The "I'm Sorry Joe".....thread

[dirtybird10]

[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1303488989' post='668658']
I actually agreed with your first post, until i saw this one. In your first post i agreed because what you explain with the Ravens is exactly what made both Brady and Manning great QBs in their young careers. Both Brady and Manning had really good running games and relied on them heavily to win the Super Bowl. The Ravens will make sure Rice is used.

However this post here, i can't disagree with more. I can point to a hand full of games that Flacco put this team on his back and either won or should have won.

Playoff game against the #1 seeded Titans his rookie year. Chris Johnson and that offense took advantage of a tired Ravens defense early. If Flacco doesn't lead the offense down the field and tie the game up on a prefect TD pass to Mason, that game might get away from the Ravens. Flacco also led the game winning drive.

His first game ever against the Steelers in Pittsburg. Flacco made huge plays in that game, but the defense let us down late.

In 2010, in Pittsburg Flacco put this team on his shoulders, and should have lead a game leading TD drive, but Mason dropped a wide open TD on a perfect pass. The score of that game should have been 27-20, but the Ravens end up losing 20-23

The Vikings game of the same year, Flacco led the Ravens back and should have led a game winning drive, but Hauskca missed a game winning FG.

The NE game, Flacco was leading a game winning drive when Clayton drop a 4th down pass.

[b]Flacco play huge in the game last season against, ATL and probably should have won that game. [/b]Those are just a few games that Flacco put the team on his shoulders. He's not just a game manager. Brady, Manning, right now? No, but I think people need to understand how great it is to be comparing Flacco to the likes of Brady, Manning, Brees, and other great/elite QBs, because we could be comparing him to Boller, Redman, Wright, and a long list of other Ravens QBs who couldn't get it done.
[/quote]


Probably??? Good lord there was less than a minute on the clock and like 80 yards to defend our lead. Certainly should have won that one!

[Ravensfan23]

[quote name='dirtybird10' timestamp='1303840219' post='670909']
Probably??? Good lord there was less than a minute on the clock and like 80 yards to defend our lead. Certainly should have won that one!
[/quote]

Ok bad choice of words on my part.

[reediddy]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1303399646' post='668214']
I stand by my argument that he manages games, I can't really think of a game he has played where he has put the team on his back. Like I said, our defense and running game is our strengths and he keeps us afloat and moves the chains and gets us redzone touchdowns.
[/quote]

I'll never forget the last drive against Pitt though, the first time around...great stuff

[BloodRaven]

[quote name='Romo Ravens' timestamp='1303286206' post='667649']
I think a lot of people will be saying sorry after next season.. The haters will look like fools and I'll let it be known.
[/quote]

what haters?

[PuRock]

I've stuck up for Joe, so no input needed for me.

But if the day for a Cousins/Cody apology thread comes, I'll be there.

[Militant X 1]

[quote name='Jay D83' timestamp='1303837778' post='670887']
"I'm not sorry! [b]I did what I did cause Flacco humiliated me,[/b] and since he gets away with everything, I let him have it. And since you're all so STUPID to believe his lies, I don't care if you're little idiotic Football season gets ruined. Who wants to think about football during a lockout anyway!"

Errr....that's Home Alone 2, nevermind. Carry on
[/quote]

what did you do? and how did Flacco humiliate you? lol!

~Mili

[Guest deltaraven]

[quote name='Romo Ravens' timestamp='1303286206' post='667649']
I think a lot of people will be saying sorry after next season.. The haters will look like fools and I'll let it be known.
[/quote]
Why is your name Romo-not a tony fan i hope?

[Guest deltaraven]

[quote name='Militant X 1' timestamp='1303390700' post='668168']
that's all i've been saying as well! but, Joe is a good QB and if he cleans up a few things in his "overall" gameplay then he is well on his way to greatness!

~Mili
[/quote]
Joe has made the playoffs consistenly(3 times in his 1st 3 seasons) Hes the Ravens all time leading passer in yards,td passes etc.-Hes still very young give him time and give him the cast of characters to get it done

[RoflDogs]

As the biggest Flacco apologist ever, I don't have to give Joe any apologies

[Romo Ravens]

[quote name='deltaraven' timestamp='1304173483' post='676689']
Why is your name Romo-not a tony fan i hope?
[/quote]

My last name is Romo. Tony is a good QB, Flacco is better in my opinion

[JoeCool#5]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1303399646' post='668214']
I stand by my argument that he manages games, I can't really think of a game he has played where he has put the team on his back. Like I said, our defense and running game is our strengths and he keeps us afloat and moves the chains and gets us redzone touchdowns.
[/quote]
Obviously you didnt watch the KC playoff game, where the defense in the 1st half was busying getting run over by KC running game and Joe carried the team as the running game was non-existant, like most of the entire year.

Running game is our strength?? LOL. In 2008, and maybe 2009. Yes the running game was the strength. But LAST YEAR, a 27th rank rushing attack out of 32 is more like a weakness. Its not like the Ravens didnt try to run the ball either, as they ran it more last year then the previous year. And the only average just over 3 yards a carry. Last year, I cant count the number of times, the Ravens didnt convert on 3rd and short due to the OL getting stood up at the Line of Scrimmage. By the end, I was praying for 3rd and 4s instead of inches, due to the Ravens running game was soo horrid in short yardage and goalline situations.
And running the ball was a nightmare last year, I pray for the days the Ravens can be balanced and have the 3 headed monster back to its former glory. I want the Ravens running game to take the air out of the ball and run out the clock but that only happen once (Browns 2nd game)

But you really cant blame the running backs last year, for they were too busy trying to avoid getting TFL, as the patchwork OL (Gaither injury REALLY hurt the team) was getting blown up off the line of scrimmage.

Joe did pretty good considering how bad the OL and the running game performed, for he did carry the team on numerous occassions last year.

The Ravens will be a pass first team until the OL learns how to Run block.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='JoeCool#5' timestamp='1304277242' post='679027']
The Ravens will be a pass first team until the OL learns how to Run block.
[/quote]

The foundation is already is in place for a good run-blocking line with Oher, Grubbs and Yanda(assuming he's re-signed). It's the center and other tackle spot that must be solidified.

[scrock]

Joe Flacco carried the offense at time this past year, the running game wasnt anything special and the defense gave up leads constantly....we wouldn't have won the game in KC if it wasnt for Flacco.

[ellicottraven]

Look I don't think there is anyneed for anybody to apologize to Joe. Simply this is the NFL and there tends to be serious scrutiny at all levels. Coaches, fans, etc. Just because Joe is criticized by fans does not mean Joe is affected. Knowing Joe's characteristics he probably does not even care. He is that cool!
However, with pressure comes performance. I am sure Joe if he is getting the criticism, will respond favorably to it like all potentially elite QBs' must do!

[Ravensfan23]

I just posted this in the draft section, but it also applies here.......

In his first year Flacco was learning how to be a good QB. In college Flacco was always the best player on the field and he would be able to just hold the ball and wait for WRs to come open. He still does that at times.

However when he got to the NFL, he had to learn the timing of his steps, 3 step, 5 step, 7 step, coming from under center. He had to learn how to get his head around quickly on play actions. He had to learn how to have control over his weight when dropping back from Center, staying balance when needed and loading up on his back foot when needed. Flacco did all of these things while actually being our starting QB. That's a lot.

The next year, Flacco had to take what he learned and continue to progress, but now, become a better NFL QB. Learn how to anticipate his WRs running routes, throw guys open, timing and judgment on deep balls, holding the defense, quickly reading and deciphering coverages,

For the first 2 years Flacco got by on his raw Talent and the fact that's he's naturally a good decision maker with the football. Did he make plays and help this team win? Of course, but it was still a learning process with Flacco.

Last year, was that all so important 3rd year, but for Flacco it wasn't the same as guys like Matt Ryan. Why, because Flacco was still learning things expected of him at the QB position that a guy like Matt Ryan got while still in BC. Flacco played so well last season, but still he's continuing to round into the QB that he will ultimately be. Throwing WRs open, timming on deep balls, and keeping the same tempo with his mechanics, are all things that Flacco needs to get more consistent at.

My reason for saying all of these is in response to the people that feel Flacco needed to have control of the offense last year. Me personally I don't feel he was ready and I think the Ravens felt the same. I've said plenty of times that i strongly believe that Flacco will be Peyton(with stats and starts) and Brady(superbowl and winning with less) good. However I always attempt to stay true, and call a spade a spade. I don't think Flacco was ready to take that step last year.

He played great, and most times his teammates let him down. However overall, I think Cam did the right thing with Flacco by not putting too much on his plate. Is he kind of spoon feeding him a bit? yes, but it's a fine line between being cautious and being overly cautious. Flacco is the QB of this franchise and anyone close enough to call Maryland home, knows that.

So in knowing that the last thing this organization wants or wanted to do was place too much work on Flacco and place unnecessary pressure on him. If they put all of this. on Flacco and he failed, the potential of having his confidence shot early would be devastating. The Ravens felt like they putt too much on Kyle Boller too fast and paid for it by having championship caliber teams continue to be failed by the offense.

All the potential in the world can be shut down by a lost of confidence. Now i'm not saying that Flacco isn't a confident guy, or that he couldn't overcome a rough season, but why risk it? Do any of you remember the scene around Baltimore after the Week 2 lost to the Bengals? Knowing the potential is still there for your 3rd year QB to have that type of performance, why put him in position to have that type performance, knowing how much we as fans and the media would rip that guy?

Flacco is going to be a really special QB in the NFL, and I think that leading the team to a AFC Championship in his first season, lead people to place even greater expectations on Flacco. I think the Ravens know what they have and just like there draft mentality, wanted to stay true to their original assessments of Flacco.

Flacco was viewed as being a guy that would take about 3-4 years to develop into a starting caliber NFL QB. Well his pure talent along proved that he's a starting NFL QB, and a damn good one. However his development is what's going to catapult him into that Elite level and maybe even beyond. The Ravens just wanted to make sure Flacco had the chance to properly develop, before placing the offense in his hands completely. You don't wanna put the offense in Flacco's hands, then have to take it from him.

Now Flacco is practically demanding more responsibility in this offense, the Ravens are surrounding Flacco with what he needs to succeed once he takes control of this offense, the Ravens are getting him involved in the draft process of WRs, Flacco's showing his leadership during the lockout, This is the year Flacco will take off. I would be down right shocked if Flacco doesn't have control of this offense from the opening game vs the Steelers. I expect to see a lot of no huddle, up tempo, aggressively attacking defenses, put your foot on their throats and don't let up until the game is over type offense from the Ravens this year.

[3-4ravdef509]

[quote name='Ravensfan23' timestamp='1304401505' post='680394']
I just posted this in the draft section, but it also applies here.......

In his first year Flacco was learning how to be a good QB. In college Flacco was always the best player on the field and he would be able to just hold the ball and wait for WRs to come open. He still does that at times.

However when he got to the NFL, he had to learn the timing of his steps, 3 step, 5 step, 7 step, coming from under center. He had to learn how to get his head around quickly on play actions. He had to learn how to have control over his weight when dropping back from Center, staying balance when needed and loading up on his back foot when needed. Flacco did all of these things while actually being our starting QB. That's a lot.

The next year, Flacco had to take what he learned and continue to progress, but now, become a better NFL QB. Learn how to anticipate his WRs running routes, throw guys open, timing and judgment on deep balls, holding the defense, quickly reading and deciphering coverages,

For the first 2 years Flacco got by on his raw Talent and the fact that's he's naturally a good decision maker with the football. Did he make plays and help this team win? Of course, but it was still a learning process with Flacco.

Last year, was that all so important 3rd year, but for Flacco it wasn't the same as guys like Matt Ryan. Why, because Flacco was still learning things expected of him at the QB position that a guy like Matt Ryan got while still in BC. Flacco played so well last season, but still he's continuing to round into the QB that he will ultimately be. Throwing WRs open, timming on deep balls, and keeping the same tempo with his mechanics, are all things that Flacco needs to get more consistent at.

My reason for saying all of these is in response to the people that feel Flacco needed to have control of the offense last year. Me personally I don't feel he was ready and I think the Ravens felt the same. I've said plenty of times that i strongly believe that Flacco will be Peyton(with stats and starts) and Brady(superbowl and winning with less) good. However I always attempt to stay true, and call a spade a spade. I don't think Flacco was ready to take that step last year.

He played great, and most times his teammates let him down. However overall, I think Cam did the right thing with Flacco by not putting too much on his plate. Is he kind of spoon feeding him a bit? yes, but it's a fine line between being cautious and being overly cautious. Flacco is the QB of this franchise and anyone close enough to call Maryland home, knows that.

So in knowing that the last thing this organization wants or wanted to do was place too much work on Flacco and place unnecessary pressure on him. If they put all of this. on Flacco and he failed, the potential of having his confidence shot early would be devastating. The Ravens felt like they putt too much on Kyle Boller too fast and paid for it by having championship caliber teams continue to be failed by the offense.

All the potential in the world can be shut down by a lost of confidence. Now i'm not saying that Flacco isn't a confident guy, or that he couldn't overcome a rough season, but why risk it? Do any of you remember the scene around Baltimore after the Week 2 lost to the Bengals? Knowing the potential is still there for your 3rd year QB to have that type of performance, why put him in position to have that type performance, knowing how much we as fans and the media would rip that guy?

Flacco is going to be a really special QB in the NFL, and I think that leading the team to a AFC Championship in his first season, lead people to place even greater expectations on Flacco. I think the Ravens know what they have and just like there draft mentality, wanted to stay true to their original assessments of Flacco.

Flacco was viewed as being a guy that would take about 3-4 years to develop into a starting caliber NFL QB. Well his pure talent along proved that he's a starting NFL QB, and a damn good one. However his development is what's going to catapult him into that Elite level and maybe even beyond. The Ravens just wanted to make sure Flacco had the chance to properly develop, before placing the offense in his hands completely. You don't wanna put the offense in Flacco's hands, then have to take it from him.

Now Flacco is practically demanding more responsibility in this offense, the Ravens are surrounding Flacco with what he needs to succeed once he takes control of this offense, the Ravens are getting him involved in the draft process of WRs, Flacco's showing his leadership during the lockout, This is the year Flacco will take off. I would be down right shocked if Flacco doesn't have control of this offense from the opening game vs the Steelers. I expect to see a lot of no huddle, up tempo, aggressively attacking defenses, put your foot on their throats and don't let up until the game is over type offense from the Ravens this year.
[/quote]

Also, his first two years he got by on our defense and running game supporting him. Last year both were questionable, and he still improved his game.

[lowrider]

Flacco is great. And people honestly forget about the Kyle Bollers of the world and always forget about how rough it was before Flacco came to Baltimore. That being said. The Baltimore Sun had some statistic, that Flacco held onto the ball 4 times longer than any other qb in the NFL (it was something similar to that, I could get a link if you need me to). He needs to make quicker decisions and he has the tendency only to throw to WR's who are only wide open. He needs to anticipate and throw and know his WR's are gonna be there.

Granted last year he didn't have a burner for a WR to stretch the D, and his O line was inconsistent along with the run game. He also needs to make sure something like the interception in the 3rd quarter against the Steelers in the playoffs never happens again. That was a bad decision.

Now I've been tough on Flacco, but those are the things holding him back from being elite. People need to get off their knees for Matt Ryan and give Flacco some credit. He has been a very good qb and he made some great throws last year. He just needs to piece it all together. And he isn't far off of piecing it all together

[3-4ravdef509]

I agree with you on principle. But Flacco wasn't holding onto the ball too long just because he had problems with progressions, which at certain times he did. But he also had very slow receivers being told to run deep routes. And often, he didn't have all his weapons on the field.
I think 10 to 15 times a game, we'd have Boldin run a streak, Mason run a curl, and rice run a screen, and Heap on a little out. That's not a very good design to get people open. Thus Flacco goes through his short list of reads, and doesn't know what to do. So I believe many of his supposed flaws are flaws of the system too.
Now, the INT 3rd quarter in a playoff game against Pittsburgh, I agree. There's no excuse for that.