sibelius

1 hour ago, omar586 said:

is it me or flacco is horrible in moving in pocket? i mean he pulls  a bledsoe and stays back where the passrush finds him, like freaking statue , he doesn't move up the pocket like regular QBs, lol

Probably more indicative of the fact that the weak links on the line are C and RG. 

21 minutes ago, Doomville said:

I don't understand one thing. Marty is known for his run first offense yet why is our pass-run ration even worse than when trestman was with us. And it's not like our run game is bad. It's not amazing but it's definitely good, better than in the beginning of the year. 

I'm putting this on Joe. It's clear at this point in his career that the OC still has way too much say over what he does on the field. 

Joe should know the playbook. Joe should be able to read the defense and make the right call in late game situations. I almost threw up when I was watching the presser and he said "Marty is giving me another touchdown." What the heck?? You're a QB with 9 years in the league...take some freaking ownership of the playbook.

I've come to realize that Flacco simply isn't a bright guy. All the physical talent in the world (much moreso than a guy like Brady), but he just doesn't have enough going on upstairs to overcome mediocre coordinators and bad play calls.

We need a young, cerebral OC that can grow here for the rest Joe's career. I still think we can make it happen this year with a firmer hand from Harbaugh, but moving forward we need a stud at OC if we're going to be a consistently dominant team. 

1 hour ago, OLD SCHOOL SMASH BALL said:

What if this is Sizzles last year? Who will take over the as the next General? 

We seem to be letting our homegrown talent go the last several years, not signing our own guys to a 2nd contract.

Who will keep "The Ravens Way" going after Suggs is gone?

Some pretty big shoes to fill. Will a void be created? Are we a free agent team now? The drafts have been lean the last several years, what impact will that have in the future?

The drafts have been lean? There are two starters on this defense that didn't begin their career as Ravens...Weddle and Dumervil. Wha?

In terms of the next Rah Rah guy, don't sleep on Judon. If you watch his college pregame tape you'll see a guy that doesn't shy from being a team's heartbeat. I think in 2 years once Sizzle and Doom pass the torch, Mosley will be the leader but Judon will bring the noise. 

On 12/9/2016 at 5:50 PM, ravensdfan said:

Eh so Pees gets all the credit for one season - but still the Pees' crowd wants to give him none of the blame for the other four lol Sorry but that just doesn't wash. This is his fifth season - not his first or second. It is my opinion, but I think conversations were had and his seat was getting a little hot. I think that is why he is suddenly on the field this season after chilling in the booth for the last four as well. I'm glad whatever the reason that we have an actual defense again and it's fine giving Pees credit for that - though I'd venture Weddle and Frazier should get a bulk too - but then he has to take the blame for the previous failures.

The cognitive dissonance must be brutal. You're a D fan. Your D is #1. Yes, sadly, the DC gets a lot of credit for that. 

Weddle and Frazier work for Pees. They both chose to do so. Let's enjoy it. 

This needs to be a statement game for Powers. He is the weak link the secondary (not a flat out liability like an Elam, Melvin, or Wright), but he needs to prove that he belongs on the best defense in the league. 

13 minutes ago, kbman said:

I posted this last night at NFL.com under the Ravens-Patriots game discussion ...

On December 16, 2012 at around 3:00PM EST, Joe Flacco lay on the ground in Baltimore. There was blood trickling onto the Ravens goal line from a cut on Flacco's face. One of the cleats from the Bronco's Chris Harris had caught him as he dove, trying to prevent Harris from scoring on a 98 yard pick 6. Despite being partially blocked near the 50 yard line, Flacco had continued to chase Harris, and almost caught him. His chase was likely as much in frustration as in desperation.

The Ravens had entered December 9-2 and on a four game winning streak which included tough road wins in Pittsburgh and San Diego. They appeared to have their home game with the Steelers in hand when arch-nemesis James Harrison hit Flacco from the blind side and stripped the ball, leading to the deciding TD. This was followed by a close loss to the Redskins in Washington, and now a blowout loss in progress to the playoff-bound Broncos. The Ravens once-promising season appeared to be going down the tubes in a hurry.

And then a miracle happened.

OK, the miracle was a few weeks later, after the Ravens had rebounded against the defending world champion Giants to get into the playoffs, then defeated the wild card Colts at home. They were again playing the Broncos, this time in Denver, and it appeared that the Broncos had the game in hand. They were up 35-28 with under a minute left and the Ravens were facing 3rd and 3 at their own 30 yard line. That's when Flacco unleashed a pass that traveled 60 yards in the air to hit Jacoby Jones with the game tying TD. The Ravens went on to win the Super Bowl, and in the process Joe Flacco tied Joe Montana for the most post-season TD's without an interception.

Two years later in the divisional championship game, Flacco matched Brady TD for TD, twice taking 14 point leads in Foxboro. But the Ravens eventually fell victim to the Pats as their defensive secondary wasn't up to the task of covering the Patriots receivers.

This year is shaping up similarly to 2012. The Ravens started 3-0, but then went 0-for-October, losing four games in a row to the Raiders, Redskins, Giants, and (ugh) Jets. They were all close games, and there were serious injury problems throughout that time, but regardless of that, the Ravens entered November 3-4, lucky that the rest of the AFC North was faring just as badly or worse. Since then they have gone 4-1 with that one loss being to the Cowboys in Dallas. They have also gotten healthy. And if they can remain without significant injuries, their chances at taking it all again are far better than their 7-5 record might suggest.

After that loss to the Pats in the 2014 playoffs, the Ravens were predicted by many to win the SB in 2015. That was before a raft of injuries hit the team, eventually leaving half the opening day starters on IR, with other key injuries as well, including first round draft pick Brashad Perriman who never played a snap in 2015. Their season of frustration was made all the worse when, in the same game, Justin Forsett broke his arm and Joe Flacco went down with torn ACL and MCL in his left knee.

They finished 5-11, their first losing season under John Harbaugh. The one bright spot was that they DID get some nifty draft picks - picks which have paid off well. Perhaps the most important have been first round pick Ronnie Stanley at left guard, and fourth round pick Tavon Young at CB. Stanley has lived up to his hype as a quality offensive lineman, and the Ravens four game losing streak just happened to correspond to the four games Stanley missed due to injury. Meanwhile Young has played his way into the starting cornerback spot, winning the job from opening day starter Shareece Wright.

The Ravens defensive backfield also has PFF's top rated strong safety, Eric Weddle, and converted CB Ladarius Webb who is rapidly developing into a quality free safety. They are a far stronger unit than the one that Brady picked apart in the 2014 playoffs. Meanwhile, Flacco has better offensive weapons than he has ever enjoyed. Whereas his only deep threat in 2014 was Torrey Smith, he now has Mike Wallace, Brashad Perriman, and Chris Moore who can all burn down the field. He also has big-bodied tight end Darren Waller who has the speed of a wide receiver and the height to be able to go up high in the back of the endzone.

The Ravens also have two quality running backs in Terrence West and Kenneth Dixon. Dixon, another fourth round pick, has recovered from the knee injury that kept him from playing the first several games of the season, and is showing the kind of elusiveness that made him the Ravens top running back this preseason. Now that the offensive line has gotten healthy and learned to play as a unit, both the running game and the passing game have improved.

If the Pats want to win on Monday they had better be significantly better than they were in 2014, because the Ravens are.

well done

5 minutes ago, rossihunter2 said:

in terms of brandon williams market value and why he's probably priced himself out of baltimore, the league is obsessed with trends and the most successful offenses have gone back to getting bigger than the opponent and running it down their gut with mauling offensive lines: dallas, tennessee, oakland, washington

this of course makes stopping the run even more important so i think teams might end up bidding for brandon and driving his price up to snacks harrison level of money, maybe even higher depending on the salary cap increases this year

Factor in that he has at least 2 national spotlight moments left, plus any potential playoff success, and it's not a stretch to see him getting a top contract offer from someone next year if he continues performing at his current level. If he starts getting sacks, forget about it. 

I think weather plays into our favor because I don't care who's playing for the Patriots, there isn't a team in the league that can match the physicality or intensity of the Ravens. When it's bitter and cold out, that intensity chips away at the psyche.

Adam Gase on the game: "I called my friends around the league leading up to the game and they all complained about how their offense plays against them."

The Patriots hate playing us not because we can beat them, we beat them because they hate playing us. It hurts. 

Let's go. 

I'm hoping this year is what we thought we would have post '14 was going to be — the year it becomes the Joe Flacco offense and not a set scheme. That way we can keep Marty and let him be what Tom Moore was for Manning...a savvy offensive mind that would give sound input and develop gameplans but ultimately defer to the QB for execution. 

47 minutes ago, Gtown Purple said:

That would actually help us since NE's offense is predicated mostly on short timing passes off cut type routes. Our running game is superior to theirs.

Their running game has been better, but the ceiling for ours is much much higher. I think we'll see a glimpse of that Monday. 

Dixon is going to put their LBs on skates. 

1 hour ago, rmcjacket23 said:

1. The obvious issue with this comparison is that you are referencing INDIVIDUAL statistical performances. I'm referencing TEAM performances, i.e. winning and losing games. Those advantages are reflected in your stats, but they are not, however, reflected in the W/L record of a team necessarily. Its one of the main reasons why fans couldn't care less about PED usage in a sport like football. Its a team based sport, where individual accomplishments don't matter nearly as much.

As an aside, PED usage doesn't turn pop ups and foul balls into HRs. Direction of impact is what changes a foul ball into a HR, and PED usage doesn't add 200 feet of power to a hitter. Those are largely myth's that have been long since debunked. 

2. Pretty unreasonable experiment, because it implies that "not cheating" would result in a 50% reduction in Wins of those kinds of games. There's really no basis for that type of reduction... its just a wild guess to fit whatever narrative you are selling.

So similarly, I could say that "not cheating" might mean that they lose only 10% of those games, because I too can just conjure a round number out of thin air to fit my narrative. So at 10% more losses in close games, does the narrative change much? Probably not.

3. I'm not suggesting they don't cheat... its pretty clear at this point that they do. I'm suggesting that its the epitome of ignorance to think they cheat all the time because of a handful of completely different incidents that may or may not have even involved the people fans accuse of cheating over the course of what is now like 15 years.

Here's a hypothetical example of how flawed this logic is:

I own a watch collection of over 100 watches. I see a watch that a street vendor is selling that I want to add to my collection, but I don't have the money to pay for it. So I steal it. I get caught doing so.

An ignorant person would say that every watch in my collection was stolen. In reality, I stole one. 

This is the logic (or lack thereof) that some fans use when they discuss the Patriots. 

We can agree to disagree. In my view you're just flat out wrong here -- condescension notwithstanding.

27 minutes ago, TheRavenouseD2008 said:

Actually I think that one play a few weeks ago where they were batting passes like crazy was orchestrated by Urban he is known for stuff like that ....

Urban and Guy, for sure.

1 minute ago, rmcjacket23 said:

Some of these yes, some of them no.

The draft picks for the most part you are correct... we've whiffed more times than we should have or are used to. 

But guys like Monroe or Rice I had no issue with. There were essentially no red flags for Monroe when we gave him the extension he got (which was affordable compared to the market). And with Rice, nobody can know he's a domestic abuser. Those are two examples of "hindsight" knocks that fans complain about.

Draft picks there are valid complaints in real time, along with some other situations. Signing Pitta to that deal even after he dislocates his hip... a questionable decision at the time and even more so now. Decisions like that warrant second guessing from the fans.

When fans wait until years after a contract is handed out and then complain about it and say "it was a bad decision" based on information they don't get until after the contract is signed, it makes fans look unintelligent quite frankly. Implies that there's some sort of crystal ball somewhere where FO's should be able to predict things like injuries, domestic abuse, lack of desire to play, etc.

 

Agree. Some of the names are debatable but overall this is clearly an front office with a winning method. We just need to sit back and enjoy the blessing.

2 hours ago, rmcjacket23 said:

If KO is here, Stanley isn't. We offered KO a contract to play LT for us, not LG. Can never get a reasonable ROI on paying a LG $12M a year. The reason why the Raiders can afford to do that NOW is because Derek Carr, Amari Cooper and Khalil Mack have cap hits totaling $11M COMBINED in 2016, and will likely continue that trend into 2017 as well. When all three of those players get gigantic paydays (and they will), guess where they will come looking first to cut? The Guard who's making $10M+ a year. They'll dump him or move him to LT, because they won't be able to justify that price tag anymore.

I'll give the Raiders credit... they were smart with his contract. They didn't spread out his bonus after the lifetime of the deal... they just paid it and took the cap hit. He costs $13.2M against the cap in 2016 and 2017, which is smart, because Cooper, Mack and Carr are likely still on rookie deals during that time.

After that, he has no guaranteed money left, and the dead money is minimal.

Such are the perks of a team who spent the last decade drafting in the top half of the draft because they never won. We can be one of those teams if you'd like to be... all you gotta do is lose for a decade.

This is where the o so special "patience" that fans show on here makes these kinds of posts hypocritical.

I can say one thing for certain... your understanding of the salary cap is not nearly as good as you think it is...

 

Agree. You can legitimately knock the FO for reaching on Upshaw, Elam and Brown, misjudging Monroe's character, the Rice debacle, and repeated FA blunders in the secondary (i.e. K. Lewis, K. Arrington, M. Huff, etc.). Beyond that they've been straight up maestros in rebuilding this team for the end of Reed/Lewis' career and the years following whilst remaining competitive and built for the long haul.

33 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

OK, and?

Does that mean that if you don't fumble the ball you are guaranteed to win the game?

You're identifying very small pieces of a very big pie that you have to fill in order to win a game...

That's similar to the baseball hitter's argument (i.e. McGwire, Bonds, etc.) that PEDs can't give you better hand-eye coordination. No, but they can turn pop-ups/foul balls into homers, they can give you more opportunities at the plate that you wouldn't have had otherwise, and over time those advantages will be reflected in your stats. The Patriots have a baseline of practices that they use to create a competitive advantage and then compound that with superior organizational talent that puts them over the top.

Thought Experiment: Take every game the Pats won by a score or less in the Brady/Belichick era prior to 2016 and make half of them Ls.

You're looking at a very different narrative around that franchise. No one is saying they are not generational talent. We are saying that they clearly are willing to flat out cheat to gain an edge and it has contributed to their W/L record. If not, they wouldn't be doing it.

1 hour ago, rossihunter2 said:

no but weddle will be playing safer ball than reed used to - weddle doesnt gamble really he makes his reads and keeps everything in front of him as much as possible so it's a different skillset - he's beaten less but obviously also makes less game-changing plays

Well that's why Weddle is leaning on Webb so much. You saw in his presser that he's trying to convey the concepts to Webb and get him up to speed as quickly as possible because he does have the range to make those gambles (see: Tannehill interception). There aren't many safeties in the history of the league that can make that play.

To diagnose the pass, disguise the coverage on the opposite hash, and then have the athleticism to beat a receiver like Devante Parker (4.4 speed) to the spot is an All-World safety play. That's the type of play that makes QBs start to question throwing at all. Then they start writing your name on their wrist ;). 

I was just thinking batted passes will be a factor as well. I could see us with Urban and Guy in on early downs to turn the short throws into long throws. Then we pin our ears back. The best part is we have versatility on the line so even if they hurry us up we can stay balanced between our ability to stop the run and defense the pass. 

1 hour ago, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

Lol, this thread.

We just had our best pass rusher return and our defense has been great for all but maybe one half of football this year. 

I'd say our best "sack-getter" but not our best pass rusher at this point. Suggs is on another level this season. I was watching an interview with Branden Albert (Miami LT) and he was asked if it was disheartening to play against Sizzle and his response was, "He's one of the best pass rushers to ever play this game, but next week is a new game."

The way 55 is impacting games this season is underrated. 

1 hour ago, rossihunter2 said:

im still blaming shareece: dez caught two passes against tavon - one was for 10 yards or so on 3rd and 2 and he was tackled immediately, there's not much you can do against dez there, the second one is a much fairer criticism because he played 10 yards off dez 1vs1 in the endzone

however, most of dez's production came on the other side of the field mostly against wright so of course people will blame wright

Pees' defense is predicated on being able to shut down one side of the secondary and ball hawk on the other. It just doesn't work for 4 quarters without a guy like Jimmy.

Tavon Young should never be put in position to guard Dez 1v1, if not because of physical mismatch alone then because of the experience differential. Garrett is a smart offensive coach. Once the Dline got a little tired in the middle (thanks to offensive inadequacy) there was no way to stop Dez, Zeke AND Witten. Our only hope was to blitz, but without Jimmy they just ate us up by scheming matchups for Dez/Witten and letting Zeke do his thing.

The Raiders had a similar game plan but Young was still on the sharp end of the learning curve and Wright just doesn't have the talent to be anything higher than CB4. If we can add one more competent outside CB3 so we can move Tavon to the slot in 3+ CB situations (and keep the rest of the defense together) I think we'll finally see the rare form of Pees' design. 

I'm setting the under at 1 hr until our new friend is banned (although for all the talk about rules, Mods around here let trolls live for a surprisingly long time).

If Sunday was a statement game for the passing attack, I expect Monday to be a similar outing for the running game and the ILBs.

It's been masked by the increasingly solid play of the secondary and the DL, but Mosley and Orr have been abused in coverage when QBs had time. Guys like Lewis and Bennett will eat them up if they continue to underperform in that aspect. But given the pride and work ethic of the team, combined with the leadership of Suggs in the LB room, I see them being locked in.

In terms of the running game, I don't think there's an LB in the league that's ready for Dixon's acceleration and jump cutting ability. Stanley, Zuttah and Ducasse are getting much better each week. I see inside runs early and often. That will open up PA and those "Joe Flacco Moonshots" that Pats Fans fear so much. Except this time they're going to Mike Wallace and Breshad Perriman. 

This is going to be a fun game . I've said it before, but if Harbaugh really wants to have a Chuck Noll-type legacy (or better), this is exactly the kind of moment he needs. 

This is a year I'd like to see the Ravens use every cent to retain our guys long term. We've been drafting and developing extremely well and have enough veterans that I don't really see us going after starters in FA. 

11 hours ago, hereweare said:

Typically teams have played safeties on top of our WR so that makes it difficult. Marty has adjusted the last 3 games though and used the team's WR speed in crossing routes. Covering someone horizontally is hard enough.. when you have Wallace, Perriman type speed that makes it damn hard. (can't forget SSS he's still fast too and quick in/out of breaks)

Once teams decide to shrink they're safeties to help in the crossing routes or to stop the run , then I'd assume we will see Flacco throw some bombs. But neither have occurred yet

If anything, I'm encouraged we have a QB that has finally proven that he can do both. He needs to do it against better defenses but a Joe Flacco that can consistently beat you at any level of the field is one something the rest of league wants no parts of.

26 minutes ago, Tornado700 said:

So you think the Ravens can hang 31 points on a Patriot defense that is every good as ours? Both teams have allowed the exact same amount of points scored against us. I love your optimism but we gotta be real here. They are 9-2. We are 7-5. We are playing in Gillette stadium. It's supposed to have alot of rain there. About ten years ago, my wife and I went to New England to watch our Ravens. The game was played in a steady, all game down pour, Ravens got beat 21-3. As Mod 3 said, advantage goes to the home team. I know that everybody is jacked up because we thumped Miami pretty good. We played our best game of the year while Miami played their worst game of the year. This will be a defensive game. I love my Ravens, but got to be real here. Pats 20 Ravens10. Hope I'm wrong.

I'd feel this way if I was just checking scores and not following the team...what does a game from 10 years ago have to do with Monday?

All that matters is how we're playing now, and that pretty darn good. I think you're going to be pleasantly surprised by Monday's effort. 

One improvement I do want to see is more production from Jernigan. He seems to be doing his disappearing act again. That or I'd like to see us find more ways to get Urban on the field. All he does is make impact plays when given the chance. Brady's quick passing is susceptible to being batted down. 

13 hours ago, rmcjacket23 said:

Implies that there will be an opening in Cincinnati for him to go back to.

If he went back to Cincinnati, my guess is it would be as HC (if Marvin gets fired) or as an OC for a new HC that he has a history with.

Agree to disagree. The base in Cincinnati is extremely unhappy with Zampese and feel that Dalton has regressed. Hue has a proven track record there, is best friends with Marvin Lewis, and has worked for him on 2 separate occasions. Given that the Bengals are all but guaranteed to kiss the playoffs at this point, if Hue becomes available I think that job opens up in a heartbeat. 

Hue is also a well known egomaniac and I just don't see Harbaugh bringing him back at this point in his regime.