MERGED: Are The WRs Getting Open?

[AsianRice]

[quote name='True' timestamp='1293465017' post='586406']
Mason plays to his strength with that great comeback route. Him and Flacco have perfect timing and 90% of the time the ball is caught. But with Boldin I am unsure of why Cam doesn't use him more across the middle with slants, crossing, drag, or even screens. Boldin has way too much talent and skill to be so underused and his abilities are not being used well in this offense. He has been awfully quiet these past few weeks (in fairness the Ravens did run quite a lot the last 2) and I hesitate to say it is because he's always doubled covered, that's what usually happens when only 2 WR are going out for routes.

They have to figure how to use Boldin closer to the LOS about 5-10 yards, instead of 15-20 yards deep. Boldin excels in the short passing game and I only see it happen a couple times a game.
[/quote]

I agree some of your thoughts on how to use Boldin, but I think if we run the ball well, we can do anything. However, if our running game is shut down, we need to use Boldin to his best ability in order to move the ball. Deep route is not Boldin's style. His cream and butter play is in the middle, slant or screen like you said.

Cam needs to get all his plans straight up, and when time comes, he needs to use it effectively. We have only 1 shot in playoff: win or go home. No more testing or getting in the groove. Right call is for right execution.

[I AM LEGEND]

Extremely concerned in recent weeks that Boldin isn't getting separation....Mason seems to get it at a fairly decent good percentage...but Boldin is out there looking like a substitute for Mark Clayton recently...and if Boldin isn't gonna give us #1 WR production then we're back to basically the same team we've had in years past.

For one Flacco doesn't have a quick release like warner had and therefore he's missing Boldin at critical times during the route when he is open...teams have also stopped pressing Boldin cause he's so big and physical that it doesn't benefit them to have a smaller db get manhandled at the line by anquan..however anquan doesn't really have the speed to make them pay on quick slants and other quick pass situations so its tough.

I personally would like to see anquan lose a couple of pounds before next season...at times he's out there looking like a OLB more then a WR.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='I AM LEGEND' timestamp='1293471830' post='586460']
Extremely concerned in recent weeks that Boldin isn't getting separation....Mason seems to get it at a fairly decent good percentage...but Boldin is out there looking like a substitute for Mark Clayton recently...and if Boldin isn't gonna give us #1 WR production then we're back to basically the same team we've had in years past.

For one Flacco doesn't have a quick release like warner had and therefore he's missing Boldin at critical times during the route when he is open...teams have also stopped pressing Boldin cause he's so big and physical that it doesn't benefit them to have a smaller db get manhandled at the line by anquan..[b]however anquan doesn't really have the speed to make them pay on quick slants and other quick pass situations so its tough.

I personally would like to see anquan lose a couple of pounds before next season...at times he's out there looking like a OLB more then a WR.[/b]
[/quote]

You don't need a lot of speed to run quick slants successfully. And as we've seen a good number of times this season, Q still isn't easy to bring down by just one DB.

I don't think he needs to lose weight; the OC needs to recognize what he's good at and actually design plays for him.

[Milton145]

I think receivers just aren't getting open enough to where Flacco feels comfortable throwing them the ball. Though Boldin is the type of receiver that even when he's covered he's still open (I've seen this a few times).

Most of you guys are concerned with the amount of catches Boldin is getting but what about Derrick Mason? Most of us argeed that with Boldin being here, it would open up things more for Mason and he'd be tearing up 2nd tier CBs...well that is what he's doing now and I'm quite satisfied with it.

Another reason I think why we stall on some drives is because Todd Heap is out. This passing game has the potential to rip it up once Heap comes back in the postseason IMO.

[beasy2487]

I really think it's Cam Cameron and the playcalling that's keeping all of our WR's in a cage, not just Q.

Flacco and Mason have outstanding timing and, as a result, they can outsmart and outwork DBs but I don't understand why everything looks so HARD for our offense. Even when we make plays it's almost always a tight window and flawless execution. Don't get me wrong, I love having a blue collar team that outworks the opponent but why do we make everything so difficult on ourselves instead of playing to our strengths?

The answer, in my mind, is that Cameron hasn't adjusted his system to the players that are on this team. It seems as though in Cameron's mind, each player on the depth chart serves a particular purpose and he rotates players in and out taking no heed of the areas where they excel. For example, this is why we see Anquan constantly running streaks--In Cameron's system, the #1 receiver runs a high percentage of streaks even though our #1 isn't built to be most effective on those routes. We also see this phenomenon in our backfield where we rarely see 2 back sets even though we have 2 starting caliber backs.

I do like the job Cameron has done and I give credit to the players for executing the plays he's giving them, but I do not think he is using enough plays that put the tools we have in position to wreak maximum havoc. It's a tough situation and I hope it doesn't come back to bite us in the playoffs.

[Wacko4Zacko]

Houshmanzadeh is getting open. lolz

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='beasy2487' timestamp='1293474470' post='586496']
I really think it's Cam Cameron and the playcalling that's keeping all of our WR's in a cage, not just Q.

Flacco and Mason have outstanding timing and, as a result, they can outsmart and outwork DBs but I don't understand why everything looks so HARD for our offense. Even when we make plays it's almost always a tight window and flawless execution. Don't get me wrong, I love having a blue collar team that outworks the opponent but why do we make everything so difficult on ourselves instead of playing to our strengths?

The answer, in my mind, is that Cameron hasn't adjusted his system to the players that are on this team. It seems as though in Cameron's mind, each player on the depth chart serves a particular purpose and he rotates players in and out taking no heed of the areas where they excel. For example, this is why we see Anquan constantly running streaks--In Cameron's system, the #1 receiver runs a high percentage of streaks even though our #1 isn't built to be most effective on those routes. We also see this phenomenon in our backfield where we rarely see 2 back sets even though we have 2 starting caliber backs.

I do like the job Cameron has done and I give credit to the players for executing the plays he's giving them, but I do not think he is using enough plays that put the tools we have in position to wreak maximum havoc. It's a tough situation and I hope it doesn't come back to bite us in the playoffs.
[/quote]

I couldn't agree more beasy.

Further supporting the claims you made in your third paragraph is the play Joe got picked off on yesterday([url="http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d81d3544c/Joe-Haden-interception"]here's a video link[/url]).

Cam called a hook and go to Q and not only was Joe's throw poor but the corner, Haden, played it perfectly. Still, why don't you have Mason, Houshmandzadeh or Stallworth run that route?

[beasy2487]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1293475019' post='586503']
I couldn't agree more beasy.

Further supporting the claims you made in your third paragraph is the play Joe got picked off on yesterday([url="http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d81d3544c/Joe-Haden-interception"]here's a video link[/url]).

Cam called a hook and go to Q and not only was Joe's throw poor but the corner, Haden, played it perfectly. Still, why don't you have Mason, Houshmandzadeh or Stallworth run that route?
[/quote]

In addition, the screen plays to Housh... It's like "the 3rd receiver runs the screens" even though with our personnel it makes NO SENSE.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='beasy2487' timestamp='1293475640' post='586512']
In addition, the screen plays to Housh... It's like "the 3rd receiver runs the screens" even though with our personnel it makes NO SENSE.
[/quote]

Yep. He'll run them to Houshmandzadeh once a game to get him involved but rarely to Q and never to Stallworth.

[PWNEDbyDEANO]

With the Chargers failing to make the playoffs, would you like to see us replace Cam with Norv Turner? I think he could utilise our weapons correctly, like how he gets the ball to Gates as often as possible, or puts jump-balls up to Floyd or Jackson being as they're both 6'5. I think he would make our offense tick a lot better because, as you all have already said, we don't work things to the personnel that we have, just Cam's 10-play playbook.

[rlh445]

[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1293438766' post='586274']
I was just joking about Cam lol ... ever since Clayton left, I've been looking for a new whipping boy. Cam has made a good case for the position this season


BTW- Speaking of throwing it into tight windows, did you see the TD pass to Housh today??
[/quote]


Haha I did see it. I was even like, 'Holy heck that was a tight window to throw to,' as the announcers were saying something about what a tight window that was lol.

[FerrariFan87]

I want to believe that Cameron has been gliding along all season with this vanilla passing game/offense in general with the hopes of catching our playoff opponents off-guard... I'm probably crazy, but what we've seen just can't be how he envisioned this offense to run.

[gabefergy]

I have to admit, I am very disappointed with how Cam has utilized Q this season. I think a large part of the problem is that our receivers largely have similar talents. They are smart, physical, possession receivers. Only Stallworth is a true downfield threat, but he has barely been utilized this season. Q gets sent on long routes because Cam wants to use him as a decoy to stretch the field and take attention away from Mason or Housh. I think the answer is to use more 3 or 4 WR sets like we were earlier in the season. Throw Heap and Rice in the mix and there are a ton of options for Joe.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1293479868' post='586560']
I have to admit, I am very disappointed with how Cam has utilized Q this season. I think a large part of the problem is that our receivers largely have similar talents. They are smart, physical, possession receivers. Only Stallworth is a true downfield threat, but he has barely been utilized this season. Q gets sent on long routes because Cam wants to use him as a decoy to stretch the field and take attention away from Mason or Housh. I think the answer is to use more 3 or 4 WR sets like we were earlier in the season. Throw Heap and Rice in the mix and there are a ton of options for Joe.
[/quote]

I agreed with the first part of what you said but the problem with three and especially four WR sets is the offensive line's struggles in pass protection.

[Romo Ravens]

[quote name='PWNEDbyDEANO' timestamp='1293476184' post='586525']
With the Chargers failing to make the playoffs, would you like to see us replace Cam with Norv Turner? I think he could utilise our weapons correctly, like how he gets the ball to Gates as often as possible, or puts jump-balls up to Floyd or Jackson being as they're both 6'5. I think he would make our offense tick a lot better because, as you all have already said, we don't work things to the personnel that we have, just Cam's 10-play playbook.
[/quote]

Oh God yes. If you look at it, there will be a plethora of OC's who will need a job come the offseason. Norv Turner, Josh McDaniels and Gary Kubiak come to mind. Please dump Cam and get one of them, namely Turner!

[gabefergy]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1293481615' post='586575']
I agreed with the first part of what you said but the problem with three and especially four WR sets is the offensive line's struggles in pass protection.
[/quote]
Yeah, that is definitely true. If Joe played more out of shotgun and looked for quick passes, instead of long and intermediate routes I think the passing game would be successful with 3 receiver sets. Rice and Heap can stay in to help protect too.

I'm not saying just run those kind of sets, but I would like to see them more often.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='gabefergy' timestamp='1293490092' post='586666']
Yeah, that is definitely true. If Joe played more out of shotgun and looked for quick passes, instead of long and intermediate routes I think the passing game would be successful with 3 receiver sets. Rice and Heap can stay in to help protect too.

I'm not saying just run those kind of sets, but I would like to see them more often.
[/quote]

So would I. It's just one of the many puzzling realities with this team. That they're poised to go 12-4 season despite all the personnel and coaching issues says a lot though.

[JohnJohnson]

My opinion is that they're too predictable with the routes. We rarely complete short-medium passes unless they're to Ray Rice. We are noticeably ineffective at using the short pass, which would take some pressure off of our run game and usually keep the clock moving as well.

Run run pass isn't going to get us to the SB. We have to give Flacco more chances to convert and pick up chunks of yardage, especially if we fall behind against a team like the Colts.

[ravensfan160]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' timestamp='1293481615' post='586575']
I agreed with the first part of what you said but the problem with three and especially four WR sets is the offensive line's struggles in pass protection.
[/quote]
Your argument is flawed. With more receivers running routes the o-line doesn't have to block as long. I'd rather see a lot more of that than sending only 2 receivers out on routes.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='ravensfan160' timestamp='1293502274' post='586806']
Your argument is flawed. With more receivers running routes the o-line doesn't have to block as long. I'd rather see a lot more of that than sending only 2 receivers out on routes.
[/quote]

I'd rather see more than two WRs on the the field in passing situations too but my argument isn't flawed, especially considering we're talking about this team.

Think back to the New England game. Late in the contest, possibly in OT, the offense went four wide on consecutive plays and both times, Joe was unable to find anyone and was ultimately flsuhed out of the pocket.You'd think having more options would mean the ball getting out quicker but obviously, that isn't always the case.

[purple.n.black]

[quote name='rlh445' timestamp='1293437988' post='586264']
Please don't take offense. Why do you care if Boldin exceeds one thousand yards? Is he on your fantasy team or..? And really, this isn't a question aimed at you..more like a question that is aimed at a lot of posters and fans in general who feel like Boldin isn't getting enough looks as if that's a slight on him. It's a compliment. He's definitely being looked at as the number one wideout on the team, and is being treated as such. It's harder to get the ball to a guy that's being purposefully taken out of the equation. It's not like we're not going to him, but we're not gonna go to our best wideout every play.
[/quote]
I'm not sure of the actual numbers, but I know Flacco didn't have a whole lot of trouble finding Mason last year. And who did Mason have to get him open, Clayton? Washington? Not to take anything from Mason I am just saying it seemed like we were able to do better for what we had last year. Of course the running game was working a lot better, which I think is the biggest problem in the passing game this year. But that doesn't mean it should be like this.