What Can Be Done About The Officiating?

[Mick0311]

[quote name='Moderator 2' date='08 November 2009 - 06:57 PM' timestamp='1257731831' post='278071']
It not just the Ravens games, this ref crew did a MNF Miami and missed a bit of holding too. If you watch any games there are missed calls in all games and the 2 biggies that Harbs had overturned today proved that. Either simplify the rules and let them play or full time refs, you are not going to be able to discount the human element.
I thought it was telling Periera was not on the NFLN defending his refs last week.
[/quote]


Very true. I find it laughable most of the time when Periera gets up there and defends his crews. Sometimes they were right, but sometimes I watch him try to explain things and I think we are watching two different videos or something. I don't mind refs missing calls sometimes, as long as they miss the same ones for the other guys. There was a play yesterday where T.P. was being held so badly, and by his neck/face, that I cannot understand how they missed that one. The freaking RB ran right by him, so you know they were looking in that area for holds. I'm not a conspiracy theory type of person, but I think it is getting pretty weird.

[jschultz]

The refs suck and the whole system needs to be massively overhauled to make the game calling more accurate, consistent and complete (i.e. - no missed calls too).

[lgcs27288]

play better so we dont have to worry about bad calls changing the outcome of games for us.

[Raven43hike]

[quote name='jt3751' date='08 November 2009 - 08:49 PM' timestamp='1257731365' post='278058']
Before folks start with the "stop the whining" comments, this thread has nothing to do with losing any game because of the refs.

It is painfully obvious, even to uninterested observers, that the officiating in Ravens games is tilted to their opponent. Without trying to figure out the reason(s), what can the Ravens front office and the Ravens community as a whole do to try to affect a change. Losses, bad play, bad coaching are all parts of any sport at one time or another. But watching obviously biased calls and non-calls week after week is ruining the spirit of the game. What can be done?
[/quote]
Just make them a non factor just flat out beat the opponent

[McBoller]

[quote name='Flacco-the-Unitas' date='08 November 2009 - 08:54 PM' timestamp='1257731657' post='278066']
We could give-em Ochocinco dollars.
[/quote]
Someone else is paying them a lot more than $85. We need to come up with more than that.

[Raven43hike]

[quote name='Raven43hike' date='09 November 2009 - 02:26 PM' timestamp='1257794784' post='278894']
Just make them a non factor just flat out beat the opponent
[/quote]
They should be younger also

[FlacAttack]

I never believed in the referee conspiracy against the Ravens, but judging by the officiating this season it is hard to dispute this claim. The Referees clearly make calls that accomodate to our opponents while ignoring blatant calls against them. Clearly something needs to be done about this.

[Tank 92]

[quote name='I AM LEGEND' date='09 November 2009 - 09:32 AM' timestamp='1257777161' post='278545']
lol maybe we can assign Laundry to do it since he dosent like making clear cut interceptions

but I've Been saying this forever and will continue to say it...THe Ravens are the most picked on team in the NFL and have been that way for a long time. This in no way is to take pressure off our HORRID secondary play..they stink...yes we know this..but throw In The fact that for some reason were picked on doesn't help

now let's be honest and get down to the facts of why were picked on

1. The inability of certain media,football figures and fans to put Ray Lewis's Murder charge behind him where it's suppose to be..let's be honest besides the ravens fans we've probably heard 100,000 Ray Lewis murder jokes..I've heard it from fans, radio host,etc

2. Other unfavorable characters we've had on the team in the past including are fearless leaders Brian Billick and Rex Ryan This also includes CMac, Jamal Lewis who served time, Bart Scott and others. I've also heard 100,000 jokes in the past about our team being thugs,jailbirds,etc..

3. 2007!!!! Monday night football against the pats really Hurt us... We came out of that game with a really bad image...the biggest being crybabies..Bart throwing flags..Mason complaining about sorts of racism..

I felt like we could a break on some of these things once we started to shed some of the "problems" I.e. Billick,Cmac,Ryan, Scott....and to be fair in a way we did..last year I can't recall any feelings of being picked on except for when we went up against the Steelers and let's be honest alot of teams have that feeling when u go up against the Steelers.

But our old issues seem to have resurfaced this year and guess when...right after the Pats game when we went back to our old ways about complaining...Ray got sucked in,so did Harbaugh..and it seems like the flags have been flying every since.

Now needless to say our secondary sucks but add that with our image and it's a deadly mixture..

That one ochocinco PI came so late yesterday it made me sick..

Any time you have a veteran reciever such as Mason who gets treated like a rookie Wideout we have a problem..


However something needs to be done on a higher level involving the owner and league that can put some of these issues on the table and show them that the ravens as an organization and the Ravens fan base will no longer stand for it.

If Brady can complain about a flag during the game

why can't w complain about a flag after the game
[/quote]
You have pretty much outlined my exact thoughts concerning the reasons. Someone needs to be held accountable to change the situation. I really don't know how it can happen, it's been occurring off and on since Ray's thing and Billick publicly blasting the refs. What I do know is that it ruins watching the games. Poor play, bad coaching decisions, missed kicks, etc. I can accept as faults, criticize and hope for better as a fan.

The way the Ravens have been victimized by bad calls/no calls over the years is inexplicable and unacceptable. Sometimes I think I should just give up following NFL football and find something else for my sons and I to do with our Sunday afternoons.

[tweety]

It's hard to believe the referees would be lop-sided. There was a lot of holding and that missed P.I. call on Mason in the endzone was big. It is true the Ravens don't get the benefit of the doubt along with other teams.

[funky141]

[quote]I never believed in the referee conspiracy against the Ravens, but judging by the officiating this season it is hard to dispute this claim. The Referees clearly make calls that accomodate to our opponents while ignoring blatant calls against them. Clearly something needs to be done about this.
[/quote]


I watched the same games as you did and the calls were 98% correct. I'll give you 1 or 2 maybe/questionable but other than that the officials have been fine.

[PSU RAVEN]

For me what it really boils down to is the holding calls/non calls on the offensive line.

If the other teams can hold Suggs and Pryce and get away with it and the Ravens get 10 yard penalties when they hold, the game is pretty much decided.

The sad part is that one can point out that the holding call is justified (true) but what about the non-calls when the other team is on offense??

There is no balance

[PSU RAVEN]

[quote name='I AM LEGEND' date='09 November 2009 - 09:32 AM' timestamp='1257777161' post='278545']

1. The inability of certain media,football figures and fans to put Ray Lewis's Murder charge behind him where it's suppose to be..let's be honest besides the ravens fans we've probably heard 100,000 Ray Lewis murder jokes..I've heard it from fans, radio host,etc

2. Other unfavorable characters we've had on the team in the past including are fearless leaders Brian Billick and Rex Ryan This also includes CMac, Jamal Lewis who served time, Bart Scott and others. I've also heard 100,000 jokes in the past about our team being thugs,jailbirds,etc..

[/quote]

...on some level I am looking forward to the day that our team is no longer defined by these lightning rod personalities.

[I AM LEGEND]

[quote name='PSU RAVEN' date='10 November 2009 - 09:57 PM' timestamp='1257904626' post='279949']
...on some level I am looking forward to the day that our team is no longer defined by these lightning rod personalities.
[/quote]

you know what..i use to think the same thing...but I just can't be subjected to some bland team who has no personality like 90% of the teams in the NFL...even if it does mean we get picked on...the Ravens have carried a "by any means" attitude and that's why I love them...it's also why were hated outside Raven nation. I love most of the Lively football players we've seen here for over the past decade...from loud mouth Bart..To get it done Ray..

I think it's completely unfair that we as a fanbase need to wish for our "lightning rod" players to go away just so we can be back in the favor of the NFL..

Believe it or not the NFL needs us...without the bad guys, good guys don't exsist.

[BleedPurple92]

Play disciplined football?

Especially in the back end. Play technically sound, and don't give up silly PIs.

[I AM LEGEND]

[quote name='BleedPurple92' date='11 November 2009 - 01:13 AM' timestamp='1257916437' post='280044']
Play disciplined football?

Especially in the back end. Play technically sound, and don't give up silly PIs.
[/quote]

you forgot that after all that...we still have to pray that the other teams WR doesn't have a fit in front of the ref and cry for a PI flag...that he'll most likely get

[Mick0311]

[quote name='funky141' date='10 November 2009 - 06:15 PM' timestamp='1257902125' post='279929']
I watched the same games as you did and the calls were 98% correct. I'll give you 1 or 2 maybe/questionable but other than that the officials have been fine.
[/quote]


I agree, but the issue that keeps coming up, and the one I will defend to the end, is that those calls are RARELY missed on us. How many times have you heard the announcers say something about how iffy some calls have been? More this season than any I can remember. It's frustrating when Oher gets called (unsportsmanlike) for that push in the back, which was a penalty by definition, but weak at best, and then turn around and watch Pryce get held by his head while a RB dances right past him. It's BS.

[BrownsFan]

Refs have been inconsistent on calls for a long time; it's not THAT hard to be inconsistent either. What's PI to me isn't to you and vice versa.. so how can you expect every single call to be exactly correct? There will be some calls that should have never been and those that should.. it will never change.

I do however think if there were full time refs the number of those correct/incorrect calls would drop.

[RavensAllTheWay]

I'm not saying most of the calls against us are bad, but the problem is that they're never gonna stop. I'm pretty sure this is gonna keep happening for the rest of the season. It's unavoidable. Some calls have been terrible and VERY costly, while some calls have been good.

[shaikh015]

Unless Goodell steps in and regulates on them about the play calling nothing would happen....If people are striking instead of tailgating then it might work also.

[Marc2k6]

Why are we still talking about the refs? The refs are not the ones tripping and falling during plays!

[Aaron Vaught]

The organization owners and the NFL are no better than the lobbyists walking the halls of the White House. At the end of the day, it's all in who can pay more than the other guy. You want to fix football; take money out of the equation entirely. The only way to do that is for everyone to stand up -- (at this point I'm asking too much already) -- and tell the NFL, "Fix it, or we won't be coming back."

All it'd take is one solid week across the entire NFL; no one buys a ticket or watches the game on the television. What are you left with? A bunch of guys in jerseys playing in an empty arena and the folks at ESPN, Sportscenter and Fox scratching their heads... everyone in the NFL wondering why they even got out of bed on Sunday morning.

The revenue lost may seem like a drop in the bucket but add it all up; player salaries, utility costs, air time (both tv and radio)... from top to bottom, the pennies add up. It'll get their attention.

The odds of such an occurrence, slim to none -- more so the latter. The reason no one will do it is because they don't want their team to feel they "no longer care."

This is the only way to truly start fixing the problem. Hit them where it hurts, in the pocket book.

Then you build from the ground up, sit down and do a 'lessons learned' and rewrite the books. Once done, have a sit down with everyone including refs, players and coaches explaining the rules; what dictates a penalty and what doesn't. Next, I think it's time for football to join the 21st century... the technology is there -- USE IT and use it wisely, you can get rid of the crybabies on the field and the challenge flag issue. Totally agree with accountability and fining of refs and players; also agree with making refs full time. Go one step further, have back-up officials just in case you have to fire one during the game.

The NFL is a money grubbing machine and nothing is ever going to change for anyone until you say you've had enough and boycott the entire establishment.

Final note; I've got a handful of tickets for Monday night in Cleveland... if things don't get straightened by years end across the league, I presume they will be the last tickets I buy. Also, I won't resubscribe to NFL Sunday Ticket. The money I spend to have what used to be a great time, I can spend on a daily newspaper from the Baltimore Sun to be delivered to me in Indiana.

I know 99% of you are going to read this and think it's moronic, dim witted or even worse... and that doesn't bother me... what bothers me is that I used to love to watch this game and from the word "Go" this season, when all that 'stale air' from 2000 started rolling back in I just knew it was going to be bad.. I just never thought it'd get this bad.

I will continue to be a Ravens fan and I will continue to raise hell in community by doing so... nothing will ever change that.

[neepo13]

[quote name='BrownsFan' date='13 November 2009 - 03:26 PM' timestamp='1258143983' post='281278']
Refs have been inconsistent on calls for a long time; it's not THAT hard to be inconsistent either. What's PI to me isn't to you and vice versa.. so how can you expect every single call to be exactly correct? There will be some calls that should have never been and those that should.. it will never change.

I do however think if there were full time refs the number of those correct/incorrect calls would drop.
[/quote]
Agreed but when two very similar situations pop up in one game and one draws the flag and the other doesnt there is a problem. When we played the Bengals, there was a pi on Fabian Washington on an overthrown ball by Palmer. Fabian's hand got tangled with Johnson's. Johnson cried for the flag and got it. Later on in the game Flacco goes to Mason, who has Joseph beat. Joseph grabs his arm which slows him down and keeps him from going for the ball and there is no flag. Both db's got their hands tangled with the reciever but only one got flagged. And the only difference is one cried for it and the other didnt. Thats a problem.

[DMT]

[quote name='neepo13' date='15 November 2009 - 05:51 PM' timestamp='1258325508' post='282036']
Agreed but when two very similar situations pop up in one game and one draws the flag and the other doesnt there is a problem. When we played the Bengals, there was a pi on Fabian Washington on an overthrown ball by Palmer. Fabian's hand got tangled with Johnson's. Johnson cried for the flag and got it. Later on in the game Flacco goes to Mason, who has Joseph beat. Joseph grabs his arm which slows him down and keeps him from going for the ball and there is no flag. Both db's got their hands tangled with the reciever but only one got flagged. And the only difference is one cried for it and the other didnt. Thats a problem.
[/quote]
Yes it is! BUT...this team just won't win as long as we leave it close enough for the officials to make a difference.

[jschultz]

[quote name='DMT' date='15 November 2009 - 07:37 PM' timestamp='1258328277' post='282051']
Yes it is! BUT...this team just won't win as long as we leave it close enough for the officials to make a difference.
[/quote]
I keep hearing this from people on this board and while there is some truth to it, the fact of the matter is that refs can decide games against you that shouldn't even be close.

Oh you just threw a sixty yard bomb? Well I can call holding on just about every offensive play and negate that at will. Same goes for run plays. On defense I can call illegal contact or PI on almost every throw. Who is going to overrule me? No one. And if you complain about it, it will just get worse next week and you will be fined.

That's the system we have right now and it sucks.

[1defense]

The only ones that can crack down on the refs are the league office and pressure from the players association which is highly unlikely.I hate to say it but sometimes when the refs are bull rushed over I wonder if it isn't the only way the players feel they can vent not to justify it but after some of the calls I wish I could bullrush them myself.

[Child Of Humanity]

I think almost every team feels this way about the officiating. Cincy certainly does. Yes the crap calls about roughing the passer in NE game was absolutely absurd. As was the lack of a call on the hand check in the endzone last week that should have given the Ravens 1st and goal at the 1. But really bad calls happen against all teams except NE and PITT. Refs know better than to flag theose two teams much because their franchises rule the NFL. But yes the officiating this year seems worst.

[quote name='jt3751' date='08 November 2009 - 08:49 PM' timestamp='1257731365' post='278058']
Before folks start with the "stop the whining" comments, this thread has nothing to do with losing any game because of the refs.

It is painfully obvious, even to uninterested observers, that the officiating in Ravens games is tilted to their opponent. Without trying to figure out the reason(s), what can the Ravens front office and the Ravens community as a whole do to try to affect a change. Losses, bad play, bad coaching are all parts of any sport at one time or another. But watching obviously biased calls and non-calls week after week is ruining the spirit of the game. What can be done?
[/quote]

[Tank 92]

[quote name='DMT' date='15 November 2009 - 06:37 PM' timestamp='1258328277' post='282051']
Yes it is! BUT...this team just won't win as long as we leave it close enough for the officials to make a difference.
[/quote]

The bad calls occur at any time of the game, many times killing drives and preventing the O from finding a rhythm. There are always going to be close games, probably a greater number than "comfortable blowouts". There are too many good teams in the league (even in the NFC!) now to expect a great number of lopsided scores.

I'm with you in spirit though; The Ravens need to step it up or the next three weeks will not be fun.............