law215

Aiken went from leading receiver to all but forgotten. He has had some critical drops and that can't happen with a team pushing for the playoffs and have veterans that are better. It was frustrating watching him miss the opportunities he had.

Problems with the Ravens

1. Harbs

Hire coordinators that are friends. Does not appear to have influence over play-calling or scheme. Can’t have a head coach that can not influence the game plan. The result is a revolving door of coordinators. Ravens hire former coaches because Harbs can’t teach young coordinators that would be on the staff for a long period of time.

Almost every week he talks about running the football, CBs having bad eyes/technique, being disciplined, vague clichés like ‘play winning football’.

Yet what you see on the field is Joe passing the too much, CB with the eyes in the backfield, stupid penalties, lack of urgency. I don’t think the players or coordinators listen to him or fear him.

You can’t pay everybody, so a coach must develop young players. Ravens rely on old guys to be starters way too much. That's why the can not sustain high level of play the last few season.

If the talent was that bad, they would not be in so many close games. It’s play calling and poor execution. That is the head coaches responsibility to control.

2. Joe Flacco
I have defended Flacco for years. Many fans stated his contract would handicap the Ravens and they were right.

Because of the contract, FO could not bring in or retain top talent. Flacco can not carry the offense. He needs a run game, o-line, and a receiver like Boldin that’s open even when he is covered. He needs an OC to call the plays and whisper in the head phones when to change the play. He need a QB coach to maintain his mechanics

After 9 years and $120 M, that’s one player with a lot of needs. A guy you paid to be a solution, but is often a problem. His pick yesterday was embarrassing.

3. OZ/DeCosta. Hortiz
The evaluation from scouts and drafting has been terrible for years. Even OZ stated that much. Ravens have need playmakers on both sides of the balls, yet that continue to draft DT,DE, and ILBs. Drafting receivers that can’t catch.

They need a new scouting department even if it means paying more to steal from another team.

I am not sure it was effort or that fact Bengals are just more talented than the guys we have and the coaching is better.

Harbs comment that "its only natural" to not put out a better effort is unacceptable. It contradicts everything he said going into the game.

Ravens played this game like they just wanted to pad stats. Flacco targeted Pitta 16 times, throwing the ball 49 times. Is he on an incentive contract because the problem all year was throwing the ball too much.

Harbs hire his friends
Joe throws to his buddy and can't read a defense (poor work ethic)
Pees plays if safe with a lead
OZ cant draft WR ,CB,S well

This team is a mess. They are lucky to be 8-8. They are a tip ball away from 7-9.

Anything less than many changes is unacceptable.

First cuts.

1. Joe Hortiz is in his 19th season with the Ravens and 7th as Baltimore’s director of college scouting. He is responsible for all aspects of the college process, coordinating the schedules and cross-checking duties of the area and regional scouts. Hortiz also manages the team’s draft preparation and the evaluation and ranking process of hundreds of NFL draft-eligible prospects.

If he is in his 7th year, then that matches the time when the Ravens drafts really declined. 2009 – present. Long list since 2009 of failure to effectively evaluate talent

He will be gone before Steve even considers releasing OZ.

2. Marty Mornhinweg who is in his second year with the Ravens, took over as offensive coordinator after Week 5 in 2016. He originally joined the Ravens in 2015 as quarterbacks coach. Prior to his 2015 Baltimore arrival, the 22-year NFL coaching veteran spent the 2013-14 seasons as offensive coordinator of the New York Jets

So he’s been with the Ravens and Jets. Both offensive units stink and QBs don’t progress. He should not make it pass tomorrow imo.

3. Juan/ Castillo, a 35-year coaching veteran, is in his fourth season with the Ravens and his third as the team’s offensive line coach. Castillo was promoted to coach the offensive line in 2014 after serving as the Ravens’ run game coordinator in 2013. Last season (2015), Castillo guided an offensive line that helped produce a franchise-record 4,271 net passing yards and the second-most total net yards (5,749) in team history. In 2014, Castillo led an O-line that permitted just 19 sacks, the second fewest in team history (17 in 2006), ranking behind only Denver (17) as the NFL’s fewest.

Ravens have not been a good run team since Castillo was hired. His 2014 accomplishments align with when Kubiak was here.

Failed to develop o-linemen. Hurst, Jensen, Wesley which limits quality depth. His title as run game coordinator was a bad joke.

Harbs is the coordinators boss. How many coordinators will Oz have to hire before he starts looking at the coach?

I read Greg Roman formerly of Bill and 49ers may be in the mix. Another friend of Harbs. SMH

Firing Harbaugh or losing Flacco would be the dumbest thing the Ravens can do. The secondary is extremely slow. The pass rush is extremely old. The WR bunch is extremely average. Perriman has a steep learning curve and we have no legit playmakers at wideout. CB, OLB, WR. Fix any 2 of those 3 and we will have a better record next year. Also a must - get an OC that works well with Flacco like Kubiak once did. Flacco is not the problem, when he's put into a system that works for him. He's an above avg system QB. Making extreme moves like cutting HC or QB will only push us back onto the Browns level.

In other words

the slow secondary
weak pass rush
poor Wr bunch
game plan of OC or offensive system


are not Harbs responsibility? If not Harbs responsibility , then who is to blame?

How about being 31-33 over the last 4 years?

Maybe the problem is having a head coach who has so little responsibility in the problems that he is clueless on how to fix them.

  1 hour ago, law215 said:

Once Flacco got paid and the front office could not afford to deal Harbs a loaded hand, he has done nothing but throw coordinators and players under the bus.

His history of winning was when he inherited

pro bowlers and HOFs on defense
had a solid offense line
had productive vets and free agents like Heap, Mason, Maghee
and a better QB than Billick ever had
has a front office constantly provides him with former head coaches on his staff since they know he can't do it on his own

Now that he has to COACH and develop, he can't win

yeah, he also inherited a losing team. We were 5-11 when he got here in spite of all the "greatness" he inherited.

What does Harbs bring to the table?

In the 2007 5-11 season Billick had McNair who was old and injured and Kyle Boller. The defense was top 5, solid offensive line with Yanda, Grubbs, Jason Brown, Gaither, pro bowl TE Heap and Wr Mason were already on the team.

Rex Ryan as DC, FB Lorenzo ONeal, RB McGahee. That's a team with great players.

Harbs was setup for success.
When did you start following the Ravens?

I'm happy for Pitta who is blessed to come back from such a devastating injury.

I don't buy the emotional let down. This team is not well coached, has a limited pass rush, and has a secondary that most receivers can take advantage of.

I expected this which is why I wasn't upset after the lose to Pitt!
If we really want to get back to winning.

Fire Ozzie and promote Eric Decosta! I'm tired of trading back for picks and bad deals!
Fire Harbs! The coaches lost us at least 4 games! I'd love to see Tom Coughlin!
Pull #5 in the office and ask him does he know what are team colors are!
Cut Wright, Webb, and Elam!
Ask Suggs and Doom for pay cuts. If not, thank you for your service! Take the cap hit! We have to get younger!
Find a way to keep our best player on defense BWILL

I only question one point. Oz mentioned in last years end of year conference that Decosta has been leading the draft room and taking lead on personnel decisions. Steve said DeCosta is like having 2 GMs. Because of that, I think you keep been both, but get a new fresh perspective from outside.

Best loss of the season. We moved up a few spots for the draft. Our needs are faster cover guys, better pass rushers, better offensive lineman who can block consistently, and receivers who can actually get open and catch the ball. Grab a few high dollar young players in free agency, cut some older and slower expensive players, and get more speed in the draft. Most importantly please get some creative coaches on offense. I am sick of watching 3rd down and 8 and we throw a 5 yard pass and punt. I am sick of watching our defense give a 6 yard cushion for easy completions. I am still a fan but come on man!!!! Bring Torrey Smith back, at least he could get open and catch the football and you can probably work out a good deal for him. Get the best offensive line players out there, pass protection and run blocking can make any offense look good even ours. See you all in the summer.

The problem with counting on draft spot is the Ravens have not drafted playmakers in the first 2 rounds in a long time. Offensive lineman are safe bets in the first round. Finding the elite pass rushers, WR, CB, and safties are what improves your team. It's also what OZ has not done well as of late.

Once Flacco got paid and the front office could not afford to deal Harbs a loaded hand, he has done nothing but throw coordinators and players under the bus.

His history of winning was when he inherited

pro bowlers and HOFs on defense
had a solid offense line
had productive vets and free agents like Heap, Mason, Maghee
and a better QB than Billick ever had
has a front office constantly provides him with former head coaches on his staff since they know he can't do it on his own

Now that he has to COACH and develop, he can't win

  5 hours ago, law215 said:

  6 hours ago, whobilly said:

  11 hours ago, sizzlingdoom said:

I'd like to see:
SSS with 18 rec for 243 yards and 2tds
Tucker nail a 70 yarder with 5 yards to spare
Joe not play AT ALL, And Mallet tear it up, resulting in a comp pick
All the young players on D, esp Judon
A loss. Yeah scold me if you want, but it could make a huge difference for the future of the Ravens
Harbaugh coach like he's coached all year, which should result in getting canned
Perriman step up, and show us he can be a major contributer for the future

It would take all of 10 seconds for Harbaugh to get another job. Don't hold your breath on Perriman. Not a Player just another WR "Roster Filler"

It might take Harbs 10 seconds to find another job, but to think missing playoffs 3 out of the last 4 years won't warm his seat is a mistake.

Harbs inherited a team that in 2006 was 13-3 and 2007 was 5-11 because QB was hurt. Ownership was tired of Billick. Since the vets left in 2012, what has he done? ...

Make the playoffs in one season sliding under the door as a wildcard, go through 3 OCs (Caldwell, Trestman, Marty), one of the most penalized teams, draft picks not developing or seeing significant playing time, and made in game decisions that cost the team wins.

2017 is a hot seat year.

You forgot to add the Super Bowl WIN. Also forgot to mention IF Lee Evans hangs onto the TD Pass in NE in 2011 we would have made two SB appearances. Ask the fans of the Eagles, Browns, Bills, Chargers, Bengals, Texans, Titans, Jags, Chiefs, Falcons, Rams, Cardinals, Bears, Lions, Vikings, and several others how they feel about the Ravens.

Harbs is that you? Because other teams are bad, don't expect me to lower my expectations. The team is bigger than blind loyalty to its head coach

Same "the guys fought hard" rhetoric. 64 plays and only 15 runs. Absolutely pathetic coaching job. In a meaningless game you drop back your QB 49 times, passing on the 2 yard line. Pathetic. Mosley carted off.

Harbs blows a lot of hot air and false hope. Is there any doubt if they beat the Steelers, then Bengals would have knock them out of the playoffs.

Team looks like they mailed it in this week. First time the team looks like they will not play hard for Harbs. His seat is getting hotter.

Defense is being carved up. All this without AJ Green.

First drive and Flacco has been hit twice and almost picked. Is an injury worth just passing to pad numbers in a meaningless game?

  5 hours ago, sizzlingdoom said:

I'd like to see:
SSS with 18 rec for 243 yards and 2tds
Tucker nail a 70 yarder with 5 yards to spare
Joe not play AT ALL, And Mallet tear it up, resulting in a comp pick
All the young players on D, esp Judon
A loss. Yeah scold me if you want, but it could make a huge difference for the future of the Ravens
Harbaugh coach like he's coached all year, which should result in getting canned
Perriman step up, and show us he can be a major contributer for the future

It would take all of 10 seconds for Harbaugh to get another job. Don't hold your breath on Perriman. Not a Player just another WR "Roster Filler"

It might take Harbs 10 seconds to find another job, but to think missing playoffs 3 out of the last 4 years won't warm his seat is a mistake.

Harbs inherited a team that in 2006 was 13-3 and 2007 was 5-11 because QB was hurt. Ownership was tired of Billick. Since the vets left in 2012, what has he done? ...

Make the playoffs in one season sliding under the door as a wildcard, go through 3 OCs (Caldwell, Trestman, Marty), one of the most penalized teams, draft picks not developing or seeing significant playing time, and made in game decisions that cost the team wins.

2017 is a hot seat year.

I'd like to see Ravens walk off the field completely healthy.

That's right throw Flacco out there with Hurst in the line-up. SMH

I say we bring back Rex Ryan. We can say whatever we ant about Dean Pees having the #5 defense in the NFL- what does it mean if we cannot count on him when we need to?

Over the past two years our defense under Pees has shown that Bend but don't Break ALWAYS breaks at the wrong time and that NO lead is safe.

2015
Week 1 The Broncos rally with 28 seconds left to beat us 19-13
Week 2. The Raiders rally behind Derek Carr to score the game winner with 26 seconds left leading the Raiders to a 37-33 win
Week 3. The Ravens blow a 14 point 4th quarter lead to the Bengals losing 28-24
Week 5. Jsoh McCown throws for 400 yards to come from behind and tie the came with seconds left and then leads a scoring drive to victory in over us in OT giving them a 33-30 win
Week 6. The 49ers and Kapernick hits a 51 yard pass to ABoldin and then a 21 yarder to Q Patton to lead the 49ers to a 4th quarter victory over us 25-20

Week 9. The Jags win on the last play of the game with a Jason Myers FG for a 22-20 victory over us

Week 13. Dolphins score two TDs in under a minute to beat the Ravens 15-13
Week 14 and 15 were blowouts losing to the Seahawks and Chiefs 35-6 and 34-14 respectively

Week 17 we saw Andy Dalton throw two 4th quarter TD passes to rally the Bengals past the Ravens 24-16

2016
Week 4. DCarr throws 4 TD passes including his final TD pass to Michael Crabtree to Rally the Raiders to a 28-27 victory in BMORE

Week 5. The Skins take the lead on a 50 yard drive in the fourth quarter (perriman later drops a TD pass in a comeback attempt but another 4th quarter comeback sinks us)

Week 6. Giants use a 75 yard 2nd half TD pass and then a 66 yarder to Odell Beckham with 1:24 left in the 4th to beat us 27-23

Week 7. The Jets send Ryan Fitzpatrick in for injured Geno Smith and Fitz leads the woeful Jets to 3 second half TDs for a 24-16 victory over us

Week 11. The Cowboys see rookie Dak Prescott lead them to 14 second half points to come from behind an beat us 27-17

Week 14. The Patriots see us rally and seize control of momentum heading into the 4th quarter only to give up an 80 yard TD pass to Chis Hogan sealing our fate with a 30-23 loss to the Pats.

Week 16. The Sqeelers erased a 14 point fourth quarter lead and scored 24 of their 31 points in the 2nd half (including 21 in the fourth quarter)

Pees bend but don't break philosophy doesn't work bc it ALWAYS breaks at the worst opportune movements. That has happened in 15 of our 17 loses over the past two years. (and BTW if we look at 2014 it is just as bad). That is a big enough sample. Pees should go. (I wouldn't mind bringing Rex back) but Rex or not - Pees got to go or it will be more of the same in 2017!

My only argument against Rex defense has been lit up by Tom Brady during Ryan tenure. Bills defense has been no better than Ravens lately no matter the QB. Pees at least keeps the game close no matter who the Ravens have play or where.

His lack of aggressive play calling with a lead is a concern. Everything looks like prevent defense when there is no pass rush.

I wouldn't be upset if they did not fire Harbs, but you have to put him on notice.

He cost the team 2 games on decision making
the team does not play disciplined on the field, too many penalties
he can't control he Coordinators. They run the show on game day without supervision. The bone heading play calling needs to stop on both sides of the ball.
Does not have an identity anymore. They missed 3 out of last 4 playoff. That's not a winning culture.

Some team would be wise to give McDaniels in NE another chance or Kyle Shanahan. A young coach to a team with vets to help control locker room, established front office, and a QB already in place.

All of the 4 changes revolve around OZ job. You know he has not performed well if blog writers are pointing it out.

I agree. A few changes and the Ravens could be a serious contender next season.

1. They need an OC with a run first mentality. Kubiak did not make Joe better. He made the run game better and was a better play caller. Both helped Joe who is not a cerebral QB and can not carry an offense on his own. There is talent of the offense already to attract a good OC.

2. Get another voice in the draft room, contracts, and scouting department. Ravens went into last offseason talking about getting playmakers, pass rushers, and guys to close out games. They missed on Correa ,who was supposed to be a pass rusher at that position in the draft, moved back in the 2nd round with consensus top talent on the board, waited until round 4 to add to an injury prone and slow secondary, and doubled down on D-linemen with talent already on roster.

They made bad choices on contracts and who they ,IMO, did not do enough to keep. Wright was a bad signing, Webb was paid too much money, and Hester was a waste of time and money. Yet not enough cap so pester Boldin to take a pay cut, can't keep KO because he's too expensive. Let Pollard and Stewart go. Both are not great players but is better than Levine and Elam who they kept. SMH.

OZ is always bringing old players to cover that fact he misses in the draft. When undrafted guys out play guys you draft in the 1st and 2nd rounds, you need another voice in the room. I'm not saying fire OZ, but he need a different voice in the room to make these personnel decision. DeCosta is not the answer either.

Drop the money ball mentality and be aggressive to get a game changer.

3. Pees is not the issue. Ravens need a thumper in the secondary and better CB.

The fact that Pees can have these guys in the top 5 defense for most of the year with limited pass rush and poor CB proves he's a good coach. I would not put these guys on an island, blitzing with the game on the line. They are not athletic enough to make plays. Safeties are too small to bring down boney Antonio Brown.

3.

  7 hours ago, law215 said:

I know the truth hurts. Tell me how many sacks Correa has? Spence or Ngakoue would be more useful to go along with a Suggs or Doom. The fact your 5th rounder is more productive proves the 2nd round was a miss.

Why ask Boldin to take a pay cut in the first place? Then pays Smith and Webb top money to get burned and be injured on the sideline. Pay Wright who is a liability

You are actually defending Castillo. What O-line have you been watching for the last few years. Most penalized, near the bottom of league in rushing. Castillo is best o-line coach like Billick was an offensive guru. It is not about reps but results.

 

Truth? All you are doing is making stuff up.

Webb signed his deal in 2012 (Boldin was still here) & Jimmy signed his deal last year - 3 years after Boldin left. So the Ravens didn't cut Boldin to sign Webb & Smith like YOU claim.

And if you knew anything about football, you would know that a O-line position coach has NOTHING to do with what happens in the actual game on game day or that an o-line coach has nothing to do with our rushing stats. Again, I'll take the word of experienced experts in the field over a nobody on the message board.  Castillo has had to work with crap (Hurst, Shipley, etc) and still put together a decent o-line. KO - ever hear of him? Who did he learn from? The Ravens started 2 rookies on the left side of their o-line this year - that's unheard of. And they played great. But all you want to do is regurgitate ignorant, uninformed monkey poo.

If OZ can admit his recent drafts were below standard, why are you defending it. A position coach has nothing to do with what happen on the field? And I know nothing about football. lol

One statement Castillo has to work with crap then the next you credit him with drafting KO. What a joke.

It's not about when but who he chooses to pay or be willing to let go.

  3 hours ago, law215 said:

I want to put this out there for all the Harbs and “In OZ We Trust” blind loyalist.

1. Pass rusher was, according to Steve, the biggest need.
a. However, they pass on Noah Spence, home grown kid Yannick Ngakoue, and don’t make a move for Irvin.
b. Meanwhile Correa is drafted in the 2nd round, but can’t get on the field.
c. He relys on guys north of 33 years old to run down QBs in the 4th quarter. Not smart.
2. The secondary has needed improvement for the last 4 years. What have they done?
a. Cut Pollard who was an intimidator and knock out artist. Not every safety is the next Reed. You still need guys that can force fumbles and tackle.
b. Offer Wright to a contract. Are you kidding me? The guy is a bum.
c. Release Stewart, who is ballin for the Broncos.
d. Cut Brooks who was their most physical safety. These pass weeks you can see Weddle is too small to get down guys. How can’t he knock down boney Antonio Brown?
e. Waiting until the 4th round to draft a CB
f. How is Elam on the team? Too arrogant to concede that his 1st round pick is terrible
3. Poor use of Cap and Talent
a. Pass few seasons drafted Gilmore, Williams, Boyle. Already have Pitta, converted Waller and Brown to TE. Yet spend money on 35 year Ben Watson. Not a long-term plan. Sometimes I wonder if He and Harbs are on the same page.
b. The Devin Hester experiment was a disaster
c. Draft Perriman in the 1st round because he has speed. How many deep balls was he thrown? Slants, Screens, end arounds. If Campanero can get 39 yards, maybe Perriman with 4.3 speed get a TD. How many times he is on the field? I get that he is not consistent, but he will never be without opportunities. Can’t have a 1st rounder not part of the weekly game plan.
d. I know Marty is the OC, but Harbs is the HEAD coach. Shouldn’t he walk over to Marty and say “Run the Ball!”
e. I can go on all day about drafting receivers that can’t catch.
4. Identity Crisis, devaluing players
a. I have never seen a GM that wins a super bowl then immediately blows up a team the way OZ does. Cut Dilfer for Gerbac. Didn’t learn from that and then cut Boldin, who is really a big part of Flacco playoff success. SMH
b. Ravens use to be a power running team. Harbs hires his buddy Castillo, and the Offense line and run game have been terrible since. Flacco is an average QB (9 years of stats proves it), yet they lean on him instead of what has been successful for Ravens championship teams, the run game and paly action.

Where is Pollard playing at? Where did he play last year? He didn't because he sucks.

Stewart wasn't cut - he signed with his hometown team much like Lebron did with Cleveland (He wasn't going to sign with anyone but the Broncos)

How did Terrence Brooks do against the Ravens for Philly? - oh wait, he was riding the bench the entire game.

They didn't cut Boldin, they traded him because he was one of the highest paid WR at the time and wouldn't take a pay-cut. That saved money was spent on signing Dumervil.

Noah Spence had substance abuse issues, I guess you haven't been around long enough to hear about the former Ravens "off-field" issues. No way was he getting drafted by this team at that time. He's got 1 more sack than Matt Judon - that's a high 2nd Round vs 5th Round, you think that's better?

Juan Castillo is considered one of the best O-line coaches in the NFL. Not by a bunch of clowns on the internet, but by Owners, Coaches, GMs, Owners, etc - people that actually know what they're doing and don't just make up facts on a message board. That's why he runs all the O-line drills at the NFL combine (the place where all teams send their scouts and coaches to evaluate the talent. Kinda makes sense to have one of the best guys running players through the drills, doesn't it?)

Try to not make stuff up when you post, it doesn't lend credence to your argument.

I know the truth hurts. Tell me how many sacks Correa has? Spence or Ngakoue would be more useful to go along with a Suggs or Doom. The fact your 5th rounder is more productive proves the 2nd round was a miss.

Why ask Boldin to take a pay cut in the first place? Then pays Smith and Webb top money to get burned and be injured on the sideline. Pay Wright who is a liability

You are actually defending Castillo. What O-line have you been watching for the last few years. Most penalized, near the bottom of league in rushing. Castillo is best o-line coach like Billick was an offensive guru. It is not about reps but results.

Absolutely nothing!

It would be a disaster to go out there for pride and have Stanley, Flacco, Mosley, Wallace, Pitta, Dixon tear up a knee or worst. Use this as an opportunity to evaluate players on the bubble, future contract, and coaching schemes going forward. You can say what you want about skill level, but they played with heart and have nothing to prove.

Yes, injuries are part of the game. But for the sake of 9 wins, who are you willing to sacrifice in a meaningless game. treat it like a 5th preseason game.