The Raven

43 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

He's as good as gone next year anyway. Rainer pointed out that we move ahead of the colts and saints with that move who will be both looking at edge guys, CB, and the colts looking for OL as well. Tj watt, Sidney jones, adoree Jackson, dion Dawkins, Charles Harris, maybe even dan feeney, all guys who could become available to us by moving ahead of them

Still not sold. Jernigan is worth more than helping us move up in any round other than the first. If we trade him to move our first, I guess that's okay, but I'd still rather net the comp next year than use him to move up. He's worth more than that.

Using Jernigan to move up five spots? Are you serious? Five spots? Sorry but that's just a bad idea. I mean c'mon. The computer in Madden isn't even dumb enough to make a trade that one sided.

29 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

First inclination that Lewis might not actually stay at LG today.  Harbaugh said they'd like to keep him at LG but he's a wildcard who could end up competing at RT or C as well.

Just saw that too. Not sure how this works out. Think we'll probably just draft the best OL available and then line up the best five when the season starts. If the best is a LG, Alex is RT, and if the best is RT, Alex is LG.

Harbs also said Taliaferro and Boyle are options at fullback. I don't mean to brag but I have said in the past that Taliaferro could find a roster spot because of his capability as a fullback. He's a decent receiving back, and he's hefty. He can pass block, too. To me, he matches the description of a new age fullback. Not sure if he'll be a great blocker at fullback but he's got the size and strength to do it imo.

Boyle has gotten fullback snaps but I think he may be too slow and too tall to be a modern fullback. Good option though, and he fills multiple roles. Makes a lot of sense to use him as a fullback. Versatility could be what wins him the job.

11 hours ago, SepticeyePoe said:

I thought that Orr had replaced Daryl Smith.

7 hours ago, rossihunter2 said:

Your point is fair enough but he actually replaced Daryl smith 

Ah, you're right. I forgot about him somehow

3 minutes ago, SepticeyePoe said:

Who was the UDFA that he replaced? My mind is blanking at the moment.

Bynes I think, and before that we had Jameel McClain, another UDFA, in the mix. Albert McClellan too.

3 hours ago, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

Orr's impact here was overrated anyway. I'm not worried about ILB. We seem to find a good sidekick every year to our lead guy. 

Also: while it's nice to have an "impact" linebacker, it's relatively easy to find a solid starter at LB. Linebacker is one of few positions where it's pretty easy to find a guy that isn't a total liability. How many UDFAs have we had come in and look like aces? Hell, Orr was one of those guys. You always like to have impact players in the middle of a defense but let's not pretend that Orr was irreplaceable. He replaced a UDFA and he may even be replaced by a UDFA.

Thinking on this more, I'd execute that deal in a heartbeat for a third round pick. No question. 

Whether Lombardi is right or not, it's an intriguing idea, and one that I think does have merit. We've got lot of young bucks in the DL stable who can't develop for lack of snaps. Throw Urban and Henry out there. Henry as a really low floor because he's so raw, but his ceiling is gigantic -- higher than Jernigan's if he can ever figure out how to use his hands and leverage. 

7 minutes ago, 757RavensFan said:

A few posts on Twitter that the Ravens are in talks to trade him.  

Not seeing anything from Zrebiec, Hensley, La Canfora, Schefter, or anyone who matters. Who is tweeting this?

Moreover, I wouldn't be a fan of the move. Jernigan is the only guy we have who brings any interior pressure at all. What's the plan if we move him? Sign Art Jones? 

14 hours ago, RayRayRaven said:

jus pulld qbr for the season. everyone above joe had better numbrs. but I judge joe by the eye test and he's not doing well.

im spellin better payin attention to red underlines now, but i'll see ya on anotha board. we have to to see how our pics outplay oz's pics.

signin Jefferson and bwilliams pretty much put the kabach on the compre hensuv plan. we coulda done it. it wuld have been painful this yr fur sur but the pain is comin anyway. u gotta make bold moves to boldely improve

his bess yardage yr last but he looked like a guy that had collectd

same as it evah was

joe kilt my roster

wuld rather have traded him and eaten the bad record this yr

it already settld. isn't it a question of when?

With all due respect, what the hell does that even mean? I'll forgive poor spelling if you actually convey a thought (it doesn't even have to be an intelligent one) but I don't even think you managed to pull that off this time. 

And I don't give a crap about yardage when his efficiency was garbage. Joe Flacco is about as efficient as a Hummer, but at least he's big and flashy with the big plays.

24 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

He had a really strong year last year compared to 2015.

It's been a weird year. I blanked on that.

4 minutes ago, usmccharles said:

Im not disagreeing that the offense was not good.  But I was will go back to the FO not giving Joe enough to work with, yes Joe needs to play better, but the continuous revolving door of OCs, OL, and lack of dynamic WR talent has taken a huge toll on this offense and Joe's regression

In seasons before 2016, I agree wholeheartedly, but in 2016, he had as much to do with his struggles as his poor supporting cast.  His footwork and throwing motion were the worst they've been since he was a rookie. His accuracy was poor. His decision making was awful. 

In 2013 and 2015, I gave him passes. But, in my opinion, 2016 was the first year since "maturing" where he really got in his own way.

Still would've preferred to cut him and throw the young bucks to the wolves but whatever

48 minutes ago, Moderator 3 said:

And that's the kind of statement that drives the "Flacco lovers" nuts.  As a matter of fact, the Ravens were in the top 3rd of the league in AVOIDING 3 and outs.  He was NOT failing to move the chains at a high rate.  Granted, there were too many failed attempts at securing the first down later in the drive, but a fair amount of that was lacking a playmaker on offense.  It takes two to move the chains. 

23 minutes ago, usmccharles said:

Sometimes facts are hard

Okay. I misspoke and said three and out. I'd still wager that we were among the worst in the league at finishing drives. We ranked 24th in converting third downs, converting just 36 percent.

We were definitely among the most inefficient offenses in the league, anyway, and that's due in large part to Joe. The facts show that we were one of the least efficient passing offenses. We were 24th overall in yards per play and 27th in yard per pass attempt.

Sometimes, facts really are hard.

11 hours ago, DomMcRaven said:

I'm surprised that Aiken chose the Colts, but that's his prerogative.

I'm not surprised. He gets to catch balls from Andrew Luck. Luck wasn't too hot this past season but he's one of the best QBs in the game and I think better than Joe.

24 minutes ago, berad said:

What is there to debate over?

Does he need to play better? Yes. Everyone and their mom has come to that conclusion.

Will he be on the team for the foreseeable future? Yes. The team still has a lot of confidence in him and his contract is structured in such a way that it makes it harmful to cut him, anyways.

Beyond those two points, what is there to talk about? 100+ pages worth? At least we don't see the phrases 'deer in the headlights', 'can't/won't win the big game', etc anymore.

18 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

For me, the issue now is it is, "Joe needs to play better, but... (insert 10 excuses here)." For me, there is no but. He isn't playing well and his play last year hindered the team. 

I know he's capable of better, so let's not make excuses. 

5 minutes ago, berad said:

Ah, so that's the rub.

I won't excuse it, he missed some throws he should make. He made some sloppy interceptions, too. Those hurt us, especially early in the season where we lost some winnable games.

However, he did play markedly better down the stretch. From Week 9 (Thursday vs Cleveland) to the penultimate Pittsburgh game, through those 7 weeks, he put up 14 TDs to 7 INTs, 280+ yds/game, a 94.7 passer rating, and his 6.9 yards/attempt was at his career average. Through those 7 weeks, we also won 4,  losing to Dallas, New England, and Pittsburgh. That's respectable but the teams' and his floundering in the middle of the season kept us from the playoffs.

I see both sides. Joe could definitely use help -- he easily has one of the worst supporting casts of the upper tier of QBs -- but he doesn't do a good job at all of helping himself or others, and he's largely responsible for a lot of our problems. His sloppy play and risk taking cost us games.

His craving of the big play leads to too many three and outs by ignoring timing routes and failing to move the chains. More and more I believe that he looks for the big play on every play. Doesn't it seem like every throw is either a check down or a down field attack? There's no in between. Only in the two minute drill -- when he's forced to move the chains to stay alive -- does he throw on the break and in timing with the receiver. That's really it, I think. He wants the big play and doesn't care much for precise, meticulous drives.

We still debate over Flacco?

2 hours ago, Filmstudy said:

I reviewed Carr's 2016 play and posted analysis with (Q,T) references here:

http://russellstreetreport.com/2017/03/20/filmstudy/ravens-brandon-carr/

Cliff notes:

• The Ravens are set for a big pass rush improvements from personnel in secondary
• Ball skills on defense are concentrated into just 4 players (Weddle, Young, Smith, Mosley), which is scary for a team that has gone from a historically bad INT total in 2015 to the NFL leading interception rate (3.11%) in 2016.
• Carr is a pure press corner who is selective in applying hands (more often vs smaller receivers) and stays with a receiver well in straight line coverage using bump-and-run techniques.
• Despite a coverage style which involves significant hip and elbow contact past 5 yards, Carr has reduced his penalties over 2014-16 from 12 to 6 to 3.  He was penalized 3 times for DPI, but did not draw a single flag for iC or DH in 2016, which speaks to an understanding of how the game is called.
• Carr avoids tackling contact with RBs (or as 2nd man to the ball) to an extreme degree, which may be the secret to his durabilty.
• He played primarily RCB for the Cowboys, but with Claiborne out vs the Bucs in week 15, he followed Mike Evans on the bulk of plays.
• The team-friendly contract allows the Ravens to consider undervalued, developmental, or injured CBs in this year's draft.

A "pure press" corner who is selective in applying hands sounds inherently contradictory, but I guess I'll just chalk it up to semantics....

When you say "pure press," do you mean press man, or pressing before dropping into zone (a la tampa 2 style). 

15 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

This was actually my major area of concern for KO following the playoff run. I didn't think he moved well enough to the second level or identified second level blocks well enough. 

Of course, I'm not expert on the line and that clearly turned out wrong.

You weren't wrong by any means. KO was immobile as a statue as a rookie, but he just got better. He committed himself to getting leaner and quicker and it paid off in dividends.

Ooooh that's a tempting move. I think he'd pair well with Joe, too. I see this as a good fit. I'd send Philly as much as a 3rd to get him, but it may take more. I'm all for it. I was desperate for him in the draft.

20 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

I get the sense it's more about the team than individual opinions in this case.  I'm personally not sold on Lewis at LG, but the team seems to be.  They apparently view him as a potential pro bowl G.

I mean, they've developed quite a few Pro Bowl guards (Yanda, Grubbs, KO) so I can see it. They might be on to something. KO had the exact same problems his rookie year that Lewis had. Pad level and mobility. 

I really don't know how I feel about Alex Lewis at LG. I see people -- not just here -- that call him promising and say he's got a lot of potential. I don't see it. Because he's so tall and has such long arms, he's a wall in pass protection. But he's also really immobile, and his height makes it difficult for him to get leverage, so he was actually kinda bad in the run game. I'm hoping he works on his flexibility and quickness to contribute more as a run blocker. At his size, he could be a beast for us if he could move better and get lower.

I really wouldn't oppose drafting another interior guy to compete for the job.

10 hours ago, T3hRaven said:

Whatever you say.

See I'm committed to getting this past 100 before this place shuts down.  What about the rest of you?

10 hours ago, T3hRaven said:

Life goes on.

It's good to see you, anyhow. Lets get it to 100

12 minutes ago, 52520Andrew said:

My guess is that the forums exceeded his facepalm tolerance

Hahahah. probably.

On 3/9/2017 at 10:01 PM, T3hRaven said:

Can we get this Dump Thread over 100 pages before close?

Oh yes, I've found my old arsenal of gifs.

Dude! Where have you been?

we've got a lot of money tied up in the secondary right now. Anyone at all worried about all the money tied up in the defense?