kjbmore

3 hours ago, usmccharles said:

Yet we are still ranked in the top in total defense yards after getting thrown on for 400 yards.  Best run defense and in my opinion, the most important stat is points allowed which we are 4th best.  11th in passing yards.  2nd in INTs.  Obviously where we lack, sacks @ 14th. 

All across the board this is a great defense, but just because we don't have the flashy interceptions and the big sack numbers, it doesn't feel like it used to.   We don't have a Ray lewis, or Ed Reed, but guess what.....not too many teams do or ever did

The stats feel misleading to what I see when we're up against top notch offenses - that said we haven't been blown out by anybody

Still feels like a contain D to me, second Himmy goes out, all that contain goes out the window

Hopefully we can get everybody dialled in this week, ready for the big games coming up on the road 

I don't really have faith in this defense.

Realise the Offense constantly puts them in tough spots but against top flight opposition with the game on the line - I have very little faith they'll get a stop

vs Pats, vs Cowboys, vs Giants, vs Raiders

#1 d and when it mattered we gave up a 1 play TD 

yeah I'm just not really feeling the ranking 

playing the Browns twice a year, plus the jags, jets, Dolphins, bills  probably has more to do with it than our defense actually being that good

i don't even feel we're in the top 5 or 6 defenses

Sea, Den, Pats, KC, Min

hope the boys bring and show out to close out the season

im more inclined to think we give up big plays like the hogan TD on the weekend

prove me wrong

Can we score enough points to win out.

The Steve smith report is worrying, doesn't sound like things are coming together - quite the opposite

wheres the passion Joe? 

Wonder if they've been putting in extra work to get this thing on track

3 hours ago, -Truth- said:

Which is an asinine assertion. No successful team has a structure wherein the players coach themselves and the HC simply takes the credit, certainly not one winning a SuperBowl. What's the connection here, that the mere presence of players with leadership skills correlates to lower levels of involvement of the coach? Lewis was a generational leader, there's no question there. But only 2 of those 6 players were on our '14 roster and we were a few plays short of another AFC Championship reunion at Denver. Eric Weddle has clear leadership ability and is currently captaining the defense. By that thought process, is he essentially coaching the defense? Let's get real. This process is so broken, even Blake Bortles wouldn't use it as a throwing motion.

Yeah pretty sure lots of successful teams have players who essentially coach themselves and make adjustments as they see fit, sometimes you just need to give general direction and point people on their way, what's an audible - is that not a player coaching themselves and those around them, does a defense change their alignment or look at the los, do players sometimes do that all by themselves

Coach themselves to the extent they know which adjustments need to be made in game, recognise where they need to be etc is that such a hard concept to grasp - that HOF players on all levels of that defense could go out there and communicate amongst themselves and be proactive without having to be instructed by a coach?? Hence coaching ones self or teammates around you.

In 2014 Kubiak was coaching the Offense and guess what?? the defense couldn't defend 2 14 point leads when it mattered - get burnt once yeah but twice 

anyhow let's see what magic Harbs can break out for the rest of the season, time to do some coaching

1 hour ago, -Truth- said:

What does that point even imply, that he wasn't required to coach before? The finish to this season can help change perspectives, I agree. But let's look at where we were in '12 and '14 around this point. We were 9-5 in '12 with two games remaining. We were 9-5 in '14 and we needed help from San Diego along with a win against Cleveland to make the postseason. Even in '13, we were 8-6 with two games remaining. It didn't seem that we were close last year regardless of the injuries, so we agree there, but 14 of our 16 games were within a single touchdown, 2 of which came after we lost our starting QB, RB and WR. Our biggest loss this season came by 10 points. That's not a coincidence as far as the managing by the HC goes. Is John Harbaugh a brilliant X's and O's coach? No. But neither are some of the better HCs around, and it's not as if his level of input has changed since the SuperBowl. We've been in control of our destiny in all but one year since the SuperBowl with just a couple of games remaining. It'd obviously be preferable if it wasn't as close, but I'd take that level of control at the beginning of every year.

I've never understood the divide of specific parts of the draft when referencing the performance of the FO. Ronnie Stanley and C.J. Mosley have earned their keep. Same goes for Timmy Jernigan. Breshad Perriman has flashed despite missing his only two offseasons. We've went through injuries with the likes of Bronson Kaufusi and Perriman. Are we going to have situations where we make selections that aren't deemed favorably? Of course. I was personally puzzled by the fact that we went with Kamalei Correa over the likes of Cody Whitehair. But that happens to literally every team. Separating each selection or acquisition by a specific group glazes over what we've done as a whole. Kenneth Dixon and Tavon Young may be the future of their positions on our team. Matt Judon has flashed considerably and could be our starting OLB next season. Alex Lewis and John Urschel will likely be key reserves. We've brought in the likes of Michael Pierce and Zach Orr via the UDFA. Even in the draft where we blew our first few like in '13, we brought in Brandon Williams, Kyle Juszczyk and Ricky Wagner with almost consecutive picks. The same goes for the FA. I personally wanted Freeny over Babin, but I was in the minority. I recall that most members who posted their opinions were pleased with the acquisition of Babin considering that he was applying pressure with the Jets the year before. That being said, we've struck gold via FA more times than not, and we're arguably one of the best teams in amassing players from the bargain bin who perform well for us. As far as the recent one goes, Eric Weddle may be the best acquisition of the entire offseason. Mike Wallace has been a pleasant surprise to a lot of fans, myself included. Singling out Babin alone doesn't do our FO justice by any means. We currently have the 4th best ranked defense. 7 of our 11 defensive starters were brought in within the last 3 years. Timmy Jenigan, Brandon Williams, Lawrence Guy, C.J. Mosley, Zach Orr, Tavon Young and Eric Weddle fall into that group. Elvis Dumervil falls just out of that range at 4 years. 8 of our 11 offensive starters have landed on this team no longer than 3 years ago. Can't exactly complain about the team turnover after the SuperBowl.

I'm pretty sure it implies that the Ravens players were essentially coaching themselves.

With the likes of Lewis, Ngata, Suggs, Reed on defense and guys like Boldin and Ray Rice on Offense.

anyway yada, yada, yada results speak most clearly - see what the rest of the season tells us

5 minutes ago, Deflated Football said:

He didn't practice today so he probably won't play on Sunday. Unfortunately I wouldn't be surprised to see him shut down for the season to let him get healthy for the P word. I have enough confidence in Tavon to have him contain Green and Brown

Not tavon I'm worried about, it's all the other people that end up being out there

Time to see what our supposed #1 defence is made of

How long is Jimmy expected to miss? Haven't seen anything

1 hour ago, -Truth- said:

I've seen the Bernard Pollard tweet floated around about Baltimore paying for breaking up something special too early after the SuperBowl run. This was at times passed along with agreement in Pollard's mind-numbing theory. With that in mind, I'm genuinely curious as to what specifically was disassembled. Let's take a look at the difference between the 2012 and 2014 playoff teams.

Offensively, Joe Flacco started on both playoff teams. He enjoyed arguably his best year in 2014 under Gary Kubiak. Ray Rice was retained until the controversy and hasn't played a snap since. He was replaced by Justin Forsett, who rushed for over 1,200 yards that year with the league's highest YPC at RB. Torrey Smith started on both teams. We retained Vonta Leach until his retirement after the 2013 season. He was replaced with Kyle Juszczyk. Entirely different styles, but both were certainly capable FBs. We traded away Anquan Boldin for peanuts in an attempt to sign another FA, a regrettable move in my eyes. With that in mind, we likely wouldn't have courted Steve Smith Sr. into a back up role in the following offseason, so it at least worked out in that sense. Smith Sr. was coming off of a quality 1,000 yard campaign in the regular season of '14. Dennis Pitta was retained but was unavailable due to the injury. Owen Daniels played admirably in his absence. On the OL, Kelechi Osemele and Marshal Yanda started on both teams. We replaced the retired Matt Birk with Jeremy Zuttah. We replaced the perpetually-struggling Michael Oher with Ricky Wagner, one of the better RTs in the league in '14 before the Lisfranc. We traded Bryant McKinnie after an awful start to '13, and he was replaced with Eugene Monroe.

Defensively, we replaced the retired Ma'ake Kemoeatu with Brandon Williams. Haloti Ngata started on both teams. We replaced Arthur Jones, who's struggled mightily in Indianapolis after landing a significant contract, with Timmy Jernigan. Terrell Suggs started on both teams. We replaced Paul Kruger with Elvis Dumervil and Pernell McPhee. The duo of Ray Lewis, retired, and Dannell Ellerbe, struggling mightily in Miami after signing a massive contract, were swapped out with C.J. Mosley and Daryl Smith. Williams was an elite NT at the time, Mosley was a Pro-Bowler and DRoY runner-up. Jernigan and Smith put forth above-average seasons and we had the league's best pass rushing corps at the time between Suggs, Dumervil and McPhee. Courtney Upshaw was used on running downs in both years. The duo of Ed Reed and Bernard Pollard were swapped out with Will Hill and Darian Stewart. I would've personally loved to retain Reed considering that he's my all-time favorite player, though his level of play had trailed off. Pollard was released after being routinely exposed in coverage during the SuperBowl. Hill was an upgrade over Pollard, and a case could be made for Stewart as well. Corey Graham went on to play well for Buffalo so his loss was felt. Jimmy Smith was on both teams, though his injury in '14 was a costly one.

Our entire ST unit carried over, including Jacoby Jones. Onto the assessment.

Of every offensive starter from the SuperBowl roster of '12, we retained all of the possible ones coming into '13 but one, Boldin. His loss was felt, but would his presence alone have helped the offense overcome a dreadful performance from the OL that returned 4 starters, masked a running game that was averaging a historically abysmal 3.1 YPC, or turned around an offense averaging a league-worst 4.5 yards per play? Not likely. Of every defensive starter from the final roster of '12, we retained all of the possible ones aside from four. Although Upshaw technically started in the SuperBowl, Kruger deserves a mention. He had two solid seasons in Cleveland under a massive contract before recently being released. He was replaced by Elvis Dumervil, who immediately resupplied the loss in pass rushing production and was arguably an upgrade over Kruger. Ellerbe was released by Miami two seasons after his lucrative contract. He was replaced by Smith, who played at a near Pro-Bowl level for two seasons and was a clear upgrade over Ellerbe. Both Ellerbe and Kruger are currently starting for New Orleans and contributing to their below-average defense. Ed Reed had a less-than-stellar stint in Houston before signing with New York after his mid-season release. He's currently coaching for Buffalo. Bernard Pollard went on to have one solid season in Tennessee before being released. He's currently out of the league. He was replaced by James Ihedigbo, who had a rock solid campaign in '13 and was at worst a push of a replacement. Cary Williams went on to struggle in Philadelphia and Seattle. He's currently out of the league. If you're still sour about the loss of Boldin, it's partly understandable. But God help you if you feel that parting with Ellerbe, Kruger, Williams, Pollard and Reed was the loss of something special, especially considering that we replaced almost all of them with either on-par replacements or upgrades. What were the key differences between the '12 and '14 rosters? We obviously had the leadership and motivation of Reed and Lewis. That being said, as far as talent and level of play are concerned, our QB play was as good as ever in '14. Our running game was more productive and effective in comparison. Our WR play was roughly a push between the loss of Boldin and the addition of Smith Sr. Our TE and FB play were basically just that as well. Our OL was arguably more talented. Our front seven was significantly better in '14. Our safeties were at worst on par with the unit of '12. Our CBs were a downgrade due to the loss of Graham. Statistically, we had the 12th highest ranked offense as compared to the 16th ranked in '12, and we also had the 8th highest ranked defense as compares to the 17th ranked in '12.

 The significant issue between the two units was injuries. We sent 19 (!) players to I.R. in '14. Two of them were Wagner and Smith. We were somehow able to overcome the insertion of James Hurst in the playoffs, and you can say what you wish about loading up on CBs, but we lost five CBs to the I.R. that season. That's incredibly difficult to plan for, and it was arguably the difference in the game with New England. Rashaan Melvin was starting in the place of Smith, and he allowed an unfathomable 14 receptions on 18 targets for 210 yards and 2 TDs. That almost wasn't surprisingly considering how far we were forced to go down the totem pole. The truth is, at worst, we had a roster in '14 that was equally as capable of going on a run as the one in '12. You could easily make a cast that our team was better in '14 as far as talent and coaching goes. Most of the starters from '12 that weren't on the '14 roster were either retired or would've played their last snap before our final postseason appearance that season. We slipped up in part due to the element of chance, that being injuries, which can happen to any team. Personally, I find the notion that we lost something special to be largely unfounded and almost comical.

How about the other half of the comment - now HE has to coach and he can't or something along those lines.

Jury's out, see how we finish up this season but other than 2014 - we're not doing much since all those guys retired and we're burning through high draft picks, surely the coach has some input into who we draft.

Yes half our team was injured last year but we were still losing - before we lost everybody and the fact we are so exposed by key injuries is also an indictment on the front office and the coaching staff, no forward planning, so heavily dependent on key players - Freakin patriots shipped out their 2 best players on defence lost 2 studs on Offense and still whooped us.

We could of grabbed Dwight Freeney last year after Suggs went down, we grabbed Jason Babin, who's the genius making these decisions - maybe they wanted better draft positioning.

10 hours ago, rmw10 said:

 

One. Step. Behind.

The Offense has to get booed off the field and we lose to the Redskins before we fire Trestman. Then Hester has to let punt after punt after punt go until it can't be ignored anymore.

Can we start being proactive and smart instead reactionary and short sighted.

The fact we even had to call upon Hester in the first place is an indication of how ill prepared our Front Office and Head Coach have been.

Hey Harbs weren't you a special teams coach - surely you can round up a half decent returner??

7 hours ago, kjbmore said:

Everybody jumping up and down saying its s legit injury rah rah and this is stupid but if a guy is constantly getting injured or getting knocked out of games it's an issue - particularly when we struggle once he goes down.

I think he's a bit on the tall light side, doesn't seem to have the strongest legs either - you can't deny his injury history - it's becoming a contributing factor to our losing too.

Im not saying cut him or he's a bad player but how about throwing a couple more picks at the position, so we aren't left in the same boat repeatedly.

Yes the op was a bit over the top but if the same problem happens in 2014, in 3 big games this year - as I said before to we just watch the game with our fingers crossed hoping nothing goes Jimmys way or do we actually build some solid talent across from him - has to be done this year - quite happily spend a 1st and one of our 3rds on CBs  this coming draft

Love how this post got all negged up - happy to be proven wrong but if we don't throw some resources at the corner position I'm pretty confident will be sweating on Jimmys fitness next year or dropping games when he goes out with an injury 

ill come back and find the post and bump it when it plays out that way next year

people need to stop drinking the purple syrup

3 hours ago, Ravens419 said:

I'll respect pollards opinion when he has a career outside of Baltimore other than that he's just salty you're not a head coach for the same team for nine years and make annual playoff apperences and are a bad coach Imo 

How many playoff appearances have we had since - Reed & Lewis left?

Think this is what Pollards getting at, Harbaugh didn't do too much coaching of those guys - they coached themselves.

Offense caught fire primarily because Boldin caught everything thrown his way

Since then and if we believe Kubiak was responsible for 2014 as the Offense clicked and we rode it.

Other than beating Pittsburgh continually - I can't think of too many times we've faced quality opposition and come out on top.

If AJ Green was healthy we probably would of lost to Cinci this year 

I'm waiting to see if we can start beating the Tier 1 teams again and how this season plays out

3 minutes ago, 757RavensFan said:

Wrong.  Elam was on the field bc Powers had to leave due to a concussion.  They moved Webb to the slot corner and Elam took Webb's spot. 

Ok contributing factor to Elam being on the field

if jimmy doesn't go done - wright goes to outside, tavon goes to cover powers spot, Webb stays where he is and Elam is never on the field.

its ok though, hope you felt better pointing out how wrong I am

have a nice day

Everybody jumping up and down saying its s legit injury rah rah and this is stupid but if a guy is constantly getting injured or getting knocked out of games it's an issue - particularly when we struggle once he goes down.

I think he's a bit on the tall light side, doesn't seem to have the strongest legs either - you can't deny his injury history - it's becoming a contributing factor to our losing too.

Im not saying cut him or he's a bad player but how about throwing a couple more picks at the position, so we aren't left in the same boat repeatedly.

Yes the op was a bit over the top but if the same problem happens in 2014, in 3 big games this year - as I said before to we just watch the game with our fingers crossed hoping nothing goes Jimmys way or do we actually build some solid talent across from him - has to be done this year - quite happily spend a 1st and one of our 3rds on CBs  this coming draft

3 minutes ago, Cillmatic said:

This is idiotic

Why??

The guy is constantly getting hurt and we lose once he goes out

Do we keep crossing our fingers and hoping he never gets hurt again or do we start thinking about plan B

So far this season Jimmy has been knocked out of Giants game, didn't play vs Dallas and was knocked out of today's game

Our secondary can't absorb losing him against tier 1 opponents.

Please give some sort of plan or idea of how we can avoid losing our #1 corner in big games moving forward? 

yeah and no 

just going to copy n paste this from my comments in the good bad ugly thread

my point exactly, our problem with our secondary is we're depending on a guy who is injury prone - only reason elam was on the field tonight

need to move on, not totally but we need to build our secondary thinking jimmy will not play - we need to add a #1 corner and i would look to add another corner who can play slot but ok if called to go outside in a pinch

we look like - new #1 corner, #2 Jimmy, Tavon slot, - backups - wright, canady, another slot corner not powers 

when Jimmy smith gets injured because he will, its just a matter of when

#1 corner stays where he is, tavon either bounces out or stays in the slot, wright, canady, draft pick comes in

2014 injured, 2015 injured, 2016 looks like were going down the same road

stop crossing your fingers and hoping injury prone guys will stop being injured, go out and get help

provided we win a couple games and we're in the hunt - probably safe for this season, if we make the playoffs - hes golden

if we dont and we dont again next year - hmmm probably time to go and guys like pollard might actually be right

3 hours ago, terps85 said:

2 hours ago, terrynjulia03 said:

Interesting stat. The ONLY year Jimmy played all 16 games. 2013. Every other year since he came in in 2011 he's missed games and every year at least 4. 

my point exactly, our problem with our secondary is we're depending on a guy who is injury prone - only reason elam was on the field tonight

need to move on, not totally but we need to build our secondary thinking jimmy will not play - we need to add a #1 corner and i would look to add another corner who can play slot but ok if called to go outside in a pinch

we look like - new #1 corner, #2 Jimmy, Tavon slot, - backups - wright, canady, another slot corner not powers 

when Jimmy smith gets injured because he will, its just a matter of when

#1 corner stays where he is, tavon either bounces out or stays in the slot, wright, canady, draft pick comes in

2014 injured, 2015 injured, 2016 looks like were going down the same road

stop crossing your fingers and hoping injury prone guys will stop being injured, go out and get help 

2 hours ago, terps85 said:

The Ravens had the 5th best pass defense in DVOA.  While secondary depth is an issue, the starters are very good.  Young is a budding shutdown corner and Jimmy is good in his own right.  Add a pass rusher to this team and the defense is scary good.

 i honestly think we need to spend our top pick on a CB and look to add another top flight corner and move away from Jimmy as our #1 corner - if hes healthy and hes out there happy days we have too quality corners but, and its nothing against him - hes too frequently injured - we got smoked in 2014 when he was out and we're getting smoked this year when he goes down

vs the giants, doesnt play vs cowboys, today vs the patriots - to beat the best teams we need our best players on the field 

jimmy unfortunately has not shown to be able to stay on the field 

5 minutes ago, redrum52 said:

We miss coverage in our secondary.  Lack of corners, Jimmy always seems hurt and no consistent rusher.

we need another outside corner - powers needs to go, young to the slot, can man up on the shifty guys, jimmy and other corner on the outside, if our 2nd corner is solid, wright on #2 wr isnt horrible - sometimes

11 minutes ago, ratedr said:

They also nearly blew the biggest lead in Super Bowl history. Thank goodness Jim Harbaugh was dumb and decided to call passes to end the game.

i remember ray rice fumbling and giving 49ers good field position and then the offence laying an egg and 49ers were back on the field.

we're not even going to the sb if the defence doesnt show out in foxboro - horse before the cart

15 minutes ago, OUravensfan said:

Weddle is not elite, he's good. He also gave up the game clinching TD and got trucked sticked on the game sealing drive, not elite. 2 awful dropped INTs this year

also thought he should of made a play on the first TD, breezed past Mitchell - blow him up 

we miss the nastiness in our backend 

nobody is scared of our secondary - we need some nasty back there

28 minutes ago, Cville-Raven said:

lol exactly and what was exactly special about that defense? Hell, that defense almost lost us that damn Super Bowl. They won in spite of them not because of them.  

that defence shut out the patriots in the second half of the afc championship game

6 minutes ago, Cville-Raven said:

Only guy worth keeping of those three was Boldin. Reed was just a name looking for way too much money at that point. 

What have we done since - we rode those guys to a SB - ride it out again, couldn't have been much worse than 8-8 and if it was just would have kick started a true rebuild with higher picks

17 minutes ago, Ravens4Real said:

To everyone calling out Hester on one mess up, this game could have easily of been a Patriots win by 20+. While he deserves some blame, he is no where near the main reason we lost.

He set the stage but no not the main culprit but you've got to have all phases on point to win in Foxborough and we're not even close