sflegend89

Here's Waller matched up with PJ Williams if you're interested, one of the drafts top 8 CB's for sure.

Agreed. There's nothing AB can physically do on the field that Wallace isn't capable of. Like you alluded to, the difference is AB worked his tail off and was determined to become a great player by grinding day in day out and reaching an impeccable level of muscle memory on his routes/catching that can only be accomplished through pure dedication and relentless practice habits. AB was a project coming out of a small school, he didn't just wake up one day and become a better WR than Wallace because of his genetics or by being more "savvy". I think you hit the nail on the head, the difference was effort and attitude. Both Perriman and Engram talked about it at his press conference, the difference maker in the NFL is hard work, talented players are a dime a dozen. That ties into Perriman coming from a football family with an NFL receiver for a father, that work ethic and understanding of it's importance has been instilled in him and that's something the Ravens brass really liked about him. They believe he's willing to put in the work, if talent and genetics trumped work ethic and attitude then DGB would be a top 10 pick.

I was actually hoping the Steelers took Byron Jones, not that he can't potentially be a good corner or anything but he's a better athlete than he is a football player. You never know with corners, Morris Claiborne was a MUCH better prospect coming out of college and he's pretty much flopped in Dallas. I'm happier with Perriman, if you're going to go for a "boom or bust" player I would rather it be at WR where we don't already have anyone like BP than at CB where at least we already have Jimmy who is a proven shutdown guy. Jones has more the skill set of a FS than a corner anyway, potential? yes. Safer pick than BP? No. I would have been game for trading back though, getting an extra 3rd rounder and taking Devin Smith would've been cool but if we weren't ahead of the Jets we would've missed out on all the top WR's (in my opinion) anyway. Besides DS what player was worth trading back for at the top of the 2nd? We probably would've taken Maxx with the pick if we traded back so it definitely worked out for us by just picking at 26.

Yeah it was definitely intended to be a negative breakdown from the get-go. You could turn on film of Calvin Johnson in college and put it in super slow-mo and just nitpick every little detail possible if you wanted to. These players are only human and they are very young while playing in college at that, it's not hard to find things you can criticize in even the players that get drafted top 10. You could turn on film of Kevin White and say a lot of the same things about his route running. At the end of the day the guys doing that breakdown are just fans like any of us, they have their own personal biases, agendas, and short coming evaluating players. If either of those guys were even remotely on the level of an NFL or even college scout at evaluating film they would have a job doing it somewhere, there's a reason they are making low profile youtube videos. They don't know any more about evaluating film than a decent amount of members on this board and they have their biases on top of that.

I watched that breakdown a few days ago, it was horrendously over ambitious to say the least. The guy called Marlon Brown "Malcolm Brown" numerous times, they certainly are weekend warrior film watchers. I also believe the main guy is a Cleveland Browns fan, so of course he's going to go out of his way to be negative. I could tell they already made their verdict to trash Perriman very early in the video and didn't go into it open minded at all. Here were my major gripes, I actually had watched that entire Bowl game before I saw the breakdown so it was very fresh in my mind. The game is on youtube if anyone wants to see the things I'm talking about. 1. Uhhh Perriman had 138 yds in that game, they don't mention that once and you would never guess he had such a great game by how they break it down 2. They consistently criticize Perriman for terrible throws from Holman. They bring up how bad Holman's accuracy was for maybe 5 seconds and never mention it again. They blast Perriman for allowing a ball to get broken up by a db when the throw was clearly low and behind him, the db wouldn't get anywhere near it if Holman could actually put the ball on target. 3. They bring up that Holman doesn't look for Perriman that much and that he's not "the guy" on offense. Interesting because I watched that entire game and Holman targets Perriman constantly. At the end of the game when UCF is trailing Holman literally goes to Perriman for the entire drive in crunch time and Perriman put's the offense on his back to set them up for a TD and keep his team alive. The guy had 9 freakin' receptions and would've had even more if Holman didn't overthrow him multiple times or just not see him completely. 4. Holman is a one read QB, if his first read isn't open he has a very hard time making anything out the play. There's a play where Perriman is WIDE open in the endzone and Holman doesn't see him because he wasn't the primary read and even the announcers mention it. Plus NC St. DL was dominating and Holman was under constant pressure that game to compound his short comings even further. 5. They criticize Perriman for going to the ground after a catch and make a comment along the lines of "Dez Bryant has better body control, he would't go to the ground". Again.. it was a terrible throw low and behind Perriman and he had to go to the ground to even secure the ball. They go on and on about body control and completely brush off the degree of difficulty to stop your momentum going full speed across the field to make a catch behind you at knee level, it's not a matter of "body control" they clearly don't understand the type of catches that term applies to. 6. The only legit point they make the whole video is on Perriman's route shaping. They are correct when they mention that he has a tendency to angle his crossing routes up instead of flattening to create more separation. Perriman's route running is his only area of weakness overall and if you did any research on him you already knew that. Thankfully it's the most correctable short coming a WR can have coming into the NFL because it can be coached, look at Demaryius Thomas' routes in college, they weren't any better than Perriman's. DT took well to NFL coaching, hopefully Perriman can as well.

You say plus 20 lbs like that is a small difference lol. That is the difference in weight between Calvin Johnson and Jordy Nelson, Streeter was thin and lanky, Waller is big, physical run blocker, and built like a TE. Waller also fell in the draft because of his off-field issues, he was projected as a 4th round talent. Streeter didn't have any red flags, he went in the 6th because he just wan't that talented. Streeter played in a pro-style offense at Miami and was actually given opportunities to produce, Waller played in a flexbone option offense where they run the ball HEAVILY and his opportunities were few and far between. I'm not saying Waller is a home run by any stretch but he's a very different type of player than Streeter and he's a lot more talented. Comparing Waller to Streeter because they were both tall, late round WR's is such a one dimensional comparison. When you look past the surface they are very different.

A lot to be excited about but sad to hear about Julian Wilson's injury. What is it with the rookie mini-camp injuries this year? These guys have played years of college ball, probably had over 100 full contact practices during their college careers, regular season games, and most of them have never had a major season ending injury. Already we've had Fowler, Heureman, Wilson, among others get season ending injuries in the span of 2 days in the NFL. It's not even like rookie mini-camps are full throttle, full contact, type of practices. They are the lowest intensity practices they will probably ever have in the NFL. I don't recall such high profile players going down at mini-camp in recent years. I suppose it's just really bad luck. The only other things I could think might be a factor are going from not playing for a while because of the lengthy draft process and being asked to jump right back into action instead of being "eased" back into playing full speed. Also just the pressure of it being their first impression in the NFL and wanting to maybe do too much right away to try to impress the coaches.. I think it's probably a little bit of all those things but primarily just bad luck.

Buck Allen basically said the same thing about USC, I think they just don't want to sound overwhelmed or like their school didn't prepare them adequately, these guys take a lot of pride in the programs they come from and don't want to paint them in a bad light by saying the speed of practice wasn't what they are used to. Plus this is just rookie mini-camp, I actually take them at their word when they say it's not a big jump from their college practices.. because it's not supposed to be. It's just meant to let the rookie's wet their beaks and get familiar with the coaching staff and the NFL practice environment. I wouldn't read that far into it, let's wait until TC starts, that's where the real grind begins and we find out what these kids are really made of.

They are pretty similar in some regards, their combine numbers are virtually identical across every single drill. Missouri threw the ball 452 times during DGB's final active season in 2013. Waller had 6 TD's last year and GT only threw the ball 201 times. DGB played in a scheme that put WR's in a better position to get open/produce and Waller played in a option offense that didn't even throw the ball half as much as Missouri and when they did it was usually out of some flexbone type formation. With that said I still think DGB flashes more on film but to me Waller was an underrated commodity, 6 TD's in that offense is very respectable, Demaryius Thomas career high at GT was 8 TD's in a season. Missouri also did a great job of throwing that goalline fade for DGB, GT runs the ball when they are on the goalline, they aren't going to throw a back shoulder fade for a WR very often even if they do have a weapon like Waller because it doesn't fit their offensive philosophy, most of Waller's TD's came on throws of over 15 yds. Waller doesn't stack up athletically with Calvin or Demaryius coming out of GT but he was still overlooked and undervalued in my opinion.

I feel the same way, if you want to talk about "Play Like A Raven" SSS is the poster boy for that motto. I've loved every minute he's been here and my only regret is that we will only have him for a few seasons. Too bad him and Boldin never got to play together here, that would've been special.

I think Jimmy is going to step into that leadership role even more now that we locked him up long term. I also think Webb is an underrated leader, a lot of the young guys, especially the db's look up to him. Then you have the future leader of the entire defense in CJ, I think he's going to mature into that leadership role really well in the next couple years.

Great post, very interesting stuff in there. Cool to see some stats that actually corroborate my film based comparison to Kevin White from earlier. I didn't do any in depth film study on White like I did for Perriman pre-draft because I knew he was so far out of our range. It was a revelation to sink my teeth into White's film now post-draft and realize we got a virtual doppleganger of a top 10 selection all the way at 26. Loved the point you made about industry groupthink. It definitely plays a role in the pre-draft process, for instance I didn't think Manziel or Tebow had any right going in the first 3 rounds. But because those are sexy picks every talking head in the industry said "upside, playmaker, he's a winner, he won the Heisman, blah blah blah". When it get's forced down your throat over and over eventually you start to subconsciously buy into the hype, even scouts do to a degree. Not that Kevin White is the equivalent to Tebow/Manziel or anything but it is a very real factor in the pre-draft process and is typically why guys who have been in the spotlight get elevated over similar and sometimes better prospects who haven't gotten the same kind of exposure.

Exactly, they were definitely scrambling and discussing the next couple prospects on their board after Maxx got selected. If they planned to take Golson they wouldn't have needed nearly the entirety of their allotted to turn in the card, that's just a dead giveaway. Look how fast Dallas turned in their card when they legitimately planned to take Byron Jones in the 1st. The real answer is that it just makes their entire FO look bad if they admit their arch rival jumped them for their highly coveted prospect. Why would they willingly admit that and bring on a load of negative attention from their fan base when they can just as easily say "Nah, weren't gonna take him anyway". Anyone who takes Colbert at his word on something like that is a fool, it's just common sense not to admit to something like that publicly.

At least those 2 were generally close in talent and only a few picks apart. Comparing Maxx to Jesse James is like us saying Nick Boyle is better than Heath Miller. Steelers fans remind me of a little kid who missed out on the last slice of pizza and tries to convince his friends that his stalk of celery actually tastes better than the pizza and he didn't want it anyway.

In theory it wold be incredible to watch with all the personalities and talent we currently have but like other's have said it's a distraction from football and it makes players more worried about trying to be entertaining on TV than absorbing what they're learning in practice. As awesome as it would be I have to say no because it creates a toxic practice environment and that's why teams are so hard pressed to do HK these days.

Still gives me chills

I agree that neither White or Perriman got drafted for their route running prowess haha. They are both raw talents with high ceilings, White is a bit further along than BP at this point, played a higher level of competition, produced big numbers, and had the spotlight on him for far longer as a potential 1st round player so I see why he was valued higher than Perriman despite being extremely similar prospects long term. The reason I put BP's ceiling even a little bit higher is because of his speed. Don't get me wrong, White is fast, but BP can turn on the afterburners and flat out fly when he get's the ball in space. They have similar speed/quickness off the line up scrimmage and into their breaks but there's no doubt that Perriman has another gear that White doesn't once he get's going.

I don't think saying Perriman has the highest ceiling is biased at all, it's definitely Perriman or DGB. BP is far from the most polished which always creates doubts for teams but he is the total package, speed, strength, quickness, height, frame, YAC, body control, fights for the ball, and contrary to the media narrative, has great hands... the only things he needs to be a top tier WR at the NFL level are things that can be taught like route running, using his hands better to create separation, and just more overall nuance in his technique. Having Bobby Engram as his coach, Steve Smith on the field with him, and Flacco at QB put's him in a great situation to do that.

Dang, kinda expected him to have quite a few suitors though. I still believe we'll add a respectable corner at some point before camp.

Please show me in my post where I said that. All I said was that White is a more polished route runner (which is true and not saying much because it's easily BP's biggest area of weakness), and White has a higher floor (Which in my opinion is true and that's more based on the level of competition than college scheme)

The point I made was still valid, I just accidentally flipped them. Why would someone get more volume in a pro style offense vs spread? I mean if you notice the context it's clear what I meant.

You are correct. Just noticed that I flipped the two, that's why I was talking about more volume going to White though because of WVU's spread offense.

The more film I've watched on on BP then better I feel about the pick. To be honest something that stood out to me the most as one of his strengths is actually his hands. Early catch window with arms extended, pure hands catcher. Doesn't use his forearms to cradle in the ball like Devante Parker does a decent amount. When you put on tape of BP and Kevin White they are really similar players, White also has that early catch window and is a pure hands catcher. Even their body control when they make a leaping grab is extremely similar. The biggest difference to me is just that White played in a pro style offense that throws the ball a lot and BP played in a spread offense and didn't get nearly the same volume of targets. White is the more polished route runner and Perriman has a little more burst when he hits his 2nd gear. You can teach route running, you can't teach speed. I honestly see Perriman as the higher ceiling and White as the higher floor. Very similar players though, surprised more analysts didn't pick up on that comparison. Long term: 1. Amari Cooper 2a. Kevin White 2b. Breshad Perriman 3. Devante Parker 4. Nelson Agholor 5. Philip Dorsett

Even for being a homer for your team that is beyond ridiculous. James was good value where they picked him but he's more of a reliable depth player like Spaeth than the heir to Heath Miller. James doesn't have the suddenness, athleticism, route running prowess, or soft hands that Maxx has. I almost feel bad for even giving this argument any validation by even acknowledging them in a head to head comparison because it's such a landslide. They're just mad about getting jumped for Maxx and are scrambling to assuage some hurt feelings, it's an asinine comparison. I'm more interested in if James is even better than Nick Boyle, that is a legit comparison. Maxx completely outclasses James on film and every scout in the NFL would corroborate that, if you want the final nail in the Coffin. Maxx Williams, (In a Power offense that rarely throws the ball): 36 rec, 569 yds, 15.6 avg, 8 TD's Jesse James (In a pro style offense) 38 rec, 396 yds, 10.4 avg, 3 TD's You really want a laugh? Maxx also out produced James' 2014 numbers when he was a redshirt Freshman. Maxx was legitimately a better TE than James is now when he was 19 years old. The more you dig into this so called "comparison" the more of a mockery it becomes. Steelers fans can live in fantasy land all they want in the offseason, once the games start the cold hard reality will set in for them.

Maybe I'm missing something here but I feel like a lot of teams who needed DL help were sleeping big time on him in the 2nd and especially early in the 3rd. I was convinced that he would be the Steelers pick in the 2nd after we nabbed Maxx, I was actually getting bummed out that the Steelers would salvage that situation by at least coming away with Davis. The fact that we were able to get him an entire round later blew my mind and I just couldn't comprehend a talent like that at a valuable position falling so far. Apparently Davis felt the same way, he really did seem genuinely shocked that he made it out of the 2nd round entirely, let alone late 3rd. I anticipated that Perriman had a real shot to make it to us, never did I even remotely expect Williams making it to us in the 2nd, and if you told me Carl Davis would make it to us in the 3rd I would laugh you out of the building. I think when the Davis pick was announced there were quite a few war rooms that immediately wished they had a mulligan, Ozzie always does a great job keeping the DL stocked in the mid rounds and other GM's know it.