Jackson And McNeil: What Happens Now?

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

[url="http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5292257"]Article Here[/url]

In case you don't know both Jackson and McNeil of the SD Chargers have refused to sign their tenders. Losing both your starting Pro Bowl LT and you #1 beast of a WR who has led the league 2 season in a row in yards per catch is quite a blow. Not only have they lost two great players (talent wise), but this will also greatly affect Rivers ability to throw the ball.

Both are hands down great players, maybe even elite, but does this constitute having personality issues? Yes it kills their team and causes problems for the organization, and it's all over money. But these are two great players who, at least in their own opinions, are being far underpaid. They are also looking for extensions. I understand 2011 is unsure, so teams are hesitant to resign players for long extensions, but these 2 guys are faces of that franchise and huge reasons for their success. This is becoming a trend among players, but some of the deals are getting done, and I feel there has to be a way to work around the 2011 scare; like by putting in a stipulation that the player only gets paid if they play the season. Seems like the players are all taking the bad rap, but the front offices are just as much to blame. I'd be happy to know that both these guys want to be with the organization (and get paid) for a long time.

Regardless, what happens to them now. I know they can hold out until week 10 and then play to get the credit for the season, but will SD really want to keep these guys around with all the drama that surrounds them now? Will the fans ever forgive them if they sit out? I am happy because they are a top AFC contender and in our way to the title. Definitely good for us!

What if they want to trade either of these guys, or straight up let them go? I personally would love to acquire Jackson. He's 27, a huge and fast target, a serious deep threat, and getting better. Like I said earlier I don't count this as him having behavior or attitude issues. If we could trade a future 1st round, I'd do it to lock up a top WR for 4 years or so. Him and Boldin with Flacco, Rice, our O-line and the young TE's for years to come??? Forget about it!

Before you "vets" jump all over me, let me say this: I don't know if this can even happen, or if they did look to trade him that we would even be looking. I am just saying that if he was put on the block and given a 1st rounder as compensation I'm jumping on that, locking him up for 4 years for 28 million, 16 gaurenteed and 10 or 12 mill the 1st year.

What do you all think about the whole situation, not just the whole acquiring part? I know SD still retains their rights, but does anybody know what the options are? Could these guys become available? What do you think about San Diego's chances with them gone? Will they reach an agreement even though the GM said "we lost 2 great players today..."?

[ed.s52]

I dont really see that happening for SOOO many reasons.

1)Both V-Jax and the Bolt's FO know that he will probably drain money out of them and eventually resign, especially considering if they lose both of these players they are screwed unless they can find great replacements (Jared Gaither?)

2)Where would Mason work? I dont want to ditch Mason for V-Jax unless we get one hell of a deal for him.

3)The Bolts have a chance for the Lombardi trophy this season, do they really want to mess that up.

4)We already have so many weapons I can guarantee you that a team without a great reciever would give them a better offer ie the Browns, KC, Seahawks, Rams, Redskins, etc.

[BuckWilds]

[quote name='BOLDnPurPnBlacK' date='20 June 2010 - 03:33 AM' timestamp='1277019194' post='423879']
[url="http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5292257"]Article Here[/url]

Before you "vets" jump all over me...

[/quote]

Why be negative with 'you vets' and assuming all the vets would jump all over you? Advertising so much, that 'you vets' are hostile, will probably get people to jump all over you. Just some friendly advice.

Beyond that, it's something interesting to take a look at. I'm sure Ozzie is taking a look at that talent and seeing if it fits into the Matrix. Thanks for the article link!

[Ed_Reed_Pick_Six]

[quote name='Zhamtao' date='20 June 2010 - 09:04 PM' timestamp='1277021069' post='423885']
[b]Why be negative with 'you vets'[/b] and assuming all the vets would jump all over you? Advertising so much, that 'you vets' are hostile, will probably get people to jump all over you. Just some friendly advice.

Beyond that, it's something interesting to take a look at. I'm sure Ozzie is taking a look at that talent and seeing if it fits into the Matrix. Thanks for the article link!


[/quote]
Don't think he meant it in that way.

Imagine Jackson deep down field on the other end of Flacco bombs!

[ed.s52]

[quote name='Ed_Reed_Pick_Six' date='20 June 2010 - 12:13 AM' timestamp='1277021588' post='423888']
Don't think he meant it in that way.

Imagine Jackson deep down field on the other end of Flacco bombs!
[/quote]

Or, better yet, Bouldin on the end of those bombs... and yes I said Bouldin.

[Ed_Reed_Pick_Six]

[quote name='ed.s52' date='20 June 2010 - 09:17 PM' timestamp='1277021840' post='423892']
Or, better yet, Bouldin on the end of those bombs... and yes I said Bouldin.
[/quote]
Boldin isn't a 'beat-you-deep' receiver.

Stop saying Bouldin!

[Purple Punishment]

I dont want SD falling apart! They are very good at beating the Colts and Pats in the playoffs. Maybe they knock off Indy this year and we beat em in the AFCCG

[Rav'n Maniac]

Good article! Thanks for the link!

The thing that surprises me most is that their F.O. announced reducing their salaries to veteran minimums. Talk about a huge slap in the face. It sounds like the team is distancing themselves away from the players and closing the door.

I think this is a big mistake on the part of the Chargers! Although, I agree that no one player should be allowed to place himself above the team but, this seems too drastic. They can send a message without risking alienating other players. How do you think Rivers is feeling right now!

Man, I would love to see what their fan base is saying about this. I'm sure they are ripping the team up about this one.

[Clutch Ravens]

Give your Franchise Quarterback a $92 Million contract then take away his Number 1 Receiver and his blindside protection. Sheer, unadulterated genius on the part of the Chargers front office.

[BloodRaven]

Lol, everyone knew this was coming. They had great drafts and for a while there were the NFL's paper champs, but now the window of opportunity is closing and they are about to lose two key cogs in their offensive machine.

[PuRock]

[quote name='BOLDnPurPnBlacK' date='20 June 2010 - 03:33 AM' timestamp='1277019194' post='423879']
[url="http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5292257"]Article Here[/url]
Before you "vets" jump all over me, let me say this: I don't know if this can even happen, or if they did look to trade him that we would even be looking. I am just saying that if he was put on the block and given a 1st rounder as compensation I'm jumping on that, locking him up for 4 years for 28 million, 16 gaurenteed and 10 or 12 mill the 1st year.
[/quote]

As a "vet" I need to applaud you for posting this in the right section. You'd get killed if you went into the general discussion and posted we should trade for V-Jax. And you could get killed even more for suggesting we give them Troy Smith or McGahee.

I wouldn't mind having V-Jax. I doubt we could get Jackson at the same pay rate we got Boldin. We got a steal out of Boldin. The new going rate for stud wide receivers is around 10 million per year. V-Jax is three years younger than Boldin and can probably command more money.

So its a question of how much do we want to invest in our wide receivers when we have other areas of contract concerns (such as OL).

I'm still holding out for drafting a young WR. I really want a home grown product at WR.

[BuckWilds]

[quote name='PuRock' date='20 June 2010 - 10:31 AM' timestamp='1277044287' post='423997']
As a "vet" I need to applaud you for posting this in the right section. You'd get killed if you went into the general discussion and posted we should trade for V-Jax. And you could get killed even more for suggesting we give them Troy Smith or McGahee.

I wouldn't mind having V-Jax. I doubt we could get Jackson at the same pay rate we got Boldin. We got a steal out of Boldin. The new going rate for stud wide receivers is around 10 million per year. V-Jax is three years younger than Boldin and can probably command more money.

So its a question of how much do we want to invest in our wide receivers when we have other areas of contract concerns (such as OL).

I'm still holding out for drafting a young WR. I really want a home grown product at WR.
[/quote]

The thread was actually in general... one of the mods was nice enough to move it.

I really want to hold out for a draft-based WR as well - I want one that can grow with the "O". It needs to happen soon though, because it won't be long before Joe and Ray are 27 and growing with the "O" will actually be picking up someone on the second half of their 20's.

[Wacko4Zacko]

well I guess Im not drafting rivers for my fantasy team.

[PuRock]

[quote name='Zhamtao' date='20 June 2010 - 10:56 AM' timestamp='1277045803' post='424007']
The thread was actually in general... one of the mods was nice enough to move it.

I really want to hold out for a draft-based WR as well - I want one that can grow with the "O". It needs to happen soon though, because it won't be long before Joe and Ray are 27 and growing with the "O" will actually be picking up someone on the second half of their 20's.
[/quote]

Oh then I take back what I said.

[darklight1216]

[quote name='BloodRaven' date='20 June 2010 - 09:28 AM' timestamp='1277040488' post='423970']
Lol, everyone knew this was coming. They had great drafts and for a while there were the NFL's paper champs, but now the window of opportunity is closing and they are about to lose two key cogs in their offensive machine.
[/quote]
I remember analysts talking last year about how the window was closing for San Diego. I don't know if it will impact them very much this year though. That division can and has been won by an 8-8 team, so they can make the playoffs as long as they stay ahead of some of the league's worst teams.

San Diego will probably figure something out. Having VJ would be cool, but it's just wishful thinking.

[JO_75]

[quote name='ed.s52' date='20 June 2010 - 03:51 AM' timestamp='1277020289' post='423881']
I dont really see that happening for SOOO many reasons.

1)Both V-Jax and the Bolt's FO know that he will probably drain money out of them and eventually resign, especially considering if they lose both of these players they are screwed unless they can find great replacements (Jared Gaither?)

2)Where would Mason work? I dont want to ditch Mason for V-Jax unless we get one hell of a deal for him.

3)The Bolts have a chance for the Lombardi trophy this season, do they really want to mess that up.

4)We already have so many weapons I can guarantee you that a team without a great reciever would give them a better offer ie the Browns, KC, Seahawks, Rams, Redskins, etc.
[/quote]

No way we would go for him.Plus V-Jax would require a team giving up a 1st round pick and we got a steal for Boldin. Yeah The Chargers have a good chance at the Super Bowl and not having V-Jax or McNeil would hurt the Chargers.

Yep I expect if the Chargers do trade VJ it will be to a team who needs a receiver, and If I were the Rams I would be really considering trading for VJ. VJ can be a huge help to help Bradford long term wise and AJ Feely in the short run. Granted like I said it would take a 1st round pick and the Rams most likely will be picking in the top 5 or 10 again next year, where they can get a Julio Jones or an AJ Green or they could focus on their defense but I would give it up for VJ and I'm sure the Chargers would love to take Jones or Green with the pick they got for VJ.

[RavensAllTheWay]

You know whats funny? I had no idea this forum even existed until just now

But anyway, yeah we need to start developing the rest of our WR depth chart. And Jackson apparently wants a lot of money, so would it really make sense to spend even more #1 WR money on a position that we have legitimate starting talent in already? Same exact situation for McNeil.

[Moderator 3]

If you click on "View New Content" at the top of your page, you'll see all of the threads (in all of the forums) with posts since you last visited. Just be sure to click "Mark all items as read" before you leave.

[hawkprey]

Can we stop with this "should we get this guy?" every time some other team makes a move? T.O., Haynesworth, Vincent Jackson... I don't want any of these players. Let's just face the facts that we can't have every great player in the league.

[PuRock]

[quote name='hawkprey' date='20 June 2010 - 08:09 PM' timestamp='1277078949' post='424135']
Can we stop with this "should we get this guy?" every time some other team makes a move? T.O., Haynesworth, Vincent Jackson... I don't want any of these players. Let's just face the facts that we can't have every great player in the league.
[/quote]

Get use to it, because it will never go away. Ever since the beginning of time (or when this forum was created) posters always want to go after the flavor of the week.

But for all the times I shot down threads about trading for Anquan Boldin, it actually came true for once. So who knows?

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

[quote name='Zhamtao' date='20 June 2010 - 03:04 AM' timestamp='1277021069' post='423885']
Why be negative with 'you vets' and assuming all the vets would jump all over you? Advertising so much, that 'you vets' are hostile, will probably get people to jump all over you. Just some friendly advice.

Beyond that, it's something interesting to take a look at. I'm sure Ozzie is taking a look at that talent and seeing if it fits into the Matrix. Thanks for the article link!


[/quote]


It was meant more jokingly than anything... I've seen many a poster be ripped to shreads by some of the more veteran members of the boards for suggesting we trade or acquire another WR, and just wanted to clear up that this thread was more directed toward the state of the Charger's franchise bc of this situation and how it affects our run to the postseason.

I would hope that anyone whose read my posts would know that it wasn't meant as disrespect. I think you've added a connotation of sarcasm because of the quotation marks around the word "vets" that was not intended. The quotes were used simply because I was quoting the title that had been given to a certain group of posters in the past. Either way, I think it would be a bit overly sensative to assume any sort of disrespect by my comments, but thanks for the heads up.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

[quote name='hawkprey' date='20 June 2010 - 07:09 PM' timestamp='1277078949' post='424135']
Can we stop with this "should we get this guy?" every time some other team makes a move? T.O., Haynesworth, Vincent Jackson... I don't want any of these players. Let's just face the facts that we can't have every great player in the league.
[/quote]


If you read the original post, this thread was more intended for discussing the state of the Charger's team without these guys, what you think will happen as far as giving them new contracts, will they hold out, will SD trade or release them?

Of course it gets a mention of "should we go after VJ?" Or any high profile player for that matter. It's June, there's not much else to talk about, unless we want more threads about who looked good running around the field without pads on. Yes OTA's tell us something, and they are insightful, but I just cannot do it for 3 months straight.

Besides we are the fantasy football generation... it may not be a realistic discussion. None of us are in the front office so whether we talk about whether we should get Ken Lucas or VJ, nothing we say really holds any weight. These things are hypotheticals, if you are Ozzie and a player like VJ who has a history with your OC is available, at what price do you consider it if at all? You clearly wouldn't consider it and you provided your opinion. It's an appreciated opinion, but no more and no less than anyone elses. If there is someone who would take a shot then that's their opinion.

One may be more likely than the other, but neither is better. This stuff is supposed to be fun, and bold moves are fun. Doesn't mean they are correct or good for a team but its fun to talk about. If you don't like a certain type of thread, ie ones about acquiring players we dont need, then dont enter and post. Leave it for the people who enjoy it. I don't like baseball, so I don't go to games. If I went to games and just sat there the whole time yelling "this game is so STUPID, its BORING" that would be ridiculous. I should just stay home... Same applies here; I am not saying you're wrong about not liking it, you are entitled to that.. but then why come in and put down the people who do enjoy it?

And I would like to point out as one person stated, if Boldin's name came up last year, there would have been a ton of people saying NO WAY it will happen. But it did. People say no way, because star players are hard to acquire and dont move around as much. But sometimes they do, and it's fun to speculate. It's fun, and thats all.

[JO_75]

Could Seattle have interest? http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/06/21/seahawks-could-have-interest-in-vincent-jackson/


[quote]NFL Network's Total Access program broached the topic Monday night. Reporter Jason La Canfora had the following to say:

"If the Chargers came to a point where they were trying to trade Vincent Jackson," said La Canfora, "I would expect the Seahawks to be quite active in trying to acquire him."

As noted by La Canfora, the Seahawks were heavily involved in bidding for former Broncos receiver Brandon Marshall prior to the draft. Seattle's interest in Marshall not only indicates that the team might be willing to part with the compensation necessary to acquire a top-shelf young player, it shows that Pete Carroll's team has identified wide receiver as a weakness.

In order to acquire Jackson, the Seahawks would likely need to fork over something similar to what the Fins paid for Marshall -- two second-round picks. Seattle would presumably also want to extend Jackson's contract long term, as he is under control only through the 2010 season.


We should make it clear that La Canfora's story does not cite sources, and is hardly a concrete report. It's speculation, but informed and reasonable. If the Chargers do put Jackson on the trade block -- which would entail notoriously stubborn G.M. A.J. Smith "giving in" to some degree -- Seahawks G.M. John Schneider should be among the first people Smith calls.[/quote]

Well that would be interesting. Hasselback to Jackson..... TOUCHDOWN! and in a year or two.... (Insert Rookie or 2nd Year QB Here) to Jackson..... TOUCHDOWN!

[BloodRaven]

Question: What are VJack's weaknesses?

[darklight1216]

[quote name='BloodRaven' date='22 June 2010 - 05:40 AM' timestamp='1277199616' post='424669']
Question: What are VJack's weaknesses?
[/quote]
Drinking and driving?

[JO_75]

It seemed that the Chargers had 1 team calling for VJ's availability but they said "No Thanks."

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/06/22/chargers-said-no-thanks-to-vincent-jackson-trade-inquiry/

[quote]Kevin Acee of the San Diego Union-Tribune reports via Twitter that, in response to a call from at least one team regarding Jackson, the Chargers said, "No thanks."

If the Chargers are willing to squeeze Jackson by reducing his tender offer and then telling the media that Jackson and left tackle Marcus McNeill have been "lost," they should be willing to trade either or both of them.[/quote]

It would be interesting on who the team was but at least we know the Chargers are smarter than Broncos when it comes to trading away star players... the Chargers knew how and when to say no.

[hawkprey]

[quote name='BOLDnPurPnBlacK' date='21 June 2010 - 02:34 PM' timestamp='1277148879' post='424370']
If you read the original post, this thread was more intended for discussing the state of the Charger's team without these guys, what you think will happen as far as giving them new contracts, will they hold out, will SD trade or release them?

Of course it gets a mention of "should we go after VJ?" Or any high profile player for that matter. It's June, there's not much else to talk about, unless we want more threads about who looked good running around the field without pads on. Yes OTA's tell us something, and they are insightful, but I just cannot do it for 3 months straight.

Besides we are the fantasy football generation... it may not be a realistic discussion. None of us are in the front office so whether we talk about whether we should get Ken Lucas or VJ, nothing we say really holds any weight. These things are hypotheticals, if you are Ozzie and a player like VJ who has a history with your OC is available, at what price do you consider it if at all? You clearly wouldn't consider it and you provided your opinion. It's an appreciated opinion, but no more and no less than anyone elses. If there is someone who would take a shot then that's their opinion.

One may be more likely than the other, but neither is better. This stuff is supposed to be fun, and bold moves are fun. Doesn't mean they are correct or good for a team but its fun to talk about. If you don't like a certain type of thread, ie ones about acquiring players we dont need, then dont enter and post. Leave it for the people who enjoy it. I don't like baseball, so I don't go to games. If I went to games and just sat there the whole time yelling "this game is so STUPID, its BORING" that would be ridiculous. I should just stay home... Same applies here; I am not saying you're wrong about not liking it, you are entitled to that.. but then why come in and put down the people who do enjoy it?
And I would like to point out as one person stated, if Boldin's name came up last year, there would have been a ton of people saying NO WAY it will happen. But it did. People say no way, because star players are hard to acquire and dont move around as much. But sometimes they do, and it's fun to speculate. It's fun, and thats all.
[/quote]

I don't mind talking about the players, or the speculation of what will happen to them, I just don't want them. We have a team that's superbowl-ready, and we've seen what having too many big names does to a team. I live in NY, if I wanted a madden team I'd root for the Jets.

By the way, I predict both these players somehow find their way to the Jets.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='hawkprey' date='23 June 2010 - 12:14 PM' timestamp='1277309692' post='425066']
I don't mind talking about the players, or the speculation of what will happen to them, I just don't want them. We have a team that's superbowl-ready, and we've seen what having too many big names does to a team. I live in NY, if I wanted a madden team I'd root for the Jets.

By the way, [b]I predict both these players somehow find their way to the Jets.[/b]
[/quote]

Don't see it happening. The Jets have to worry about holding on to their their top talent before thinking about signing talents like McNeil and V-Jax.

[BuckWilds]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' date='23 June 2010 - 12:33 PM' timestamp='1277310784' post='425075']
Don't see it happening. The Jets have to worry about holding on to their their top talent before thinking about signing talents like McNeil and V-Jax.
[/quote]

True. There's only so much even the Jets can gorge themselves on new acquisitions.

[hawkprey]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' date='23 June 2010 - 11:33 AM' timestamp='1277310784' post='425075']
Don't see it happening. The Jets have to worry about holding on to their their top talent before thinking about signing talents like McNeil and V-Jax.
[/quote]

Don't worry, I was kidding. Honestly I see both of them staying but costing San Diego a lot.