Puntit

If we lose in overtime again how long before Ozzie starts pitching Pees to USC? Love the idea above of using Juice as our RB. We won't though, and I bet Kaepernak ends the day with more rushing yards than any RB on either team. The silver lining Sunday is that without any of our starters we will actually get to see if any of our youngsters are worth keeping as we rebuild. Basically training camp 2.0. We can forget about the score and just see who can tackle, press cover, get separation. My bet is we come out of there with a much better idea of what our future needs will be. Which I see as making lemonade from lemons.

The worst teams we still get to play are SF, Jags, Miami, Chiefs and Cleveland. Jags are improved this year and we already couldn't keep up with Cleveland at home. And we are going into SF very banged up, possibly without Doom or Forsett. So best case scenario we sweep this bottom crowd and finish the season with 6 wins. More likely we get 4-5. So everyone should really stop thinking about playoffs -- just not realistic based on what we've shown the past five games. This season we just need to see what we've actually got to build on. If Ozzie thinks he can't sign both Yanda and KO, our next "trade" should be to deal whichever one we aren't keeping to a contender for a draft pick. Maybe deal SSSr if he's truly set on retiring after this year. We need picks more than one year players right now. From the looks of it right now we will potentially need to pull in two OLB, two CB and a WR in the first five rounds of the next draft to right this ship. Other teams discards haven't panned out, of late.

Anyone saying it's at all about the offense when the team is already scoring 30 points a game just doesn't understand football. A good defense can protect a 3 point lead. The top teams in the league dont really need to score more than two touchdowns to win a game. If you are upset that Flacco couldn't extend a 30 point lead, you are basically trying to win a foot race with one leg and saying, well, if only we hopped faster we'd have a shot. The season is likely over. The only teams on our schedule we now realistically stack up against are SF, Jacksonville and Miami, and all of them are frankly, better than Cleveland. So i dont have high hopes. Let's try out the young guys and see what we've got, and hope to pick in the top ten next year after we put together the 3-4 win season I'm unfortunately anticipating.

A big part of the problem is actually that guys like Upshaw and Jernigan, guys the article said Ravens "scored" with weren't exactly wreaking havoc either on Sunday. Upshaw is in a contract year and isn't really making much of his new opportunities. It's way too easy to blame things on Pees, and he likely won't get another season after this one, but from what I could see, the issue is less with the play calling and more with the total lack of execution by players on the field. I think it's time to make some guys take charge on the field and maybe even fire a player or two to shake up the rest from just phoning it in. A few years back, Tandon Doss, I recall, became a much better player after he was cut for a while because it never occurred to him that his job was in jeopardy for lack of execution. And im sure his firing had some impact on those who survived the cut. A healthy fear of being fired might go a long way.

Let's just play our younger players and see what we really have going into 2016. Let Webb, Forsett, Smith Sr, Canty and Gilmore heal. I can deal with losing if we use the game productively to evaluate guys and see them improve, all the while our draft stock climbs. We basically should look at the remainder of 2015 as preseason for 2016. Figure out if guys like Brown and Jackson and Babin and Melvin really belong on the team going forwards. Get some youngsters playing time.

Putting the blame on Pees is wishful thinking -- one move and you can fix the organization. Unfortunately he's just a symbol people can rally against. Wed all love it to be a single move quick fix, but I don't think that's reflective of what we saw on the field which was mostly failure of execution. Poor tackling, lax coverage, inability to beat your man. None of this is on Pees -- the guys weren't executing. This wasn't a case of an AJ Green or Megatron beating them, or a Tom Brady or Aaron Rogers making pinpoint precision throws. This was a journeyman QB throwing to guys like Benjamin, Hawkins and Bainbridge were beating our secondary consistently. McCown threw for 457 yards, dwarfing franchise records set by Bernie Kosar. Could Pees have schemed differently, and sent out different coverage packages and in retrospect limited the guy to, say 350 yards? Maybe. But bad execution is what killed us all day. Bad tackling, giving players too much room to make plays and an inability to pressure the QB even on blitz packages. All you accomplish by firing Pees is giving us someone else to complain about for the rest of the season, I'd probably keep him, and let him go at the end of the season, when we earn that top draft choice. And use the rest of the season to get some snaps to our less experienced players, and see who actually wants to be here next year.

@crusader - we let Pollard go because he reportedly challenged the coaching staff, not because he was vocal. Plus he was too slow to cover speedy WRs and with the league fining the heck out if certain types of hits he was becoming a liability. Ray Lewis, Steve Smith are the kind of fired up vocal types the team has never had much of a problem with. I recall them trying to get guys like Ngata and Canty (and Flacco) to become more vocal leaders, to no avail.

1. Don't bother firing Pees. Its only partly 20% on him, and 80% on lack of execution. we can replace him in the offseason but frankly he's not the reason our secondary is playing like they don't care and are just happy to get paid to play a game. Attitude change is what's needed. 2. Right now we are playing bad enough to get the first pick in next years draft, so maybe we don't want to change anything. I'm not so sure the Jags or SF are going look any different than Cleveland against us. 3. If we aren't going to be able to keep both KO and Yanda next year, maybe we should trade one to a contender as we get close to the trading deadline. Same with Steve Smith Sr actually -- let's get him that ring. We are in a rebuilding year and more draft picks Ozzie can package abd move up in the mid rounds might be huge. We will be rebuilding out defense big time this draft. the bright side -- we have some good young offensive linemen, tight ends, Flacco, Mosley, William, Davis, Jimmy Smith and hopefully Tucker to build around. That's a good core. Upgrade a few rookies around them and we can be in business.

It would be nice if we could just right the ship by firing Pees. But from what I saw the plays weren't the problem. The execution was the problem. If our secondary can't or won't tightly cover the likes of Benjamin, Hawkins and some second tier tight end, that's on them, not Pees. He wasn't saying "that's your man, make sure you give him room to catch the ball". And if our rushing pressure without Suggs let guys like McCown and Carr get real comfortable in the pocket, I'm not sure that's on Pees either. He's calling rush plays, and they aren't giving the effort needed to hurry these guys. Mosley and Smith are supposed to be doing on field communication to adjust on the fly and Mosley in particular seemed lost and out of position that whole game. I'd love it to all be on Pees, as that's easy to fix, but I see a team of guys content to play a few quarters of football and phone in the rest. It's like Suggs went down and the D said "ah well, we can win next year". It's an attitude problem. Lots of guys happy to be on the team. Right now I don't like our chances even against the Jags, another team with a QB no worse than Clevelands, a good TE and that doesn't rely on the run (the only thing our D seems to know how to stop). Right now SF is the weakest looking team on our schedule and I don't think we can fix things (or Forsett) in time to give them a game. So in short, firing Pees won't fix things. Bringing in someone better next year is fine but we aren't going anyplace with the talent we have even if we got Rex or Pags back. A good draft, along with some team leaders might. I actually think anyone playing like they are just happy to have a Job in the NFL should be shown the door. A few sacrificial lambs to make people afraid for their jobs would go a long way with this team, who look way way way too comfortable shrugging off an overtime loss. I don't want guys giving interviews where they say "this one is on the D", "we have to execute better". I don't want to see guys in a rush to trade jerseys with opponents after the games. I want to see guys pissed off, throwing Gatorade jars and screaming at each other. I want to see guys on defense with Steve Smith mouths. There's no fire here. So don't worry about Pees. Even with better play calling we are going to lose every game with our personnel playing with the attitude "win or lose I'm still living the dream".

While we need to try to salvage this season, as the trade deadline approaches and it becomes likely more clear we aren't going to make much noise this year, I hope like bmoraven suggests Ozzie takes a hard look at who we might not be able to resign for the right money and gets good value for them. I think we will be rebuilding this coming March and I don't want more than one season behind the Browns in the standings.

To be fair neither Torrey smith nor Jacoby Jones is having the kind of season that would merit the kind of money they are currently getting.( Nor is Ngata.) We would be no better off with those guys. The $ going to Ray Rice and Pitta kind of hurt, and Perriman and his mysterious knee injury left us holding the bag a bit. But again, offense isn't why we lost these games -- 30 points has to be enough to win, period. If your defense routinely let's the other team put up more than 30 points, you won't win many (any) games.

Who is the weak link on defense? Honestly it was a team effort. I saw no standout performers this week. Mosley was constantly out of position. Smith and Hill were non factors. The rest of the corners apparently couldn't tackle and played poor coverage against WRs who weren't exactly Josh Gordon caliber. From the box stats, our best defensive lineman today was apparently some guy named, appropriately, Guy. I'd love to peg it all on Pees so we can fix it easily, but I think he's as frustrated with some of these clowns for lack if execution as we are. This is going to take a few years to fix because it will require upgrading a lot of the defense around very few building blocks. Very good news for Suggs if he hopes to return next year -- we've got nobody else that can bring what he brought to the table.

@Dewy101 -- I'm not sure saying it's Pees job to make the defensive players do their job. He is responsible for drawing up plays, putting the right personnel on the field, but if they don't make the play or make bonehead penalties, his only recourse is to pull them and put someone else in. And I think that's what we've been seeing with the demotion of Melvin, with players like Guy getting more playing time, maybe even the impetus of Ozzie going out to get Davis. But you can't win a game when guys are happy to phone it in. Maybe McCown is an amazing QB, and merited a 450 yard game. But more likely we have a few guys who are content just playing on an NFL team and not playing like it's their last shot at a ring.

@Ravensfan5520 -- why would you want them to consider picking WR in the first round AGAIN. Never works out for us. Best WR we ever drafted in recent history was Torry Smith in round 2. If we pick high we need to get a pass rusher or corner or replace whichever guard we can't afford to keep.

The offense is fine -- they put up 30 points and had multiple leads in this game. The defense let a second tier QB on a 1-3 team rack up 450 yards on them. He was rarely under much pressure and his receivers weren't guys like AJ Green or Julio Jones. It was just a bad showing by a bunch of guys that, as Steve Smith seemed to suggest, in one of his rants a few weeks back, don't have that winning instance and "are just happy to be on the team". I don't think Pees is the whole problem (I wish he was, that would be much easier to fix). I think we have multiple guys on the team that look great on paper but phone in their performances. And then seem happy in the post game interviews mugging for the camera and saying "I have to play better. We need to execute". No kidding. If we can't beat Cleveland at home, I really don't love our chances against 9 or 10 of our upcoming opponents.

The offense still put up 30 points without Smith, Gilmore, Camp, Taliafaro and Perriman actually. The next men up on offense performed adequately. The defense however let a second tier QB throw for 450 yards, with essentially no pressure or coverage. Oakland may have been better than advertised -- I can buy that. The Browns really aren't. If you can't protect a lead in the fourth quarter on multiple weeks, maybe you aren't good enough to be playing for the Ravens. (I'm pretty sure Webb and Doom were on the field when Oakland moved the ball 80 yards x2 on us two weeks ago, BTW). Suggs went down and the defense seems to have thrown in the towel. On paper our defense looks adequate, even with injury, but for whatever reason, they seem content to tank games and then say "I need to play better", "this one's on the defense". No kidding. I see what Steve Smith was complaining about when he went off a few weeks ago that some of the Ravens "are just happy to be on the team" and aren't focused on the win. That's what I think we saw today. Bunch of guys who pull up on rushes or coverage waiting for the next guy to make the play, and then all too happy to mug for the camera post interview and say "my bad". Really weak effort. If the Ravens are smart, someone's young head will roll if only just to wake up the rest, like they kind of did cutting Doss a few seasons ago.

Offense put up more than enough points to win and once again had a lead late in the fourth quarter. The defense is simply not good enough to keep opposing teams from marching down the field and scoring. I think this has nothing to do with Flacco and lack of weapons. If you put up 30 points in a game, IMHO the fault shifts 100% to the defensive side of the ball. I could buy that Carr was better than we expected. The Cleveland QB makes me believe we are just making these guys look great with horrible coverage. A couple more showings like today and I think Ozzie has to decide who in their contract year we will be able to afford to resign and swap the other(s) to an actual contender for draft picks before the trade deadline -- we are unfortunately quickly moving from contending mode to rebuilding mode.

Let's see the team string a few wins together before we declare them to have found the right mix of anything...

Whether we plan to run the ball a lot against Cleveland, I think its not bad strategy for the Raven to tell everyone who asks that they plan to run the ball over Cleveland this week. Let them spend a disproportionate amount of time preparing for that -- it will make the passes to Brown and Aiken more effective if we go that route. Honestly, a couple of dozen ten yard passes to tight ends and juice with a lot of hammering of their smaller corners by these guys should open things up. We don't have speed but we actually have some decent size mismatches we can exploit in traffic, and if guys are only going 10 yards a play Flacco can get rid of the ball faster and feel less pressure. But what do I know.

Bringing Ross up from the PS is the obvious move. Not sure who you drop though.

The teams that go nuts trying to acquire big name missing pieces through free agency and trades always end up in the places Miami and SF are now. Both those teams threw tons of money at guys with no results. As frustrating as it is to not have a Torry Smith on the team the answer is not to throw $10 million and a draft pick at a guy and then be frustrated that he's not all that. The answer is more often to get $3 million of value out of a few discarded sub- $1 million type guys. So don't expect a big splash trade. Or even wish for it. Expect another journeyman trade for an undervalued guy. Undervalued is the key. Someone we'll probably have to google when the deal is announced. It's why Ozzie is regarded as good at his job and the guys running Miami, Cleveland, SF, Tampa, Chicago, right now really aren't. It's not that players aren't good once they leave Baltimore. It's that they were given crazy pay for past performance at the peak of their careers while being helped along by other guys to succeed. Torry Smith is only a $10million player with a handful of QBs throwing to him. Some of our pass rushers over the years were stars here because teams were double covering Suggs and Doom, and really didn't merit their salaries once they were expected to look the same on their own. If Ozzie won't pay it there's a good chance there's just not enough longterm value there. Better to save the money and use it to lock down Tucker, Yanda and/or KO, IMHO. I'd rather struggle through the year with a WR corps of no names and a heavy dose of TE/FB/RB short yardage grind out games than give away the farm for a short term rental that isn't cap friendly and means we have to cut loose other pieces next year.

If things don't pan out this season maybe SSS can be convinced that a "do over" season with players like Perriman and Suggs back from injury and another first round draftee in the mix will give him a better last shot at a ring.

To be fair to Shipley, he was a cheap rental backup center we brought in to back up Geno, but then asked to play a starter out of position due to injuries at guard, and for the most part he managed to struggle through, gave us what he had. There werent a lot of free agent guys out there at the time who were as plug and play. But we had so many weak links and injuries on the Oline during that year that I don't think you can put too much blame on that guy. He was frankly no worse than advertised, and was never advertised to be a starter or a guard, just depth.

I don't think the old timers listed in this article are better than Doom, Mcleland, Upshaw and Smith each just getting more playing time. If we do pick up another OLB, maybe we should raid someone's practice squad as there's a decent chance Suggs, a 33 yo coming off an injury, may not ever be a Starter going forward. grooming another potential replacement behind Doom and Upshaw wouldn't be such a bad idea.

I hope Tomlin steps onto the field to trip the Pats wide receiver running along the sidelines with a bicycle pump under his jersey, both benches clear in an all out brawl in response, and Brady, Edelman, Rothlesberger, Brown earn themselves four game suspensions each for their involvement. Meanwhile Bell and Blount get busted for possession again driving around in the arena parking lot.