JoeyFlex5

We didn't see Dorsett as a first round talent likely due to lack of prototype traitrs

 

For anyone that doesn't think we got a steal with this pick, you need to go watch the tape again. This guy is easily imo the 3rd best receiver in the class and quite possibly the 2nd. 

yea man i was low on the pick at first but after a while to sit on it, this is the most excited ive ever been about a pick. i dont think i have seen a wr more tailor-fit for our offensive style, his ceiling, well, there is none, and his floor is an elite deep threat, i really think we got a steal and this guy is gonna shock the world and make the naysayers scratch their heads and say "i thought he had bad hands?"

Well, you never know. Maybe the Colts take Perriman, lol.

that is very true. although something gives me the feeling that dorsett was just their guy, just like agholor was clearly "the guy" for the eagles and perriman was "the guy" for us, guess well never know and im happy to never know

Yeah, I agree, but I wonder if Dorsett would have made it to us. 

if we traded back? obviously not

qb-duh 

rb- forsett, buck, LT 

fb- juice 

wr1- SSS, aiken 

wr2- perriman, brown 

5th wr- camp 

te- williams, gilmore 

lt- monroe, hurst 

lg- yanda, myers/urschel 

c- zuttah, urschel 

rg- ko, myers/urschel 

rt- wagner, hurst/yanda(if shuffling is needed) 

 

rolb- suggs, zd 

lolb- doom, upshaw 

wilb- smith, brown 

silb- mosley, smith(brown starting at wilb in case of mosley injury) 

re- jernigan, urban, klm 

nt- williams, davis 

le- canty, davis, klm

cb1- jimmy, ajax 

cb2- webb, melvin 

cb3- ajax, walker 

fs- lewis, brooks

ss- hill, elam, 

nickel- elam, brooks, walker 

 

kr- perriman 

pr- campanaro 

 

obviously the DL, and OLB corps and pretty much the whole secondary will be a revolving door of rotations for mismatch purposes, but this is about what i expect it to look like

I don't think Perriman will get a lot of action in his rookie year.

 

He has a lot to develop.

 

SSS, Brown, Aiken, and Camp are going to have to do the heavy lifting this year.

 

Perriman will just play a couple "nine" routes here and there.

you are just wrong, i mean so wrong. torrey smith got the nod as the #2 almost immediately and breshad perriman is miles ahead of where torrey was as a rookie. perriman is capable of much more than just nine routes and you would be killing his value by only sending him out occasionally to run a nine route. brown and aiken simply do not deserve the hype, brown came in under the radar and posted a few wide open td catches as a rookie and then fell off big time and people still latch onto him as our savior, aiken made a few plays late in the season and the same thing is happening. we didnt draft perriman in the first round to let some UDFA depth wr's play over him. if you think perriman is so raw that he wont even see the field except for spread sets then you should stop listening to the naysayers, we have had much worse wide receivers come in as starters and no wr on our team right now besides SSS is even near perrimans caliber, and yes i can confidently say that before even seeing him take an nfl snap

Why all the Campanaro can't stay healthy talk? He had ONE injury and it was a bad hamstring pull that took awhile to heal.

campanaro has a injury history dating all the way back to high school i believe. maybe its just college im not sure, but i THINK he has quite the long list of football injuries.

I agree. Personally, I think entirely too much is being made of his drops. As noted many times, they were the result of concentration issues, not bad hands, and he has steadily improved in that area. The front office and coaches also feel that this is something that isn't much of a concern and can be corrected.

 

Let's also not forget that as others have noted, "concentration drops" were weaknesses listed in the scouting reports of guys like Andre Johnson, Julio Jones, Demaryius Thomas and Odell Beckham to name a few - these guys turned out ok, I'd say.

 

As another point of reference, I was scanning the fantasy football sites (they seem pretty consistent that Perriman is a definite draft in Rookie leagues), and I found these analyses:

if that quote is true, then wow, im happy. haha

I wish people would avoid trying to compare BP to Torrey. Is it really necessary? Why not just support our 1st round WR and see how he pans out when he hits the field.

 

A lot of people did the same complaining when we drafted Mosley last year, and look how that worked out. Seems Ozzie usually has a plan that surprises a few of us now and then. 

im sick of the comparison man. i understand making comparisons to current players, but at least make an accurate one. i truly think its because he is fast and has dreads so he automatically draws comparisons to torrey. i think the most accurate one ive seen is demaryius thomas, and i also think michael irvin made a good connection by comparing him to andre johnson, 3 guys with similar measurables across the board, all 3 had questions of raw route running coming out but showed the natural shiftiness to learn, all 3 had questions about the occasional drop(though AJ worked that out for sure) and all 3 could really attack that ball and make some circus catches. i think there is absolutely zero base for the torrey comparisons

I very much think this is the case. I don't think we saw Dorsett as a first round talent, evidenced by the fact that we would've traded back if Perriman wasn't there. Not that Dorsett is bad. You know I really like him. We probably saw him as an early second guy not a 15th overall.

i personally saw dorsett as a first round talent because i was able to look past the system he came from and i thought his potential was very obvious and alot of others just left it at "he only ran go routes in college so thats all he can do" but i certainly dont think dorsett has the ceiling of perriman, and i think that, along with height, may have been why perriman was ranked so high and dorsett was viewed as a 2nd. id be willing to bet though, that if we traded back, then dorsett wouldve been on our board as a coveted guy

Maybe so. I'm sure that played a part but They did think enough of Dorsett to have him in for a visit which leads me to think they considered him regardless of "fit".

Clearly they preferred perriman.

i think they liked both and dorsett had to be in consideration, but like you said i think it came down to preference, although i do think it may be possible they saw dorsett as his original projection of 2nd round value

I think if the Ravens had taken Dorsett, a lot of peripheral chatter would be centered around the notion that Ozzie killed rounds one and two instead of the trepidation being exhibited by many of us.

Here is the thing I keep coming back to: The Ravens had a very up close look at both prospects by way of pre-draft visit and they chose Perriman. That carries weight with me.

i dont think it had anything to do with them having a closer look, i just think for their board specifically they had perriman as a better fit, and i think even without any visits it would have been the same. flacco isnt the best timing qb and that is the type of offense that dorsett will shine in, perriman on the other hand is sort of an ideal target for flacco and our offense, we can get more out of perriman than possibly any other wr in the draft not named amari cooper.

Im so pumped about Maxx Williams. The dude has OVER 10 inch hands! Bigger than most o-linemen. Add that with his rediculous long arms and wingspan. I loved him so much I wanted us to draft him in the first round. Good thing we didnt because I love Breshad Perriman also. People are cutting Perriman short which I dont see why. Hes tall and fast. Think of a mix between Torrey and Q. He stopped dropping passes the more experience he had. I expect Perriman to be a flat out stud. I predicted that before we even drafted em.

i like ur enthusiasm but a mix between torrey and q is just not accurate at all lol. 

 

the most accurate comparison i have seen is demaryius thomas, i also understand michael irvins comparison of andre johnson, very similar styles of play and build, johnson too was considered raw coming out of college, with some refinement and practice on the jugs machine i think he will be every bit as good.

I was trying to erase that from my memory, but yup thats our last vision of Torrey in a Ravens Uniform. Not Finishing his route and letting the defender catch a pass thrown his way like he was receving a fair catch. That was the final straw, I didn't care if he came back after that.

exactly how i felt, ive always liked torrey as a person but he messed up on that play, and it isnt the first time hes done it either. i think i can recall 2 times in his whole career where he was actually aggressive in going for the ball, the pre-halftime leap over champ bailey, and the 3rd td catch of his career when he climbed the ladder against the rams, aside from those 2 he has played every ball passively and allowed for turnovers and stalled drives that should have been touchdowns

The fact that Perriman, actuallly ATTEMPTED adjusted to those poorly thrown balls by his QB makes it a whole lot easier for me. I couldn't stand torrey not finishing routes and not attemption to catch those passes.

that has always been my knock on torrey and it cost us dearly vs the patriots. it is simply a knock that nobody can have on perriman, that boy is AGGRESSIVE getting to that ball

breshad perriman was in consideration for early 2nd late 1st round all along, his tape is more than enough to justify that, his workouts just solidified his status. 

 

i just think that after seeing some of the wr's who have came in and succeeded that we cant just look at his issues and say hes gonna bust, he immediately looks way better than kelvin benjamin, torrey, and in my opinion he looks about equal or better than alshon jeffrey and demaryius thomas than all of them looked coming out of college, and all of them were serviceable at least as rookies and all of them proceeded to be very, very productive.

LOL @ thinking Waller will ever be a starting receiver.

waller does seem different than the other super tall project receivers we have drafted though, ill say he certainly has a better shot than tommy streeter or justin harper or jeremy butler ever had, he has good hands and can highpoint the ball and pluck it out of the air, and make contested catches, those guys just ran down the field and tried to body catch everything and it made their height useless. still thinks its a longshot though, and i thought dezmin lewis was a far better prospect and has legit #1 wr potential, and was one of the steals of the draft

Has that ever worked out? Fans suggest it every offseason, but I've yet to see a young player stowed away on IR ever actually play great afterward. They're usually gone in a couple seasons.

this is true but its something the ravens seem to favor, id prefer to see waller on the active 53 for special teams and as a sideline blocker and redzone guy.

i think the #2 will be perriman, in terms of role and production. i think steve smith takes the #1 in terms of production(targets) and i think he moves around often from the outside to the slot, just to create the best mismatch possible, he is an ideal slot receiver and at his age i think he holds more value there than a full time outside job, i think kamar aiken will typically see alot of snaps as the outside receiver opposite perriman in 3+ wr sets. 

 

in spread sets where we use 5 wr's i think the most used formation would be perriman on a island, with camp working the slot on his side, with a bunch formation on the opposite side consisting of aiken and brown with smitty being the one lined up off the LOS to take advantage of the size difference and letting smitty get lost in the crowd, it keeps our 2 best receivers separate on the field, and forces too much accountability on each side of the formation for the defense to handle consistently. 

 

i think we will carry smitty, perriman, aiken, camp, and brown on the active 53, waller gets the ir treatment, butler is the odd man out. i think by year 2 waller is more of an asset than marlon brown and he phases him out on the active 53, if smitty retires then brown stays on the active 53 as the 5th man and sees little playing time as our TE sets would likely be favored over a 5wr set. if brown isnt offered any kind of deal from another team then we keep him around for depth purposes and special teams.

we keep on talking about his Size and speed over torrey..

what honestly separates him potentially from Darrius Heyward Bey who is very similar in traits and athletic ability…?

everything.

seriously though, DHB was garbage and everyone knew it at the time except for al davis. he had absolutely no ability to do anything more than run a straight line. he could not get his hands out to catch the ball and expected to do everything with his arms and body, he had no suddenness or shiftiness at all, no verticals, no body control, no hands ability, no YAC ability, just sprint down the field and hope the qb can drop it right into his forearms and prey he can hold on, that is all DHB ever had to offer.

perriman has much more overall athleticism, better reach, explosion, body control, tracking, adjustment, and he even plucks the ball with his hands much better than DHB or even torrey for that matter, it is merely a focus issue and a matter of having pitiful qb play delivering poorly placed throws, you can see he is stellar at adjusting to poorly thrown balls all over the field and getting his hands on them, and more often than not he hold onto them, its just that on occasion he doesnt fully execute the "catch and run". i believe he will more than make up for the occasional drop with overall great production. the bigger concern to me is that he is lacking the ability to sell his routes, he telegraphs his routes on occasion with bad shoulder and head movements, i think as a rookie that will be a bigger issue than his hands, but its a very coachable issue.

Perriman's problem isn't with his hands, it's with his concentration. That is potentially fixable, but it's going to take awhile to instill the good habit while ridding himself of that bad one. You have to keep in mind he didn't start playing until he was a junior in high school because he had an inherited knee condition that didn't clear up until he was older, and he's only 21 years old. He's young, somewhat inexperienced and so of course he's going to be raw. But he has the tools, the talent, and the bloodlines. Although I liked Agholor or Devin Smith more (because they don't have the concentration issue) I'm still high on Perriman. He's definitely an improvement over Torrey when he was a rookie. Like Torrey was as a rookie, he'll be our #2 WR by season's end.

id even say hes an upgrade over year 4 torrey. many of torreys problems coming out were never fixed, in year 4 he was still body catching most passes, and he never developed the aggressive mentality to go up and get it, he was way too passive of a player coming out and he stayed that way. 

I would not get excited about Waller's exploits this season....he'll be extremely lucky to dress on game day. He needs at least this year, maybe 2, to develop & acclimate.

i realize this, but he looks alot better than our other late round wr projects from before, considering he can actually go up and catch with his hands and has the size to make it in the nfl, instead of a tall guy skinny as a rail who runs straight lines and body catches everything. plus we are in a better position now to develop a project guy like waller than we ever have been, with a quality wr coach, joe having much more creative control over the offense, and a OC who does great things with tall receivers

Thanks for the break down Joey, very informative.

So in other words he just needs to sell his routes better: bait the DB and keep him guessing. Hopefully he'll take well to coaching, if so Engram and Smitty are the guys for the job.

Man, I can't wait for video updates from camp!!

How about his weight, am I the only one who'd like for him to get to a neat 220lbs as long as it doesn't affect his athleticism and agility.

at 6'2"+ his 212 is fine, he carries his frame very well and any additional weight could really hinder his agility and explosiveness, he is already very physical and aggressive and getting outmuscled is just not on his list of concerns, hes a big guy and uses that size excellently.

I ought to start a weekly radio show that features the noted experts here on Baltimoreravens.com.

Only half kidding.

ive said it before and ill say it again, about half of the posters on these board, especially on the draft forums during draft season, are twice as knowledgeable as a large majority of analysts

If you put Gilmore or Juice in Camp's spot and Forsett at the back (I'm assuming our Oline plays at the last year's level), I just don't see how that offense can be stopped. Waller must be a nightmare for CBs on run plays. He is a mean blocker and corners can't do anything but run backwards if they engage him, opening a huge space for Forsett, or watch Waller catch a jump ball if they don't. The beauty is that the box can't be really stacked because Perriman and Williams or Senior are meanwhile getting open on the other side. If play turns into pass, you have 3 catchers on the field averaging just short of 20y per catch and aren't easily stoppable one-on-one.

 

When that offense gels, we will have the most complete Ravens team ever. And If they can gel early, Denver won't have enough Peyton's to beat us, no matter how warm it is.

 

Call me crazy but I am excited.

yes wallers blocking is something that is sort of forgotten when you think about a 6'6" wr running a 4.4. but he comes from a triple option where his primary job is to clear an outside lane, with us being a stretch based offense it is one hell of an asset to have such a dominant and experienced blocking wr, it will allow our rb's to turn the corner much more often rather than force a cutback, so those times when the OL doesnt execute perfectly(which happens no matter how good ur OL is) our guys can step on the gas and turn it up the sideline for big runs, its hard for a normal sized db to make the tackle when a 6'6" 240lb wr is shoving them into the bench 10 yards downfield. 

 

and yes putting gilmore in the slot or making juice a movement guy between the backfield and the slot will make it that much more deadly, the potential is reminiscent of the power sweep offense ran by lombardis packers, if waller can make his way on to the field consistently then it not only helps the passing game, but a guy like buck allen who has tremendous speed and too much power for a db to easily take down in the open field, can make a living for himself in the screen game and by turning the corner and running behind a guy like waller or gilmore. im really excited about the potential of what were building here, makes me sad that waller may never even make the active 53 and if he does make it it probably wont be for a few years

WVU ran a spread offense designed to get their wide receivers the balls in space so they could make plays. It's also a very air it out and wide receiver friendly offense from a production standpoint. White will have some kinks to work out in the NFL.

this. i think kevin white was seriously overrated and i think he is more raw than perriman. i still think he is the 2nd or 3rd wr in the class based on ceiling alone, but i think his bust potential is riskier than our guy to be honest