terps85

I can't tell if you're agreeing with me or not. The "not necessarily" leads me to believe you are not, but everything that followed said otherwise. Flacco cannot magically make the other players around him better at their job, or execute. He can put the blockers in the best possible situation or the receivers in the best possible situation, but if they are not any good, the results will be bad. I really don't understand what's so hard about this.

That's the whole basis of thinking that players can make other players better, is it not?

You just are not reading what I'm writing man. Flacco can call the right protection and routes, but he cannot execute for everyone else. He can do all of that pre-snap stuff (which is Flacco playing well btw, not the receivers) with a line and receiving corps consisting of people that post on this board and the results would obviously not be good. Is Flacco all of a sudden a worse player because those around him are not doing their job?

Preston Smith has been pretty good for the Skins and would definitely had filled a need. But I'm still not convinced Perriman won't turn it around here soon.

Your definition of a better player isn't the same as mine. Literally the whole point of what I'm trying to say is the first part of what I quoted. The whole saying of "quarterbacks making other players around them better" is what is not true. Flacco can't make his line play better or receivers create separation, much like Mike Wallace couldn't magically give Bridgewater or Tannehill the ability the throw the ball downfield. More production doesn't mean better player. Would you take Golden Tate over Odell Beckham because he had more catches last year?

Got ya man. Saying players perform the same regardless of situation wouldn't make any sense at all, I agree with you there lol. But yeah, it sucks. I don't know how much of it is the receiving corps or the line, but it's definitely frustrating. Revis shadowing Perriman could mean a good thing, but that might be a bit too optimistic.

I've never said players aren't going to perform better in environments more suitable to their strengths though. At the end of the day, the receiver still has to be good enough to beat the guy across from him. The idea that a QB can make it so a receiver can beat the guy across from him is what I'm saying doesn't make sense. By your logic, any team with a good run game should automatically have a good passing game and vice versa. But that's not the case because at the end of the day, it comes down to talent. It's what makes football the best game there is. It's such a complex game, but all comes down to beating the guy across from you.

You don't become a more talented player based on the players around you. Does Steve Smith now run a faster 40 time because he's playing Flacco instead of some of the scrubs they had in Carolina?

Just going to ignore he's coming off knee surgery? But if you're talking about arm talent, you must also be ignoring his 50 yard dime to Wallace. Much like Wallace with changing schemes, Flacco was able to throw that with good protection, further showing he just didn't forget how to throw which is what you're insinuating. No one has said players will perform the same regardless of situation. The idea of Flacco magically giving someone talent is what I'm saying.

You're confusing talent with production.

He's still not making him any better of a player, he's just in a better situation because the quarterback fits his strengths, which he has always had.

With all due respect, you're just throwing out a bunch of generalizations that aren't really true. If you watched Vikings games last year (gamepass or live) you would have realized Wallace still was open deep plenty, but didn't have a QB to get him the ball. Saying a receiver is more talented or better because he has a QB that can get him the ball deep just doesn't make any sense.

Of course. Mike Wallace is a prime example. He's with Tannehill and Bridgewater, two guys who struggle throwing it downfield. Did Flacco magically make it so Wallace could get open deep again?

Again, this is a quarterback doing a better job. Ultimately it comes down to the receiver beating his man and the good quarterbacks don't have some magic wand that just magically makes the receiver able to generate separation. In the first quarter last week, Wallace beat his guy on a post for tat long gain. It was a great throw, but obviously would not have been a successful play had Wallace not beaten his guy. Flacco wasn't involved in the route before he threw it, so he had no impact on the route itself (Wallace beating Skrine). If it were true that quarterbacks make players better, then the Patriots would not spend early picks on pass catchers (Gronk, Dobson, and others in the 2nd/3rd round that did not pan out). It's the same issue that we have seen with the Ravens. I'm sure most of us can agree that Flacco is at his best when throwing downfield. The line has been brutal this year and he does not have the time for the deep routes to develop. Does he magically become a good down field thrower again if he is able to, ignoring the bad footwork, step up and throw the ball deep?

Ok, but this is still the QB doing his job or playing better. The receiver still has to win, regardless of how favorable of a spot he is put in.

The key phrase you keep using is "look better". A good QB will not magically make their receivers beat the defender off the line or create separation. A good QB will take better advantage of these situations, sure, but a good QB cannot create these situations.

Not only would it explain his lack of stats, but it shows what the Jets think of him and that he might be/probably is doing better than what the fans' perception is.

Oh, I must have missed that post. Sorry about that. But yeah, I've had problems with it too. Sometimes it disappears and other times the submit button doesn't work.

After throwing 38 the previous year with a 112 rating. His rating last year was 92.

Productivity and talent are not the same thing though. Last year, Golden Tate had more receptions and yards than Odell Beckham. Would you consider Tate better than Beckham?

You also have the whole Aaron Rodgers falling off last year without Jordy or really anything around him. Why didn't he make them better too?

For the whole "a good QB makes everyone around him better" thing, there are plenty of counter-examples. Very obvious one is Aaron Dobson who was drafted in the 2nd round by the Patriots a few years ago and was already cut. QBs don't have magic wands that make receivers run good routes or catch the ball. As for Flacco, he's just not good enough to carry an offense without a running game. He makes too many bad throws and his mechanics are atrocious at times. He looks great when he actually steps into his throws, but that rarely happens. It sucks that he's never had a receiver he can rely on to make plays and get 50/50 balls (besides Boldin in the playoffs).

According to Mike Clay (ESPN fantasy football guy) Perriman was shadowed by Revis yesterday. The Jets obviously don't think he's a bust.

It would be inexcusable to not take Tim Williams if he was there in the 2nd. Of course, I thought the same thing about Myles Jack this year...

Yeah it seems like he is creating pressure in his head at times. Underthrew a deep ball yesterday (to Wallace I think) because he unnecessarily fell backwards.