Baltimore RAYvens

Nassib is probably my favorite prospect outside the top 10. Would love to see him in Purple and Black

Welcome aboard. Join my bandwagon lol. I love Carl Nassib man. I even created a thread for him. He's criminally underrated.

I think I posted in there as well. 

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but know Nassib came into PSU as a stick and has slowly been getting bigger and better in turn getting more playing time. Was he a full-time started last year?

i too think hes a luxury pick in the sense that hes a DT, but hes special, hes a moving piece that will allow a lot of flexibility in the near future regarding our DL, jernigan looks different, carl davis fell to the 3rd because he was reported to be lazy and have a bad attitude, if those guys want a 2nd contract then they would need to shape up or be shipped out with nkemdiche here, plus all of our Dlinemen are rotational players, it would be nice to get a guy that coaches cant take off the field. 

 

nkemdiche under clarence brooks would set the trend for 3-4 defenses, every team with a 3-4 will be searching high and low for "the next nkemdiche". you know how the OLB and the NT were always the positions that you NEEDED to begin building a 3-4? nkemdiche will make teams say "we need this superhero-esque DE that can slide anwhere in pass rush situations if we wanna build a 3-4" 

 

would still be hard pressed to take him over bosa/stanley/ramsey though, even if he is possibly the most talented guy in the draft.

 I think that Watt is what every team is looking for now to build a 3-4 around. A dominant DE who can get to the QB as often as you used to expect your star OLBs to get there and still be a run stuffer.

I'll admit I haven't watched much tape on Nkemdiche yet, but if he can be that guy then by all means. Generally "I'm not as high on" means "I haven't watched enough tape to be sure"

How's that? I like Ramsey and Nassib a lot but I'm not married to them. As much as I like both, Bosa is a very good prospect and is widely considered the best at his position and arguably the best defender in this class. How's that taking a need?

I assume you mean Bell, but I'm not sure I agree there. Just because nobody talks about him doesn't mean he's not good. Vonn Bell has done well this year. He had 6 interceptions last year. He's a good player.

I'm not sure how this is drafting for need. I'm more than happy to get more picks, but I'm not sure I like the idea of getting cute and missing out on someone. In that regard I have to agree with Sami because sometimes trading back doesn't work out. Also, I'm not sure Steve will even agree. If you recall, the front office wanted to wait to get Joe but Steve just said get him and not risk it. Do you think Steve will go for this when he has a business to run here and knows the people want a pass rusher and they have a chance at getting what may be a very special talent?

I'm not saying Bell isn't a good player, I think he could be good. I failed miserably and didn't make any sense that last post. I just like the idea if the opportunity presents itself to slide back. I would agree in saying Bosa is the best defender in this class, but I don't think he's so far the best that he's better than adding another early second rounder. I think the potential to get good value for the pick and pass on Bosa has the opportunity to be there. If Bosa's there and there's not anyone clamoring to trade up then by all means, take Bosa. I just think that teams will be getting anxious to move up to grab their franchise QB and be willing to offer to give up next years first + a second this year +some more, and if that's the case I think you have to at least consider it.

i would actually take bosa. im just making an argument on why LT should absolutely be in consideration regardless of who else is on the board. i still think bosa is a better talent at a position thats even more immediate of a need. my top board currently has bosa, stanley, nkemdiche, ramsey, in that order.

I agree 100% there. I think LT only gets pick if we move back and see Bosa and Ramsey go, I'm not as high on Nkemdiche as you are, I think he's special, but it would be too much of a luxury pick for us 

I'm a bit frightened that anyone here is in your nightmares, let alone dreams.

He had that Flacco Fu Manchu going. It was truly terrifying 

Nassib is a guy that I really like. I think the biggest reason that there's not more hype for him is because he isn't tackling trees like the other D-linemen at PSU.

I had a nightmare that Joey won a contest and got to pick for the Ravens this year in the draft and took the LT first overall XD

If we're going LT with our pick I'd rather see Tunsil out of Old Miss, I think he's about the same talent wise but has a nasty streak that's rare to find. We need to get some nasty back on the team

We could get Bosa (pass rusher) in the first and Vonn Bell (FS) in the second without trading back.

That would be filling needs, and you can do that regardless of location, but I think talent wise, the value is greater by moving back 

I'm going to tell you now this isn't going to happen unless Ozzie feels really really confident, like 100% sure, he can still get him. There's evidence supporting the notion that the Ravens want to get an elite talent behind Suggs now that can be his long-term replacement. Steve himself said he'd like a pass rusher earlier this year before the draft. I also recall rumors that we wanted Alvin Dupree before he went to Pittsburgh. A report came it recently that we tried to trade up to get Mack in 2014.

I really think we're going pass rusher and taking the elite talent. I know Ozzie likes draft picks, but this could be a top 5 pick. I'm not sure he passes on a top 5 player.

All of that points to us grabbing Bosa, which I would love. I think he's what we need, but if you're taking a guy like that you expect him to be on the field day 1 and making an impact. If that's the case then you have around $17 million in cap space tied up between Bosa, Suggs, and Dumerville. Do you cut/trade Suggs or Doom? Do you just rotate all three of them?

I'm going to play devil's advocate for every scenario all year long for every scenario. I love the thought of having so many options having a pick this high, can't ait to see how Ozzie and DeCosta handle it.

I've finally hopped aboard the Ramsey train.

Not only do I think he's farther ahead of the DB class (outside of VGIII) than Bosa is of the OLBs, but he seems to have that fire to be the "dog" on defense.

Really love in the Miami game, they run a screen, and he gets blocked by two guys and cut down. Instead of lay down he jumps up and grabs the receiver and holds them to a short gain. Really goes to show the motor and fight in this guy that we need to put back on our defense

Outside of Cillmatic, I don't think anyone could complain if we took Bosa with our pick. HOWEVER, I think we get much better value talent wise if we slide back a few slots. I think the value is better for grabbing a Ramsey/Nassib+2nd pick, then it would be for a Bosa/Fuller combo. 

Bosa is a beast, but I don't think he's as far ahead of the rest of the rushers as Ramsey is ahead of the other safties

I've been all over Bosa as our first pick up until this point, but the more I watch of him and the Ravens, the more I think we need to trade back a few spots and get an extra 2 this year and an extra 1 next year. That should give us enough new talent this year to end the "rebuild phase" and then enough next year to put us back into the elite team category 

He was one of the healthiest players in the league before coming to Baltimore and managed to stay healthy through 2013. Not sure why he's been injured so much here, but he's not the only player

Time to look at the trainers and the strength/conditioning program? If we were only hit by injuries like this for this year, maybe just a fluke or coincidence, but for what seems like 3 straight years now?

Have they dropped him back into coverage at times? I know with Nassib he drops back into zone a few plays a game and looks awkward AF, but is somewhat effective

Nassib has also become my favorite prospect as of late. I would actually prefer that we trade back and pass on Bosa for a guy like Ramsey or Hargreaves and grab him later.

I think him and Bosa have a very similar skill set and ceiling, where as Bosas floor is higher

Like you said, we'd be weak at DE and LB to switch, but with the position we're in there are plenty of prospects that could allow us to make the transformation if the DC called for it. 

I personally think if we keep up this pace we have a shot at both Bosa and Jack, which would go a long way to making the 4-3 possible, but I also think they have the ability to be studs in the 3-4

I think we're all in agreement that he COULD develop into a Watt type player, but no one is saying that he will be that guy day 1. When you compare him to the rest of the class, especially when you weigh against the needs and team philosophy, he's relatively far ahead of everyone else in this draft class, at least IMO.

He looks like he has the frame to add another 20lbs of muscle, and could easily play DE at 295 for us in the 3-4.

I don't think the RGIII haul is realistic at #3 because if a two teams really wanted Goff, they would ultimately bid themselves up to the higher picks most likely (3 firsts, 1 second rounder was the RGIII trade). I also don't think Goff will go that high; he seems like he's a bit overrated because of his gaudy offensive system, and by being the best of an average QB class.  I think a Julio Jones kind of haul is more realistic: 1st, 2nd, 4th, 1st (next yr), 4th (next yr).

 

But I understand the point is to start a discussion, so I'm game. Trading down would make me disappointed initially, since I really want one of those top-5 or 6 talents. However, I am almost always of the mind that trading down is great value. We have a lot of needs, so getting solid players instead of blue-chip talents could be just what we need. In addition, filling out the roster with solid rookies takes better advantage of the rookie wage scale. This also will lead to more solid players leaving for FA at the end of their rookie contracts, which will benefit the comp. pick formula down the line. 

 

As we get closer to the draft, we will know better how the first and second rounders will fill out. For now, I bet we could get Treadwell late in the first, as well as any of the edge rushers not named Bosa or Nkemdiche. Ramsey could even be a possibility if playing CB has limited his stock at all. One of the blue-chip ILB prospects could fall as well, since we are going to need a Daryl Smith replacement. Ezekiel Elliot could be a possibility if he falls a bit. Kendal Fuller is another one, although he should probably play his senior season because he needs to prove himself healthy and talented enough t be worth a high pick. He's probably a late 2nd at best if he declares early. 

The RGIII haul was just the Redskins being the Redskins. I still think that the Julio Jones value would be great, but not if we're trading down that far. I may be mistaken, but I think the Falcons moved up from 27 to 6. I would imagine we could get similar value moving back from 3-5 back to 6-8. 

I personally hope not, but I certainly think it's possible. I think Joey is being a bit harsh concerning his athleticism. I haven't watched a ton of Penn State games, but I've watched enough where I feel comfortable saying the guy could sneak into the first due to what amounts as an overall weak draft class.

Nassib doesn't lack athleticism and he's sneaky fast and quick around the edge to get to the QB. This is completely wrong. If there's anything I question with him, it's his instincts, which tend to be hit or miss. I've seen more misses than hits, and this is especially evident against the read option and the run game. He's good when rushing the passer but needs work setting the edge. He uses his hands well, although he needs to do better with his leverage. Athleticism isn't a problem with him, however.

The difference between Nassib and Orchard is Orchard got his sacks through gap blitzes and patiently waiting without needing to consequently disengage from the tackle. Nassib actually beats tackles to get to the QB.

I agree with you, when rushing the passer he seems to be able to shed the tackle pretty effectively and often. I think he could fill in like Pernell McPhee did for us. Strong pass rush, and send him as a passing down Blitzer and let his instincts develop over a year or two and watch him become a stud. 

I think Joey was comparing the rise of the prospects, not the prospects themselves

were talking real scenarios, not mock generators.

yea, but it's funny to see the "simulators" being way off. simulations are supposed to have some merit of truth, which at this point doesn't appear likely

How far do we think Nassib is going to rise? He's played a beastly 3 games but was virtually unknown before this year. Do you think he can push himself all the way into the first if he keeps up this pace?

While the idea of moving back and still getting our guy while being in a position to grab Fournette next year, that's about the only reason I could consider moving up.

Like you said, if the teams in front of us have their QB, but what if they don't? What if we wind up at the second pick and Goff goes first to someone who needs a QB? Do you still entertain the idea with Bosa right there?

honestly... the most unrealistic thing there is that we take hargreaves at 2nd overall..

When i did it Hargreaves went #1

were speculating a trade back, which really would be brilliant, but it may just about impossible to trade out of the first round from a top 5 pick lol

Jokes. I find the reputation that Ozzie trades out amusing. There has only been 3 times we haven't picked in the first round. 2004, 2010, and 2012. 

We lost 04 to move up and take Boller, 2010 Denver gave us what we gave up for Boldin (and some), and 2012 where we moved back 5 spots and picked up a fourth round.