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BOLDnPurPnBlacK

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Everything posted by BOLDnPurPnBlacK

  1. That 5 spot jump, according to the "draft trade chart" everyone references... would be equivalent to the 122nd pick (4th rd comp). Id prefer the 4th rd comp bc you could always trade it to move up the 5 spots, or stay put and take a player if the guy you wanted in the 2nd falls to your spot. Ill take the flexibility of controlling the pick as opposed to being forced into the 5 spot swap before even seeing how the draft board is playing out.
  2. I like Lawson later... but your liking taco at 16 makes 0 sense to me. Raw and raw can be with only 1 year of production, and has tested to be a far lesser athlete than was originally thought. So in the same range if not worse athletically than Barnett, with no where near the technical ability or production.... yet you like him at 16? To each his own.
  3. Tabor ran an unofficial 4.75 40 at his Pro day. Man, thats bad. Let the free fall commence (if it hadnt already). I mean, a year ago he was arguably the top or in the convo to be the top CB in the draft. Now, hes clearly fallen out of top consideration and into a large, constantly moving 2nd group. With the personality/ego type stuff, his sometimes reckless jumping, sloppy technique/grabbiness..... and now this incredibly slow 40 time. Who knows where he could end up. Late 3rd/4th round??? You could convince me to take a shot on him there.
  4. If Barnett gets past NO, we're getting him. Cant see Ozzie letting him go 1 pick ahead of us. I'd imagine a trade up at that point with maybe the Eagles where we give up one of our comp comp 3rd or 4th rd pick to move ahead and get him.... they fall back and still get their guy in Cook. Just my intuition. Dont think we'd give up the ammo needed to leapfrog NO.... but i have a feeling they absolutely LOVE Barnett, and if its just a cpl spots to guarantee getting him -- cant see them passing it up.
  5. Pass rushers also dont typically get coached well in college. Most of the top talents are viewed that way because of their athletic traits, with coaches thinking they can teach the technique to pair with the athleticism. Bosa had similar concerns and blew up the NFL bc of his technique, skill set and relentless motor. What he did transitioned right over to the NFL. JJ Watt was thought not to have the explosive first step needed to be a great pass rusher.... but his hands work, ability to work inside and out, insane motor, etc... all made him a monster in the NFL. And NFL program can make guys bigger, stronger, more explosive so long as they have the requisite athletic ability for the league. Sure guys can learn technique as well, but its a lot more difficult for an incredibly raw athlete to become an elite technician than it is for an elite technician to get a little bit quicker first step... or to add a little closing speed. If Barnett's measurables were just a little bit better I guarantee you there'd be a very serious debate over who the 1st pick should be.
  6. No, I dont hate picking King and dont hate Ross -- I just hate the combo, and especially Ross in the first because i fully expect better players to be available. Though i think theres a slim chance a Mike Williams, Derek Barnett, Foster or Lattimore could fall, there are several far more realistic players id take over Ross. Tim Williams, Haasan Reddick, Charles Harris, Cam Robinson, Marlon Humphrey, OJ Howard... id take Corey Davis over Ross and he has a chance to be there. Id probably even prefer Dalvin Cook or Fournette to Ross. And if Ross is the BPA at 16 (which i cant see) then id much prefer to trade back and target Cam, Bolles, Ramchyzk (sp?), or Lamp.... Tim Williams/Harris/Takk/TJ Watt, White/Wilson/Humphrey/Conley, etc... and get much better value, an extra pick(s) and still a better player (imo of course). I do like King and think he has amongst the highest upside of the CBs in that range but if we went WR in the 1st as your mock does id much rather we go Dan Feeney, Dion Dawkins, or another highly rated OL, highly rated pass rusher is still available... and theres at least a few CBs id have to think long and hard about before taking King especially if Quincy Wilson is there. I think Magnuson is taken way too high here. I would expect better players at that position to be available, and definitely better players at other positions. Its not terrible overall... but i hate Ross at 16. I get hes not one dimensional like most speed guys, but his route running is way over sold. Doesnt have great hands, will find it harder to separate in the NFL, doesnt come back to the ball well, and can be very wild in his runs after the catch.... spinning wildly and exposing himself to big hits. He'll get destroyed doing that in the NFL. Plus injuries are a concern, and are of major concern to a guy whose best asset is speed. And while he may be more well rounded than most speed guys, speed is still his only elite trait. Take away the elite speed and hes no where close to a 1st round talent. If he were a back end 1st or early 2nd talent without the speed, then yea i could see the speed making him worthwhile at 16. But i just dont see it, and dont see him as bringing anything unique to our offense. Dont take it personally. You like what you like. Stand on your convictions, nothings wrong with that and no one can blame you for liking who you like. But it doesnt make those who disagree wrong.
  7. Barnett's done it against NFL level competition. Got 3 sacks going up against Tunsil in 2015. Most still think he'll be a great LT in the league. He abused Cam Robinson who is an NFL talent. Looked good and was productive against DJ Humphries. Will Holden, David Sharpe, Kendall Baker who are all NFL level talents. And he's had some of his best, most dominant performances against the guys most viewed to be guaranteed NFL talents... and high end talents (depending on position with Cam) against Alabama and Ole Miss. Granted it's no guarantee. And this is one I can't wait to bring back up once we see him play in the NFL... but theres a lot more to like than just his bend. Its the way he sets up his pass rushes and has a plan of attack, his polished moves/counter moves, the footwork, his finishing ability, and his combo of hand fighting, footwork, and bend that allow him to take the most direct path to the QB which allows him to get there just as quickly as some of the guys who are more athletic than him but have to take a more rounded route to the QB. The only reason he gets the Suggs comp is bc hes a guy that on tape clearly has elite talent, has probably the most NFL ready skill set of any pass rusher ive seen in some time but at the very least in this draft class thats strong on pass rushers, has elite, steady production over 3 years against arguably the best competition available, and is a hardworking leader thats also a really good kid by all accounts who could only fall due to over-valuing raw athleticism. But we will see.
  8. I like it. Dont see him at C, but i dont think they want to pigeon hole themselves into having to find a C and RT. They just want to find the best possible OL and then fit them in the best way. So if a stud G falls to us in the draft, you dont want to not pick him bc youre stuck on Lewis playing LG. If hes an improvement over Lewis, and Lewis is an improvement at RT over anyone else on the roster then we absolutely should do that. Get talented OL here. Thats all that matters. Then figure out what combo gives us our best 5. Shoot -- if it means Yanda kicking out to RT id be ok with that so long as him doing so give us a much stronger OL unit.
  9. The point still remains... we've had an awful long stretch of high quality MLB play with at least one major contributor being an UDFA. Orr, McLellan, Ellerbe, McClain, Bynes. Even during Daryl's time here we had UDFA LB's that were key parts of the rotation. 2013 - Jameel and Josh Bynes 2014/'15 - Orr and McLellan We had Jameel and Ellerbe playing roles on defense back to 2009, and 2008 was Bart Scott's last year here who you can trace all the way back to 2002. Didnt make a huge impact that year, but i believe ended up starting in 2003. So that's a 13-14 year stretch of having UDFA LB's starting, or providing us a starter level backup on defense. And now we have Levine and Onwuasor both UDFA's that could be in the mix to play a large role at ILB.
  10. Ross is top of the list for me. I could see someone drafting Takk higher than he should be based on the athleticism. High upside but has a LONG way to go to develop into a consistent NFL pass rusher. If Taco goes top half of the first round that's a reach to me. If he goes before any of Harris, Tim Williams, Barnett it's a big reach. I could see someone taking him over Harris or Tim Williams and that'd be a mistake imo. I also really like Adoree Jackson as an immediate weapon as a returner who can develop into a nice starter at CB. But if he goes in the 1st I think it's a reach based on the athleticism and upside... ultimately depending on which other CB's are still on the board. I also think David Njoku is slightly overrated. Don't see him as the sure fire #2 TE worthy of a 1st like many do. Def think he's in a group of 3-4 TEs that have big upside and I'd take mid 2nd but Howard is the only one I'd take anywhere in the 1st. Mahomes is a good one though almost any of the QB's could be reaches depending on where they go but that's expected with QB's. If you need one, and you think there's a chance they could be a franchise guy even a cpl years down the line it's tough to call them a reach anywhere. Carr was a guy who would've been considered a reach as a top 5 pick but in hindsight no one would say that. Prob should've gone 1st overall.
  11. So our problem is that we're really good at finding starter to star level ILB's through UDFA? Struggling to see the problem....
  12. He makes at least $6m no matter what. If another team pays him $2m the Jets still owe him $4m. Only way Jets don't pay him something is if another team offers him at least $6m. So that won't impact if he plays or not. Just a matter if he wants to play for $6m or sit at home and make that.
  13. I would add though Hooker is gone for sure. Fournette likely gone. But since this exercise is 100% to be gone.... Garret Adams Hooker Lattimore 1 of Davis/Ross/Williams 1 of Cook/Fournette/McCaffery Allen Thomas Thats it. Thats all im confident in right now.
  14. No way do i think Peppers goes before we're on the clock. Howard may not go Top 15. I think he will, but i dont think in any way its a lock. Foster could slip. At least one team in the Top 15 has him off their board completely, and with Reddick's ascension a team looking for that ILB could decide Reddick's versatility, athleticism, and ability to pass rush is more worth it than Foster. I could see Williams being available. It's not likely, but if say Tenn falls in love with Ross and someone else views Davis as the #1 guy -- Williams could slide. Idk that its even a guarantee that any Top 15 team goes WR with all the defensive talent available. Wouldnt be totally surprised is both Williams and Davis were on the board. I also dont think Barnett is a lock to go Top 15. With Reddick flying up boards, Tim Williams red flags dissipating to a degree, and Takk, Taco and Harris all having more athletic gifts -- we've seen teams fall in love with that raw ability/upside over the proven, polished play maker. And, literally every mock generator i do that matches big board up with team needs, seems to have Barnett over looked. Even when hes rated properly on the big board as the 3-10th prospect.... he gets passed for some reason. Browns are taking Garret, and then outside that who has a need for pass rusher or doesnt have another highly rated prospect available to them at a position of greater need? If Barnett gets past NO i think he's there for us. Maybe Carolina, maybe Cinci, and then NO. Only teams i could see going for him. But cant see Carolina passing up on Fournette, Adams, Hooker, or Lattimore. All or most should be available. Cant see Cinci going pass rush if Foster's there. I could see them go Williams before Barnett too. NO's the only one. But i could see them go secondary if they have a highly rated player available (Lattimore if available, Humphrey, Conley, etc..). So i wouldnt say 100% no. Its certainly possible. I mean no one wouldve said Tunsil was gonna be there for Miami and that 2-3 tackles would go ahead of him. but they did.
  15. You can say he wont be good until you turn green.... wont make him a bad player. Nothing anyone anywhere says will effect how he turns out one way or another. But, some are actually providing insight based on what can be seen from watching him play. One is "not getting into it." He's made some of the top available OT's in this draft look absolutely silly. Some of these tackles will play in the league. Some will likely start early on. So, theres some pretty solid evidence he'll be effective against at least some NFL tackles. No, its certainly not a guarantee. But I remember a certain pass rusher who was displayed dominant production against college tackles and it was thought he may not have the athleticism to succeed at the NFL level... fell to the Ravens and went on to become a DPOY. Not saying that Barnett will be as great as Suggs has been.... but sometimes what you see on tape does transfer over to the NFL. And I'll take the guy with dominant production for 3 straight years over guys with one stand out year, based mostly on athleticism.
  16. Well its also not black and white... 1st round pick or roll out some bum. You can get adequate or even very good RT play from a number of means. I mean, we got Wagner from a mid round pick and he was among the best RT's in the league his first year starting. The coaching staff really like Wesley and Nembot. Whether they really like them as starters, or still just really like their potential development remains to be seen. There are some decent RT prospects that should be available rounds 2-4. And honestly idk that Cam projects best to RT anyways. Plus theres still FA and training camp cuts. We've filled holes on the OL several times at that point in FA. You're right that it could spell trouble if we're rolling out Hurst every week at RT. But, throwing a 1st round pick at the problem isnt the only way to improve that. And as others have mentioned, I think the issue at C is much more glaring and will impact the overall success of the OL much more than RT. So if we're going to jump at a RT prospect who probably isnt the greatest value there, might as well grab the best C in the 1st round then??? In the draft lets just get the best players... with the board slightly modified to slant towards our needs. If they feel Cam is in the ballpark of BPA at 16, or they dont think anyone worth 16 is sitting there and decide to trade back -- then im ok with it. But just saying, RT is a hole so go get the best possible player to fill it by any means -- darn the consequences, or possible elite talents we leave in our wake -- isnt the right way to go about it. We need pass rush, so couldnt getting that Von Miller type player to dominate opposing OL's in that way be just as, if not more, important? We could use an upgrade at C, since pressure up the middle via an Aaron Donald/Calais Campbell/Kawaan Short/Geno Atkins/Danny Shelton is the quickest way to get pressure on the QB or blow up the run game. So, not ignoring the value of a good RT. Just also recognizing even greater value in having a great C, and also how having the 2nd pass rusher will create that problem for other teams.
  17. I like Toth better. Also doesnt have great athleticism, but does have some power and bully in him. Definitely wouldnt be a good prospect if we're planning on doing more stretch zone, but if we are truly moving to more inside zone, gap and power concepts -- I think Toth can be a good player... so long as hes mostly tasked with blocking in a phone booth.
  18. Dont like the idea of Ross with our 1st. Just dont want another guy whose main asset is speed. It's great, and could lead to an explosive offense -- but hes already got an extensive injury history, and speed is a trait that can diminish with injuries. He's more well rounded than most speed guys in that hes not a one dimensional, one-trick pony.... but take away the speed and the other traits arent worth a 1st round pick. Not even close. King i actually do like. Great height, length, athleticism combo. Has a frame to actually fill out even more to where he could bully even the biggest, most physical receivers in the league. And great at tracking/denying the ball; especially deep. May not be a day 1 plug and play type of guy like some of the others, but we dont necessarily need that with Carr here and his upside is tremendous. And Magnuson i actually like, but think its a bit early here. I like Moton and he could be around here... if Elflein is available im definitely going him here over the RT. I actually really like Jordan Morgan out of Kutztown in this range, maybe a little later, over Magnuson. 6'4", 310-320 lb dude, 4 yr starter at LT who probably projects better to guard but I think could play RT. Has great feet and is a nasty, mauling dude.
  19. The point is, in my opinion, every faces the same jump in competition. I think those that have raw athleticism, speed or power as their outstanding trait are going to have a much harder time adjusting to and competing at the higher level. A guy like Barnett who hasnt gotten by on pure athleticism, but has already crafted technique, hand fighting, bend, moves and counter moves to defeat blockers... is going to better equipped and prepared to compete at the highest level. We're all projecting though. So its a matter of opinion. Ive just seen far too many freak athletes fail bc they havent been able to develop the finer points of the game, and plenty of guys knocked for their athleticism prosper in the league bc of their elite technique. Sure there are examples of it going the other way... and a base line of athleticism is required either way. I just think the technique is the much harder of the assets to acquire. And, on Barnett specifically, i think the knocks on his athleticism are overblown.
  20. How do you define "playing the ball?" Is it moving your arm in the direction of the ball? Is it looking back for it? Youre talking about the league and refs that cant figure out what a catch is. And you think itd be fairly easy for them to decide what intent looks like consistently?
  21. Spending cap space though to fill a "hole" with a mediocre player probably wont have the same impact in improving the team as adding a premier player at a position that maybe isnt viewed as being a need. A roster with no real "holes" but that is lacking true difference makers anywhere, isnt going to win much in this league. There just werent any real viable options, at a price commensurate to their value, that filled our needs. Maybe a couple players that you look at, like maybe Brandon Marshall -- helps fill the need at WR, is a proven talent, and signed for a reasonable deal - fits the profile of what we wanted. But the reality is we probably did reach out, and it was just more important to him to stay close to NY so he could continue his TV career. Same maybe with a guy like JC Tretter -- couldve filled a need at Center. But, the Browns wouldve outbid us for him... Just using two specific examples to paint a picture. We decided to spend our money on cornerstone type players that will be here and likely produce at a high level for years. If that player lines up with a need; im sure they prefer that. But the quality/profile of the player is going to matter more than whether or not they fill an immediate, perceived hole.
  22. I agree. He just stated that the Jags will give us Hurns for Jernigan. Done deal. What??
  23. He's not "injury prone" -- hes coming off an injury. That's like calling Flacco injury prone last year. And hes had teams talk to him. Giants were very interested but wanted him to move to G. He didn't want to. Plus he's a veteran in FA for the first time in his career. He's not going to rush into a 1 year deal he doesn't like. Hes going to wait to evaluate all of his options... wait til after the draft, maybe even into OTA's or TC when someone suffers an injury and his market heats up. He'll be on a team this year. And I bet he'll play well. He's just got no reason to rush back and sign with anyone. He's going to wait until he's confident he's going to the best situation for him. And even if we are interested I'm not surprised there's been no talk of it. Ozzies smart enough with a guy like this to let the market set his value, and swoop in to buy low if his options don't materialize.
  24. There are times it's not called just like anything else... but accidental contact is called all the time. You see CBs just accidentally get their feet tied up with the WR while running and it gets called PI. I just think forcing a ref to determine if the contact interferes, and then determine if that contact was done with intent or not is just muddying the waters unnecessarily. I just dont see justification for a rule that says - yes we have deemed the defenders actions took away your 80 yd play... so we're going to "reward" you 15 yds!! Then theres also the issue of -- if you make a distinction between intent and no intent, you have to clearly define in the rule book what constitutes intent. So how do you define intent? What does that look like?
  25. So the Jags are just gonna give us Hurns for Jernigan? Even though they already signed Malik Jackson and Calais Campbell the past 2 seasons? And they have young, recently drafted DTs that they like as well. But theyre going to just give up a young, very good starter at WR for what would be a back up DT for them? How do you know this? Or what would give you the idea that it's even remotely possible? They have no need for Jernigan... and even if they did why would they give up a high end playmaker when just a mid/late rd draft pick would do??