We're Going Nowhere Fast If...

[ravensfan160]

Joe can't learn to read cover 2 bump and run coverage. Apparently thats the adjustment the Patriots made in the second half. Pats defenders were talking about it after the game. It wasn't us being conservative, it was the Bengals game all over again.

They dropped 8 into coverage a lot and instead of Joe taking the extra time he had to wait for a receiver to get open he impatiently dumped it off to Rice. Brady on the other hand moved around and bought time, like he should, on their late TD to Branch.

Too bad we don't play the Jets more often. Rex Ryan is too stubborn to do anything but blitz.

[I AM LEGEND]

Noooo! Don't criticize Flacco on this board!

[True]

From what I've read it seems that those check downs were actually designed by Cam Cameron since the receivers were only playing a couple yards further than Rice. I guess he expected for Rice to make nothing out of something. Only thing is Belichick had game planned to take out Rice from the game so the offense fell right into his trap.

Joe should have just said screw it and audibled out of the play and made his own decisions.

[JohnJohnson]

I don't totally disagree, but it seems kind of hard to find a window for a big gain against 8 in coverage when you go 2 wide with Rice out of the backfield.

[ravensfan160]

[quote name='JohnJohnson' timestamp='1287459377' post='513380']
I don't totally disagree, but it seems kind of hard to find a window for a big gain against 8 in coverage when you go 2 wide with Rice out of the backfield.
[/quote]
Well then its the coaches fault. Either way, our offense right now has a giant neon sign on them telling opposing defenses exacly how to stop them.

[Bltravens]

[quote name='I AM LEGEND' timestamp='1287458847' post='513370']
Noooo! Don't criticize Flacco on this board!
[/quote]
Weird.....

[Alexir]

4-2 not 2-4. Didn't know if OP was dyslexic....

[Rinbee]

[quote name='True' timestamp='1287459294' post='513377']
From what I've read it seems that those check downs were actually designed by Cam Cameron since the receivers were only playing a couple yards further than Rice. I guess he expected for Rice to make nothing out of something. Only thing is Belichick had game planned to take out Rice from the game so the offense fell right into his trap.

Joe should have just said screw it and audibled out of the play and made his own decisions.
[/quote]

Joe released the ball so quickly with no pressure that they had to be designed plays. At least take a second to look and hit Rice when he clears the line a bit.

[DrMoonTooth]

[quote name='JohnJohnson' timestamp='1287459377' post='513380']
I don't totally disagree, but it seems kind of hard to find a window for a big gain against 8 in coverage when you go 2 wide with Rice out of the backfield.
[/quote]
Exactly. Why not counter coverage with more to cover? They rush three, we put Boldin, Mason, Housh, Heap, and either Dickson or Pitta spread out wide with and test their heavy coverage. I guarantee you we win that battle.

[RavensAllTheWay]

All I can say is Rice's numbers really pissed me off. 8 catches 38 yards. 28 rushes 88 yards.

He ran over that defense not once but twice last season. Bellichick had all this time to prepare and scheme him out, which is exactly what he did. So not getting fresh legs in there (McGahee) and putting the load on the same one player just plays right into their hands, especially in their house because the crowd eventually got rolling.

I woulda loved to see Flacco moving around more. He's improved more in his pocket awareness than anything since last season. But yesterday, it was awful. We never saw him extending plays and giving time for his WRs to eventually become open.

[purple.n.black]

[quote name='RavensAllTheWay' timestamp='1287460393' post='513399']
All I can say is Rice's numbers really pissed me off. 8 catches 38 yards. 28 rushes 88 yards.

He ran over that defense not once but twice last season. Bellichick had all this time to prepare and scheme him out, which is exactly what he did. So not getting fresh legs in there (McGahee) and putting the load on the same one player just plays right into their hands, especially in their house because the crowd eventually got rolling.

I woulda loved to see Flacco moving around more. He's improved more in his pocket awareness than anything since last season. But yesterday, it was awful. We never saw him extending plays and giving time for his WRs to eventually become open.
[/quote]
Yup, we made it even easier for BB, it is almost as if he was counting on us to play like that and not change our game plan up to get any type of production

[JohnJohnson]

[quote name='RavensAllTheWay' timestamp='1287460393' post='513399']
All I can say is Rice's numbers really pissed me off. 8 catches 38 yards. 28 rushes 88 yards.

He ran over that defense not once but twice last season. Bellichick had all this time to prepare and scheme him out, which is exactly what he did. So not getting fresh legs in there (McGahee) and putting the load on the same one player just plays right into their hands, especially in their house because the crowd eventually got rolling.

I woulda loved to see Flacco moving around more. He's improved more in his pocket awareness than anything since last season. But yesterday, it was awful. We never saw him extending plays and giving time for his WRs to eventually become open.
[/quote]

I feel like it has to be lack of confidence in the play. How else can you explain 3 quarters of good offense, followed by about a half of nothing? If Flacco subconsciously doesn't believe in the play, then it has to affect the decisions he makes. It probably becomes the best option to get the guaranteed yardage from Rice, instead of running around trying to find 2 receivers, [b]maybe [/b]a tight end against a cover 2 defense.

[Bltravens]

[quote name='JohnJohnson' timestamp='1287461374' post='513411']
I feel like it has to be lack of confidence in the play. How else can you explain 3 quarters of good offense, followed by about a half of nothing? If Flacco subconsciously doesn't believe in the play, then it has to affect the decisions he makes. It probably becomes the best option to get the guaranteed yardage from Rice, instead of running around trying to find 2 receivers, [b]maybe [/b]a tight end against a cover 2 defense.
[/quote]
Thats what grinds my gears, run a singleback 2 TE seam play or something....

[JO_75]

[quote name='True' timestamp='1287459294' post='513377']
Joe should have just said screw it and audibled out of the play and made his own decisions.
[/quote]

You know sometimes we talk about Joe "growing up" and maturing well the thing is he can't do that until he starts using audibles when he feels he needs to. That is when this offense will take off, when Joe starts doing things on his own, making audibles and reading defenses more. If Joe works on those 2 things... this offense could be much better.

I thought the Handcuffs were taken off Joe this season when we got Boldin and we would see Joe doing audibles to get out of certain situations but Cam still has the handcuffs on Joe. Such a shame now it seems Cam is holding back the offense's potential, maybe Cam has to go I mean Phillip Rivers still had success after Cam so maybe that's what Joe needs, to get away from Cam and have a OC who allows Joe more freedom in the passing game and doing audibles.

[Bltravens]

[quote name='JO_75' timestamp='1287465969' post='513455']
You know sometimes we talk about Joe "growing up" and maturing well the thing is he can't do that until he starts using audibles when he feels he needs to. That is when this offense will take off, when Joe starts doing things on his own, making audibles and reading defenses more. If Joe works on those 2 things... this offense could be much better.

I thought the Handcuffs were taken off Joe this season when we got Boldin and we would see Joe doing audibles to get out of certain situations but Cam still has the handcuffs on Joe. Such a shame now it seems Cam is holding back the offense's potential, maybe Cam has to go I mean Phillip Rivers still had success after Cam so maybe that's what Joe needs, to get away from Cam and have a OC who allows Joe more freedom in the passing game and doing audibles.
[/quote]
Pretty sure Flacco and Cam have a love hate relationship. That AFC division game last year when Flacco was ALL OVER Cam on the sidelines really said it all.

[JohnJohnson]

[quote name='Bltravens' timestamp='1287466551' post='513458']
Pretty sure Flacco and Cam have a love hate relationship. That AFC division game last year when Flacco was ALL OVER Cam on the sidelines really said it all.
[/quote]

And as Flacco gains experience and sees others upset as well, he'll start to feel more certain that he's not being naive when he disagrees with Cam. An offensive coordinator shouldn't have everyone talking about him, you should be talking about the players and execution. Unfortunately, the game plan was blatantly flawed, and everyone knows it. I hope he feels the pressure, because it's on. This was a game that influenced a lot of fans who are on the fence about Cam. I can't imagine what's being said between some of the players.

[plesiosaur]

[quote name='RavensAllTheWay' timestamp='1287460393' post='513399']
All I can say is Rice's numbers really pissed me off. 8 catches 38 yards. 28 rushes 88 yards.

He ran over that defense not once but twice last season. Bellichick had all this time to prepare and scheme him out, which is exactly what he did. So not getting fresh legs in there (McGahee) and putting the load on the same one player just plays right into their hands, especially in their house because the crowd eventually got rolling.

I woulda loved to see Flacco moving around more. He's improved more in his pocket awareness than anything since last season. But yesterday, it was awful. We never saw him extending plays and giving time for his WRs to eventually become open.
[/quote]

Frustration set in when they kept Rice running the ball and didn't sub McGahee all stinking game! Putting in McGahee when Rice failed to produce shoulda been part of the game plan.

[Ravenslifer]

[quote name='True' timestamp='1287459294' post='513377']
From what I've read it seems that those check downs were actually designed by Cam Cameron since the receivers were only playing a couple yards further than Rice. I guess he expected for Rice to make nothing out of something. Only thing is Belichick had game planned to take out Rice from the game so the offense fell right into his trap.

Joe should have just said screw it and audibled out of the play and made his own decisions.
[/quote]


Yeah, but, remember, according to Cameron, "audibles are overrated". Joe doesn't have the clout of a Manning or Brady to say to is OC "I'm going to pretty much do what I want" and get away with it, yet. I think he plays better when he's allowed to call his own plays on occassion, but I'm neither the head coach or the OC, so I can't make that decision to ease up on the leash. For all we know they could have told him "listen to us or we'll start using Bulger".

[Ravens549]

The Pats also had a pass rush, we did not.
Brady didn't buy time...he had time.

[Perfekt]

From the article on the front page they tried to make it seem like Flacco could have changed the play. I still dont believe that tho because im sure Flacco didnt want to get stuffed when McClain could have pushed the pile.

Something just doesnt smell right this season with our offense.

[johnny86]

Oh wow, here's something new...somebody who thinks it was Joe Flacco's fault....

[Jamal]

Flacco wont really have a chance with 2 WR's and the same plays all over again.

[jimmypowder]

We are going nowhere fast if our punt and kickoff return game doesn't improve
dramatically.

[SaVaGe]

I like cams philosophy, talk all off season about your off season acquisitions so other teams prepare for them, then go out there and don't use them. Were 4-2 primarily because of the play of the defense and how strong it has been. Yeah it let us down last week but that is due to them being on the field 3 and out after 3 and out.

[WinnipegRaven]

[quote name='plesiosaur' timestamp='1287489306' post='513551']
Frustration set in when they kept Rice running the ball and didn't sub McGahee all stinking game! Putting in McGahee when Rice failed to produce shoulda been part of the game plan.
[/quote]

That just makes WAY too much sense. The Pats got carved up in the playoff game last year and weren't about to let it happen again. Its one of those things I can't wrapmy head around - Rice killed em last year, did we really expect that the Pats wouldn't be prepared? I mean seriously, they had 2 weeks to get ready and it was as if we expected "it worked last season, it'll work again this season" crap.

[Jamal]

[quote name='WinnipegRaven' timestamp='1287511764' post='513912']
That just makes WAY too much sense. The Pats got carved up in the playoff game last year and weren't about to let it happen again. Its one of those things I can't wrapmy head around - Rice killed em last year, did we really expect that the Pats wouldn't be prepared? I mean seriously, they had 2 weeks to get ready and it was as if we expected "it worked last season, it'll work again this season" crap.
[/quote]
This is how stubborn Cam can be

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nh33bGAxl58

[reediddy]

Flacco had a great game, and the Pats made adjustments in the second half to ensure he wouldn't keep tearing them up like he was. This is Belichick, not some moron coach, he knows what he is doing and he made the perfect adjustment. We should have stayed with the power running game, but there is no point fretting over this loss. Flacco will learn

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='reediddy' timestamp='1287531546' post='514318']
Flacco had a great game, and the Pats made adjustments in the second half to ensure he wouldn't keep tearing them up like he was. This is Belichick, not some moron coach, he knows what he is doing and he made the perfect adjustment. We should have stayed with the power running game, but there is no point fretting over this loss. Flacco will learn
[/quote]

The power running game wasn't working and sticking with it was one of the reasons the Ravens lost.

Joe had success going down-field for 3 quarters and then Cam decided short crossing outs were the way to go late in the game. Yes, Belicheck made a good adjustment but Cam's counter-adjustment was weak.

[AsianRice]

[quote name='DrMoonTooth' timestamp='1287460387' post='513398']
Exactly. Why not counter coverage with more to cover? They rush three, we put Boldin, Mason, Housh, Heap, and either Dickson or Pitta spread out wide with and test their heavy coverage. I guarantee you we win that battle.
[/quote]
Good points and that's what I've been screaming all day during Pats game. It's time for Cam to step away from playcalling power and give it to Joe.

Harbs, stop giving too much man love to Cam. Joe is your man, not Cam. Joe is our franchise QB!

PS: Cam is just for designing and giving the plays, and Joe will pick which playcall is best to fit for certain situation.

[AsianRice]

[quote name='Jamal' timestamp='1287518374' post='514043']
This is how stubborn Cam can be

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nh33bGAxl58
[/quote]
and ignorant....