Anyone Wish We Drafted Kyle Wilson?

[AlaskanRavensFan]

[quote name='Andrew Glass' timestamp='1281499587' post='448152']
I thought the trade was stupid from day 1, We could of drafted wilson, Got cody or a pass rushing(a ton were still on the board) and got one of the TE's. Terrible move.
[/quote]

Maybe you have forgotten, but last year ended with our offense only being able to score 3 points against the Colts. Even if we had Wilson or anyone else as our corners do you think we would have been able to hold the Colts to 3pts or less? I think that the FO realized that scoring more than 3 points against the elite teams would probably be very important for the 2010 season. So, they went and got some TE's a pro-bowl reciever AND managed to improve the defense for years to come since Gregg, Pryce, Lewis, Reed, have only year(s) left. Corners are only as good as the pass rush in front of them. No one I know thinks the Saints had a great stable of corners, but they got pressure up front and that allowed their entire secondary to jump routes and make plays on the ball.

When the Jets couldn't get pressure on Manning even Revis got exposed, so I think the desire for great corners, although valid, does not warrant saying that the trade was stupid.

[1/28/01]

[quote name='AlaskanRavensFan' timestamp='1281544333' post='448335']
Maybe you have forgotten, but last year ended with our offense only being able to score 3 points against the Colts. Even if we had Wilson or anyone else as our corners do you think we would have been able to hold the Colts to 3pts or less? I think that the FO realized that scoring more than 3 points against the elite teams would probably be very important for the 2010 season. So, they went and got some TE's a pro-bowl reciever AND managed to improve the defense for years to come since Gregg, Pryce, Lewis, Reed, have only year(s) left. Corners are only as good as the pass rush in front of them. No one I know thinks the Saints had a great stable of corners, but they got pressure up front and that allowed their entire secondary to jump routes and make plays on the ball.

When the Jets couldn't get pressure on Manning even Revis got exposed, so I think the desire for great corners, although valid, does not warrant saying that the trade was stupid.
[/quote]
Nicely said and I agree 100%!!

[ravensfan160]

[quote name='BloodRaven' timestamp='1281539188' post='448256']
If some of you think you know better than Ozzie, and that our picks were bad and that Kyle Wilson is guaranteed not to be a bust, then you should be held accountable for your words if you're wrong. I'm bringing this page back in 3 years.
[/quote]
Valid point and even I'm not sure what I'd do if we could go back. Thats why I didn't ask "anyone ELSE wish...". I just wanted to see what everyone else thought.

The big thing with me was Wilson was getting a lot of hype. So much so that there was talk the Browns might take him instead of Joe Haden.

[Milton145]

I know this is off topic, but do you think Ozzie would have traded back even if Dez Bryant fell to us?

[JohnJohnson]

[quote name='Milton145' timestamp='1281546476' post='448375']
I know this is off topic, but do you think Ozzie would have traded back even if Dez Bryant fell to us?
[/quote]

Yes, he said that Denver offered such a good deal that he probably would have traded back even if Dez fell. Knowing Ozzie, he might have squeezed a little more out of them...like an extra 6th round pick or something. They really wanted Tim Tebow...

[Bltravens]

Not a chance, even with Kindle breaking his face. We finally have a 2 TE set, I dont think people realize how huge thats going to be in 2 years when we have 2 TEs that cant be covered by LBs. If Kindle doesnt break his dome, we're not even talking about this, and we're talking about how gross our pass rush is.

[ravensfan160]

[quote name='Bltravens' timestamp='1281550051' post='448396']
Not a chance, even with Kindle breaking his face. We finally have a 2 TE set, I dont think people realize how huge thats going to be in 2 years when we have 2 TEs that cant be covered by LBs. If Kindle doesnt break his dome, we're not even talking about this, and we're talking about how gross our pass rush is.
[/quote]
True, but it wouldn't hurt if Kyle Wilson turns out to be a bust either.

[Ravens Lover]

It's to early for me to really say anything

[lowrider]

When we went into the draft, I saw our weaknesses to be TE, DL, pass rush, CB, in that order. We need those two tight ends. Need them. I don't trust Davon Drew to be our TE and Heap has had injury problems and is getting old.

Then DL was hurting from losing Edwards and Justin Bannan. Gregg is old, we needed Cody. And according to baltimoresun, he has been looking great.

Then pass rush was vital. We struggled to get to the qb. The reason why it wasn't more of priority is because we are banking on Suggs playing better, and Barnes is there. But Kindle fell to us and he could have really been an impact rookie.

Finally, cb. It was a weakness. We all knew it was. But with how Foxworth played, we were banking on Washington and Webb coming back and being solid. If all of them were solid, our defense is top three without a doubt in my mind.

How are we supposed to expect Foxworth blowing his knee out without being touched and Kindle falling down two flights of steps. We addressed the weaker positions first. Stuff happens. I don't regret anything, because injuries happen. But if anyone has a time machine we can go talk to Ozzie real quick because he is totally an idiot for not seeing those injuries happening...

[1/28/01]

[quote name='lowrider' timestamp='1281551904' post='448419']
When we went into the draft, I saw our weaknesses to be TE, DL, pass rush, CB, in that order. We need those two tight ends. Need them. I don't trust Davon Drew to be our TE and Heap has had injury problems and is getting old.

Then DL was hurting from losing Edwards and Justin Bannan. Gregg is old, we needed Cody. And according to baltimoresun, he has been looking great.

Then pass rush was vital. We struggled to get to the qb. The reason why it wasn't more of priority is because we are banking on Suggs playing better, and Barnes is there. But Kindle fell to us and he could have really been an impact rookie.

Finally, cb. It was a weakness. We all knew it was. But with how Foxworth played, we were banking on Washington and Webb coming back and being solid. If all of them were solid, our defense is top three without a doubt in my mind.

How are we supposed to expect Foxworth blowing his knee out without being touched and Kindle falling down two flights of steps. We addressed the weaker positions first. Stuff happens. I don't regret anything, because injuries happen. But if anyone has a time machine we can go talk to Ozzie real quick because he is totally an idiot for not seeing those injuries happening...
[/quote]
correctamundo!!!

[ClintLB8]

[quote name='justifythegame' timestamp='1281404343' post='447554']
Well to answer this question it really depends on how those 2 TEs turn out. But at this point yes i wish we had tried to get wilson. And this is from a guy didn't like wilson to begin with. But i thought sergio kindle was one of the most overrated players in the draft, people had him going in the top 20. i wasn't a big fan of the guy, but i guess you couldn't argue with a 2nd round pick.

But kindle's injury shouldn't play a huge role on this topic. the ravens don't play rookies unless they are forced to. we have more depth at a LB than any position, we are more likely to see kruger on the field than kindle even if he was healthy.
[/quote]


I definitely disagree with this... Sergio Kindle is a beast hands down. He has definitely top 20 talent. at 6-3 250 pounds with 4.6 speed, high motor, really good football intelligence. This guy was a 5 star prospect coming out of high school and showed it during his career at Texas. He has experience at both outside linebacker and defensive end which made him extremely valuable to teams that run the 3-4 because he isn't one of those guys who was d-end in college that has to transition into a linebacker role like some do. He was a super star on one of the best college football programs in the nation. The fact that we got him in the 2nd round was very lucky. It was unforunate about him falling down some stairs. I do understand that he has some baggage with him as far and not having the cleanest record but he was definitely top 20 talent. If it wouldn't have been for the injury concern he would have been a top 10-15 pick.

[berad]

I still remember when, last year, people were upset about the drafting of Michael Oher - saying we should have taken a WR, instead. How did that work out?

Or in 2008 when people questioned the selection of Joe Flacco. And didn't understand the pick of Ray Rice: we already had McGahee coming off a 1,200+ yard season, right?

There seems to be a trend.. Some people will always question, they'll always be short-sighted, but the Ravens front office and Ozzie Newsome know a hell of a lot more than we could ever pretend to..

[JohnJohnson]

[quote name='berad' timestamp='1281584102' post='448811']
I still remember when, last year, people were upset about the drafting of Michael Oher - saying we should have taken a WR, instead. How did that work out?

Or in 2008 when people questioned the selection of Joe Flacco. And didn't understand the pick of Ray Rice: we already had McGahee coming off a 1,200+ yard season, right?

There seems to be a trend.. Some people will always question, they'll always be short-sighted, but the Ravens front office and Ozzie Newsome know a hell of a lot more than we could ever pretend to..
[/quote]

Exactly. And in a year or two, we'll be running dangerous 2 TE sets with two talented pass catchers (and blockers, because they both have the motivation and competition to improve).

[1/28/01]

[quote name='berad' timestamp='1281584102' post='448811']
I still remember when, last year, people were upset about the drafting of Michael Oher - saying we should have taken a WR, instead. How did that work out?

Or in 2008 when people questioned the selection of Joe Flacco. And didn't understand the pick of Ray Rice: we already had McGahee coming off a 1,200+ yard season, right?

There seems to be a trend.. Some people will always question, they'll always be short-sighted, but the Ravens front office and Ozzie Newsome know a hell of a lot more than we could ever pretend to..
[/quote]
Nicely said...

Its always easy to question, but so hard to admit when you're wrong; as is the case on this board with so many!

[ed.s52]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1281542633' post='448319']
Yeah, that's a bit crazy. Let's trade two great POTENTIAL players for one great POTENTIAL player [/sarcasm]
[/quote]

So you wouldnt trade a 3rd and 4th round pair of TE's for a first round corner?

You basicly saying if you were a GM and you were going to trade the 29th pick in the 1st round, you would trade down for early 3rd and 4th round picks.

If for some reason you think thats smart, it certainly isn't smart enough to proclaim the alternative of having that 1st round pick is stupid.

[1/28/01]

[quote name='ed.s52' timestamp='1281585925' post='448827']
So you wouldnt trade a 3rd and 4th round pair of TE's for a first round corner?

You basicly saying if you were a GM and you were going to trade the 29th pick in the 1st round, you would trade down for early 3rd and 4th round picks.

If for some reason you think thats smart, it certainly isn't smart enough to proclaim the alternative of having that 1st round pick is stupid.
[/quote]
I guess I should have gone with bigger font when I typed POTENTIAL. Maybe someone else can pull up the site that lists the averge draft round of starters in the NFL and prove my point here. If we were talking about trading a 3rd and 4th for a true, proven #1 CB, then yes, I would in a heart beat, but we're not.

[ed.s52]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1281586633' post='448834']
I guess I should have gone with bigger font when I typed POTENTIAL. Maybe someone else can pull up the site that lists the averge draft round of starters in the NFL and prove my point here. If we were talking about trading a 3rd and 4th for a true, proven #1 CB, then yes, I would in a heart beat, but we're not.
[/quote]

I gurantee you there are more skilled players drafted in round one than in round 3. I realize Kyle Wilson has "Potential", but he obviously has more of it than Dickson or Pitta because Wilson was drafted 2 rounds before both of them.

Once again, a 3rd and 4th round prospects are USSUALLY not worth (or ussually not even close to worth) a 1st rounder.

And please don't bring me an arguement that there are plenty of good people in the league from the third round, because if you do than I could just name about 10x those names from the first round.

[1/28/01]

[quote name='ed.s52' timestamp='1281587395' post='448843']
I gurantee you there are more skilled players drafted in round one than in round 3. I realize Kyle Wilson has "Potential", but he obviously has more of it than Dickson or Pitta because Wilson was drafted 2 rounds before both of them.

Once again, a 3rd and 4th round prospects are USSUALLY not worth (or ussually not even close to worth) a 1st rounder.

And please don't bring me an arguement that there are plenty of good people in the league from the third round, because if you do than I could just name about 10x those names from the first round.
[/quote]
Difference of opinion here....love it. To me, Pitta and Dickson are (will be) more valuable to us than Wilson could have been. With two, we obviously have double the possibility to make one "stick". There are just as many 3rd and 4th rounders starting in the NFL right now as 1st rounders, just as there there as many 3rd and 4th round "busts" (although that late in the draft they're not labeled as a "bust", but you get what I'm saying) as there are 1st rounder "busts".

[ed.s52]

[quote name='1/28/01' timestamp='1281587874' post='448848']
Difference of opinion here....love it. To me, Pitta and Dickson are (will be) more valuable to us than Wilson could have been. With two, we obviously have double the possibility to make one "stick". There are just as many 3rd and 4th rounders starting in the NFL right now as 1st rounders, just as there there as many 3rd and 4th round "busts" (although that late in the draft they're not labeled as a "bust", but you get what I'm saying) as there are 1st rounder "busts".
[/quote]

I get what you mean, having two is like playing it safe, if one fails you still have another. I'm just saying that in general 1st rounders outperform 3rd rounders. Count the 1st round Pro-Bowlers, All-Pros, and HOF's compared to those from the 3rd round and obviously the 1st round has an advantage.

But like I said earlier, your opinion makes some sense, but not enough to discredit mine, and mine is certainly not crazy like you previously stated.

[1/28/01]

[quote name='ed.s52' timestamp='1281588290' post='448852']
I get what you mean, having two is like playing it safe, if one fails you still have another. I'm just saying that in general 1st rounders outperform 3rd rounders. Count the 1st round Pro-Bowlers, All-Pros, and HOF's compared to those from the 3rd round and obviously the 1st round has an advantage.

But like I said earlier, your opinion makes some sense, but not enough to discredit mine, and mine is certainly not crazy like you previously stated.
[/quote]
Given what we know and how Ozzie works (draft picks draft picks draft picks), its not plausible and not the norm in Baltimore. What you said and the generalities mentioned make sense and in a "normal" world a 3rd and 4th will always out weigh a 1st. But in this case, we already know what we're getting (or at least have seen a bit of what they're capable of) with Pitta and Dickson and I wouldn't give that up is what I was saying. We're both bringing valid points and now I'm going to bed, ha!

[BloodRaven]

[quote name='ed.s52' timestamp='1281588290' post='448852']
I get what you mean, having two is like playing it safe, if one fails you still have another. I'm just saying that in general 1st rounders outperform 3rd rounders. Count the 1st round Pro-Bowlers, All-Pros, and HOF's compared to those from the 3rd round and obviously the 1st round has an advantage.

But like I said earlier, your opinion makes some sense, but not enough to discredit mine, and mine is certainly not crazy like you previously stated.
[/quote]

To help paraphrase for Ozzies detractors, I think we all understand that opinion is divided and by all means valid, but thats all they are, opinions. The only thing we really have to project the future on is off is Ozzies track record, which really speaks for itself.

[JEEPercreepermd]

[quote name='ravensfan160' timestamp='1281381328' post='447260']
Rex's arrogance is starting to annoy me.
[/quote]
Rex's arrogance started annoying me back in 07, when the season was already down the tubes but the guy would just never shut up. So annoying.

[Integrity]

People are over valuing the corners available in this past draft because of the injuries we are having. I would not have spent the 25th pick on ANY corner in this year's draft, not even Joe Haden. This just wasn't a good year for corners. The majority of the top corners in this draft were short, slow, or worse... short AND slow. Ozzie wasn't going to reach for a corner again simply because we needed one, anyone remember DeRon Jenkins? Of course not. Chris Cook would have been a good pick in the late second or third, but he went before our first pick.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Integrity' timestamp='1281625668' post='449006']
People are over valuing the corners available in this past draft because of the injuries we are having. I would not have spent the 25th pick on ANY corner in this year's draft, not even Joe Haden. This just wasn't a good year for corners. The majority of the top corners in this draft were short, slow, or worse... short AND slow. Ozzie wasn't going to reach for a corner again simply because we needed one, anyone remember DeRon Jenkins? Of course not. [b] Chris Cook would have been a good pick in the late second or third, but he went before our first pick.[/b]
[/quote]

Ozzie and co. reportedly wanted him and attempted to trade up the Rams wanted too much for their second round pick.