RayRocks

It really depends ...if we don;t get any serious injuries to key players etc. I for one said earlier that the Urban loss is bigger than people think. You are right..its been 3 weeks now..it will be 5 by the time the season starts..so at worst he would be out for 7 weeks and at best 3 weeks. So lets be optimistic and say he would be back training after week 4. 

 

I think he should return...i think he can make it easy into the season. The bulk of his recovery ( 5 weeks) will already be there come the broncos game. So its just 4-6 games out I feel. 

I believe IR-DR means a minimum of 8 games, with a maximum of 10 before you have to be active.  If Urban really is just 4-5 weeks away from being ready to play, then there's also the option to leave him on the active roster and just keep him inactive for the first quarter of the season (at least one DL will be inactive anyway).  The only issue there comes if we suffer other injuries on the DL.

I'm expecting his recovery to be at least 6-7 weeks into the season, which would give him another few weeks to get back in shape before coming off the IR-DR.

As of now I would want to use it on Urban.  Its really only between Elam and Urban and if Brooks would not have come back as soon as he did I probably would have leaned towards using it on Elam.  Urban was playing extremely well before he got hurt earlier in camp and if he can come back and give a mid season pass rush boost then I am all for it.  When Urban went down they said a 8-12 week injury and it has already been about 3?  This all is based on the assumption we use by week 1 and don't save it for in season.

Personally, I think the option is either Urban, or "save it just in case."  I think it really will be an evaluation next week where the doctors will give an update on his recovery and if he's on pace for an October return, then it might be worth using.

I think in the 4 years (if my memory serves) of the IR-designate to return, we only used it once (on Ray Lewis).  The number of "major" in-season injuries that occur and are less than a 12 week return time-table are pretty slim, and I think most of those seem to be "minor" fractures or muscle tears.  It seems that all other season ending injuries as a 3-10 month recovery process. 

The team very well could lose an important player to one of those returnable "major" injuries and get a star back for a playoff run, but that's assuming that IF we lost a "star" player we'd even be eligible for the playoffs to begin with.  The reason Ray was given the ID-DR was because he was an older star who was on his last ride despite being a shell of his former self, physically.  He happened to suffer an injury that put him exactly at the time-table that would bring him back for the playoffs, and because the backups were just as capable as he was, physically, at that point we didn't really miss too much.  There aren't many situations I can think of with this team where the same thing would happen because there isn't great depth under our "star" players (Flacco, Suggs, Jimmy, SSS, Tucker, etc.).

Personally, for these reasons, I'm in favor of using the IR-DR on Urban... but there is definitely a risk involved.  However, getting a fresh pass rusher onto the team mid-season could be exactly the boost we'd need after the bye week so there are possible great rewards as well.

I think it's also worth noting that it's particularly difficult doing sprints while wearing a brace.

It's also worth noting that Ray Rice suffered a thigh bruise his rookie year and missed 4 games (3 regular season + 1 playoff) and nearly a month because of it.

To all of the people saying "oh he just fell on it he should be playing," other players missed the same amount of time for similar injuries on this team and ended up being fine.  Perriman will hopefully be back before the last preseason game and maybe the Broncos won't be sure how to gameplan for him.

i follow pretty much every team on twitter and other NFL links. I see who's out for other teams as well..thankfully we haven't lost a player the calibre of a pouncy or nelson but we aren;t getting healthier..in preseason one can go through a rough patch but we haven't recovered..we aren't getting players back healthy..they come back..and get re-injured..not good.

 

Right now Harbs is winning the most brutal bootcamp battle.

I don't think Harbs went any harder in training camp this year than he has in his previous 7 training camps, and typically I'd say it's paid off.  I'd venture to guess that 80% of the players that are "hurt" right now would probably play if it was a real game.  I'd expect almost everyone to come back at full strength next week, barring any major injuries in the Redskins game.

This whole "He's Amendola 2.0" thing kinda interests me.

Amendola has played in 11 or more games every single year except for 2011 when he dislocated his elbow in the season opener. That was more of a freak accident, and other than that year he's averaged 52 catches per season.  If we got 52 catches out of Campanero for one season I'd call that a massive success for a a 7th round pick.

Even if he caught 40 passes for each of the next 3 years, he'd still be worth keeping on the roster.  The Ravens have never had a 3rd receiver catch over 40 balls since Flacco was drafted (outside of a TE and/or RB).

If Campanero has a career similar to Amendola and misses 3-5 games a year because of injury, he's still worth keeping around until the end of his rookie deal.

I disagree with the Colston comparison as he's not really a deep threat like Megatron or even Waller.  The Calvin comparison honestly shouldn't happen since Waller has proven nothing, but they come from the fact they have similar size and weight (Colston is 20+ pounds lighter than either of them) and the fact they both ran very fast 40s for their size (4.3 for Calvin, 4.4 for Waller) where as Colston's 40 was more in line of a guy his size (4.5).  Most importantly, Calvin and Darren come from the same school. 

 

I don't agree with the Calvin comparison as Waller hasn't proven to be on that level on the field, but in terms of measurables, it's the right one

My comparison was less "physically" and more how I expect them to be used.  Calvin is a really complete receiver and the only part of his game that was really questioned coming out was his route running.  Waller is more stiff in the hips than Johnson is/was, and that's not necessarily a knock on Waller - CJ has incredibly loose hips for a man of his length.

 

Baltimore Ravens ‏@Ravens  2m2 minutes ago

RB Lorenzo Taliaferro has a MCL knee injury that will keep him out a few weeks, per Harbs.

 

If "a few" means 2-3 weeks, I could see them just keeping the 3 RB's on the team for the opening game and have 2 active for the first game if LT needs a few extra days.  It's a little risky, but better than losing a player to another team.

If "a few" means 3-5, then Magee (or FT) will almost certainly be on the active roster to start the season.

I think people are making some strange comparisons for Waller.  I like him quite a bit, but I see him more as a Marques Colston type than I do Megatron, or whatever other big-bodied WR's he'd been compared to.

I think he'll be best off using his body and above average speed/quickness in the middle of the field, with the ability to be a threat in the Red Zone fairly often and splash plays on occasion. 

I see Perriman getting closer and closer to the PUP. If he cant practice there is no reason to consider him on the roster. The Ravens can field a very good WR corps without him. I expect them to make a decision about that soon and get ready for the start of the season without him. Waller, Aiken, Campenaro, Sr., Brown, Butler and Carter can handle it until game 7. Get the kid 100% ready. rushing it would be a mistake. Lets use him as a weapon in the playoffs when its needed.

This has been explained probably 100+ times already, but Perriman CANNOT go to the PUP list.  It's either he's on the active roster for the first game of the season or they put him on IR.  If it was deemed that his injury could take another 2+ months, they could give him the IR - designated to return status which I think would put him back week 9.

Those are the only options, and even if Perriman needed to miss the first game or two, I doubt they would exercise any of the other options.

There we go Arthur! 

I still think we find a way to keep him.

Come on Perriman your 21 years old it doesn't take that long for that knee to heal. This is beginning to look a bit suspicious. They may wait until the swelling is all gone and do another MRI to discover something more serious that's what it seem like they are doing to me.

You don't understand what a bone bruise is if you're making this statement.  Two weeks to heal sounds about right, and I think it's been about 11 days.  As long as he's back for preseason games 2-4 he'll still have plenty of time to get up to speed and make an impact early in the season.

I think the question is can you count on Urban to stay healthy for even one game?

At least Marlon has shown some durability by playing the entire 2013 season, and he did bulk up to get stronger and tougher.

More than likely, they'll give the IR-DTR to Urban and cross their fingers, and if Marlon needs extra time, they'll deactivate him if it's just for a few weeks, but if it's longer, he gets IR'd or cut with the understanding that as soon as a roster spot opens, he gets resigned--maybe for a bit more money than he was previously making, though I can also see Marlon getting the Bajema treatment too this year. Because we are that deep in WRs with 3 who have comparable skillsets to Marlon (Aiken, Butler, and Daniel Brown who I can see on our PS) As for Waller, he's a lot faster than Marlon, so they don't compare.

Our coaches seem high on Marlon, so who can say for sure what they're going to do with him, just wish he'd get and stay healthy. Same goes for all our other oft-injured guys. We've got championship caliber talent but much of it can't be counted on for the whole season.

According to reports, Marlon is over his back injury and now just has a hamstring issue.  My guess is he'll be fine within a week or two.

Can they just let him stay active, and heal from his injuries?? Get him back late season week 12-13 or so..

But IR Designate to return if I remember correctly can only be used for 1 player per team, per year. Now Brent Urban is a nice player but Im not using IR Designate to return on him, because with a whole preseason to go and 16 game plus hopefully playoffs any of our core pillar franchise players could go down long term but not season ending, like Ray Lewis did before. Pick a name on our Defense..Sizzle,Dum,Jimmy, etc those are IR Designate type players.

Now I know you can do unlimited PUP and unlimited IR, but if he has a legitimate return possibility to return later in season IR is not an option because then the player is gone for the year. So I would suggest PUP List him that will get you to week 6 of the regular season, then carry him as a activity member of the roster who's not suiting up on game day. Kind of like they did all year last year with Arthur Brown LBr. Then come week 12-13 he will be ready to play

You can't PUP list him.  It's either IR or IR designated to return.  There's a case to be made for the designated to return for Urban, because we've only used it once in 3 years and he's slated to be available in October.  IR designated to return is a minimum of 8 weeks before you can be activated, so it becomes really tricky because there are so few injuries that have a healing time of 6-8 weeks.  It seems like most are healed in 2-3 week, while the more severe ones are 3-12 months.

Reposting my reply from the Scout.com forums... my take on possibly using the IR-Designated to return.

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I'm not overthinking the knee injury unless he's still not practicing by Monday.  I would assume it's a light bone bruise, not just the skin of the knee that was bruised.

I'd temper my expectations of Perriman to 600-700 yards.  He's still raw and not refined in his routes, so I would guess at least 30-40% of his yards will come from big plays for now.

I'm not sure why people are concerned about Perriman's injury.  A bone bruise probably will take a week or so to heal depending on how deep it is.  I was expecting at least 5-6 days, so as long as he's practicing before the end of the weekend I won't be worried.

Brown, on the other hand, is someone I worry about.  Hopefully it's just something that requires rest.

and don't forget about when pitta and brooks return.

You don't factor those in since there's a good chance there will be at least 1-2 players on IR between weeks 1 and 6.

a bruised knee isnt a major concern, it hurts, causes swelling, which can lead to ligament damage if you attempt to play on it at full speed, but it isnt something that generally lingers, nags, or takes a while to heal. 

 

i hate knowing we probably wont be seeing him play our preseason debut, but id rather him sit it out than to aggravate it.

I wouldn't even go as far as to say he won't play against the Saints.  We have 10 more days before that game, so I think as long as he practices again before the end of the weekend he'll play a few snaps in that game.  Unless it's a really deep bruise, 5-8 days would be an expected amount of time for healing.

Carl Davis is going to get plenty of snaps

Yeah, I'd like to wait until at least 2 weeks after the vets have reported before I'll decide that a rookie will be shelved for the year.

wow this thread is ridiculous. melvin is an undrafted corner at best. hes used as a band aid, thats it.

Melvin had some spectacular moments last year once he started to play.  He was exposed some against Brady and the Pats, but to say "he's a band aid" is definitely undervaluing him.

For a second year player with pretty much no experience, he played better than any of the other corners (outside Webb and Smith) last year.  I think as a 4th corner entering his third year, he provides excellent depth and already some solid experience at the position.

I think it's between he and Vaughn for a roster spot. If i'm not mistaken, Vaughn also has return experience. We also have to remember that Asa Jackson can be placed on PS if he's not performing up to par.

Not 100% positive, but I don't believe players are eligible for the Practice Squad in their 4th seasons (Asa has appeared in 14 career games and I think the limit is 9 regular season games). 

I'd like to see Perriman give us at least 45 catches, 800 yds and 5 TDs. To me that's the floor for what id consider a success. He was brought in to immediately replace Torreys production so that's what I expect to see.

Considering the log jam we have for #2-4 on the depth chart there may not be the available snaps and targets guys like Odell, Benjamin, and Evans got last year so it might be difficult for him to get into the 1,000 yard, 60+ catch territory.

If that's the case it may be a good thing though bc it probably means Aiken and or Brown are playing very well.

I could also see Perriman take off and earn the #1 spot as they try to save SSS legs for a playoff run and he goes off for 1,200 yards. In my evaluations I see a guy that with some refinement, development of consistent route running and an actual elite QB throwing him the ball can become a top 10 receiver in the league.

QB check. Development is the question mark but he's in a great environment to do it with great teachers in Engram, SSS and Trestman; a great system for his skill set; the QB strengths exploit his strengths; and other young receivers that create a highly competit [profanity deleted]kng rtive environment for him every single day at practice.

My gut says our long search is finally over. We've got our Julio, Dez, AJ, Demaryius type guy.

I enjoy your enthusiasm, but expecting almost 18 yards/catch from a rookie receiver is asking for a lot... especially when that percentage is higher than Torrey had in all 4 of his seasons here.

I don't think 40-55 catches and 600-800 yards is out of the question for Breshad's rookie campaign.. but 1200 yards would be close to top 5 rookie WR campaigns of all time (and certainly top 10).

Could somebody clear something up for me ? I was under the impression that if a player participated in training camp that he was then not eligible for the PUP. Is this true and if not, could somebody explain exactly how all that works? Thanks.

Correct - anyone who is still injured when training camp starts (for the most part) starts on the 'preseason' PUP list.  If they're still on the PUP for the start of the regular season they cannot be activated until after the 6th game.  If a players practiced in training camp even just for 1 play, then they are no longer eligible to be added to the PUP list.

I'd never wish injury on any player, but I don't understand the whole "I hope their team is at full strength."  Who cares what someone's excuse is?  If DT holds out it gives the Ravens a competitive advantage.  I don't think DT will hold out for the first game, but if he does I won't be upset one bit.

Agreed. Marlon Brown played way flat last year when asked to step up. I think he gets pushed down the roster if not off with the amount of talent we have now. Seems like everyone else is hungry except him.

I can't really imagine Brown not making the roster unless he really just comes to camp playing very poorly.

Remember, Trestman LOVES big receivers, and he's really the only experienced one we have.  Also, a sophomore slump for wide receivers is fairly common... it's typically in their third year that they start to play well.  Given the way Harbaugh talked about Marlon earlier this offseason, and the fact that he is our second most experienced WR in camp, I'm fairly confident he'll make the team.