Adam Schefter Said We Are One Of The Teams Likely To Sign Nnamdi..

[gabefergy]

[quote name='behindenemylines' timestamp='1304353631' post='679813']
People say "we can do it" others say "its impossible!"
I wanted to add some numbers to the debate so I did some research.
For our purposes, the league proposed a $141m Salary Cap, the NFLPA proposed $151m. Lets say they meet halfway and its $145m(this is all assuming they reach an agreement- otherwise its uncapped. If uncapped, Id say go do it because we'll lose a couple of very expensive players in the next few years freeing up the space we need).

The ravens currently have around $100m in signed commitments, including a few players who I dont see as having a future here that are sucking up big bucks:
Willis Mcgahee- $6m
Kelly Gregg- $3.5m
Domonique Foxworth $4.4m

Going through the draft positions we drafted at vs the 2010 draft... we'll owe rookies around 3m next year.

They will have to pay Haloti $12.5m a year. I imagine a long-term contract would be similar in the first year, though maybe a tad more.

To pay for our tenders, we'll have to lay down about $14m.

Then, there are a couple critical signs we need to make:
Josh Wilson - I anticipate we will pay him in the vein of foxy, say 4m a year.
Marshal Yanda - I imagine we'll pay him similarly to some of the NYJ guards, also say 5m a year.

So that puts us around $140m.
Dawan Landry is also a free agent, but I dont see them signing him because he'll want a big contract- he's very good. Plus we have Haruki and Tom waiting to play, with Chykie being a combo man. He's been both safety and CB. Could be a solid 4th backup.

So that leaves 5 million, plus whatever we can gain by trading or cutting Willis, Kelly Gregg and Foxy. Make no mistake, we can cut foxworth if we go get Aso. So by cutting or trading Willis and Foxy, we'd get ~10.4m back, giving the Ravens 15.4m to play with.

If you can get Asomugha for around 12-3/year, damn right i'd do it. Then spend the rest (and maybe even trade/cut Kelly Gregg, since we have an overabundance of Dline guys) on a pass rusher and you're set.

If my math is wrong anywhere or anyone sees an error in my grasp of the situation, point it out below. For example, I am not sure if we cut those 3 guys if we get all, a portion, or none of their salary back(in terms of cap credit). My perception was we can get most of it back.
[/quote]

A couple things to consider:

1) We don't know what the FA rules will be like, if they are like 2010 we won't be able to sign Aso simply because we were a top 8 team last year.

2) We have to consider players that should receive long term deals coming off rookie contracts. Grubbs next year needsto be re-signed and Ray Rice definitely deserves a nice contract. Flacco will probably get paid after next season as well, and we all know that will be a sizeable contract. It wouldn't be prudent to give a huge contract to Asomugha if it handcuffs our ability to sign our own down the line.

[lgcs27288]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1304364056' post='679928']
A couple things to consider:

1) We don't know what the FA rules will be like, if they are like 2010 we won't be able to sign Aso simply because we were a top 8 team last year.

2) We have to consider players that should receive long term deals coming off rookie contracts. Grubbs next year needsto be re-signed and Ray Rice definitely deserves a nice contract. Flacco will probably get paid after next season as well, and we all know that will be a sizeable contract. It wouldn't be prudent to give a huge contract to Asomugha if it handcuffs our ability to sign our own down the line.
[/quote]


Looking towards the future, you also have to think who will be gone. If we have Aso, Im pretty sure everyone is going to be Super Bowl or bust. So, if we do happen to win the Super Bowl, Ray Lewis and Ed Reed are as good as gone, Birk and Mason will probably retire either way. Maybe even Heap.

[izvoodoo]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1304315230' post='679616']
We know the organization adheres to their big board. It wouldn't surprise me if Ozzie and company had Torrey rated higher than Houston.

McPhee is a question mark but he has some workable tools.

Carter wasn't the only OLB the organization was targeting. That's something else Ozzie explicitly said.
[/quote]

I never really like Justin Houston but seeing so many teams who had pass rush needs pass on him makes me like him less.

If he were really starting material someone in the 2nd would have taken him.

[behindenemylines]

[quote name='lgcs27288' timestamp='1304365201' post='679948']
Looking towards the future, you also have to think who will be gone. If we have Aso, Im pretty sure everyone is going to be Super Bowl or bust. So, if we do happen to win the Super Bowl, Ray Lewis and Ed Reed are as good as gone, Birk and Mason will probably retire either way. Maybe even Heap.
[/quote]


Even without a SB- these guys are probably leaving:

Mason- $4.5m
Birk- $3m
Foxworth-$4.4m (if not gone already)

So that's $12m

With SB:

Ray Lewis- $4.5m
Ed Reed- $6m

And another $10.5m

but yeah you are totally right. I dont think handcuffing the future makes sense, it just depends on when the contracts for everyone ends. Grubbs, Ray Rice, and Flacco should be taken care of.

[wayne]

I think Ed will stay about 2-3 years longer after Lewis retires, especially depending on the state of the franchise which seems to be stacking up pretty good for the future. Also, it depends on Ed's health status going into these up and coming years which is the biggest factor to me!

[Jamal]

[quote name='Clutch Ravens' timestamp='1304334704' post='679669']
Actually, Lawson was very efficient when given the opportunity to get after the Quarterback.

I'd say he's a poor man's Terrell Suggs: he can do everything, like Suggs, just not as well as Suggs can. I'd be cool with him playing accross from Suggs on passing downs.
[/quote]
I don't see that comparison at all. He doesn't offer near the pass-rush desired from a 3-4 OLB, but hes not a bad option on the inside in a Lawrence Timmons type of role.

[jaqule999]

I can't see us doing this, he is too expensive and now that we drafted two new CBs were not going to try to get him.

[Elmo]

Here's the thing as I see it:

If Aso [b]wants[/b] to come to Baltimore to play for a ring, over money and other competing teams, Ozzie will find a way to get it done. If Aso has a list of contenders he'd like to go to, and chooses the ones paying the most, it won't be Baltimore.

Of the teams considered contenders, the Eagles are probably the ones who'll make the biggest offer ('cause Reid don't like paying guys on their 2nd contract).

Basically it's all up to Aso, there's probably no team in the league that would turn down his services, there's just a difference in what those teams are willing to pay him

[Kwothdaraven]

If he came to baltimore, we would instantly become the leagues best defense. The same cant be said with the eagles. So if thats something hes interested in, then maybe he takes a paycut. But i seriously doubt hes taking a paycut

[darklight1216]

[quote name='Kwothdaraven' timestamp='1304417593' post='680424']
[b]If he came to baltimore, we would instantly become the leagues best defense.[/b] The same cant be said with the eagles. So if thats something hes interested in, then maybe he takes a paycut. But i seriously doubt hes taking a paycut
[/quote]
I'm not so sure about that. Baltimore still needs someone not named Suggs who can sack the quarterback and their run d isn't what it used to be. Of course, if you were talking strictly about points (which is what really matters), then it's possible, but there are always unforseen things like injuries that can disrupt the best of plans.

[Crabcakes&Football]

Nah let some other team overspend on Nnamdi. Our secondary is gonna be formidable as hell next year.

[CorvusCorax]

I would rather resign Carr and Wilson and have great depth at CB.

[mgridda]

Our team ranked #2 in Yards Per Passing Attempt allowed only allowed 6.4 YPA. I think they allowed #9 in passing touchdowns allowed with something like 22.

With that said, our pass rush was terrible and we only had 27 sacks or so. The other teams with top passing yards allowed rankings sacked the QB 48 or so times last season. I happen to think that we knew our secondary needed help, so we did not play in press coverage very often.

Think about last year. Did we often see Wilson/Fabian and Chris Carr 10 yards off the LOS in man coverage or in zone? We didn't press the receivers, they got clean breaks and the QB was able to pass the ball quickly. Now, Jimmy Smith can press. Nnamdi Asomugha is also a big corner who can press and push receivers around.

Smith allowed 11 completions in 2 years at Colorado and only 1 for a reception. Asomugha leads the league every year in least times targeted by a passer. They are both shut down corners with the ability to play bump and run safely and effectively.

Josh Wilson is 4 years younger than Aso - and he has speed that can keep Wallace in check and I love him, but the fact of the matter is both he and Chris Carr had tremendous years: the best years of their careers. And they were both in a contract year and they're both perhaps looking for that pay day.

They earned some fame with how they played for the Raven's secondary to supposedly be the weak spot but for us to finish with the #2 passing yards per attempt in the league. So they turned some heads, especially since Zbikowski started at FS the first 6 games while Reed was on PUP list. So, teams might contact them at the start of Free Agency and they might offer them contracts that Ozzie won't feel comfortable matching. He might feel that they would have to pay them over their value to keep them. I really love Josh Wilson, but this could be especially true of him. He played fantastically last year. But he's young and he's fast and teams can definitely break the bank for him.

For what it's worth, I'd be happy keeping Wilson, but iirc he's a RFA and we'll get like a really good draft pick for him.

Now, Aso has not been on a winning team since he was drafted by the Raiders in 2003. He started in 2005, and he hasn't come close to .500 until last year (and he made up his mind he's leaving long before that). Aso is a good guy, and his bank account is full of Al Davis' money.

He doesn't need more money.

He needs a situation where he can contend for a Superbowl and can play in the playoffs. Aso has never gone to the playoffs. He always watches from home. I think he's itching to finish a season where they're not 4 - 12 or 2 - 14 or 5 - 11.

So, imagine if Aso ends up taking less money than he is worth. [b]Imagine if Aso decides to take less money to sign, than it would to sign both Carr and Wilson.[/b]

That's very plausible due to the reasons I listed above. And Aso will help our pass rush where Carr or Wilson cannot. Why?

Press Coverage. Imagine a Quarterback receives the snap and drops back from under center. He looks at his first read progression, his tight end and finds his future route blanketed in a disguised Ravens zone coverage by the linebackers, Lardarius Webb is blanketing his runningback whose running a flare pattern, as well. Now, he assumes that the timing for his #1 WR's route is perfect and looks over to his 3rd progression to see - that he's a little off course due to a jam - and that Aso is right on his tail, then he looks left to his #2 WR and finds - that he's a little off course due to a jam - and that Jimmy Smith is all over him. The Quarterback hesitates to throw it to either of them, thinks of looking back at his RB or TE and then gets slammed by Terrell Suggs/Kindle/Kruger/Redding/Ngata/McPhee...

That's why having Aso and Smith are dangerous. Because they're two shut down guys. Meaning a QB will not pass to either his #1 WR or his #2 WR. Both sides are shut down. What does that mean?

It means Ed Reed could have the greatest year of his career and perhaps record 18 interceptions and break the NFL record (14 ints) because Reed can freelance much more and the QB will throw a more pressured pass to one of his 3 other eligible receivers (if none are blocking).

Webb is a great nickel corner and so is Foxworth. Honestly the Ravens would have a killer secondary if they can do this and it will improve Reed's numbers and improve the pass rush 10x.

Finally, the Ravens have one advantage over every other team on the market:

Chuck Pagano. Aso and Pagano have a fine relationship.

[flynismo]

Pass yards per attempt is a pretty weak stat.Our defense is notorious for playing off the reciever and giving up short passes the entire length of the field, which is the reason we also ranked 22nd in pass defense.

[mgridda]

[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1305102757' post='684976']
Pass yards per attempt is a pretty weak stat.Our defense is notorious for playing off the reciever and giving up short passes the entire length of the field, which is the reason we also ranked 22nd in pass defense.
[/quote]

^^^ Obviously did not read the entire post, but decided to respond to something he didn't read entirely anyway...

[quote]Think about last year. Did we often see Wilson/Fabian and Chris Carr 10 yards off the LOS in man coverage or in zone? We didn't press the receivers, they got clean breaks and the QB was able to pass the ball quickly. [/quote]

I said that in the third paragraph. Come on. I don't see how pass yards per attempt is a weak statistic at all. Total yards given up is a weak statistic.

Is there a difference between these teams:

3,782 passing yards allowed on 596 attempts
3,782 passing yards allowed on 445 attempts

I would venture that there is. That's why total yards is a flawed statistic. The average of yards per pass attempt makes more sense. Are you aware that with 596 passing attempts on them the Ravens defense was #3 in how many times opposing teams attempted to pass? That's because of two reasons:

1. Ray Lewis, JJ, Suggs, Gregg, Ngata and the rest of the team being a force against the run
2. Everyone projecting our weakness as pass defense and our strength as run defense.


Boy were they wrong. Our strengths were both run and pass defense. We're the Ravens.

[BloodRaven]

Lets sign every single free agent.

[Ravens Lover]

[quote name='-Truth-' timestamp='1304107112' post='674607']
Unless we're planning on cutting Foxworth, and not bringing back Wilson and Carr, this would make no sense. That's not to say that I would mind, but I just don't see it happening.
[/quote]

I agree would love him 100% but there a far more needs on the team than corner right now to use our money on

[Free Agent]

I'm not gonna lie, I would love to add Nnamdi. But that would mean spending some serious money on just corners. Nnamdi would take a big contract, Chris Carr and/or Josh Wilson would need a sizable contract, and Jimmy Smith would need a solid rookie contract as well. Those numbers scare me away.

[flynismo]

[quote name='mgridda' timestamp='1305103325' post='684978']<br />^^^ Obviously did not read the entire post, but decided to respond to something he didn't read entirely anyway...<br /><br /><br /><br />I said that in the third paragraph. Come on. I don't see how pass yards per attempt is a weak statistic at all. Total yards given up is a weak statistic.<br /><br />Is there a difference between these teams:<br /><br />3,782 passing yards allowed on 596 attempts<br />3,782 passing yards allowed on 445 attempts<br /><br />I would venture that there is. That's why total yards is a flawed statistic. The average of yards per pass attempt makes more sense. Are you aware that with 596 passing attempts on them the Ravens defense was #3 in how many times opposing teams attempted to pass? That's because of two reasons:<br /><br />1. Ray Lewis, JJ, Suggs, Gregg, Ngata and the rest of the team being a force against the run<br />2. Everyone projecting our weakness as pass defense and our strength as run defense.<br /><br /><br />Boy were they wrong. Our strengths were both run and pass defense. We're the Ravens.<br />[/quote]

i dont have time right now to point out all the problems in this, so let me just give you the short answer:

we were ranked 22nd in pass defense. Our pass defense was most certainly not one of our strengths last year.
Screw the stats. Look at the games themselves, and can you tell me with a straight face that our pass defense is a major reason we won 12 of those games?

[Bltravens]

[quote name='BloodRaven' timestamp='1305107593' post='684985']
Lets sign every single free agent.
[/quote]
championshiiiiiiiiip

[Guest ArmyRaven52]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1304108057' post='674639']
We would have to dump a lot of players to have that salary. I just don't see it happening. Im more than content with Jimmy Smith.
[/quote]

Ok well foxy, carr, and mcgahee, clears about twelve millionn, and if things get really crazy and we tell mason by we are staring at 15 million in cap space. Not saying we are going to sign him or even should but the space can be made without as much impact as it sounds.

[lgcs27288]

Aso is too expensive and not needed, bring in Cullen Jenkins!

[-Truth-]

Solid point about Nnamdi, but there are a few things I'd like to comment on.

[quote name='mgridda' timestamp='1305102155' post='684974']
With that said, our pass rush was terrible and we only had 27 sacks or so. The other teams with top passing yards allowed rankings sacked the QB 48 or so times last season. I happen to think that we knew our secondary needed help, so we did not play in press coverage very often.
[/quote]
Although we did rarely play in press coverage, I disagree in part with the reasoning behind it. I'm not a fan of off coverage, but I think we simply didn't have the personnel to utilize the former effectively with consistent success. Jamming is an ability that not every CB has developed, and coupled with our 2010 corps being undersized, they could've potentially been pushed around at the LOS by bigger WRs. Jimmy Smith could put that to an end, however.

[quote name='mgridda' timestamp='1305102155' post='684974']
Josh Wilson is 4 years younger than Aso - and he has speed that can keep Wallace in check and I love him, but the fact of the matter is both he and Chris Carr had tremendous years: the best years of their careers. And they were both in a contract year and they're both perhaps looking for that pay day.
[/quote]
While I can't speak for Carr, I don't think that was necessarily the case with Wilson, as he was stout in his previous Season with Seattle. In fact, to quote an article on PFF, he easily graded out as their best CB. "This is a very savvy move for the Ravens; Wilson had a 6.2 PFF rating, whereas the other Seattle CBs had ratings of 1.6, -7.1, and -12.8 last season." Another article states that, "he gave up just a 73.1 QB rating when targeted in 2009." Now he certainly improved upon those numbers, like his percentage of allowed completions. But since Wilson was coming off a solid showing on the league's 6th worst pass defense in 2009, it's very probable that his improvement was a result from playing with a better defensive group.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='-Truth-' timestamp='1305137499' post='685128']
Although we did rarely play in press coverage, I disagree in part with the reasoning behind it. I'm not a fan of off coverage, but I think we simply didn't have the personnel to utilize the former effectively with consistent success. Jamming is an ability that not every CB has developed, and coupled with our 2010 corps being undersized, they could've potentially been pushed around at the LOS by bigger WRs. [b]Jimmy Smith could put that to an end, however.[/b]
[/quote]

Agreed. Even though he's raw, Chykie has the tools to develop into a good press CB as well.

[RavenDude11]

As far as being [i]too[/i] expensive - I think you have to ask how much is a Super Bowl worth? Now signing Nnamdi doesn't guarantee winning the Super Bowl but it helps the cause that much more.

Outside of Flacco and Ngata there's no one else who really commands franchise type money for the near future. Reed, Lewis, Heap wont be around much longer which means neither will their cap space. The o-line is still relatively young and no one is commanding Elite OT type money as of yet. RB's are a dime a dozen and plus Ray Rice isn't going to receive top dollar for at least another 2-3 seasons. Sizzle is locked up and Foxworth at $5 mill a year is a bargain compared to true #1 CBs who make $10 mill a year.

Adding a shutdown CB to our defense takes the entire team to another level. Better pass rush, better coverage, fewer points, better opportunities for our offense.

Would u rather spend $10 mill a year on McGahee + Heap or Nnamdi Asomugha?

[FerrariFan87]

[quote name='RavenDude11' timestamp='1305145379' post='685186']
As far as being [i]too[/i] expensive - I think you have to ask how much is a Super Bowl worth? Now signing Nnamdi doesn't guarantee winning the Super Bowl but it helps the cause that much more.

Outside of Flacco and Ngata there's no one else who really commands franchise type money for the near future. Reed, Lewis, Heap wont be around much longer which means neither will their cap space. The o-line is still relatively young and no one is commanding Elite OT type money as of yet. RB's are a dime a dozen and plus Ray Rice isn't going to receive top dollar for at least another 2-3 seasons. Sizzle is locked up and Foxworth at $5 mill a year is a bargain compared to true #1 CBs who make $10 mill a year.

Adding a shutdown CB to our defense takes the entire team to another level. Better pass rush, better coverage, fewer points, better opportunities for our offense.

Would u rather spend $10 mill a year on McGahee + Heap or Nnamdi Asomugha?
[/quote]

Good points all around. Once we know the parameters, then I think we can start talking about signing Aso and others because we really don't know how realistic or unrealistic a shot we have of signing him and other FAs.

[Alexir]

[quote name='ArmyRaven52' timestamp='1305132292' post='685093']
Ok well foxy, carr, and mcgahee, clears about twelve millionn, and if things get really crazy and we tell mason by we are staring at 15 million in cap space. Not saying we are going to sign him or even should but the space can be made without as much impact as it sounds.
[/quote]

That's a lot of money for a guy who doesn't shadow number 1 receivers. He just plays one side of the field. I rather pass on Nnamdi and get some depth in the front 7 and SS

[mgridda]

[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1305131774' post='685086']
i dont have time right now to point out all the problems in this, so let me just give you the short answer:

we were ranked 22nd in pass defense. Our pass defense was most certainly not one of our strengths last year.
Screw the stats. Look at the games themselves, and can you tell me with a straight face that our pass defense is a major reason we won 12 of those games?
[/quote]

We were only ranked 22nd in TOTAL YARDS (your criteria for pass defense, not pass defense itself) because we were in the top 3 in passing attempts (on defense). Teams tried to go in the air against us.

and they failed. Miserably. Why?

#2 in Yards Per Pass Attempt Allowed (6.4 YPA)
#5 in Opposing QB Rating (76.4 QB Rating for opposing QBs)
#9 in Passing Touchdowns Allowed (22)
#11 in Completion Percentage Allowed (58.6%)


[i]<keep the flaming to a minimum>[/i]

[20ravens52]

I just want us to resign Josh Wilson and i'll be happy with our secondary.

[JO_75]

[quote name='20ravens52' timestamp='1305149906' post='685239']
I just want us to resign Josh Wilson and i'll be happy with our secondary.
[/quote]

Me too I already know that some team will over pay for him so I know he won't be coming here. All I want is Wilson to be re-signed, let Landry walk and for us to sign Donte Whitner to replace Landry and I would be very happy with our secondary.