No One Can Make Excuses For The Offense

[edreedfromtheu]

Okay back on topic...


I think there IS an excuse that perhaps the team built in on purpose specifically for Flacco. If the offense doesn't score like we hope, people will start pointing to one thing:

"Joe doesn't have any deep threat! He throws a great long ball and there are no receivers who can get down the field!"

Stallworth appeared to be that guy in training camp, but he's out until at least Week 9 with a broken foot.

And if that excuse fails, I'm sure people will start blaming the offensive line, with Gaither being out... and an already wide-spread dislike for O'Neil Cousins.

[theFRANCHISE]

[quote name='I AM LEGEND' timestamp='1283871552' post='468208']
My expectations are high and unrealistic?

I want Flacco to get rid of some of these bad habits and help this team win a superbowl...


If thats to much...then I don't know what to say
[/quote]
But Flacco can't get rid of these bad habits if he's sitting on the bench; decision-making is something learned through experience, not from watching film and holding a clipboard. Flacco's taken his lumps, but he's made more good decisions than bad decisions; his numbers speak to that statement, especially when placed against elite QBs in their second year like Peyton Manning.

Pessimism and criticism are fine, but developing a young QB does not preclude the team from winning a championship. If the team were to short-sightedly start a veteran in attempting to make a Super Bowl run and fall short of that goal, the development of Flacco will have taken a hit and the season will be a wash. Conversely, at least in giving Flacco the necessary experience, he gives the team a shot at winning while also continuing his development at the same time. Two birds in one stone. There are no guarantees, and there's nothing to indicate that the team would be better off with Marc Bulger under center in making a bid for a championship. Experience does not guarantee more wins; otherwise, a guy like Todd Bouman would've done better with the Ravens in 2008 as the starter.

[flynismo]

[quote name='I AM LEGEND' timestamp='1283872207' post='468223']<br />Oh yea both big Ben and tom Brady manage to lead their respective teams to superbowls in their first couple of years...so what is this argument about Flacco ONLY being in his 3rd year?<br />[/quote]

I hope to god you were joking when you said that.

[I AM LEGEND]

[quote name='flynismo' timestamp='1283880908' post='468350']
I hope to god you were joking when you said that.
[/quote]

Why?

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='I AM LEGEND' timestamp='1283882309' post='468371']
Why?
[/quote]

Bringing up Roethlisberger and Brady to fuel your argument against Joe is weak. How many QBs throughout history have been to and won a Super Bowl in their second season?

[bmorefan444]

Flacco is going to do great. He has everything he needs to progress into an elite quarterback. A sweet offensive cast, great coaching, confidence, a defense that will keep him on the field, playoff experience/wins. (lets just get that O-line together) He is still developing. Give him time b/c I sense a great career for Flacco.

[ROH522155]

This is ridiculous...This is my last post in this thread...Im boycotting it! .....Joe Flacco IS OUR GUY! Deal with it thats the way its gonna be! I just hope he proves it and wins us a Super Bowl and shuts all you haters up!

[flynismo]

[quote name='I AM LEGEND' timestamp='1283882309' post='468371']Why?[/quote]

ed_reed20 explained that pretty well, and more to the point, I find it amusing that you dont see what you have been doing this entire thread..I understand you have certain issues with Flacco, and that's fine. But to support your argument, look at the people being brought up in comparison...Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Ben Roethlisberger. Two of the best QBs to ever play the game, and the other one is another elite QB who set records in his first two years in the league. It would be one thing if you were able to say, "hey, Flacco cant even play on Brady Quinn's level". That would be an example of a reasonable gripe. But since obviously no one can say that without looking like a complete moron, that's not the issue. The issue is, you are taking examples of extraordinary achievements by legendary players (while also ignoring the fact that they had superior teams; lest we forget also that football is a TEAM sport) and holding it against Flacco that he did not replicate what those two were able to accomplish. That is silliness. What is just as silly as that is the fact that Flacco has VERY NEARLY replicated those accomplishments of the legends anyway, despite the odds alreadybeen stacked against him, yet you offer no acknowledgement of those facts.
Not everything is so black and white, you know..sometimes things are shrouded in grey (or purple, if you prefer). Relax, and enjoy the ride.

[berad]

[quote name='nk02442' timestamp='1283874116' post='468248']
It's not bashing, Its FACT. [b]The numbers do not lie.[/b]

When you come back down in to reality , let me know.

I want joe to be the next JohnnyU more than anyone. But I am not delusional because I am a die hard Ravens fan (Which I am).
[/quote]

What numbers are you looking at, man?

That the Ravens have been 20-12 under him? That's he led us to the playoffs twice and won 3 post-season games with him? How about his 20+ TDs last year - the most by a Ravens QB since Vinny Testaverde in '96? What do you make of his Ravens' record 63.1 completion percentage and 88.9 QB rating? Or that he improved in [i]every single[/i] facet of his game from his first year to his second?

And how would you feel if I said he did all those things in his first two years in the NFL? With a [i](formerly)[/i] lackluster receiving core and a young OL?

I'm sorry, but you've shown nothing to sway my and this team's confidence in Joe Flacco. He isn't perfect, few are, but he's improving and he's the best we have by far. Were you here for the Kyle Boller era? If not, look it up, then you'll understand how hard it is to get a good QB, like Flacco.

[Reddawn36]

[quote name='nk02442' timestamp='1283871976' post='468218']
SNIP
I find it amusing that you blame Joe for his sack numbers in large part, give Peyton credit for his low sack numbers but then go on to blame the O line for Bulger's sacks in STL.
SNIP

There is a big difference between a solid O line and a QB with bad pocket pressence and a QB who has NO O LINE. Kind of hard to make bad decisions when you are getting rocked as soon as you hit your drop. Stop trying to to pick apart my logic with stupid replys and comment on the subject at hand.
[/quote]
stop making stupid replies and comments, so he doesn't pick apart your logic

----------------------------------------------------------

To the guys who are comparing Flacco to Manning....

You do realize, that Manning (until lately) wasn't the same QB in the playoffs right? So for those who are calling what Flacco has done in the Regular Season "meaningless"(which btw, those meaningless games get you to the playoffs, to win the superbowl) that means (in turn) you're calling Manning just another scrub QB (which he isn't)... It's only Flacco's 3rd year.... I'm not saying don't have high expectations... but for the love of god, be ready to sit through the lows... (otherwise you're just another fair weather fan)..... Saying Flacco sucks because he liked checking down to Rice is absurd... you mean he's finding the RB who gets production... because the defense can double cover our 2 WR's on the field and still manage to get pressure? Give me a break..... idk about you, but I can't fault anyone for finding the player who can make those plays in that situation

I would quote each of you, but I'd rather make you read the paragraph up top then spend more time making another "flacco isn't the answer" post... the fact that he is already pro bowl range after his 2nd year is amazing.... the fact that he's still improving... is phenomenal

[Troy SmiTH Xx]

This is pretty sickening to see people bashing Flacco. Our "QB of the future" as we have so many times referred to him as. And he is just that. He's a Raven, and a Raven for life. He's tough, can throw the deep ball (ACCURATELY!) and can throw under pressure. Like others have said, he stepped into the fire in his rookie season and took our, mediocre at the time offense, all the way to the AFC Championship, beating the top seeded Tennessee Titans along the way, and guiding the offense pretty decently against the vaunted Steeler's D. This is just so sick that people are doubting him like this. It's pretty infuriating to tell you the truth.

As for our CB situation, we are right where we need to be with the situations that transpired during the offseason.

Overall, we are right where we need to be, and I feel 110% comfortable with this team!

[RavensAllTheWay]

All that matters is what happens this year. I don't see a single good reason to base the current Flacco off of his previous two years, expecially since he's shown slightly quicker decision making, mobility in the Giants game and chemistry with Boldin in the Giants game as well. Each year is different, and we've reached a new one, which means throw the past away.

Me personally, I hold Flacco accountable for the things that are under his control, no more no less. That's where the rest of the team comes in. I was perplexed when I saw the earlier posts blaming the O line for Bulger's recent misery with the Rams but giving no credit to the O line for Peyton Manning being sacked very little. That's like saying the QB is the hero when he does well but needs every excuse in the world when he doesn't. Let's no get carried away.

Even if Flacco needs to throw for 300 or more yards and 4 TDs to win a playoff game 41-38 or whatever, it's still not all on his shoulders. There's no way a QB or an offense for that matter does that well in a game without a solid performance out of the O line. And there's no way a QB or offense does that well without having receivers show up big.

It doesn't matter if Flacco is the MOST important part of the team. That's different from saying he is the team. I for one will not over criticize Flacco for our downfalls, but I won't over credit him for our triumphs.

[RavensAllTheWay]

Now that I think about it, I couldn't have had a better post to be my 1,000th.

[organizedchaos007]

[quote name='berad' timestamp='1283886340' post='468417']
What numbers are you looking at, man?

That the Ravens have been 20-12 under him? That's he led us to the playoffs twice and won 3 post-season games with him? How about his 20+ TDs last year - the most by a Ravens QB since Vinny Testaverde in '96? What do you make of his Ravens' record 63.1 completion percentage and 88.9 QB rating? Or that he improved in [i]every single[/i] facet of his game from his first year to his second?

And how would you feel if I said he did all those things in his first two years in the NFL? With a [i](formerly)[/i] lackluster receiving core and a young OL?

I'm sorry, but you've shown nothing to sway my and this team's confidence in Joe Flacco. He isn't perfect, few are, but he's improving and he's the best we have by far. Were you here for the Kyle Boller era? If not, look it up, then you'll understand how hard it is to get a good QB, like Flacco.
[/quote]

couldnt have said it any better.

[scrock]

[quote name='theFRANCHISE' timestamp='1283799911' post='467027']
I'd agree with you to an extent. Though most QBs take that next step in their third season, I think he has one more year before we begin to contemplate other options at QB. Four years seems to be a decent benchmark, as Flacco's rookie deal was for 5 years and there could always be major injuries to his supporting cast that could derail his progress in Year 3. If Flacco isn't the QB we need him to be after 4 years, then his contract year becomes an audition to either remain with the Ravens for a short-term extension, or find a home in a new city.
[/quote]

Flacco is the franchise QB, he's already thought of as one of the best young QBs in the league. NFL just had the Ravens as one of 5 teams that will lead the league in the new decade (2010s). It's because we have our QB in Joe. What does a guy have to do in his first two years? Flacco has set records already...nothing is good enough for some people.

[scrock]

You flacco haters amaze me, you guys must have some of the lowest football IQs ever, even lower than most women. This isn't even worth arguing over, luckily Harbaugh doesn't listen to absurd statements from "die hard ravens fans" to make his depth chart decisions. Joe Flacco will probably have a career year, set Ravens passing records, and who knows what else and it probably still won't be enough for some of you.

31 other teams don't win the SB every year...Peyton didnt win one until what his 8th year or something? Brady and Ben are the exception not the rule...what about dan marino? he never won a SB, was he a QB you would bench?

[SnOoPy]

[quote name='scrock' timestamp='1283892217' post='468495']
Flacco is the franchise QB, he's already thought of as one of the best young QBs in the league. NFL just had the Ravens as one of 5 teams that will lead the league in the new decade (2010s). It's because we have our QB in Joe. Jesus Christ! What does a guy have to do in his first two years? Flacco has set records already...nothing is good enough for some people.
[/quote]


Indeed..some people will never be satisfied.

[ravensdfan]

[quote name='scrock' timestamp='1283892836' post='468509']
You flacco haters amaze me, you guys must have some of the lowest football IQs ever, [b]even lower than most women[/b]. This isn't even worth arguing over, luckily Harbaugh doesn't listen to absurd statements from "die hard ravens fans" to make his depth chart decisions. Joe Flacco will probably have a career year, set Ravens passing records, and who knows what else and it probably still won't be enough for some of you.

31 other teams don't win the SB every year...Peyton didnt win one until what his 8th year or something? Brady and Ben are the exception not the rule...what about dan marino? he never won a SB, was he a QB you would bench?
[/quote]

Ahem.
<<<<< is a woman. Since you DID qualify your statement with "most" women though, it's all good. I agree with your sentiment here 100%! Some people just do not recognize a good thing when it kicks them in the rear.

[ooo sugahhh 52]

i dont understand how people expect a player out of DELAWARE to all of a sudden become peyton manning in only his 3rd year. is that fair? he's progressing fine, actually ahead of schedule if you ask me.

[JROCK275]

Look guys, I made the thread for a mature discussion with the flock, to share my opinion, and to get others as well. Just looking for nice, mature, sensable, clean discussions to engage in. We can have disagreements without starting "verbal wars" with one another.


(I know i'm not a mod, or a staff member... Just saying in general.)

[JEEPercreepermd]

I have a solution to the problem. Why don't we just get Chris Redman, Kyle Boller, Elvis Grbac,Eric Zeier, Stoney Case, Scott Mitchell,Anthony Wright, Tony Banks, or Jeff Blake in here. We'll let each one of them start a game or two this season and we will see how fast you start crying for Flacco. Get with it already. Flacco has done more in his first two seasons than most NFL quarterbacks.

The guy is the best quarterback that we have had here, and people won't get off of his back. It makes me sick

[AsianRice]

As the matter of fact, Flacco first 2 years stats are much better than Peyton Manning and Tom Brady of their first 2 years. He has improved tremendously. This year he will (cross finger) break out and be a probowl. Noone can fortell the outcome but one thing that everyone acknowledges Joe Flacco is one of the best rookie QB of all time statistically.

PS: Lets sit back and enjoy our season rollercoaster for championship and SB.

[ravenanchors]

Flacco will be a great quaterback in the near future because he has
Strength
Accuracy
Inteligence
Leadership
but,
he needs to develop his judgement and knowlege. I believe that is what the coaches have planned for him this year.
Over the past 2 years he had very limited support,
Heap - spent a lot of time blocking instead of receiving
Mason - the only reliable receiver on the team
Rice - the dump off man
Clayton - nice guy
D. Will - unreliable

Flacco had to throw to Rice, he was the only target he had open.
During the pre-season the coaches were trying to get Flacco used to throwing the ball to the receivers instead of dumping the ball off to rice. This was not Flacco's fault.
This year will be different with all of the additional weapons.

Also, it is more important to have a tall receiver with good hands like Heap, Pitta than it is to have a fast receiver. Heap will out-reach, out-jump and will win all contests where the ball is thrown just above his head.
The ravens will not miss Stallworth. He will be out 8 games, be rusty 2 games. That leaves 6 games he will actually be useful in. I hope he is not another injury prone receiver.

[theFRANCHISE]

[quote name='ooo sugahhh 52' timestamp='1283893895' post='468536']
i dont understand how people expect a player out of DELAWARE to all of a sudden become peyton manning in only his 3rd year. is that fair? he's progressing fine, actually ahead of schedule if you ask me.
[/quote]
...HEY, don't knock my school!

[JEEPercreepermd]

[quote name='theFRANCHISE' timestamp='1283903014' post='468681']
...HEY, don't knock my school!
[/quote]
I used to spend A LOT of evenings over on Cleveland Ave a few years ago...

[Purple Nurple]

[quote name='Reddawn36' timestamp='1283850649' post='468073']
idk man... for Reed that took skill
[/quote]

touche'. It was a half *** metaphor.

[Purple Nurple]

[quote name='JROCK275' timestamp='1283894191' post='468540']
Look guys, I made the thread for a mature discussion with the flock, to share my opinion, and to get others as well. Just looking for nice, mature, sensable, clean discussions to engage in. We can have disagreements without starting "verbal wars" with one another.


(I know i'm not a mod, or a staff member... Just saying in general.)
[/quote]


That'll learn ya.