Who Is To Blame, Ed Reed Or The Corners?

[rlh445]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1287963571' post='519482']
He had no gas left in the second half. As I said in another thread, Antwaan Barnes had 2 sacks against Brady today. Wish we kept him.......
[/quote]

Dude, seriously, the grass is always greener. How many sacks did Barnes have here? Oh wait, I'll answer that for you. He had two in 2007 and three in 2009. In 2007, Suggs had five. So in one year, Suggs had just as many as Barnes had in two. Oh, in 2009, Suggs had 5 sacks also. So like I said, the grass is always greener. One man's trash and all that. Barnes was good, but obviously the coaches didn't think he was good enough to keep. Please stop.

[Marc2k6]

Blame whoever you want but Reed, Wilson filled in well at the end but I did not see any other DB making plays like Reed. Reed put it on the line today, Hell the first play he made, he caused a fumble, let's not even talk about his Int that he returned to the 10 yard line only to give the ball right back. If we score from the 10, that game was over! Reed is the M.Fing man!

[Alexir]

[quote name='rlh445' timestamp='1287972935' post='519910']
Dude, seriously, the grass is always greener. How many sacks did Barnes have here? Oh wait, I'll answer that for you. He had two in 2007 and three in 2009. In 2007, Suggs had five. So in one year, Suggs had just as many as Barnes had in two. Oh, in 2009, Suggs had 5 sacks also. So like I said, the grass is always greener. One man's trash and all that. Barnes was good, but obviously the coaches didn't think he was good enough to keep. Please stop.
[/quote]

Wow. LOL! you are talking comparing a starter to a back up who got limited snaps! 3 sacks to 5 sacks......great argument buddy.

Barnes would of helped a lot to spell JJ this year.

[rlh445]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1287978174' post='520068']
Wow. LOL! you are talking comparing a starter to a back up who got limited snaps! 3 sacks to 5 sacks......great argument buddy.

Barnes would of helped a lot to spell JJ this year.
[/quote]


Well, you're the one who wanted to use a (back up who got limited snaps)'s performance against the Pats as a reason we shouldn't have let him go. I was merely pointing out his production here as a counter argument against keeping him or saying that with him our pass rush would be better. You brought the chess piece, I merely pointed out its relevant moves.

Also, it wasn't three sacks to five sacks, it was five sacks in two years versus five sacks in one year. At least try to comprehend the post I made. And, I do agree that having anyone relevant spelling Suggs would be great. I'm just not sure using Barnes' two sacks against the Pats is relevant in that discussion, hence my responses.

[Thepurplehaze]

I noticed on maybe 2 occasions where Ed was not in the position he was supposed to be. But seriously c'mon people.
Our corners looked like a bunch of fairys out there today.

Also, Landry is TERRIBLE. The dude is absolutely horrible in coverage and has completely forgotten how to tackle since his head injury. He's great at stopping the rush, but I'm really feeling Nakamura is faster, smarter, and more athletic than Landry this year. Make the change Harbaugh!

[Alexir]

[quote name='rlh445' timestamp='1287979058' post='520080']
Well, you're the one who wanted to use a (back up who got limited snaps)'s performance against the Pats as a reason we shouldn't have let him go. I was merely pointing out his production here as a counter argument against keeping him or saying that with him our pass rush would be better. You brought the chess piece, I merely pointed out its relevant moves.

Also, it wasn't three sacks to five sacks, it was five sacks in two years versus five sacks in one year. At least try to comprehend the post I made. And, I do agree that having anyone relevant spelling Suggs would be great. I'm just not sure using Barnes' two sacks against the Pats is relevant in that discussion, hence my responses.
[/quote]

I was comparing his 3 sacks to the 5 sacks coming off the bench or starting for an injured player.....

Meaning, wow, we could use Barnes for pass rushing downs since Kruger isn't doing anything and JJ is playing injured. I didn't say spell Suggs, I said spell JJ. I would love for someone to spell Suggs as well but that's just being greedy.

[XxSizzleXx]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1287963678' post='519486']
Webb is a jam corner. Fabian is fast enough to be a jam corner but just doesn't have the frame....or the cleats for it.
[/quote]

You must know something we or the coaching staff don't know. If I had more than two negs you'd get em

[UMDan]

[quote name='Thepurplehaze' timestamp='1287979716' post='520085']
I noticed on maybe 2 occasions where Ed was not in the position he was supposed to be. But seriously c'mon people.
Our corners looked like a bunch of fairys out there today.

Also, Landry is TERRIBLE. The dude is absolutely horrible in coverage and has completely forgotten how to tackle since his head injury. He's great at stopping the rush, but I'm really feeling Nakamura is faster, smarter, and more athletic than Landry this year. Make the change Harbaugh!
[/quote]
Yeah Landry and Washington haven't been great lately,

[rlh445]

[quote name='Alexir' timestamp='1287979794' post='520087']
I was comparing his 3 sacks to the 5 sacks coming off the bench or starting for an injured player.....

Meaning, wow, we could use Barnes for pass rushing downs since Kruger isn't doing anything and JJ is playing injured. I didn't say spell Suggs, I said spell JJ. I would love for someone to spell Suggs as well but that's just being greedy.
[/quote]

The original post you made was in conjunction with your devaluing of Suggs' play this year and you used Barnes' contributions to the Chargers against the Pats as a reason why the Ravens shouldn't have let him go, which any sane person would see as you wanting to replace Barnes with Suggs. You said nothing of spelling anyone, J.J. or otherwise until I called you out on his actual production a few posts later. The bottom line is that the F.O. cut Barnes for whatever reason they saw fit and the fact that he had two sacks today does nothing to diminish the slight production he had here in comparison with Suggs.

[Kwothdaraven]

You can in no way blame this on Ed. Theres no way a corner should get torched as badly as fabian did today, thats not even eds side of the field. The reason for 500yds was the complete absense of any type of qb pressure, i mean there was 0. Oh and also fabian was personally responsible for half of the passing yards and 3tds.

To me it seems like chris carr has been our most consistant corner, he needs to start. Him and webb rather that webb and washington. And for the love of god get mt cody in the damn game

[Ravenmore74]

[quote name='Purple Punishment' timestamp='1287962827' post='519454']
Reed has more interceptions in one game than any single player on our roster does this season. He also forced a fumble. How about getting off his back folks.

edit: If not for Reed having 2INT we may have lost to the Buffalo Bills today
[/quote]
1 interception was converted into an offensive TD. The Other Willis gave it right back!

[Thepurplehaze]

[quote name='Kwothdaraven' timestamp='1287984725' post='520147']
You can in no way blame this on Ed. Theres no way a corner should get torched as badly as fabian did today, thats not even eds side of the field. The reason for 500yds was the complete absense of any type of qb pressure, i mean there was 0. Oh and also fabian was personally responsible for half of the passing yards and 3tds.

To me it seems like chris carr has been our most consistant corner, he needs to start. Him and webb rather that webb and washington. And for the love of god get mt cody in the damn game
[/quote]
Carr has played well in the Nickel against 3rd WR's and such, but I highly doubt he would do much better than Fab against a Lee Evans. I like Wilson in there wayyy better than Fab though.

Also I agree with Mt. Cody. Get his big *** in there!

[Trilogique]

[quote name='Kwothdaraven' timestamp='1287984725' post='520147']
You can in no way blame this on Ed. Theres no way a corner should get torched as badly as fabian did today, thats not even eds side of the field. The reason for 500yds was the complete absense of any type of qb pressure, i mean there was 0. Oh and also fabian was personally responsible for half of the passing yards and 3tds.

To me it seems like chris carr has been our most consistant corner, he needs to start. Him and webb rather that webb and washington. And for the love of god get mt cody in the damn game
[/quote]
this

I'm sorry, but I just can't blame it on Reed. I know he's partly supposed to be there for when the CBs do screw up and all that, but when Fabian couldn't tackle and gets torched all game... there's only so much one man can do. especially after a huge injury. like seriously the stats say it all. 3 TDs on Fabian and around half the passing yds. that's EMBARRASSING. what the hell was the last TD the Bills made, too? Fitzpatrick saw the blitz clear as DAY and IMMEDIATELY threw to Evans (or whoever it was) and Fabian (I think it was him) got served a plate of embarrassment.

I know we won and all, and that's nice, but coming this close to an upset is pathetic. we'll rebound no doubt and show up full strength vs Miami, but man we really need to be more consistent.

[True]

Ed Reed isn't exactly a cover safety. The beauty of his skills are high risk / high reward because he's a game changer. But with his ability he does make opposing QB's look away from his vicinity so that is a plus.

For this particular game, the guy missed training camp + pre-season + 6 games. That's a lot of football time he missed and it takes a while to get back into game speed especially coming off hip surgery and his body is getting acclimated to the secondary. Chemistry is very important when working in the secondary because you have to be in sync with your teammates and they have to understand whether you'll get help or have to make the play on your own. Luckily they have this week + 2 weeks to get used to having Reed back in the secondary.

[theFRANCHISE]

[quote name='True' timestamp='1288012878' post='520327']
Ed Reed isn't exactly a cover safety. The beauty of his skills are high risk / high reward because he's a game changer. But with his ability he does make opposing QB's look away from his vicinity so that is a plus.

For this particular game, the guy missed training camp + pre-season + 6 games. That's a lot of football time he missed and it takes a while to get back into game speed especially coming off hip surgery and his body is getting acclimated to the secondary. Chemistry is very important when working in the secondary because you have to be in sync with your teammates and they have to understand whether you'll get help or have to make the play on your own. Luckily they have this week + 2 weeks to get used to having Reed back in the secondary.
[/quote]
Chemistry is the reason why I think both Ed Reed [i]and[/i] the corners share equal blame. Although Reed's turnovers were phenomenal and had an impact on the game, they should not absolve him completely of blame, as he was on the field for plays other than those turnovers. He still has a job to do other than force turnovers, as those turnovers don't matter if the opposing offense is still dumping yards and points all over the field. Sure, the interceptions helped the Ravens offense keep pace and eventually win the game, but the offense may not have been in that position if there was better chemistry in the secondary to make everything else a non-factor. The team wouldn't have needed those interceptions if the Bills passing attack was contained.

On that same token, had the cornerbacks (particularly Fabian Washington) done their jobs, then the game, again, wouldn't have hinged on Reed's interceptions.

Sure, the pass rush also factors into the equation, as the secondary was harassed all day due to the lack of pressure, but just as the offense needs to be able to lean on either component when one is underperforming, the defense should be able to do the same.