kjbmore

Good - special teams all facets - didn't give up any big returns, the blocked punt, few nice returns from Hester - can anybody comment on the sun at the stadium - Hester lets s lot of punts go - thought it may have something to do with it, Monday night game next, so well see if still happening run defense was awesome, not sure why they kept trying to run on us, when our secondary has been pretty susceptible - anyway really looking forward to seeing our run d go up against the cowboys judons sack!! the bad - offense, oline, play calling on 3rd down, I would rather we have shots downfield and live with results than continually throw short of the markers - I specifically remember a 3rd down a couple games back - we actually threw past the markers and we received a pass interference, at least give ourselves a chance and put some pressure on other teams secondaries - we have so much speed, send it at people, it's not like we've got all these shifty guys just making people miss - we've got speed - play to our strengths

yeah you keep saying im reactionary ok bud - if commenting on past events is reactionary you got me everythings in hindsight when looking back on past events but yeah whatever - im simply offering my opinion in relation to our handling of the wide receiver position, in the context of this thread about poor drafting. you think we've thrown resources at it and they havent panned out - you're entitled to that opinion. im of the opinion that the resources have generally been inadequate, i dont necessarily feel hoping for 6th n 7th round guys to pan out is a solid strategy. you keep saying we fail to develop guys, pointing at 6th and 7th round guys that havent turned into starters - im not shocked - their 6th n 7th rounders for a reason - how many teams are turning 6th & 7th rounders into starters or even contributors - historically what is the percentage of guys from the 6th and 7th that even make teams and make a contribution we spent a 2nd on torrey - we seemed to develop him ok, he didnt turn into a #1 but hes a 2nd round pick, hes probably never going to be at that level, we dont have anybody else to really point at and say yeah we can or we cant develop guys at a decent draft position - because we havent drafted anybody in a decent position (im just looking at the last 5 years or so) nobody can predict injuries but we've left ourselves so exposed - the front office is paid to assemble a roster and assembling depth is a part of that beacuse we all know injuries happen in the nfl but i think we're dropping the ball on receivers - we had to bring in givens last year at the death because we had no speed threat, how do we not have one single other active receiver on the team who can stretch the field - when thats our biggest weapon? guess what happened - we went 1-6 to start the season - im just a results kind of guy and those results speak pretty clearly to me - we had other problems but our receiving corps was definitely a big part of it if we were lighting the league on fire and dropping 30 on teams regularly id be inclined to think that the front office was doing a decent job and your view point had some merit - given that we've been in the bottom third in the league in scoring since the superbowl season - im leaning more towards inadequate to poor the penny appears to have dropped though because we brought in mike wallace and drafted chris moore and we actually had a glut of receivers this year, hopefully thisstarts translating to points on the board

Who were the other sides?

How do we keep neglecting the position?? Hahaha - You answered you own question - we've spent 2 picks in 6 years 5 years apart in the early rounds, yeah they were first and then 2 4ths again - years apart. one of the most important groups on a team and that's all we're throwing at it - again we've spent the same amount of picks on RBs in that time period and for what - we started Forsett, the last couple years and grabbed Terrence West of the scrap heap. we went into a year with torrey & Jacoby = neglect we grabbed Steve smith, we have torrey and Aiken - can't remember when we ditched Jacoby - expecting Steve smith to carry us when he's 50 is pretty optimistic, we snuck through, going into that year would have been a good year to spend some picks, knowing torrey was up for $$ and Steve smith was getting on so torrey leaves and boom our high pick never sees the field and boom Steve goes down, cos he's 50 and were left throwing to Aiken The difference between us and the steelers is they have guys like Emmanuel Sanders and Antonio - they don't have holes there, yet they're still spending 3rd round picks on the position to maintain and be able to move forward when guys like sanders and Wallace leave were waiting until we literally have to get somebody otherwise we'd have nobody to throw to

totally speculative - somebody said dodd and ogbah went ahead of where we picked - I just threw up a possible scenario to move ahead up in the draft given the teams ahead of us - they seemed like the best possible candidates to move up - we essentially needed to get ahead of the browns at the top of the 2nd we were moving back for fourths and fifths i think given where we were picking and our historical draft position - if ever there was a time to be aggressive and try and get back into the first and try come away with an ogden / lewis type scenario, this was it - we had stanley at 6

I think we could have gotten back into the first, work something with Seattle or Carolina - come away with 2 first rounders

Come on man, teams are constantly adding receivers - through the draft and free agency, feel free to run through team by team and have a look at draft picks and free agent additions If your happy with our offense the last few years you might be in the minority - I think the results speak for themselves we've been ranking in the bottom rung for pts scored the 8-8 year, the 5-11 year and this year but hey hopefully we turn it around and our current group of players can start getting into the endzone and putting some points on the board

I think our team specifically is more injured because we're older and we put a lot on the plate of our older guys. suggs, dumervil, Steve smith, then u get your freak injuries which u can't do anything about We might also be overloading our younger guys, seem like a few of them on IR - obviously some of that's phantom

That's not promising particularly when the guy turns 26 next year. its just frustrating when the FO said we need pass rushers, can never have enough pass rushers so we draft KC & Kaufasi - when guys like Spence, Dodd, ogbah, nassib, Yannick were all within our grasp here we are 7 games to the season and we can't get any pressure on the QB and our secondary getting picked apart again

i dont think its so much a case of me being reactionary - more a case of commenting on a situation in front of me, citing examples of success vs examples which havent been successful - im not paid to run a football team and assemble a roster - im merely on a forum adding my 2 cents steelers are spending mid to high picks on a consistent basis - the guys you are throwing up are afterthoughts, we're taking them in the 6th & 7th rounds, we spend one high pick every 5 years and then throw a whole heap of afterthoughts at it and hope it works if wed spent the same amount of picks in the first 4 rounds as we have on RB's - 4 or DE/DT - 6 as opposed to WR - 2 in the last 5 drafts - wed probably be in a much better place everybody knows its a passing league - we seem to be able to turn up udfa type guys to fill roles - like orr and pierce one area we cant recreate that is receiver - so when we actually had a core that won us a SB - Ozzie and the rest of the FO were too prideful to get out of their own way and resign the second most important piece of that team - right player, right price bla bla - howd that work out for us then we just keep neglecting the position but we've got a heap of mediocre running backs and defensive linemen in the wings 2012 -10th in scoring - 25pts/game - win a superbowl 2013 - 25th - 20pts/game 2014 - 8th - 25pts a game - playoffs, beat pitt, lose to new england (after being up 14 twice) 2015 - 25th - 20 pts a game 2016 - tied for 26th - 19pts a game ( I know how this story finishes and its not in the playoffs) we've gone and added some pieces, hopefully they can start to come together - a core of perriman, wallace and moore could be our future but id happily spend a first round pick on mike williams and juice this thing up - if were not scoring points, we're not going anywhere

So Yannick a MD pass rusher, taken one pick ahead of Bronson 'I turn 26 before I've played an NFL snap' Kaufusi is ranked in the Top 15, meanwhile we've got nobody in the top 50 - ZDS is tied 67th with 6, Suggs 'I've got one good arm and I'm getting too old' is tied 91st We need all the help we can get hopefully judon starts getting more playing time

Yeah just feel that we've dropped the ball a bit since the Super Bowl and given that we finally have a guy that can carry us (with decent weapons) to a SB and we've seen it, it's not like we've got a Tannehill, Osweiller, Dalton and we're not sure - we know what Flacco is capable of. if we'd been bit a bit more proactive in the last few years and def kept Boldin around, we might be talking perennial SB contender instead of wondering how high we might be drafting this year. At the end of the day - the results speak for themselves. 8-8, 10-6, 5-11, 3-4

Not really in my opinion and when they have its been in a reactionary, last minute manner due to the sheer fact we'd literally not have anybody to throw to, we finished the season with Chris Givens, Kaelin Clay, Chris Matthews, Dan Brown on our roster at WR - yeah Steve went down but the guys 39 or whatever plays harder than most in the league - it's no shock, hoping a rookie was going to come in and play lights out, from the get go. When we won the Super Bowl we had Boldin catching everything thrown his way, Pitta AND Dickson playing well and 2 deep threats in Torrey and Jacoby. Boldin pretty much carries us and wins that Super Bowl for us and we don't pay the man - I remember looking at the box score, seeing him put 200 yards in his first game for 49ers - made me sick. Meanwhile joes throwing to torrey & Jacoby Yes half of the side retired or moved on that year and the line wasn't great - or the more reason to keep your #1 weapon we go 8-8, 5 of the 8 losses are one score games - I think having boldin around gives us a couple more wins - we maybe scrape in with 10 - 6, who knows what we could do then - we are the defending champs the following year Ozzie wises up and realised torrey and Jacoby aren't going to cut it and brings in an alpha and surprise surprise we go 10-6 and blow up Pitt n then the patriots - which we should have won outside of some cheating n poor secondary play. right there Ozzie should be doubling down and looking at what won us a SB, we deviated we couldn't even make the playoffs, we got back to it and we nearly beat the eventual SB winner. nobody could foresee Perrimans injury but we needed to have more than one deep threat, Jacoby was a huge part of our SB side, his falling catch, up, spin TD, obviously throw in Pittas injury, I think you could see Steve Smiths injury coming - guy plays too hard and is too old now. anyway we basically waited for the cupboard to be bare until we decided we needed to go the shop, grabbed whatever was on the shelf and threw in the pot and hoped it turned out OK. would have much preferred if we kept Boldin, Torrey, Jacoby and along the way took some mid to later round shots, looking for speedsters and big possession type guys to work in with our group - so when torrey leaves or the wheels fall off Jacoby, or we decide it's the right time to move on from Boldin (wasn't right after the SB win) we have their replacement already in our system much like Pitt did when Ward retired and Wallace left and then Sanders left

Cardinals - Floyd 1st 2012, Brown 3rd 2014, plus a few later round picks through the 5 year span Throw in David Johnson in the 3rd 2015 All while you have one of the best receivers in the game. Respect Arians as a coach. Cardinals when they're rolling are one of the most explosive offences around.

Something made me think about the microwave reference. Have to say - when our team goes 5 -11 I'm looking for instant everything - popcorn, coffee, fast food. Id like to get better now, straight away and I think we had every chance to do that - let the teams winning their division and going to the Super Bowl pick guys who might be ok in 2 or 3 years after being in a weight room and learning and this n that we have holes everywhere and our record reflects that, we have s high second round pick who's not really helping us get any better, our 3rd isn't out there either - nobody's fault but when u pick a 2nd who's a tweener and going to take some time then lose your 3rd - you havent really helped your team get better thibk we're going to be in a similar position come draft time be interesting to see if we want to play checkers or chess next time around

I'd like to know how much input Harbs has into this toothless roster also any idea when we're going to join the other teams in the modern era of football and starting picking some receivers and corners with high draft picks - no - once every 5 years is not adequate

There is absolutely no fore thought there - what you've highlighted is how reactionary we are. If we had drafted - Perriman while we had torrey - that's forethought - we grabbed him to plug a hole, Same with Maxx drafting guys like Markus Wheaton and Sammir Coates when I have Antonio brown and sanders already - is forethought, drafting sanders and brown - when I have Wallace and ward already that's forethought, letting them sit and develop, while I've got my guys performing is smart. Sitting and hoping for 1 - yes 1 high draft pick in 5 years to pan out - instantly!! or hope 6th rounders do something while u hope that a 35 year old guy who plays harder than anybody in the league holds up for a whole season - that's not forethought - thats wishful thinking - that's what we trotted out last season guess which team has a high scoring offense and which one keeps firing offensive coordinators and is putting up 10 pts a game, screaming we need playmakers obviously we've performed pretty well recently compared to the steelers but if we'd been a little more proactive in addressing the receiver position if we're going to spend $$ on Flacco why aren't we giving him weapons although it seems like the penny has dropped and we're starting to throw some resources at WR how many years of Flaccos career have we wasted though, guy won a SB for us and we paid him and then got rid of our best WR while half our defense retired give the man weapons and let him carry us

Before they've taken an NFL snap

We've spent ONE PICK in the LAST 5 YEARS in the FIRST 3 ROUNDS on WR - how the hell are we supposed to replenish our WR corps with that. We have a decent QB and we had hoped he could elevate middling talent but we have kind of seen that's not the case. Wonder why we don't have playmakers and then we're sitting here discussing 6th and 7th round picks im just saying we need to be realistic with expectations for 6th n 7th round guys

It's definitely hindsight but we had to bring in 50 year old Hester at the death because we didn't have a returner we also don't really have a dynamic guy we can replace smith with - Aiken?? where is the fore thought, these guys are paid to think this stuff through

You're kidding yourself if you think he's going to actually make a meaningful contribution. happy to be proved wrong not holding my breathe for 6th round picks on the practice squad to do much more than fill out our depth chart next

Yeah pretty much what I'm thinking too, not talking bout moving up from 30 to 10 but when we picked at 36 it wouldn't have taken much to move back into the first, swap with a Seattle or Carolina or something - boom have our pick of ogbah, Dodd, jack, spence come away with Stanley n our pick of pass rusher - we probably only have to swap 3rds

Not sure what we do with the line in the event we draft Ramsey - it's just an example, same as people saying grab Dodd i feel our whole approach is broken at present, the results are speaking for themselves im just voicing ideas

I thought we drafted Perriman to replace Torrey? And we brought in Wallace in case Perriman dinged up again and we just tripled down and grabbed Moore - still don't have a shifty slot guy or a returner - that doesn't seem to add up - but it's ok we get Hester and run pitta out of the slot so then we grabbed one guy to replace 2 players and then he kept getting dinged and rightfully so we moved on, now we're pinning our hopes on rookies and 2nd year players - 4th and 5th rounders at that, our 2nd round pick can't get on the field, to replace guys who have been perennial pro bowlers, defensive player of the year guys think we threw more quantity at an area of concern - not sure about the quality im not really seeing succession planning until it's too late we just seem to be a couple steps behind the eightball

100% - they rammed his story down our throats never seen a 6th round pick get soo much airtime