To Heck With Character......

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='theFRANCHISE' date='09 December 2009 - 05:34 PM' timestamp='1260394444' post='308330']
There were no flags thrown into the stands, helmets thrown on the ground, and general whining and complaining that made the players look like children.
[/quote]

Yea that happend because we got shafted by bellacheat and those pay off patriots that game should have been ours and we got screwed i would heave smashed my helmet off the ground to

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Ravens_Fan13' date='09 December 2009 - 04:30 PM' timestamp='1260394233' post='308323']
Lets see barnes was getting through more then anyone on our D and getting holding calls monday night and D-WILL had 2 massive PI calls on him...thats because he was constantly beating his man....and these guys are bench warmers??? something dosent make sense here?
[/quote]

I do believe both players should've been seeing time but look at who's ahead of them. Williams had a golden opportunity to become the slot receiver coming into the year and got outplayed by Washington in pre-season. He doesn't play special teams either so there wasn't much of a reason to activate him.

As for Barnes, there a tons of bodies at the LB position. He can't play inside and both Jameel McClain and Prescott Brugess are better special teams players.

On top of that, none of us know how either practiced.

[quote name='Purple Punishment' date='09 December 2009 - 04:30 PM' timestamp='1260394248' post='308325']
Theres definitely an argument here because ummm look at Ladarius Webb. He has worked his rear end off all season to get on the 1st team and it took 11 weeks to see that he can do better than Carr or Walker? Yeah he didnt do anything to deserve an opportunity until week 10 i guess
[/quote]

I'm not talking about a player like Webb. The fact that is so long for the coaches to put him ahead of Carr and Walker annoyed me greatly. The Colts have field two rookie corners as their starters this season so experience isn't an excuse.

[Purple Punishment]

Ohhh another not on the Packers game....A ref ran out of flags to throw so he threw his freaking HAT on Mason. what the heck man that is so unprofessional. This is the type of guys chosen to call games?

[theFRANCHISE]

On a broader note, the biggest reason why character has been emphasized is because of the league's focus on discipline; why have a guy on the field who won't even be on the field for long if he gets suspended? Relating it even more to football, why have a guy in the locker room who won't want to be there if there's adversity? Losses are a natural part of the NFL cycle, just as wins are. You don't want a guy who handles losing by immediately shutting himself off, you want a guy who handles losing the same way he handles winning.

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='Purple Punishment' date='09 December 2009 - 05:36 PM' timestamp='1260394602' post='308337']
Ohhh another not on the Packers game....A ref ran out of flags to throw so he threw his freaking HAT on Mason. what the heck man that is so unprofessional. This is the type of guys chosen to call games?
[/quote]

Exactly and dude i dont blame mason hes probly sick to death of getting rip off refs like that crew on monday night

[Purple Punishment]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' date='09 December 2009 - 04:36 PM' timestamp='1260394580' post='308336']
I do believe both players should've been seeing time but look at who's ahead of them. Williams had a golden opportunity to become the slot receiver coming into the year and got outplayed by Washington in pre-season. He doesn't play special teams either so there wasn't much of a reason to activate him.

As for Barnes, there a tons of bodies at the LB position. He can't play inside and both Jameel McClain and Prescott Brugess are better special teams players.

On top of that, none of us know how either practiced.



I'm not talking about a player like Webb. The fact that is so long for the coaches to put him ahead of Carr and Walker annoyed me greatly. The Colts have field two rookie corners as their starters this season so experience isn't an excuse.
[/quote]

One thing is that Harbs wasnt giving up the #1 and 2 spots to anyone different than Mason and Clayton this year. D Will is not suited to be a slot guy. He is a man thats supposed to stretch the field. Finished there.

Just because a player doesnt practice well doesnt mean that they cant show up big time in a real game as we saw on Monday

[Jamal]

We were a lot worst in 2007, and look what happen the following year. Just because we aren't playing good football this year doesn't mean this is the end of smash mouth football for us. We are a couple of players away from being the top 3 in the AFC.

As long as we don't abandon the defense completely in the off-season, we will easily go back to our hard hitting ways.

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='Purple Punishment' date='09 December 2009 - 05:40 PM' timestamp='1260394831' post='308346']
One thing is that Harbs wasnt giving up the #1 and 2 spots to anyone different than Mason and Clayton this year. D Will is not suited to be a slot guy. He is a man thats supposed to stretch the field. Finished there.

Just because a player doesnt practice well doesnt mean that they cant show up big time in a real game as we saw on Monday
[/quote]

As little as he has been put out there to actually play reciever and not to block he came up huge for us hats of to him and i hope clayton is out sunday so everyone can see how good D-Will is mason,Was,D-will thats what it should have been all along

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='Jamal' date='09 December 2009 - 05:42 PM' timestamp='1260394941' post='308349']
We were a lot worst in 2007, and look what happen the following year. Just because we aren't playing good football this year doesn't mean this is the end of smash mouth football for us. We are a couple of players away from being the top 3 in the AFC.

As long as we don't abandon the defense completely in the off-season, we will easily go back to our hard hitting ways.
[/quote]

Yea that was my feelings to until you think about how much holes me need to get filled we need i just dont see it happening in the off season to be honest i dont see much getting fixed harbs thinks walker is a good player? so he prob. thinks foxworth is a pro bowler

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Purple Punishment' date='09 December 2009 - 04:40 PM' timestamp='1260394831' post='308346']
One thing is that Harbs wasnt giving up the #1 and 2 spots to anyone different than Mason and Clayton this year. D Will is not suited to be a slot guy. He is a man thats supposed to stretch the field. Finished there.

Just because a player doesnt practice well doesnt mean that they cant show up big time in a real game as we saw on Monday
[/quote]

But you failed to address the fact that Washington came in and took Williams' job. That's the main reason Williams isn't playing.

Why should a coach give a an opportunity to a player who doesn't practice well? I doubt coaches like Andy Reid and Belichick do that.

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' date='09 December 2009 - 05:48 PM' timestamp='1260395297' post='308360']
But you failed to address the fact that Washington came in and took Williams' job. That's the main reason Williams isn't playing.

Why should a coach give a an opportunity to a player who doesn't practice well? I doubt coaches like Andy Reid and Belichick do that.
[/quote]

I think theres more to it then that....What facts do you have to backup d-will doesnt practice well besides things you read

[flynismo]

[quote name='Ravens_Fan13' date='09 December 2009 - 04:06 PM' timestamp='1260392809' post='308295']
Did billick care about character? the answer is no we get all this B.S. crap we allowed three 100 yard rushers this year and this is acceptible to you? i dont like the state of this team under harbaugh right now
[/quote]

Umm, right, because Billick was such a great coach? No one in the locker room had an ounce of respect for him. The inmates ran the asylum when he was here. I never want that again. What I do want however is some of our fire and passion back.

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='flynismo' date='09 December 2009 - 05:56 PM' timestamp='1260395777' post='308384']
Umm, right, because Billick was such a great coach? No one in the locker room had an ounce of respect for him. The inmates ran the asylum when he was here. I never want that again. What I do want however is some of our fire and passion back.
[/quote]

Yea ill take that to hell right now id take anything back that we use to have.

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Ravens_Fan13' date='09 December 2009 - 04:50 PM' timestamp='1260395407' post='308361']
I think theres more to it then that....What facts do you have to backup d-will doesnt practice well besides things you read
[/quote]

I don't have the facts but I don't go around claiming players aren't playing simply because of fallouts with the coaches.

However, I try to look at the situation rationally. In Williams' case, there are two reasons he isn't seeing much playing time. One, the player's ahead of him have outplayed him. That definitely happened in pre-season. He doesn't practice well.

People make it sound like coaches single out players they don't like and bench them. What coach would do that? A player gets benched for legitimate reasons.

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' date='09 December 2009 - 06:05 PM' timestamp='1260396356' post='308398']
I don't have the facts but I don't go around claiming players aren't playing simply because of fallouts with the coaches.

However, I try to look at the situation rationally. In Williams' case, there are two reasons he isn't seeing much playing time. One, the player's ahead of him have outplayed him. That definitely happened in pre-season. He doesn't practice well.

People make it sound like coaches single out players they don't like and bench them. What coach would do that? A player gets benched for legitimate reasons.
[/quote]

Yea i dont have facts either im simply talking about what i have read to so there you go......

[theFRANCHISE]

[quote name='flynismo' date='09 December 2009 - 04:56 PM' timestamp='1260395777' post='308384']
Umm, right, because Billick was such a great coach? No one in the locker room had an ounce of respect for him. The inmates ran the asylum when he was here. I never want that again. What I do want however is some of our fire and passion back.
[/quote]
Billick wasn't a bad coach, he just allowed his ego to get the best of him.

Harbaugh isn't down the same path yet, but needs to be careful. I don't see Harbaugh doing the same, though, as he doesn't have quite the length on his leash that Billick had, given owner Steve Bisciotti's investment in the team. Harbaugh was Bisciotti's hire (Billick was Modell's), so Harbaugh's success is directly tied to Bisciotti's success. And seeing as how Bisciotti was able to fire one of his good friends in Billick, that shows that he understands what's at stake and can make a tough decision when necessary. Given that Bisciotti is a self-made billionaire and a successful businessman, he knows how to separate personal feelings from business. I trust the owner to exercise his power if necessary.

[RavensAllTheWay]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' date='09 December 2009 - 05:01 PM' timestamp='1260392494' post='308290']
What's point of this topic? I want a team that doesn't commit foolish penalties in key moments in the game and is competitive year in and year out.

To say, "...to hell with character!" is just a cry of frustration that doesn't achieve anything.
[/quote]
Well yeah I think character is overrated in the nfl for sure. But you're right about dumb penalties, and a CONSISTENTLY competitive team. I also don't want a choke artist team that plays its worst when it must play its best.

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='theFRANCHISE' date='09 December 2009 - 06:09 PM' timestamp='1260396547' post='308404']
Billick wasn't a bad coach, he just allowed his ego to get the best of him.

Harbaugh isn't down the same path yet, but needs to be careful. I don't see Harbaugh doing the same, though, as he doesn't have quite the length on his leash that Billick had, given owner Steve Bisciotti's investment in the team. Harbaugh was Bisciotti's hire (Billick was Modell's), so Harbaugh's success is directly tied to Bisciotti's success. And seeing as how Bisciotti was able to fire one of his good friends in Billick, that shows that he understands what's at stake and can make a tough decision when necessary. Given that Bisciotti is a self-made billionaire and a successful businessman, he knows how to separate personal feelings from business. I trust the owner to exercise his power if necessary.
[/quote]

Good post man

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='RavensAllTheWay' date='09 December 2009 - 06:11 PM' timestamp='1260396660' post='308406']
Well yeah I think character is overrated in the nfl for sure. But you're right about dumb penalties, and a CONSISTENTLY competitive team. I also don't want a choke artist team that plays its worst when it must play its best.
[/quote]

Thats whats happening now how many huge must win games have we needed to win and lost this season all of them!

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Ravens_Fan13' date='09 December 2009 - 05:07 PM' timestamp='1260396463' post='308401']
Yea i dont have facts either im simply talking about what i have read to so there you go......
[/quote]

What exactly have you read?

[RavensAllTheWay]

The Ravens are still one of the most hated teams in the league. And honestly, I don't give a crap

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' date='09 December 2009 - 06:12 PM' timestamp='1260396778' post='308411']
What exactly have you read?
[/quote]

I have read and also heard on espn that coach harbaugh has a so called Dog House when players go in they dont get back out you watch D-Will wont be back next year neither will barnes.

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='RavensAllTheWay' date='09 December 2009 - 06:12 PM' timestamp='1260396778' post='308412']
The Ravens are still one of the most hated teams in the league. And honestly, I don't give a crap
[/quote]

Yea i think we should be...we just arent backing it up this season

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Ravens_Fan13' date='09 December 2009 - 05:16 PM' timestamp='1260396960' post='308414']
I have read and also heard on espn that coach harbaugh has a so called Dog House when players go in they dont get back out you watch D-Will wont be back next year neither will barnes.
[/quote]

But have you stopped to give thought as to why players are put in the "dog house"?

[Ravens_Fan13]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' date='09 December 2009 - 06:19 PM' timestamp='1260397159' post='308420']
But have you stopped to give thought as to why players are put in the "dog house"?
[/quote]

I dont care why they are there my point is they shouldent be there its stupid to not play the better man because of a personal grudge on someone... Its childish

[Purple Punishment]

[quote name='Ed_Reed20' date='09 December 2009 - 04:48 PM' timestamp='1260395297' post='308360']
But you failed to address the fact that Washington came in and took Williams' job. That's the main reason Williams isn't playing.

Why should a coach give a an opportunity to a player who doesn't practice well? I doubt coaches like Andy Reid and Belichick do that.
[/quote]

Heres my acknowledgement

Tom Brady > Drew Bledsoe

[Ed_Reed20]

[quote name='Ravens_Fan13' date='09 December 2009 - 05:23 PM' timestamp='1260397406' post='308425']
I dont care why they are there my point is they shouldent be there its stupid to not play the better man because of a personal grudge on someone... Its childish
[/quote]

There you go again!! What personal grudge does Harbaugh have? Give me one example!

And who exactly are Williams and Barnes better than? Williams definitely isn't better than either Mason or Washington and the only reason you think he's better than Clayton is because Clayton hasn't produced.

[quote name='Purple Punishment' date='09 December 2009 - 05:24 PM' timestamp='1260397474' post='308427']
Heres my acknowledgement

Tom Brady > Drew Bledsoe
[/quote]

What does that have to do with anything at all? Brady was back-up QB who got a chance to play because Bledsoe, the franchise quaterback, got hurt.

[Florida Ravens Fan]

Doesn't make sense, coach is all about preaching character, but we are the most undisciplined team! We lead the NFL in penalties, there's something wrong here[img]http://boards.baltimoreravens.com/public/style_emoticons/default/sleep.gif[/img]

[RavingRaven]

[quote name='Florida Ravens Fan' date='09 December 2009 - 05:49 PM' timestamp='1260398977' post='308449']
Doesn't make sense, coach is all about preaching character, but we are the most undisciplined team! We lead the NFL in penalties, there's something wrong here[img]http://boards.baltimoreravens.com/public/style_emoticons/default/sleep.gif[/img]
[/quote]

Agreed. If we are going to be about character, than we should at least be intelligent. High penalty levels just means we have a lot of brain dead players. Personally, I'll take brain dead lunacy over brain dead benevolence any day.

The final word: I don't care what we look like, as long as it equals wins.

[Bltravens]

[quote name='RavensAllTheWay' date='09 December 2009 - 04:12 PM' timestamp='1260396778' post='308412']
The Ravens are still one of the most hated teams in the league. And honestly, I don't give a crap
[/quote]
Some of the best teams we've ever put on the field just kind of accepted that the NFL didnt care about them because they were unmarketable to the rest of the nation outside of Baltimore. Then played the " well go F urself, its us against the world and thats how we like it, and we're going to kill you" card.