Going Back To 3-4

[Purple Punishment]

I for one am happy that we are going back to the 3-4. I dont feel like our full potential personnel wise was met in the 4-3. Though our defense was good, they were not great. Our personnel here today are better suited for a 3-4 Defense. My questions are, whats to become of Kruger in this scheme since he gained all of that weight? Will Sizzle be taking more snaps at OLB again? Im stoked to see how Pagano orchestrates this defense. The players to run it are here and Im ready to see how we do with it next season!

[XxSizzleXx]

Did you happen to watch any games this year lol, we rocked the 3-4 the entire year. Unlike last year where we fiddled with the 4-3 a couple times it did not happen this year.

[Purple Punishment]

[quote name='XxSizzleXx' timestamp='1296946608' post='633060']

[/quote]

Face palm cause I said they were not great?

[Purple Punishment]

[quote name='XxSizzleXx' timestamp='1296946608' post='633060']


[b]Did you happen to watch any games this year lol, we rocked the 3-4 the entire year. Unlike last year where we fiddled with the 4-3 a couple times it did not happen this year.[/b]
[/quote]

Honestly I didnt notice the 3-4 very much. My lack of attention could have been thwarted by us playing to the level of our opponents lol

MODS DELETE THIS TOPIC

[ryan23945]

[quote name='Purple Punishment' timestamp='1296946279' post='633054']
I for one am happy that we are going back to the 3-4. I dont feel like our full potential personnel wise was met in the 4-3. Though our defense was good, they were not great. Our personnel here today are better suited for a 3-4 Defense. My questions are, whats to become of Kruger in this scheme since he gained all of that weight? Will Sizzle be taking more snaps at OLB again? Im stoked to see how Pagano orchestrates this defense. The players to run it are here and Im ready to see how we do with it next season!
[/quote]
we were 3-4, suggs was hybrid de olb, still 3-4

[XxSizzleXx]

[quote name='Purple Punishment' timestamp='1296946751' post='633064']
Honestly I didnt notice the 3-4 very much. My lack of attention could have been thwarted by us playing to the level of our opponents lol

MODS DELETE THIS TOPIC
[/quote]

The times where you spotted 4 d linemen I would almost guarantee that they were in a nickel. They're were times in the first few games where I started to uproar to myself because I thought we were in a 4-3, only to spot the extra DB out there. But yea, we ran the 3-4 the entire year, otherwise it was a blitz or a nickel package.

[Wacko4Zacko]

I personally like the 46 defense, but 3-4 is appreciated and supported by me.

[XxSizzleXx]

I could see the 4-6 getting majorly torched in today's game of football.

[Purple Punishment]

[quote name='XxSizzleXx' timestamp='1296946919' post='633068']
The times where you spotted 4 d linemen I would almost guarantee that they were in a nickel. They're were times in the first few games where I started to uproar to myself because I thought we were in a 4-3, only to spot the extra DB out there. But yea, we ran the 3-4 the entire year, otherwise it was a blitz or a nickel package.
[/quote]

and an LB playing up on the line from the outside. yeah now that i think about it we were in the 3-4

[edreedfromtheu]

No matter what any of you say, Suggs is a defensive end... not a linebacker. He proved this when negotiating his contract, and got the higher dollar.

I don't care what "label" you want to give a defensive formation, but Suggs will be on the end of that line.

As for what helps the Ravens defense more... well, you want more linebackers on the field IF you have talented linebackers to put on the field. Sadly, I can't say the Ravens have talented linebackers after Ray Lewis.

The draft and free agency is most likely going to determine what formation the Ravens line up in more often. Do they get a good defensive end to play on the opposite side of Suggs? If so... the Ravens will probably have 4 defensive lineman... Ngata and Cody in the middle, Suggs and whoever they draft/acquire on the outside.

If the Ravens end up getting a star linebacker before training camp, or even multiple linebackers(maybe they get Antwan Barnes back)... then they will probably be running more formations with 4 linebackers.

[RoflDogs]

We run a 3-4, but Suggs has his hand in the dirt every play and barely drops into coverage

[justifythegame]

We did not play a 4-3. What team were you watching. The schemes were different from Rex Ryan's 46 but that does not mean they were playing a 4-3. Our Starting DE was Cory Redding, if he was playing in a 4-3 he would've taken his snaps at DT. Haloti Ngata played DT and DE and Gregg played NT a lot. We had 2 MLBs on the field most of the time- usually Ray and McClain/Gooden - thats a 34 defense with Johnson or Suggs with their hands on the ground. Just because they put their hand on the ground doesn't mean they aren't playing LB, they could easily step back. You need to watch other games other than bmore games and see what a real 4-3 looks like. If we had a 4-3 Paul Kruger wouldn't have become a bust, he is a beast of 4-3 end being misused and forced into take up blocks as a 3-4 end.

[AwakenTheDemon]

This thread is full of so much win it's not even funny. Well, maybe it is...

[1/28/01]

[quote name='AwakenTheDemon' timestamp='1296957608' post='633185']
This thread is full of so much win it's not even funny. Well, maybe it is...
[/quote]
Im eating Tabasco Cheez-Its......

[tctony]

I wish the Ravens could transition to a primarily 4-3 defense. Ngata and Cody could be dominant on the inside. Suggs could beast as a 4-3 defensive end, but would play a hybrid role because he does have coverage skills. The Ravens would also need to find a new MLB and another pass rusher on the other defensive end.

IMO if you can get two great DTs, it opens up a lot for your defense and makes everyone else's jobs easier. Remember Sam Adams and Goose? Those guys could both foreseeably take up two blockers due to their sheer size. I believe that the Ngata and Cody combination could rival that. Imagine Suggs as a hybrid-defensive end on that line. We all know Ray Lewis was and is a tremendous athlete, but he was in heaven when he had a huge defensive line taking up blockers and letting him roam. Incidentally, the answer for future MLB is not currently on this team, and we need to address that.

[GoingUpTop]

Here's a simple way to know if the Ravens are in a 3-4 or a 4-3 ok;

Suggs hand in the dirt = 4-3

Suggs standing up = 3-4



Goodnight everyone!

[RavensAllTheWay]

[quote name='GoingUpTop' timestamp='1296971312' post='633288']
Here's a simple way to know if the Ravens are in a 3-4 or a 4-3 ok;

Suggs hand in the dirt = 4-3

Suggs standing up = 3-4



Goodnight everyone!
[/quote]
Exactly lol

When Suggs has his hand in the ground, he's a fourth down lineman. When he doesn't, he's a fourth LB.

[Jabara]

[quote name='XxSizzleXx' timestamp='1296946608' post='633060']


Did you happen to watch any games this year lol, we rocked the 3-4 the entire year. Unlike last year where we fiddled with the 4-3 a couple times it did not happen this year.
[/quote]
Why does everyone think we played 4-3 this season?
Everyone has been asking this, it never happened.
Ravens are 3-4; kinda revolutionized it.

[quote name='Purple Punishment' timestamp='1296946751' post='633064']
Honestly I didnt notice the 3-4 very much. My lack of attention could have been thwarted by us playing to the level of our opponents lol

MODS DELETE THIS TOPIC
[/quote]
Please delete.

[justifythegame]

[quote name='RavensAllTheWay' timestamp='1296975506' post='633307']
Exactly lol

When Suggs has his hand in the ground, he's a fourth down lineman. When he doesn't, he's a fourth LB.
[/quote]

No thats not true at all. Suggs has had his hand on the ground since he was a rookie, that doesnt mean we were playing a 4-3 then either. Suggs has dropped back and contested passes or even made picks by confusing people with his hand on the ground. When he has his hand on the ground a lot of the time there are still 2 other inside linebackers around the field and another olb that may or may not be blitzing, and redding isn't going to be an edge rusher from the opposite end, he is pushing inside and taking up blocks to help the LBs make a play. You can say its all the same thing but there is still a fundamental difference between the 34 and 43 whether suggs' hand is on the ground or not. This is primarily why we do have a true weakness at the other ILB spot since Bart Scott's departure.

[wayne]

we might have ran the 3-4 majority of the time but it was structured more like a 4-3. Look at hot the Jets or Steelers run theiur 3-4 then go and look at how we ran it, looks completely different. I want us to go back to the 3-4 fronts we were runiing 3 years back, not this 3-4 hybrid 4-3 D. Dont get me wrong, we ran it great but lets mix that in with the traditional 3-4 fronts.

[Militant X 1]

if you recorded the games you would know what the Ravens ran defensively and there would be no need for all of this going back and forth about it!

[Alexir]

4-3, 3-4, I dont care. I just don't wanna see any prevent defenses ever again in my life....ever.....ever[img]http://ravens.cdn.ipslink.com/public/style_emoticons/default/34853_brickwall.GIF[/img]

[Bltravens]

[quote name='wayne' timestamp='1297035237' post='633702']
we might have ran the 3-4 majority of the time but it was structured more like a 4-3. Look at hot the Jets or Steelers run theiur 3-4 then go and look at how we ran it, looks completely different. I want us to go back to the 3-4 fronts we were runiing 3 years back, not this 3-4 hybrid 4-3 D. Dont get me wrong, we ran it great but lets mix that in with the traditional 3-4 fronts.
[/quote]
I get what your saying, most of it is right, but Rex runs the hybrid as well. I think you mean you wanna see more of what Nolan was doing with our D back in the day.

[Chadwiick]

Alright lets see,
4-3: DE: Suggs & Kindle/Redding, DT: Ngata & Gregg, OLB: Johnson & ?, ILB: Lewis....
3-4: DT: Ngata & Redding, NT: Gregg, DE/OLB: Suggs & Johnson/Kindle, ILB: Lewis & ?...?
Alright no matter what, we don't have a truely complete linebacking corp. Our OLB's are DE/OLB style, pass-rush with a little coverage (and lots of run)... so 4-3 is pretty much out because we do not have a decent enough OLB to fit that spot... that's if we want to play to our strengths....
We need another Bart Scott to complete our 3-4.
(NOTE: no disrespect was intended to any players)

[RichieAsh]

This comment is exactly right, particularly with the Steelers comparison. They run a far more effective 3-4 featuring the zone blitz, with Harrison and Woodley freguently dropping back and the middle linebackers blitzing or fing Polamalu. They can create confusion when only sending 5, while taking away the first hot read and that's not what the Ravens do, not even close. It doesn't matter what you label the D, the Ravens scheme the last few years has not been as good as the best in the league.


[quote name='wayne' timestamp='1297035237' post='633702']
we might have ran the 3-4 majority of the time but it was structured more like a 4-3. Look at hot the Jets or Steelers run theiur 3-4 then go and look at how we ran it, looks completely different. I want us to go back to the 3-4 fronts we were runiing 3 years back, not this 3-4 hybrid 4-3 D. Dont get me wrong, we ran it great but lets mix that in with the traditional 3-4 fronts.
[/quote]

[doublerayven]

We ran a 34 base all year. Suggs had his hand on the ground on most plays that was the difference. The gap responsibility was still the same to a 34 since JJ was at the LOS. Gap duties is what really determines if its a 34 and every player confirmed that it was essentially a 34 with a down LB (Suggs). Possibly because hes our only pass rusher and we need him to rush, throwing out the potential 'surprise' that is having two rushing OLB since Suggs is our only capable one.

On nickle formations we do use a 4 man front btw. One way to determine a base D is if there is a 7 man front and it has 3 LBs parallel to each other its a base 43. We rarely did that since we do not possess the coverage LBs necessary in this formation.

[izvoodoo]

Don't shoot me... I want to draft Martez wilson... or trade out of the first round with say... buffalo who could certainly use a DE and a corner (which they could get) and take him early second round and have an extra 4th for a project center.

[Bltravens]

[quote name='doublerayven' timestamp='1297194959' post='635776']
We ran a 34 base all year. Suggs had his hand on the ground on most plays that was the difference. The gap responsibility was still the same to a 34 since JJ was at the LOS. Gap duties is what really determines if its a 34 and every player confirmed that it was essentially a 34 with a down LB (Suggs). Possibly because hes our only pass rusher and we need him to rush, throwing out the potential 'surprise' that is having two rushing OLB since Suggs is our only capable one.

On nickle formations we do use a 4 man front btw. One way to determine a base D is if there is a 7 man front and it has 3 LBs parallel to each other its a base 43. We rarely did that since we do not possess the coverage LBs necessary in this formation.
[/quote]
Not necessarily because in the 43 we used to run it often had 5 people at the LOS with Boulware dropping down to play the 43 under. But your correct we had 34 gap responsibilities this year again.

If we had another edge rusher opposite Suggs we could actually play with dropping him in coverage and letting the other guy run, or play with different nickel formations like the packers or steelers use. But when the only guy who can get to the QB is Suggs you have to send him after the QB on every snap, and that takes away alot of disguise.

[Free Agent]

The issue is Jarett Johnson on the other side. He is okay in coverage, but he could not rush the QB. He had 1 1/2 sacks, for Ray's sake!