in order to win, by alot of accounts Belichick is a ruthless coach, but the dude knows how to win games. There alot of no nonsense coaches in the league and theres some pushover guys who have also been successful but you definitely don't have to be your players friend to be successful.

On our roster right now there isnt a single player on offense who would play for Rex over Harbaugh except maybe McGahee because he's a backup. On defense the only two guys that I can see still having that "special bond" with Rex is Ngata and Suggs....maybe JJ. Ray for damn sure isn't going to play for Rex, cant see Gregg wanting to leave Baltimore for Rex, and I Ed may have loved playing for Rex but Id put money on Ed not leaving Baltimore to play for Rex. And really after Rex said that "Suggs was a bust before I took over at DC" comment I wouldnt go play for him after that ridiculously false statement, but maybe thats just me.

[Ravenseconbeast]

All this talk about the success of rex and jets...come on..lol.

Jets barely made to playoffs bc colt literally let them in twice. And while few players might fool rex thinking they play bc they love rex, i think its bc players that flock to jets, gets big time money. Only this time, Jets have a very small room to move their money their remaining budget.

They also gave away most of their picks, hence the reason this years draft was so small.

Dont believe in Rex fairy tale, his not going to win a superbowl.

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='Bltravens' timestamp='1305216414' post='685554']
Belichick is the polar opposite of Rex and he has been successful. Really to me Im not worried about Harbaugh becoming their best friend in order to win, by alot of accounts Belichick is a ruthless coach, but the dude knows how to win games. There alot of no nonsense coaches in the league and theres some pushover guys who have also been successful but you definitely don't have to be your players friend to be successful.

On our roster right now there isnt a single player on offense who would play for Rex over Harbaugh except maybe McGahee because he's a backup. On defense the only two guys that I can see still having that "special bond" with Rex is Ngata and Suggs....maybe JJ. Ray for damn sure isn't going to play for Rex, cant see Gregg wanting to leave Baltimore for Rex, and I Ed may have loved playing for Rex but Id put money on Ed not leaving Baltimore to play for Rex. And really after Rex said that "Suggs was a bust before I took over at DC" comment I wouldnt go play for him after that ridiculously false statement, but maybe thats just me.
[/quote]


He said Suggs was a bust BEFORE he took over as DC? LOL, the man is full of himself! So, I guess it's just a coincidence then that of the three years Suggs has had double digit sack numbers, Mike Nolan and Greg Mattison were our DCs.

[Ravensfan23]

[quote name='BloodRaven' timestamp='1305187182' post='685477']
It goes beyond money, Ryan knows how to bond with his players and he did it while he was here.

[b]I'm gonna use Ellerbe/McClain as an example where Harbaugh chose to discipline Ellerbe and start McClain who is the inferior linebacker.[/b]
[/quote]

Jameel McClain was viewed and actually played as the Starter from the first day of Training Camp, so that preseason moment between Ellerbe and Harbs had nothing to do with McClain starting over Ellerbe.

Jameel McClain just outworked Ellerbe in the offseason. Ellerbe rested on his merits a bit and it costed him. To his credit Ellerbe came back and worked hard.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1305222361' post='685599']
Jameel McClain was viewed and actually played as the Starter from the first day of Training Camp, so that preseason moment between Ellerbe and Harbs had nothing to do with McClain starting over Ellerbe.

Jameel McClain just outworked Ellerbe in the offseason. Ellerbe rested on his merits a bit and it costed him. To his credit Ellerbe came back and worked hard.
[/quote]

Regardless of the top spot in preseason i dont care when it came to regulat season Ellerbe was hands downe better. McClain may have outworked him but Ellerbe was definitely the better player and helped our team a lot more so should have been on the field. If he can rest on his merits and still play better than McClain then so be it, the thing with that is is nobody in the league is good enought they can rest on their merits for very long, so if he is better now that is fine but if jameel keeps working hard and is the better player or on the same level then yeah play the harder worker no doubt, but as long as ellerbe is better he should be on the field. point blank.

[Ravensfan23]

Rex and Harbs can't be compared because they are two completely different guys. Too often people always want to compare and decide who's better. The biggest thing Harbs and Rex have in common is the Ravens and the fact they're both head coaches. It's like saying Mr B. is a better owner then Mr Modell because he's much more involved in the day to day operations, while Mr. Modell was more of a laid back type. Different strokes for different folks.

Don't be fooled by players leaving the Ravens to play with Rex because it means nothing. As someone else stated, money had just as much to do with it then anything. If the Ravens were willing to dump a pile of money in Bart Scott's and Jim Leonhard's lap then they would still be Baltimore Ravens.

However it came down to choices, Ray Lewis or Bart Scott....i'll take Ray every day. Leonhard or Landry.....that's more of a toss up, but before the major injury vs the Browns, it was Landry hands down. Pryce was just about the opportunity to play in Rex's defense again.

When you got guys like Ngata, Ray, Ed, and JJ that refuse to sign with the Ravens to run and play with the Jets then I'll buy into the whole Ravens' players want to play for Rex Ryan more.

It's unfair to say, Ravens players want to play for Rex, well of course they do, most of them that played under Rex did so for 5+ years. The defensive guys loved Rex and for good reason, however Harbs was only a Special Teams coach, so it's not really a fair comparison.

[Ravensfan23]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1305222812' post='685603']
Regardless of the top spot in preseason i dont care when it came to regulat season Ellerbe was hands downe better. McClain may have outworked him but Ellerbe was definitely the better player and helped our team a lot more so should have been on the field. If he can rest on his merits and still play better than McClain then so be it, the thing with that is is nobody in the league is good enought they can rest on their merits for very long, so if he is better now that is fine but if jameel keeps working hard and is the better player or on the same level then yeah play the harder worker no doubt, but as long as ellerbe is better he should be on the field. point blank.
[/quote]

So it's cool for a player to walk around with a huge head(not saying Ellerbe did) after only starting 3 games in his rookie year, just as long as he's a good player? That's where you fall into situations like the Bengals, Raiders, and other poorish organizations.

Oh I'm the man, so i don't have to work hard, I started 3 games last season, so i got the starting position on lock. No, you bust your butt even harder now that you're the starter and make sure you're separating yourself for any other competition.

Ellerbe didn't play that well in the preseason when given his opportunity, so why should he be listed as the starter, because of what he did last year? You might not like Harbs style and that's cool, but one of the biggest knocks on Billick was that he didn't have any discipline for his players, and people think Harbs has too much.

Ask yourself this question. If Haynesworth and Pac Man were members of the Baltimore Ravens, they'd probably be among our best players. With the way things played out in their careers would you still carry the approach of best player plays no matter what?

And before anyone says, well Ellerbe isn't a Haynesworth or Pac Man, you're right. However how can you fault a coach for putting a end to poor behavior too early instead of way too late.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1305223832' post='685619']
So it's cool for a player to walk around with a huge head(not saying Ellerbe did) after only starting 3 games in his rookie year, just as long as he's a good player? That's where you fall into situations like the Bengals, Raiders, and other poorish organizations.

Oh I'm the man, so i don't have to work hard, I started 3 games last season, so i got the starting position on lock. No, you bust your butt even harder now that you're the starter and make sure you're separating yourself for any other competition.

Ellerbe didn't play that well in the preseason when given his opportunity, so why should he be listed as the starter, because of what he did last year? You might not like Harbs style and that's cool, but one of the biggest knocks on Billick was that he didn't have any discipline for his players, and people think Harbs has too much.

Ask yourself this question. If Haynesworth and Pac Man were members of the Baltimore Ravens, they'd probably be among our best players. With the way things played out in their careers would you still carry the approach of best player plays no matter what?

And before anyone says, well Ellerbe isn't a Haynesworth or Pac Man, you're right. However how can you fault a coach for putting a end to poor behavior too early instead of way too late.
[/quote]

Ok, I think there was a misunderstanding, especially in the fact that I dont like Harbs style. Honestly the character, class, level-headedness and his willingness to go to bat for his players makes him one of the best coaches in the league in my opinion. I am very grateful that we have harbs, and What you said about haynesworth is more of an illustration is what I was saying. Haynesworth was very good when ngata was a rookie, who would I rather have had if it was just off on the field play that year probably haynesworth. Now after haloti has completely bought into being a professional and worked his tail off Ngata every day of the week baby, no question about it haynesworth couldnt hold up ngata's jock anymore. I am not saying Ellerbe should walk around with his head bloated but if he can produce more on the field than mcclain regardless of what people think about him he should be on the field to give us the best chance to win. Where you draw the line is when their arrogance hurts the team or the players ability ie haynesworth, all I was saying was the people who give us the best chance to win should be on the field.

[Purple&Black]

harbs dog house...barnes, ellerbe, McCalister, and now add kindle while harbs proves he is in control of the team which is good, i think he may be too strict at times...no reason why ellerbe shouldnt see more time and now we are looking for a situational pass rusher when we had barnes right there who excelled at just that. i want to know what places someone in his dog house....if its lack of hard work then it is understandable, but if it something like a player not wanting to play special teams or talking back one time then he needs to relax

[Ravensfan23]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1305224541' post='685630']
Ok, I think there was a misunderstanding, especially in the fact that I dont like Harbs style. Honestly the character, class, level-headedness and his willingness to go to bat for his players makes him one of the best coaches in the league in my opinion. I am very grateful that we have harbs, and What you said about haynesworth is more of an illustration is what I was saying. Haynesworth was very good when ngata was a rookie, who would I rather have had if it was just off on the field play that year probably haynesworth. Now after haloti has completely bought into being a professional and worked his tail off Ngata every day of the week baby, no question about it haynesworth couldnt hold up ngata's jock anymore. I am not saying Ellerbe should walk around with his head bloated but if he can produce more on the field than mcclain regardless of what people think about him he should be on the field to give us the best chance to win. Where you draw the line is when their arrogance hurts the team or the players ability ie haynesworth, all I was saying was the people who give us the best chance to win should be on the field.
[/quote]

Yea I agree the best players should play, but sometimes young talented players need to be knocked off their high horse at times. Imo that's something that didn't happen with an Antwan Barnes. Some players respond well and some don't.

If Ellerbe came into mini camp and OTA's last season with the attitude of....oh I'm the man, or approached things like a 7 year vet who didn't have to earn a position, then it's probably good that he got knocked down.

I think Ellerbe will comeback this training camp and really impress. I actually think he'll lock down that starting ILB position for good this year.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1305227371' post='685661']
Yea I agree the best players should play, but sometimes young talented players need to be knocked off their high horse at times. Imo that's something that didn't happen with an Antwan Barnes. Some players respond well and some don't.

If Ellerbe came into mini camp and OTA's last season with the attitude of....oh I'm the man, or approached things like a 7 year vet who didn't have to earn a position, then it's probably good that he got knocked down.

I think Ellerbe will comeback this training camp and really impress. I actually think he'll lock down that starting ILB position for good this year.
[/quote]

I agree they should but the one person who unquestionably has more influence on that team than anybody is Ray who also shares the same position as ellerbe, I think ray could have done the knocking him off his high horse way better and in a more productive manner than what harbs could. Again not a knock on harbs but if you have veteran leadership like that and a player who is strutting when he hasnt earned it especially if they share the same position such as Ellerbe let Ray Ray do his thing and reel the young man in and teach him how to play the game and be a professional.

[Ravensfan23]

[quote name='Purple&Black' timestamp='1305225554' post='685642']
harbs dog house...barnes, ellerbe, McCalister, and now add kindle while harbs proves he is in control of the team which is good, i think he may be too strict at times...no reason why ellerbe shouldnt see more time and now we are looking for a situational pass rusher when we had barnes right there who excelled at just that. i want to know what places someone in his dog house....if its lack of hard work then it is understandable, but if it something like a player not wanting to play special teams or talking back one time then he needs to relax
[/quote]

you know what's funny, all those players had reasons to be in the position they were in and it had nothing(imo) to do with Harbs "doghouse".

C-Mac became a player who's problems and immaturity outweighed his on field production. At the time Chris was released, he was a 31 year old CB who had clearly lost a step but didn't want to make the switch to safety. He had two season(07,08) that were filled with injuries, and there were reports of him, constantly being late for practices, just not buying into the new direction of the team, and being problematic in the locker room. C-Mac made his bed and ultimately laid in it.

Antwan Barnes was pretty much the same way, just not as talented as C-Mac. There were reports of Barnes having poor practice habits and having a bit of a cocky attitude. Those are the type of players, that not only Harbs, but Mr. B don't want representing the Baltimore Ravens.

People look at the preseason incident with Ellerbe and think that's why he wasn't starting, when in reality it was just the fact that McClain out worked him for the starting position. All offseason everyone was talking about Ellerbe or Gooden being the starter, so when McClain took the field with the starters from the first snap of practice it was a surprise to people. Truth of the matter is, if you come into camp as a 2nd year, undrafted free agent player and get out worked, then you'll probably be out of a job. Ellerbe's potential and his talent is what kept him here. Most guys in his position just get cut.

People look at players not playing and automatically think that said player is in Harbs dog house. However we as fan are not out on the field in practice, we're not in the class rooms and film rooms. So we don't see who struggles to pick up the game plan, or who just doesn't bust their butts in practice enough, we don't have coaches tape, so we can't see who missed 5-7 assignments in a game. As fans we just see what the TV camera's show us. We see all the plays that Ellerbe or any player makes or misses on the ball. However we don't see the assignment these players miss and are lucky enough to not have it cost the team, because the ball went the other way.

Ellerbe is a talented player no doubt and I think he'll be a stud in a few years. However if the reports of him not working as hard last offseason, and in camp are true, then I'm glad he got knocked down, because it should make him better.

[Ravensfan23]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1305228022' post='685666']
I agree they should but the one person who unquestionably has more influence on that team than anybody is Ray who also shares the same position as ellerbe, I think ray could have done the knocking him off his high horse way better and in a more productive manner than what harbs could. Again not a knock on harbs but if you have veteran leadership like that and a player who is strutting when he hasnt earned it especially if they share the same position such as Ellerbe let Ray Ray do his thing and reel the young man in and teach him how to play the game and be a professional.
[/quote]

Ray's only gonna be around for the next couple years. Harbs will probably be here for the next 4-5+ years depending on the success he has during this extension. Ray is a great leader, no doubt but ultimately this team will take on the form of it's head coach, not certain player.

Also we don't know that Harbs didn't go to Ray and say, hey reel the young kid in a bit. Or maybe get Ellerbe to sit next to Ray in the meeting rooms, or spend more time with Ray. Those are the things we as fans don't know. We just see a guy lose playing time and we think he's in the dog house or Harbs is being too harsh.

As great of a leader that Ray is, it's not his job to reel in young players, whether it be Ellerbe, Jimmy Smith or anyone. If Ray choose to do it, then great. However as a Head Coach you gotta be the one to set the tone and make-up of your Team. As much as we don't want to think about it, Ray Lewis won't be in a Ravens' uniform forever. So when he's gone, what is Harbs gonna do, ask Ray to come back as a mentor?

[Bltravens]

[quote name='Ravenslifer' timestamp='1305221457' post='685592']
He said Suggs was a bust BEFORE he took over as DC? LOL, the man is full of himself! So, I guess it's just a coincidence then that of the three years Suggs has had double digit sack numbers, Mike Nolan and Greg Mattison were our DCs.
[/quote]
Ya he was comparing Gholston to Suggs to the New York media when Rex was saying he could save Gholston's career. Saying how Suggs was seen as a bust in Baltimore for awhile until he took over. Which was total crap cuz he was the Defensive Rookie of the Year in 2003. And Rex still couldnt save Gholston's career.

[jazz1988]

[quote name='BloodRaven' timestamp='1305107112' post='684982']
I don't like Harbaugh to be honest. I mean you can say what you want about Rex Ryan, but he treats his guys like equals and friends instead of underlings and employees and you see it when his guys are always batting for him wether it's on the field or in front of reporters. When our FA's can't wait to hit the open market the Jets FA's are begging to go back.

If a prime CMac and Frank Walker were both on the team right now Harbaugh would start Walker and cut CMac.
[/quote]
I dont mean this as a disrepect and you are entitled to your opinion but when I read that I was like what are you talking about. You said "I mean you can say what you want about Rex Ryan, but he treats his guys like equals and friends instead of underlings and employees and you see it when his guys are always batting for him wether it's on the field or in front of reporters"Really when I read that I was like so what and since when a head coach has to be a player/employee friend his job is to coach and lead. John Harbaugh treats his players fairly and if one player decides to act up then that player may be punish by him but thats what a coach suppose to do. you said"If a prime CMac and Frank Walker were both on the team right now Harbaugh would start Walker and cut CMac"That is so not true and Cmac was his own downfall he had clear character issues and was childish at times.What Nfl player right now do you know even if they are good or still in their prime last long on a team becuase they have character issues?if Im a coach and I have a very talented player but he had character issues that gives the team, organzation and me a negative out look then he must go if he is not willing to change

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='jazz1988' timestamp='1305247900' post='685805']
I dont mean this as a disrepect and you are entitled to your opinion but when I read that I was like what are you talking about. You said "I mean you can say what you want about Rex Ryan, but he treats his guys like equals and friends instead of underlings and employees and you see it when his guys are always batting for him wether it's on the field or in front of reporters"Really when I read that I was like so what and since when a head coach has to be a player/employee friend his job is to coach and lead. John Harbaugh treats his players fairly and if one player decides to act up then that player may be punish by him but thats what a coach suppose to do. you said"If a prime CMac and Frank Walker were both on the team right now Harbaugh would start Walker and cut CMac"That is so not true and Cmac was his own downfall he had clear character issues and was childish at times.What Nfl player right now do you know even if they are good or still in their prime last long on a team becuase they have character issues?if Im a coach and I have a very talented player but he had character issues that gives the team, organzation and me a negative out look then he must go if he is not willing to change
[/quote]

cromartie is talented but a horrible sportsman and a loud mouth to boot

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1305229704' post='685681']
Ray's only gonna be around for the next couple years. Harbs will probably be here for the next 4-5+ years depending on the success he has during this extension. Ray is a great leader, no doubt but ultimately this team will take on the form of it's head coach, not certain player.

Also we don't know that Harbs didn't go to Ray and say, hey reel the young kid in a bit. Or maybe get Ellerbe to set next to Ray in the meeting rooms, or spend more time with Ray. Those are the things we as fans don't know. We just see a got lose playing time and we think he's in the dog house or Harbs is being too harsh.

As great of a leader that Ray is, it's not his job to reel in young players, whether it be Ellerbe, Jimmy Smith or anyone. If Ray choose to do it, then great. However as a Head Coach you gotta be the one to set the tone and make-up of your Team. As much as we don't want to think about it, Ray Lewis won't be in a Ravens' uniform forever. So when he's gone, what is Harbs gonna do, ask Ray to come back as a mentor?
[/quote]

true but if we are going to find a guy to fill ray's roster spot when he leaves then he should definitely have a huge hand in molding those guys. I think harbaugh should be the coach, and you may be absolutely correct he may have gone to ray and asked him to reel him in, if he did I give him mad pops for it if he did not then that is his rite as a coach and can definitely exercise them. So that being said your right ray wont be here forever but if he can indelibly leave his mark on the younger players than they are just that much better off. I think if he hasn't had all the young lb's with ray ray anyway he has already screwed up.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1305248478' post='685812']
true but if we are going to find a guy to fill ray's roster spot when he leaves then he should definitely have a huge hand in molding those guys. I think harbaugh should be the coach, and you may be absolutely correct he may have gone to ray and asked him to reel him in, if he did I give him mad pops for it if he did not then that is his rite as a coach and can definitely exercise them. So that being said your right ray wont be here forever but if he can indelibly leave his mark on the younger players than they are just that much better off. [b]I think if he hasn't had all the young lb's with ray ray anyway he has already screwed up.[/b]
[/quote]

How? When Ed was a young player, I doubt he needed to be told by Billick or anyone else to stick by Ray and learn his ways. If the young LBs want to be great, shouldn't they seek out Ray in the off-season on their own?

[jazz1988]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1305248090' post='685807']
cromartie is talented but a horrible sportsman and a loud mouth to boot
[/quote]

He has very little chracter concerns and has potentials to be a shutdown cornerback its just that he has not lived up to the expectation that teams want to see from him. he does have a loud mouth at times and that may get him in trouble but his chracter concerns are not like a Cmac or Aquib Talib

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1305249000' post='685813']
How? When Ed was a young player, I doubt he needed to be told by Billick or anyone else to stick by Ray and learn his ways. If the young LBs want to be great, shouldn't they seek out Ray in the off-season on their own?
[/quote]

true enough they should have the good sense to do it on their own, but for the continuity of our D if any of them are lost as to how to do it harbs needs to have these players so close to ray on the field in games in practice or pretty much any chance they get. but yeah common sense dictates they should but the thing about common sense is it isnt all that common.

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='jazz1988' timestamp='1305249093' post='685814']
He has very little chracter concerns and has potentials to be a shutdown cornerback its just that he has not lived up to the expectation that teams want to see from him. he does have a loud mouth at times and that may get him in trouble but his chracter concerns are not like a Cmac or Aquib Talib
[/quote]

agreed, I just cant stand him because he is a loud mouth albeit a talented one

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1305249499' post='685817']
true enough they should have the good sense to do it on their own, but for the continuity of our D if any of them are lost as to how to do it harbs needs to have these players so close to ray on the field in games in practice or pretty much any chance they get. but yeah common sense dictates they should but the thing about common sense is it isnt all that common.
[/quote]

It's very easy as a fan to say Harbaugh should make sure his young players are hanging with vets, even during the season, but I'm guessing it's low on his priorities list.

[Purple Punishment]

Demetrius Williams is a name that runs deep with the dog house idea. When he did get a chance to see the field under John Harbaugh he did very well and made 1 of 2 circus type catches. He torched Chicago but yet after Clayton healed up, D Will went back to the bench and our #2 receiver went back to being a non factor.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Purple Punishment' timestamp='1305253052' post='685847']
Demetrius Williams is a name that runs deep with the dog house idea. When he did get a chance to see the field under John Harbaugh he did very well and made 1 of 2 circus type catches. He torched Chicago but yet after Clayton healed up, D Will went back to the bench and our #2 receiver went back to being a non factor.
[/quote]

And on one off the few opportunities he got against the Steelers, Demetrius extended one arm nonchalantly for a ball on 4th down.

[-Truth-]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1305253623' post='685850']
And on one off the few opportunities he got against the Steelers, Demetrius extended one arm nonchalantly for a ball on 4th down.
[/quote]
Remember the drop @ New England in the Playoffs? Had it not been for our defense and running game, that play would've spelled trouble.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='-Truth-' timestamp='1305255807' post='685858']
Remember the drop @ New England in the Playoffs? Had it not been for our defense and running game, that play would've spelled trouble.
[/quote]

I certainly do. It would have been a very tough grab but no more difficult than the catch he made against the Bears.

[BloodRaven]

[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1305222361' post='685599']
Jameel McClain was viewed and actually played as the Starter from the first day of Training Camp, so that preseason moment between Ellerbe and Harbs had nothing to do with McClain starting over Ellerbe.

Jameel McClain just outworked Ellerbe in the offseason. Ellerbe rested on his merits a bit and it costed him. To his credit Ellerbe came back and worked hard.
[/quote]

Exactly, I kept seeing McClain overpursue with his rush mentality or hit the wro ng hole and get washed out of a big run play. This is when Harbaughs personal issues with players hurts the team, unless Ellerbe was being a cancer there was no need to make an example out of him for the sake of making an example.


[quote name='jazz1988' timestamp='1305247900' post='685805']
I dont mean this as a disrepect and you are entitled to your opinion but when I read that I was like what are you talking about. You said "I mean you can say what you want about Rex Ryan, but he treats his guys like equals and friends instead of underlings and employees and you see it when his guys are always batting for him wether it's on the field or in front of reporters"Really when I read that I was like so what and since when a head coach has to be a player/employee friend his job is to coach and lead. John Harbaugh treats his players fairly and if one player decides to act up then that player may be punish by him but thats what a coach suppose to do. you said"If a prime CMac and Frank Walker were both on the team right now Harbaugh would start Walker and cut CMac"That is so not true and Cmac was his own downfall he had clear character issues and was childish at times.What Nfl player right now do you know even if they are good or still in their prime last long on a team becuase they have character issues?if Im a coach and I have a very talented player but he had character issues that gives the team, organzation and me a negative out look then he must go if he is not willing to change
[/quote]

You can say an coach/employer job isn't to be a friend, but you can't deny Rex's ability to make people want to play and stay on his team.

You're all so quick to throw CMac under the bus based on some apparent rift between Harbaugh and himself. I don't remember you guys saying he was a cancer for the 9 or so whatever seasons he was here.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='BloodRaven' timestamp='1305256618' post='685864']
Exactly, I kept seeing McClain overpursue with his rush mentality or hit the wro ng hole and get washed out of a big run play. This is when Harbaughs personal issues with players hurts the team, unless Ellerbe was being a cancer there was no need to make an example out of him for the sake of making an example.

You can say an coach/employer job isn't to be a friend, but you can't deny Rex's ability to make people want to play and stay on his team.

You're all so quick to throw CMac under the bus based on some apparent rift between Harbaugh and himself. I don't remember you guys saying he was a cancer for the 9 or so whatever seasons he was here.
[/quote]

I didn't agree with how long Ellerbe was disciplined for but he wasn't sat because of a one-time incident with him either.

Who exactly are these players running to leave the Ravens? Players want to play for Rex because he's a player's coach but with what some people here write, you'd think Harbaugh was the antithesis.

I don't know how many fans knew of McAllister's issues but like in all cases, they're easier to overlook when a player is one off the best at his position.