BigUgly

4 minutes ago, The Mom Gene said:

And here we go....  When for the past 3 years we've been saying that the OC's were way too conservative...  a more aggressive OC starts calling plays and we still hear that it's too "vanilla".   Nobody's ever happy.  The team will never make everyone happy.

What about endless 2 yard check down passes to a fullback constitutes aggressiveness?  I'd rather have rational aggressiveness, which is downfield passing opportunities set up by play-action passing built on the credible threat of a running game.  This entire Frankensteining of a West-Coast approach on top of the tatters of Kubiak's zone blocking scheme is an abomination.

14 minutes ago, metalraven said:

This is too funny. We'll see what he can do with his very own schemes next season. But if it's anything like what we saw this year (Trestman 2.0), this team will be mediocre at best, and Harbs will definitely lose his job.

Marty is a West Coast offense guy, just like Trestman.  There is nothing he will be inclined to do scheme-wise or from a play-calling perspective that will lead to a commitment to the running game or downfield passing.  Joe needs a lot of help to be successful, and this is quite literally the worst fit offensive scheme for him, save perhaps the read-option.

This was Harbs' press conference, and by retaining his boys, he's essentially placing the blame for the last two seasons squarely on Ozzie. Biscuit won't stand for the status quo - wonder who is the first to go, Harbs or Ozzie?

The definition of insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Unless we suddenly get a massive influx of talent on the OL, WR, OLB and CB, we are staring at 8-8 again.

  3 minutes ago, BigUgly said:

Amazing! Harbs is daring Biscuit to fire him sooner than the end of next year. Let's see what transpires after the State of the Ravens presser.

Where did you get this one?  He's not daring anyone to do anything. 

By retaining his coordinators, Harbs is basically putting the reason for consistent on-field disappointment squarely on Ozzie. Since we all know the owner finds the teams' performance to be unacceptable, he will determine where to make the change - coaching or talent acquisition. He won't accept the status quo. I think he gives Ozzie the vote of confidence over Harbs in that case.

  27 minutes ago, ByTheBay said:

  33 minutes ago, The Mom Gene said:

Agreed also... everybody is quick to throw the QB and the OC under the bus, on every team. Go check out some of the other boards. Guys and Gals I see on here that are comparing others to ours aren't really seeing that even coordinators that are being mentioned as potential here are in the very same boat. It's really sad that people cannot see beyond that. Joe's lack of protection, and the ability to get time for the plays to develop is HUGE...

If the OL is the problem then what changes would be made? Stanley stays, Lewis stays, Yanda stays, Wagner could stay. Is Zuttah really the one to blame for all of Joe's issues? I read somewhere he actually graded out pretty well the second half if the season.

We had 7 different Offensive line configurations in 5 games due to injuries. Guys moved all over the place to fill in. Once Stanley came back the left side was fine. Zuttah had more penalties than anyone on the line also. And sacks allowed up the middle??? Those are missed blocks by the Center or RB. I'm just saying... Watch a Dallas game. Prescott has ALL DAY LONG. Br*dy does as well. Look at teams with good O-Lines, and you'll see better performance out of the running and passing game.

Agreed! Zuttah was quietly terrible in pass protection, as was Vlad. Both need to be replaced.

Harbaugh just announced that they are keeping all 3 coordinators this year :s

Amazing! Harbs is daring Biscuit to fire him sooner than the end of next year. Let's see what transpires after the State of the Ravens presser.

Aiken is a decent possession receiver from the slot, but an inferior option to a 37-year-old Steve Smith Sr.  With his retirement, Aiken instantly becomes the best option there (unless one wants to bet that Campanaro can stay healthy).  Will be interesting to see if the Ravens address WR in the first round of the draft, or do as expected and land an edge rusher.

Juice is a nice player at a dying position (only half the teams employ a FB). Re-signing him will be dependent on the new OC's philosophy. Likely won't find a FB with his athleticism (he's really added strength to go along with his speed), but more commodity blockers are to be had in later rounds of the draft or as an UDFA.

Oh, I'm sure Joe is happy with the pass-heavy offense that features his good buddy Dennis, but he shouldn't be pleased with the outcome. Joe needs the training wheels put back on by a competent, strong-willed OC.

For all those thinking about cutting Joe loose any time soon, think again. We achieve no cap savings by doing so until 2019, where we gain $10M but incur a whopping $16M in dead money by doing so. In 2020, we save $20M with $8M in dead money.

The only real answer is to find an offensive scheme that fits Joe, give him positional coaching that corrects his recurring mechanics issues, and provide him with a much better line, especially up the middle.

If we don't reach the playoffs in 2017, and show improvement on both sides of the ball in doing so, then Harbs will be gone and Ozzie may be asked to step down. Harbs can't afford to botch his next OC hire, and may have to look outside his circle of coaching buds to find the best candidate. Ozzie has to nail free agency and the draft to find playmakers, even if it means trading the picks he loves to hoard in order to do so.

I think Harbs is a great head coach who, like every HC, has his flaws. Like his mentor Andy Reid, he is not the best clock manager but that is forgivable in light of his ability to prepare a team to play. His biggest issue, in my opinion, is his inability to step in and re-direct how the Offense or Defense is run short of firing a coordinator. Delegation is fine, until it stops working, then you need to take charge.

How many times did Harbs say we need to commit to the run and take deep shots on offense, only to see the next game be the same old pass-whacky dink and dunk? How many times on defense did he say we have to hold a lead, only to see the same passive defensive scheme that allows WRs to get open underneath for huge chunks of yardage?

I think we need new coordinators on both sides of the ball, and those folks need to be empowered to pick their own staffs.

So we end 2017 the same way we ended last season - questions about the offensive coordinator, holes on the O-Line and secondary, not enough playmakers at WR or OLB. We really need guys like Correa, Judon, Moore, Kafusi and Perriman to develop more quickly.

This team was not ready to play this game. Out-coached and out-played by a decimated Bengals squad that had nothing to play for.

Harbs clearly stated the intent to win, and started Flacco and an injured Yanda and Suggs. Cincy is without their starting WR, TE, RT, and RBs. There is no excuse for this performance so far. Pretty pathetic.

Would love to see Mallett throw for 400 yds and scores to SSSr, Reynolds, and Moore. Also really interested to see Onwuasor play in the middle - that dude has a nasty streak this team sorely needs.

I'm still not over this loss. We should be playing for the AFC North title tomorrow.

I love SSS. I wish he had been a Raven his whole career. Plays just like Anquan did. We'll see both in the HOF.

Agreed. Sad that the FO seem unable or unwilling to draft guys like this anymore.

We have a big decision to make with Doom next year, as he will be owed over $8M (and would save us $6M if cut).  He says he's finally healthy; I'd view this final game as a decision point for next year.  When healthy, he is a better pass rusher than anyone on the team not named Suggs (though Judon has some potential).  Sizzle and Yanda should go in for surgery for their ailments so they have time to heal fully for Harbs' make-or-break 2017 campaign.

  55 minutes ago, jsarrocohome@yahoo.com said:

I see the bungles are planning on losing to help their draft order

I think Marvin Lewis would beg to differ in his last game before retiring

Scratch that. He just said he's coming back.

I see the bungles are planning on losing to help their draft order

I think Marvin Lewis would beg to differ in his last game before retiring

Steve Smith Sr. shouldn't retire, as he is still the best WR on the team. He may be contemplating 2017 and weighing the likelihood that the Ravens offense can come around and that the team can make the playoffs.

Could be the last game for Doom, SSSr, Wagner, B Williams, Elam, Webb, and Wallace. Watson will also likely be gone, along with Talieferro. Zuttah should be gone, but he would still create some sizeable dead money. Also need to figure out how to re-sign Orr, Mallett (or another backup QB), Juice, Aiken and Camp (someone has to backfill for SSSr).

Let's play to win, and see if Marty can have another good game plan like last week. I do think it would be a good idea for Suggs and Yanda to depart early for offseason surgery (biceps, shoulder) and for Joe to perhaps sit this one out.