trevorsteadman

Just now, rmw10 said:

Webby is gone

 

Noooooooo....

Maybe signed back for cheaper...

Probably not but that is a rough loss. Makes me wonder if this move means the Ravens are going after someone else at this time.

39 minutes ago, EdTheMythicalOne said:

They really need to do some legit homework on Foster. That kind of incident to me is a big red flag about his character. No way I am touching him in the first round.

If you read the incident it was way overblown. Both sides could've been more professional about it but Foster isn't a thug. He would be a fantastic player on this team.

1 minute ago, EdTheMythicalOne said:

You need a decent starting QB to have even a chance and a ground game to go along with it. These are things the Browns don't have. While the Browns have added to the O-Line, they lost Alex Mack and Joe Thomas is not getting any younger. By the time the team (if) turns around Joe Thomas won't be a part of that and there's a franchise LT to replace which don't exactly grow on trees. I don't knock Barnidge at all, he's good. Britt got way overpaid and is very inconsistent and with who knows at QB he probably won't have a great season. I don't know about Pryor coming back but that would probably help a great deal.

I am not underestimating the power of the draft picks. More is generally better. I am basing my opinion on the recent track record of the Browns drafting which has been pretty poor. My case in point is that they had 13 picks either last year or the year before and where did it get them? They've had a top 5 pick in the first round for what...like a decade now and where has it gotten them?

I know it won't take one off season to rebuild the team but the Browns front office doesn't seem to think that way. They fire coaches after 1 or 1 and 1/2 seasons and get new front office pieces and they never get an established system in place. It would be nice to see them keep Hue Jackson around for several seasons and try to implement his system and see how it goes. I mean, they aren't getting anywhere with the previous way they have been doing business.

You need a decent starting QB to make it to the super bowl. You don't need one to get the franchise running in the right direction. People act like they need a quarterback THIS YEAR and nobody believes even with a quality quarterback that the Browns can win now. They are looking over the next 5 years and you can tell by the moves they are making.

They lost Mack but they still have an incredible o-line after they just signed a few people. They haven't had luck with past draft picks but that also has to do with the position they put some of those players in. Are you really already giving grades to their draft of last year it has only been one season.

Hue Jackson will likely stay for another two or three years. They are best off to keep getting draft picks until they find their franchise guy either that is cut/traded or via draft. I reallydon't think Garropolo should be an option. In my mind you draft these next two drafts to fill in players around the quarterback so a guy can come in and make an immediate impact.

The Ravens did that with Flacco and went to an AFC Championship the year he was drafted. The Broncos did that while getting Peyton Manning and went to the super bowl his second year there, but ultimately lost. The Seahawks did that with Wilson and in his 2nd year they won a superbowl.

11 minutes ago, Edgar said:

To the extent that Pierce is young I suppose. Certainly not as unproven as say, Alex Lewis was starting at guard for example.

I like Brandon but feel we've seen his ceiling. I would be surprised if we see a better Brandon Williams two years from now and would prefer more of a financial commitment to O LINE continuity.

Williams has been a consistent starter and has rarely been injured though. I know people are all GAGA over Pierce like I am I want him to succeed, but he is an undrafted player and has had limited action. Alex Lewis I know the team said they want him at LG but I wouldn't be surprised after this move if they shift him to RT because he is the mauler they keep talking about. It isn't hard to replace a LG. But Brandon Williams does a lot of things people don't realize like open up lanes for others to get sacks. He doesn't have the numbers for sacks but he does a lot of unnoticed things. 

I hate how much he got paid but I love him staying in Baltimore. Thats one less piece to replace on the defense that was rated #1 most the year last year.

1 minute ago, EdTheMythicalOne said:

I like Hue Jackson and I think he's a good coach but there is some sort of curse over the Browns. Their front office never sticks with a plan for very long and there is just a dark cloud hanging over the team.

The Browns are looking up? Last time I checked they don't have a starting QB. They traded for Osweiler but everyone thinks he will be cut or traded, the Browns just wanted the draft pick. They might be able to get a Jimmy G trade done...and even if they do is he really a legit franchise QB? They don't have a real #1 running back, they have some holes on the O-line, they don't have a great WR, they have a good but rather old TE in Barnidge, and their defense has a few nice pieces but overall it is pretty bad. They have a ton of draft picks, but didn't they have like 13 picks last year or the year before and how did that work out?

You don't need a starting quarterback to be looking up. I feel like everyone feels a team needs a quarterback to be looking up. I would rather have a team built around the quarterback before finding a franchise quarterback to have him succeed. They already had a solid o-line that was top 10 and they just added more pieces to it. Barnidge is productive and they have Coleman and Britt and if Pryor comes back that would be insane. 

They have 8 draft picks now in the first 2 rounds in the next 2 drafts. Plus a lot of firepower to move up with those picks. I really think you are underestimating the draft power the Browns have the next two years.

Osweiler was to just get a 2nd round pick. They weren't going to use the cap. 

It won't be fixed in one offseason like people expect every team to do but they are learning to build a successful franchise. So when they find that quarterback they like even if it isn't this year, then they will have pieces around them to succeed.

3 minutes ago, EdTheMythicalOne said:

The Browns actually had a 10-6 season a while back with former Raven Derek Anderson at QB. It looked like they were ready to turn it all around. Then they had an injury plagued follow up season that was like the Ravens a couple seasons ago...then they had a staph infection outbreak. Then they had some bad luck big name free agent signing blow ups like Lecharles Bentley who was a legit center before he blew out his knee in the first day of training camp and never played again.

Yeah back in 2007 I remember that. But I was thinking about 2014 when they went 7-9 and three teams from the AFC North went to the playoffs like they do most the time. I mean 7-9 in that division was a pretty impressive feat for that team. Especially when the Ravens, Bengals, and Steelers all had 10-11 wins. I really thought they would perform better in 2015. Seems like whenever they are looking up they crash down again.

Just now, EdTheMythicalOne said:

I agree, training camp means nothing. He was running with first team because a lot of the actual starters weren't in camp and were also being given a lot of days off. And of course he was getting playing time in the preseason games. That's what it is for is to take a look at your rookies and recent signings. You don't need to run your #1's out there for four full pre season games because you generally know what you've got already.

He was relegated to back up duty as soon as the real season started and that's what counts. He didn't win anything other than the hype machine.

Yeah but Orr wasn't given days off either....

Correa is about to start his second season. But what could he really do? Orr was an all pro, Mosley was an all pro. He had to play at a pro bowl level to even touch the field. There was no reason to have him on the roster when you have McClellan who is a fill in at OLB and ILB and is one of the team's best special teams players.

I really think people are too hard on him... If he was beating out Orr at any point in time last year that is a good sign he has upside and can possibly surprise people.

It is insane how fast people are writing him off.

3 minutes ago, EdTheMythicalOne said:

I'm not really worried about losing any of these guys.

Aiken was the product of being the only healthy guy on the roster and I don't think he was as good as the player rating sites had him for that season. I think they only attributed two dropped passes by him that whole season and I recall it being a whole lot more than that. The same site also said Steve Smith Sr. hadn't dropped that many passes and in his very first game as a Raven he dropped five. He'll get way more than what he's worth.

I like Lawrence Guy and think he's a decent player, but we've got younger guys in behind him that should step up and be able to replace him.

Anthony Levine is another decent player but you can find new special teams aces in the draft.

Chris Lewis-Harris is interesting and might be back. He performed pretty well in limited action.

Jerraud Powers didn't play up to expectations and if the Ravens can get a starting CB, have Tavon Young at nickel, and then draft a guy for depth I think we're fine.

Elam...yeah, good riddance.

I agree with everyone's assessment here except Powers. I really like what he did here last year. Would love him as a back up. 

Just now, Kid87 said:

Oh yeah I forgot about Foster at LB.. that would work too... 

Suddenly this defense looks to be coming together and gets me excited...

Hard to see the team neglect helping Flacco out for so many years in a row....

But looking at how highly paid those offensive guys have been getting paid defensive ones are a little cheaper.

Plus looking at last season the defense is looking up. So much to look forward to.

2 minutes ago, rossihunter2 said:

i hope so because i kind of have a soft spot for the browns, i couldnt believe how excited i got when they won a game last year and i like the moneyball guys and i want them to do well because it really looks like their process is working (at least in some form) but it is more of a longerterm turnaround style of team building and if they dont start doing well i think jim haslam might get impatient and get rid

whereas i really don't like the bengals...

I feel bad for AJ Green to be honest he is one of my favorite players to watch. But I hate the Bengals overall. I feel for the Browns as well just because of how bad they have been. A few years ago when they got 7 wins or whatever I felt like maybe they were looking up, but later they crashed and burned. 

Looks like the Bengals haven't really improved yet this offseason and lost a lot of key veterans much like the year before. I think they are the in the AFC North basement now.

2 minutes ago, Edgar said:

Wagner is viewed as a top flight tackle. Osemele a top flight guard,  etc.

Curious investment to me. We can replace guys on the offensive line with rookies and unproven players apparently but break the bank on Williams ?

 

The team would be replacing Williams with young unproven players as well.

26 minutes ago, Purple_City39 said:

In a passing league, a QB coming off a historic post season run on his way to superbowl winning MVP becoming the highest paid at his position is market value.

In a passing league, a DT/NT who can only stop the run coming off a season that ended with opposing teams running all over his defense becoming the highest paid at his position is overpaid.

And no, it's not exclusive because if we'd have given Wagner the same contract he received instead of paying Williams, I'd fully agree he earned market value.  Since he's a top end pass blocking RT in a passing league

I think you underestimate what Brandon Williams does.

Williams is one of the best if not the best defensive lineman against the run. He basically can stop the run by himself. He allows Suggs and others to be able to rush the quarterback more often. People look at his stats and think he should get paid off of his stats, when in reality he should get paid what he contributes to this team.

He does a lot of the dirty work on this team much like Jarrett Johnson so many years ago even though it is a different position. 

Wagner is in the bottom half of the league against the run and the front office said they want maulers and they want to emphasize running the ball again. That is the exact opposite of Wagner. The Ravens have replaced RT's in the draft relatively easily before I'm sure they can again. Also there are cheaper options later around training camp. 

I think he is overpaid as of now as well, but think in 2 years he will be on pace and you are keeping one of your defensive franchise pieces.

15 minutes ago, Kid87 said:

If we can get Claiborne, then we will probably draft WR or DE 1st round.. this is so intense man 

Think of Reubon Foster dropping from his combine incident to us to replace Orr, Foster looks like the best linebacker since Keuchly, then add Claiborne. Possibly add a Connor Barwin for cheap.

This defense looks lethal right now. I honestly have high expectations the Ravens can recreate an elite defense again.

17 minutes ago, rossihunter2 said:

I think the animal abuse is the one that will be sticky because the DVs were all dropped - also it's the volume... and this ain't petty crime

I would agree the animal abuse holds more water than the DVs. 

Still risky but I do think it is blown out of proportions. I still think he is considered at 16 if he is there. 

1 minute ago, EdTheMythicalOne said:

I agree. It is looking like just another off season from the guys inside 1 Winning Drive. I explained why I started this thread in my previous post.

This is why while it might be frustrating at times, it is still good to be a Ravens fan. It could be a lot worse, we could be the current Browns.

Browns are looking up right now though. Really excited to see where they are going. 

After this next season I don't think it will be the Browns everyone is bashing. I actually think the Browns are looking out and Cincinnati is looking down.

If the team was rebuilding they would be trading all the players they could for draft picks and not resigning everybody...

Looks the complete opposite. I think the team believes they are very close to having that elite defense again. They were #1 in the league through 12 weeks and probably would've continued if Jimmy Smith was still in the line up.

Adding a guy like Reubon Foster through draft and the Jefferson signing would put this defense through the roof. Especially if they got someone like Claiborne who is also a shutdown corner when healthy. 

It is insane how good the Ravens safety trio is at this moment. Really hoping they keep Webb and are able to utilize Jefferson in a LB/Safety role.

1 minute ago, rmw10 said:

Ravens are down to only 6 (kind of 5) free agents left on the market:

Kamar Aiken
Lawrence Guy
Anthony Levine
Chris Lewis-Harris
Jerraud Powers

and Matt Elam who doesn't really count anymore.

I like Powers back for depth depending on the price tag. Really good reserve cornerback. Lawerence Guy would also be nice but I doubt he comes back after the Williams signing. I think the Ravens will be fine replacing him with younger options. The other three I'm not too worried about. Aiken's attitude and play have been terrible this past year. Levine is a solid special teams player but the team also has high hopes for Onwuasor after his strong rookie campaign on special teams. 

3 minutes ago, Kid87 said:

Let's Trade one of these 5 TE's for a pick or a WR

It's not like any of the tight ends on this team would net the team a decent wide receiver. If they actually played worth a dang then they could be our receivers. 

Just now, jazz1988 said:

If there's any team I would want to see beat the odds it would be The Ravens. I think this team in general is built to stand against the odds and prove people wrong .

The Ravens almost went to the playoffs, a blade of grass away, with their QB coming off an ACL injury, no running game established, starting tight end out of football for 2 years, a 38 year old as their #1 wideout coming off an achilles tear, rookie wideout coming off two acl tears, and a newcomer in Mike Wallace.

The defense was #1 rated last year until the Jimmy Smith injury. Imagine how great this defense would be with Jefferson in the mix if the Ravens somehow snagged someone like Reubon Foster after his combine incident. If the team added someone for a decent deal like Claiborne look out. Lethal defense right there.

Then again I still feel like the Ravens always neglect their offense, but sometimes you can only sign the players that want to come here and not be too pricy. I think the Jefferson deal was a steal just like the Weddle deal was last year.

9 hours ago, RaineV1 said:

History of domestic violence and animal abuse.

I actually read the reports of what happened in each scenario and granted he is still probably a risk but it sounds way out of proportion from what it really was.

2 minutes ago, Ravens4Real said:

I was most certainly one of wanting to keep BW. But given the choice between the two, I would have chose to keep Wagner.

My thoughts behind losing BW was that we'd also lose Guy and that would be horrible to our run defense. I would have liked to see him signed for $7-8 million a year. $11 million was just a pure shock. I'm glad that he is back with the Ravens, but like others have said, I can't agree with that salary.

Just think in 2 offseasons that will be the average salary for a NT

5 hours ago, PurpleHorseman said:

All short area throws with a fierce rush in Arizona. I guess I wouldn't despise him so much if our offense wasn't treated like a red headed stepchild.lol

What pass rush does the Cardinals have???? LOL They were one of the worst teams at getting to the quarterback why do you think they traded for Chandler Jones and it is still pretty pathetic. 

Just now, Rebel Raven said:

It looks like a good idea.. But is Jefferson any good in one on one coverage? Especially against slot receivers? 

He has good ball skills from what I saw and a solid tackler. He is slower so he can't be up against a burner but if he is in that role he would likely have safety help.

I think if everyone just checked out his highlights from the past two years people would see how good of a player we are getting. Highlights all over youtube. I would post here but they have crap rap with bad words in the background.

1 minute ago, hn68wb4 said:

This thread is pretty much a downvote party. I don't think it's an untrue statement to say we overpaid for a player that we honestly could have moved on from.

I actually wonder how well the defense would have performed without him. 

2 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

My biggest concern with this, and to a lesser extent, the Jefferson deal, is that the same holes still exist.  WR, OL, OLB, and CB have been issues for a number of years and we still haven't filled those.  Of course, there's still the draft and plenty of FA to go, but it's interesting that the positions that have been black holes for us weren't prioritized instead of 2 positions where we seemingly had viable options, at least for the time being.  I'm not panicked or anything.  I just find it interesting how we spent big money at positions other than the ones that have been giving us so many problems.

Yes but Jefferson does fill a hole as well, and a top 5 one in his prime. People say they wanted playmakers and people are upset when we got one.

RT is not a hard position to fill the Ravens have always filled it with younger guys. They won't be probowlers but nobody can have probowlers at every position. OLB there are some cheap options like Connor Barwin and several others to come. CB the Ravens are still talking to Claiborne and others.

This is the first day of free agency the season does not start today. There is also the draft.