The Qb Controversy Won't End

[theFRANCHISE]

You all never gave him a chance and now is his time. let him have it.

He's had five years of chances. 3 1/2, if you want to get technical about the playing time that Steve McNair took away from him.

He either proves he can play now with these (more than fair) opportunities he's getting, or the team moves along to the next guy, period.

I believe if not for Steve McNair We would have won the SUper Bowl. Boller is a much better passer. JUST GIVE HIM A CHANCE.

...Boller was better than Steve McNair? That same Steve McNair that took the team to a 13-3 record in 2006?

Well, if you're referring to last year's Steve McNair, then it'd make sense...except Boller was the starter for practically half the season, and look where that got the team.

The only concern I have is the running game. Where was ray Rice? I think Allen Patrick should back up McGahee. Him or Cory Ross. They would do a better job. We need a running game.

Allen Patrick ahead of Ray Rice?...not when Ray Rice has been taking advantage of every rep in practice and has performed better overall (in the coaches' eyes) than Patrick.

I got an idea. How about we give our evaluations at the end of pre-season? That way they all get their chances to play behind 1st stringers in the 1st Quarter rather then 3rd in the last 2 quarters.

Agreed. Couldn't have said it better myself.

nahhh controversy without looking at the big picture is better!

lol. True, it's more entertaining that way...

[I*Bleed*Purple]

The point of me saying that was that Smith didn't have Mason to throw to. He had no dependable recievers to throw to! So it's futile to compare Smith's performance to Boller's performance. Both weren't great.

The point of me saying what I said is that any professional wide receiver should be able to catch a ball thrown right at them, which Mason did. And somehow because Troy didn't have Mason on the field, those throws of Kyle's don't count? Umm, ok. Then, neither did his 2 dropped passes, so we'll call it 13/15 for, say, 127 yards. Thank you. I don't understand how you just "take something away", like it doesn't count. I guess we should tell the refs than any sacks against us don't count because the offensive line is in shambles

In all seriousness, all I am and have been saying is that Kyle played better with the first offense than Troy with the 2nd. That's it!!! I don't think it's too hard to comprehend. Also, AS I HAVE SAID BEFORE, we'll see how Troy does behind the first stringers on Saturday.

[I*Bleed*Purple]

That same Steve McNair that took the team to a 13-3 record in 2006?

Yup, he was talking about the same Steve McNair that fell apart against the Colts in the first round of playoffs that very same year. I don't think the problem has been the talent. I think it lies with the coaching. Billick had a loser's attitude, and that translated very clearly onto the field. Billick was a joke. Thank God that's over. I have faith that all of our quarterbacks are capable of starting in the NFL working with the current coaching staff.

[I*Bleed*Purple]

I guess that's why Boller still shows no promise

Yup, 11/15, no promise. But 5/12.....that's potential right there! Spare me the excuses.

[I*Bleed*Purple]

I believe if not for Steve McNair We would have won the SUper Bowl.

You are half-right on this one. If it weren't for Brian Billick we'd have won more Superbowls.

[saved72907]

Yup, he was talking about the same Steve McNair that fell apart against the Colts in the first round of playoffs that very same year. I don't think the problem has been the talent. I think it lies with the coaching. Billick had a loser's attitude, and that translated very clearly onto the field. Billick was a joke. Thank God that's over. I have faith that all of our quarterbacks are capable of starting in the NFL working with the current coaching staff.

I just wanted to add that Steve McNair didn't lead us to a 13-3 record. Our defense and special teams deserves the credit for that one. Amen.

[theFRANCHISE]

I just wanted to add that Steve McNair didn't lead us to a 13-3 record. Our defense and special teams deserves the credit for that one. Amen.

Back-to-back comeback drives to beat Cleveland and San Diego in the closing seconds. Not to mention the Week 10 matchup against Tennesee, where the defense struggled and McNair would go on to lead a comeback from a (roughly) 20-point deficit.

At least give McNair credit for winning games in the clutch that season, and not playing so poorly to where the team had blown significant leads all season.

You can't say that McNair wasn't responsible for Mark Clayton's success that season, or Demetrius Williams' flashes of excellence as a deep threat.

[foreversunny23]

In all seriousness, all I am and have been saying is that Kyle played better with the first offense than Troy with the 2nd. That's it!!! I don't think it's too hard to comprehend. Also, AS I HAVE SAID BEFORE, we'll see how Troy does behind the first stringers on Saturday.

i'm glad you said that. i thought you were just arguing kyle played better than troy without acknowledging that kyle had the first string.

[Ravenoid]

I will be at that game and I expect Troy Smith to win me over. Against New England I saw him drop a nice pass in between two defenders around the 2 yard line near the left sideline where only the receiver had a chance to catch it. Unfortunately it was dropped. Later I saw him fire a nice one to the receiver over the middle for a big gain. Even Harbaugh commented later in an interview on that pass being an NFL throw. I realy like how he feels the pressure and moves out of the pocket then throws on the run.

[smashmouth]

LOL thats funny.

Dude I never said Troy had a Great game, I'm just trying to bring you Boller lovers back down to reality. Yeah Troy struggled. So did Kyle. But what im trying to get at is Troy is only in his 2nd yr with barely 3 games under his belt, he was behind a worse line than Boller with worse Wrs. Boller is going into his 6th season with 40+ games under his belt and is still making the same careless mistakes.

I'm not a naive Troy lover. I know he has a lot to overcome and learn. But at the same time I am not a naive Boller lover who can't see reality. Nor do i not realize it's just a pre-season game and there's gonna be mistakes. At the end of the day all I want is the best QB under center come sept 7th, (Which we both agree on) whether thats Troy or Boller. And if it is Boller I will be his biggest supporter cuz he's a raven and I got love for the Ravens. But i honestly don't believe he will be.

Boller has a lot of areas in his game that are better than Smith. I know that. But Smith brings a new look. Smith brings excitement, a different style, and a different mindset. He brings a higher level of play making ability and most importantly he has confidence in himself. If this wasn't Bollers 6th season I would be less critical of him. If he and Smith are roughly on the same level come sept 7th than give Troy his chance cuz boller has already had 6 yrs worth of chances. Smith is younger, more mobile, more confident, cheaper...and has more of his teammates approval than boller does.

There are more upsides with smith than there are with Boller. I was hoping boller would have shown why he should be the starter last pre season game, I even predicted he was gonna have a highlight night, but he did completely the opposite and showed why he shouldn't be the starter. And that's why I'm trying to make my case for Smith.

Not be cuz Troy can but because Boller can't.

If you go to the same barber for 6 yrs and he messes up your haircut every single time are you still gonna give him one more chance? If your bank screws up your money for 6 yrs are you still gonna stay with that bank and give em one more chance? If your car breaks down every single year for 6 yrs will you not get a new car, or will u give it one more chance? If your qb messes up your offense for 6 yrs straight are you not gonna replace him or are you gonna give him one more chance?

You have a Valid point here.. But after that Barber messes up you hair would you go to a barber that messed your hair up worse. Your bank screws up your Money.. do you go to a bank who is worse.. If your tired of your car breaking down, do you go buy a car that wont run.. Our QB has played well and has messed up the last 6 years, should we replace Him with someone who would do worse for the next 6 years..

Im not a Boller lover by any means, I accually have been pushing and hopeing that Troy Smith starts. But I'd rather throw out some facts instead os saying" Troy should start, he had a great game, He was 5 for 12 " Truth is Boller played alot better, 11 of 15 ( 2 was drops from recievers ) the play He fumbled was the O-Lines fault, I dont care what anyone says, when 5 guys jump on the QB in 1.2 secs, its unacceptable, The INT was a mis communication, and the recievers fault, still a poor throw non the less.

[smashmouth]

I just wanted to add that Steve McNair didn't lead us to a 13-3 record. Our defense and special teams deserves the credit for that one. Amen.

OK.... The defense has been TOP 5 the past decade, why comes we only won one superbowl and have had alot of bad or mediocore seasons?

McNair along with our defense = sucess, imigine if we had him or another QB of His skill for all these years....

[foreversunny23]

http://myespn.go.com/blogs/afcnorth/0-0-17...Troy-Smith.html

[Bazard]

There is only one thing that will end any qb contorversy is success.

[Tiz]

^Brohm struggles under pressure as well. Matt Ryan is going to be good and soon, he might not have Flacco's arm strength or fast release but he has a quicker read and has been tempered against elite talent, not guys that are now working at MacDonalds.

Matt Ryan likes to throw INTs. I have no idea why people were so high on him. That said he looked pretty good in his first appearance.

[Tiz]

OK.... The defense has been TOP 5 the past decade, why comes we only won one superbowl and have had alot of bad or mediocore seasons?

McNair along with our defense = sucess, imigine if we had him or another QB of His skill for all these years....

Mcnair didn't bring skill per se. He played Trent Dilfer football for us he didn't lead us to a 13 win season no more than Dilfer led us to the SB.

[rayvenfan_52]

Mcnair didn't bring skill per se. He played Trent Dilfer football for us he didn't lead us to a 13 win season no more than Dilfer led us to the SB.

But you gotta admit that McNair came through for us when our defense couldnt do it. A great example is the Titans game.

[smashmouth]

Mcnair didn't bring skill per se. He played Trent Dilfer football for us he didn't lead us to a 13 win season no more than Dilfer led us to the SB.

He brought us back to win from quite a few games. Ravens have always been a football team that when there in the lead they can keep it, but if they got behind it was more then likely a loss. McNair controlled the offense and demanded respect, He won us games.

Our special teams was ranked in the bottom half of the league in 06,our defense was the number one in the league,but In 2000 we was top 10 special teams, and our defense was the best in History.

Trent Dilfer was part of a SB and will always be known in B-More for that, But McNair was by far the better QB. Remember we lost 15-6 to the colts, If we could have found a way to win that very close game, we would all be saluteing McNair for a (probally would be )awesome SB win.

[Redreed]

He brought us back to win from quite a few games. Ravens have always been a football team that when there in the lead they can keep it, but if they got behind it was more then likely a loss. McNair controlled the offense and demanded respect, He won us games.

Our special teams was ranked in the bottom half of the league in 06,our defense was the number one in the league,but In 2000 we was top 10 special teams, and our defense was the best in History.

Trent Dilfer was part of a SB and will always be known in B-More for that, But McNair was by far the better QB. Remember we lost 15-6 to the colts, If we could have found a way to win that very close game, we would all be saluteing McNair for a (probally would be )awesome SB win.

Yeah, but many here would put that loss squarely on McNair's shoulders. If our D holds the Colts to zero TDs in the playoffs and we can't win, then that's on the O. And when McNair throws a pick on the 2 yard line to end the first half, and plays like garbage in the second half, it's on him. To quote berad; (which I totally would not do unless I absolutely had to) McNair wasn't the reason we went 13-3, he was the reason we went 13-4.

[smashmouth]

Yeah, but many here would put that loss squarely on McNair's shoulders. If our D holds the Colts to zero TDs in the playoffs and we can't win, then that's on the O. And when McNair throws a pick on the 2 yard line to end the first half, and plays like garbage in the second half, it's on him. To quote berad; (which I totally would not do unless I absolutely had to) McNair wasn't the reason we went 13-3, he was the reason we went 13-4.

Yea like I said before if the recievers was hanging on to alot of His throws, we would have more first downs which means we would probally have more points on the board. People who put that loss on McNair alone really has no sense about Footbal PERIOD. How many guys is on a football team after final cuts? How many offenseive players is on the field at one time? How many coaches do we have? and the biggest question how Good was BILLICKS offensive system? We all know he had so much talant at MIN, the etire time He was at Baltimore how did His offense fare? .. Alot of you guys contriadict yourselves so much, The fins game.. Billick called for the FG, and they win in OT because the CB got burned but yet its Billicks fault.. Yet the Colts game was McNair's fault..

But the way I look at it is this. We got the that game because of McNair, yet He diddnt have a great game, But imigine if Troy Smith played that season, or if Boller played the whole season, we wouldent have come close to seeing that game.

[Redreed]

Yea like I said before if the recievers was hanging on to alot of His throws, we would have more first downs which means we would probally have more points on the board. People who put that loss on McNair alone really has no sense about Footbal PERIOD. How many guys is on a football team after final cuts? How many offenseive players is on the field at one time? How many coaches do we have? and the biggest question how Good was BILLICKS offensive system? We all know he had so much talant at MIN, the etire time He was at Baltimore how did His offense fare? .. Alot of you guys contriadict yourselves so much, The fins game.. Billick called for the FG, and they win in OT because the CB got burned but yet its Billicks fault.. Yet the Colts game was McNair's fault..

But the way I look at it is this. We got the that game because of McNair, yet He diddnt have a great game, But imigine if Troy Smith played that season, or if Boller played the whole season, we wouldent have come close to seeing that game.

I don't have any football sense because I think McNair played awful and lost us the game against Indy in the playoffs? Okay, well, then I don't think you have any football sense because we def got by on Stover's automatic foot (breaking his own personal record for consecutive FGs made that year) and the Defense was ranked first in 11 different statistical breakdowns, including; Turnovers, Turnover ratio, Red Zone D, Total yards given up, Total rushing yards given up, QB rating allowed, interceptions, sacks, etc. That alone will win you games. Those things will win you games as long as your QB isn't falling around dropping the football or throwing interceptions on the 2 yard line in the playoffs while your D is holding the Colts to zero TDs. Gimme a break. McNair played awful that game. The pick I've mentioned a few times now was seriously one of the worst throws/decisions I've ever seen a NFL QB make, and it just so happened to be McNair, with a Ravens jersey on, in the playoffs against the Colts. We did not get there because of McNair dude, we got there because of Defense and special teams, like we always do.

[smashmouth]

I don't have any football sense because I think McNair played awful and lost us the game against Indy in the playoffs? Okay, well, then I don't think you have any football sense because we def got by on Stover's automatic foot (breaking his own personal record for consecutive FGs made that year) and the Defense was ranked first in 11 different statistical breakdowns, including; Turnovers, Turnover ratio, Red Zone D, Total yards given up, Total rushing yards given up, QB rating allowed, interceptions, sacks, etc. That alone will win you games. Those things will win you games as long as your QB isn't falling around dropping the football or throwing interceptions on the 2 yard line in the playoffs while your D is holding the Colts to zero TDs. Gimme a break. McNair played awful that game. The pick I've mentioned a few times now was seriously one of the worst throws/decisions I've ever seen a NFL QB make, and it just so happened to be McNair, with a Ravens jersey on, in the playoffs against the Colts. We did not get there because of McNair dude, we got there because of Defense and special teams, like we always do.

Our punt return avg was ranked 25th in the league.. while punting was back at 18th, out kick return avg was 10th. Our rushing yards a game was ranked 25th and rushing avergae was 31st, BUT WAIT our passing yards a game 11th, our passing average per attempt was 8th and our 3rd down efficiency was 9th. funny How special teams got us to the playoffs when it ranked so low but our pass offense was close to the front in the league. defense was good in 06, but what about the great ST and top 3 and 5 defense weve had for the past 9 years? yet we still havient made it even close to 13-3 except for 2000, We held the colts pretty well in the playoffs, 5 FG's = 5 scoring drives by the way, its funny HOW OUR DEFENSE TAKES US TO 13-3 YET CANT WIN IN THE PLAYOFFS. Funny how the comeback in San Diego go's to the defense, i forget was Ray Lewis Throwing the ball in the 2 minute drill?

You must be one of these Troy Smith fans? the ones who makes stuff up, or were you a steeler fan? and mad because we stomped our rivals 57-7

McNair completed 63% of His passes for 3050 and 16 TD's and one on the ground, 17 TD's!! J.Lewis had 9 TD's. Another funny thing is.. I dont have any clue about football yet, we WON on Stover's leg right? right? Did stover pass the ball to the opposite 30 yard line then kicked the FG? Did he run it to the Opposite 30 and kick the FG? lat time I checked McNair moved the offense down the field, and relied on stover when needed.

[Redreed]

Our punt return avg was ranked 25th in the league.. while punting was back at 18th, out kick return avg was 10th. Our rushing yards a game was ranked 25th and rushing avergae was 31st, BUT WAIT our passing yards a game 11th, our passing average per attempt was 8th and our 3rd down efficiency was 9th. funny How special teams got us to the playoffs when it ranked so low but our pass offense was close to the front in the league. defense was good in 06, but what about the great ST and top 3 and 5 defense weve had for the past 9 years? yet we still havient made it even close to 13-3 except for 2000, We held the colts pretty well in the playoffs, 5 FG's = 5 scoring drives by the way, its funny HOW OUR DEFENSE TAKES US TO 13-3 YET CANT WIN IN THE PLAYOFFS. Funny how the comeback in San Diego go's to the defense, i forget was Ray Lewis Throwing the ball in the 2 minute drill?

You must be one of these Troy Smith fans? the ones who makes stuff up, or were you a steeler fan? and mad because we stomped our rivals 57-7

McNair completed 63% of His passes for 3050 and 16 TD's and one on the ground, 17 TD's!! J.Lewis had 9 TD's. Another funny thing is.. I dont have any clue about football yet, we WON on Stover's leg right? right? Did stover pass the ball to the opposite 30 yard line then kicked the FG? Did he run it to the Opposite 30 and kick the FG? lat time I checked McNair moved the offense down the field, and relied on stover when needed.

Relax kid, we def won alot of games on Stove's foot. He set a record with FGs made and that's what I meant by special teams. Return game is what it is. It was 2006. Point still pending; McNair almost single handedly lost us the playoffs game, that was my point and you provided no counterpoint, because there isn't one. He blew it. He def came through in the

[Redreed]

Our punt return avg was ranked 25th in the league.. while punting was back at 18th, out kick return avg was 10th. Our rushing yards a game was ranked 25th and rushing avergae was 31st, BUT WAIT our passing yards a game 11th, our passing average per attempt was 8th and our 3rd down efficiency was 9th. funny How special teams got us to the playoffs when it ranked so low but our pass offense was close to the front in the league. defense was good in 06, but what about the great ST and top 3 and 5 defense weve had for the past 9 years? yet we still havient made it even close to 13-3 except for 2000, We held the colts pretty well in the playoffs, 5 FG's = 5 scoring drives by the way, its funny HOW OUR DEFENSE TAKES US TO 13-3 YET CANT WIN IN THE PLAYOFFS. Funny how the comeback in San Diego go's to the defense, i forget was Ray Lewis Throwing the ball in the 2 minute drill?

You must be one of these Troy Smith fans? the ones who makes stuff up, or were you a steeler fan? and mad because we stomped our rivals 57-7

McNair completed 63% of His passes for 3050 and 16 TD's and one on the ground, 17 TD's!! J.Lewis had 9 TD's. Another funny thing is.. I dont have any clue about football yet, we WON on Stover's leg right? right? Did stover pass the ball to the opposite 30 yard line then kicked the FG? Did he run it to the Opposite 30 and kick the FG? lat time I checked McNair moved the offense down the field, and relied on stover when needed.

Relax kid, we def won alot of games on Stove's foot. He set a record with FGs made and that's what I meant by special teams. Return game is what it is. It was 2006. Point still pending; McNair almost single handedly lost us the playoffs game, that was my point and you provided no counterpoint, because there isn't one. He blew it. He def came through in the Sand Diego game and others, but he failed when real chips were on the line and not a little bit, like, really failed, like failed to move the ball, get 1st downs, and when the DEFENSE got us close, he still blew it. Say what you want. Say whatever you want. I'll always think the ridiculous play of our D and Stove's foot got us to that game, and all McNair did is blow it, anybody else feel like this?

Edit: sorry about weird double post thing =\

P.S. 9th in 3rd down conversion is nice, but no where near as nice as 1st in Red Zone D, 1st in turnovers, 1st in turnover ratio, 1st in rushing D, first in yards allowed, 1st in opponents 3rd down conversions, 1st in sacks, 1st in interceptions, etc, etc, etc. These are all more valuable stats than 3rd down conversions, just so you know.

[smashmouth]

Relax kid, we def won alot of games on Stove's foot. He set a record with FGs made and that's what I meant by special teams. Return game is what it is. It was 2006. Point still pending; McNair almost single handedly lost us the playoffs game, that was my point and you provided no counterpoint, because there isn't one. He blew it. He def came through in the Sand Diego game and others, but he failed when real chips were on the line and not a little bit, like, really failed, like failed to move the ball, get 1st downs, and when the DEFENSE got us close, he still blew it. Say what you want. Say whatever you want. I'll always think the ridiculous play of our D and Stove's foot got us to that game, and all McNair did is blow it, anybody else feel like this?

Edit: sorry about weird double post thing =\

P.S. 9th in 3rd down conversion is nice, but no where near as nice as 1st in Red Zone D, 1st in turnovers, 1st in turnover ratio, 1st in rushing D, first in yards allowed, 1st in opponents 3rd down conversions, 1st in sacks, 1st in interceptions, etc, etc, etc. These are all more valuable stats than 3rd down conversions, just so you know.

I understand the defense was #1 and thats what defently help us to 13-3, there's no arguing it. But like I said our Defense has Always been that good but with no offensive help we could not win. Mcnair came and kept the dfense rested because He kept the offense on the filed and helped score points.

we lost in the playoffs, it happens, only one team can be champions, Pats went 18-0 and lost in the superbowl by a medicore team, Does that make Tom Brady suck because He faild to sore points on a certain drive?

[I*Bleed*Purple]

I understand the defense was #1 and thats what defently help us to 13-3, there's no arguing it. But like I said our Defense has Always been that good but with no offensive help we could not win. Mcnair came and kept the dfense rested because He kept the offense on the filed and helped score points.

we lost in the playoffs, it happens, only one team can be champions, Pats went 18-0 and lost in the superbowl by a medicore team, Does that make Tom Brady suck because He faild to sore points on a certain drive?

He broke the record for TD passes in a single season. Something we could only dream about. Don't dare compare him to "NoAir" McNair.

[I*Bleed*Purple]

16 TD's and one on the ground, 17 TD's!!

17 WHOLE TD'S?!?!?! Thats 1.0625 per game. Man, we should've paid him alot more to keep him around.

[Borris]

You know what, it is just getting ridiculous on this forum; all the qb bashing is just stupid. Jeeze, everyone in Baltimore is so critical of quarterbacks, that nobody will ever be good enough to be a starter. We screw up quarterbacks like nobody's business. Don

[Moderator 3]

3. A quarterback that we decided could never play in the NFL, Chris Redman, came out of retirement to beat out two former 1st round picks for the starting job in Atlanta.

Just for the record, Chris was released injured. It was years before he was playing again. We could not hold him on the roster that long.

[smashmouth]

He broke the record for TD passes in a single season. Something we could only dream about. Don't dare compare him to "NoAir" McNair.

SO and He caouldent win the superbowl?? SAD!! 50 TD PASSES!!! we had 17 and DID 13-3!! WAY UNDER HALF!!

[BuckWilds]

It does seem like QB is always on the menu. I wonder what one of them would do with support... I mean, it's starting to sound like Philly around here.