Ravensfan23

Glad to see Brooks ahead of schedule, but with the rash of injuries the secondary had last season, i'm glad they are taking it slow. I though he was starting to put things together before the injury last year before the terrible play against the saints that allowed the TD. The he worked his way back onto the field only to get hurt in the Jax game. I think he'll continue to learn a lot from Will Hill. I noticed the two of them interacting at the Webb Softball game, they seem to have a very close relationship which should only help in terms of the game.

I honestly think Elam starts to man that role a bit. As unpopular as he might be right now, I think he'll thrive in that role. Maybe not to the extent that Webb did because Elam shouldn't be ask to cover many WRs or TEs right now, but more like a Corey Ivy or Digg his first year. That 3rd safety Dime back type role, Blitzing, covering shallow crosses and underneath coverage, maybe as a spy against pass catching RBs. Elam has a ton of talent and I think he'd be great in this limited role. Webb's role will remain imo and at his best I think he plays just as well outside as he does inside. So i don't think he'll be negatively impacted by this signing. It just give Pees more options on the back end and when he has healthy options he calls a pretty strong defensive game.

Oh I definitely agree and you're right I wasn't comparing the two just using Jimmy as an example of how perception can change quickly. Jimmy was a stud from day 1 imo and had it not been for the injuries he would have developed a lot quicker. So again I definitely agree with Elam and Jimmy not being comparable. That's why I compared him more to the top of the 2nd round guys. Jimmy was a top 10-15 pick imo, off-field concerns dropped him. I personally can't get the busted coverage, i'm gonna look at my teammate and place blame while the play is still going instead of touching the WR down, play out of my head. It was almost like he thought he was back in college. The guy certainly has a lot of limitations, but he also has some strong qualities. He just needs to put them together as you stated. But long term Yea definitely Hill and Lewis as starters, but Pees like to play that 3 safety look a bit. In Dime packages I can clearly see Elam being what a healthy Webb was a few years back. That guy who plays around the LOS in sub packages and blitzes a lot. I can see him being that rover type guy which I think has always better suited him. Only coverage assignments he has is zone and RBs or 2nd TEs. Honestly I don't think he ever takes over for Hill, I think he stays in that rotational 3rd Safety role but he really makes his bones there sotospeak. Call me bias, but I think a healthy Terrence Brooks emerges during the back half of the season and he'll take over that coverage Safety type role once Will Hill get his deal else where.

Confidence isn't what you do after the play, it's what allows you to play free and without thinking so much. You know a confident player when you see no hesitation, no indecisiveness. I think Elam has a ton of confidence in himself and is obviously not a shy person. Hell you would have thought he was an all pro the way he introduced himself at Webb's softball game. I just think it's matter of being able to take what you know and do it on the field. Sounds simple but that's probably the biggest thing that stops people in general from ever reaching their full potential.

I view Elam the same way I viewed Dawan Edwards and I currently view Upshaw. They were both guys who could have easily gone in the bottom half of the 1st round when drafted but the Ravens got them at the top of the 2nd. Both of those guys started slow in terms of winning over the fans, Edwards with his play, Upshaw was more of a weight thing, but some play as well. However once they carved out their roles they became really solid pros. He doesn't have a large name but Dawan Edwards is one of the only Ravens to leave and have steady long term success throughout his career. So in looking at Elam like those two and even Kurger to a extent, Elam is a guy that in a prefect year the Ravens would have traded back to get at the top of the 2nd round, but he was probably the highest rated player at a position of need and they probably couldn't trade out. So now looking at Elam on the field much like the others guys mentioned above, he struggled with a larger role early on. He's wasn't ready in his rookie year to run a secondary and certain wasn't ready to bare the pressure of replacing an Ed Reed. He's the type of guy imo that needs a lesser, rotational role and play his way into the player the Ravens want much like guys mentioned already. The Ravens tried to hide him last year but because of injuries he was forced to do things that's not his game, like coverage. As a 1st round pick many will be quick to label him a bust because of the perception of what a first rounder should be, especially for Ozzie. However right now I think he's just a young player looking to find his way and having guys like Hill, Lewis, Smith, Webb and now Arrington will allow Elam to have a more simpler role as a young pup following the vets and hopefully that reduces the pressure allowing him to just play free. Long term I see Elam much like a Dawan Edwards. A guy that fans will bash early and then he'll develop over years 3-5, crave out a solid role and then get paid by another team. He'll make some plays to help this team win in 2015 and when you do that, I could careless what round you were drafted in, you're just a part of the solution imo. I remember Jamison Hensley calling Jimmy Smith a bust simply because he wasn't living up to what a "Ravens Defensive" 1st rounder should be. Now Jimmy is one of the better CBs in the game and is probably one healthy season away from being viewed a lockdown guy. Perception can change in a blink of an eye in the NFL. One day your a bust the next fans are chanting your name at the Bank for making plays.

Yea especially when consider how reliable Brown's hands are. I didn't have much about Kubes to complain about but that would definitely be one. I don't know if it was something that Kubes just wasn't seeing from Brown or what, but it seemed like he was the workhorse between the 20s and then Aiken and Gilmore would come in to close the door. Almost like Varsity Blues when Kilmer would use Wendell as the workhorse but never give him a chance to score inside the 10, minus the racism of course. But I think that will definitely chance this year. From what i saw with the Bears, Trestman loves using his big targets in the redzone.

Yea TDs are definitely more memorable then a 17 yard catch. Marlon had like 5 catches in the Patriot game but i can't honestly remember any of them but Aiken's lone catch was a TD so i clearly remember that. Here's a nice article on the impact that Marlon had down the stretch last season and to me it shows why Marlon is being looked at to have a big year. He's so consistent and a play maker when given a chance. That's exactly what we need opposite a dynamic WR(hopefully) like Perriman. Also i heard something that didn't make much sense to me about Marlon's lack of TD production. Someone either said it wrote that Brown didn't have a single redzone target last year. After having such success in that area as a rookie you would think he'd be a favorite target down there. If that's true i definitely think it changes this year.

Love the signing from two sides. First it shows the FO really identified the issue at CB and attacked it. I could see this like a Doom signing. He's not really a stud but he could be the piece that really glues the defense together because there won't be any weak links. The second reason i love it is for the same reason i applauded the Lewis signing at Safety. It gives the younger guys at CB a real chance to develop without being asked to play a major role. Now of course injuries could change that but as of right now you have guy like Melvin battling for the 4th or 5th CB who will only see limited action.

I gotta disagree with you on this one. During the last 5 games including the playoffs Aiken had a total of 4 catches for 36yds 2TDs. Brown in the same 5 games had 13 catches and 141 yards. He definitely finished the season stronger then Aiken imo. No matter if it's a opportunity thing or not, Brown certainly had a stronger finish. But i agree that Aiken came up big in his opportunities. 2 of his 4 catches were TDs.

I think he'll be given every opportunity to start week 1 honestly. It' no knock to Smith Sr. but if the Ravens can find someone who can platoon with him and start to take over his role they'll be very pleased imo. I think Brown is that guy. Now of course Sr will still be listed as the starter and even if no named starter Perriman will be heavily involved, but I think Brown is the guy the coaches are looking to take that next big step. Despite his decline in numbers and play time, he actually improved last year and now in his 3rd NFL season, it wouldn't be a surprise to see him break out at all imo. His body should be fully recovered from the injuries that hampered him his rookie year and early last year. Now we'll see that explosive big bodied physical WR that many has wanted for some time. I won't label him a #1 or #2 or whatever, but I think him and Perriman will make a great duo starting this year and I think it starts early.

Yea it's definitely possible that Trestman didn't like the options he had with the Bears in terms of smaller WRs. But I still can't see his offense looking to feature more than 1 of those type guys. I fully understood what you were saying about Smitty, but my point was who's to say the Ravens are looking for someone to be in the same mold as Smitty. I don't think Ozzie went out and got Smitty to fill an specific role, I think he brought him in because he plays like a Raven and he's really good. So moving forward i don't necessarily think you have to replace Smitty in terms of a smaller shifty guy because that's not really what the offense asked for. Imo it's not like replacing Welker in NE where you knew what type of player your wanted to fill that role. Smitty was brought in to be a #2 WR, That guy that keeps the offense moving and can take over in games where the defense looks to take away the #1 guy. I honestly don't see either Camp or Carter filling those roles right now. Maybe after the preseason i might feel different. I don't see the team giving up on Camp either, but I also don't see them labeling him a made man should he be outplayed in training camp and preseason. I just think that he'll have to force his way into the offense much like Laquan Williams was asked to do but couldn't. He's gonna have to make Trestman say, Man i gotta get this guy on the field. Now having a guy like Smitty will help because he's gonna play a huge role in the offense this year and i'm sure Trestman will love what he brings, so next year he might be looking for that same type guy as you suggested..... Wow while typing this I just saw scenarios where both Camp and Carter make the team, So i guess I do agree with you. haha Aiken while I like him, there is nothing really dynamic about him. If it comes down to a roster spot between he and say Carter, I could see the well rounded package of Carter winning over Aiken. That is of course if Carter is as impressive as everyone seems to think.

I clearly disagree with Brown but you don't like him so i get it. lol I don't see Brown and Aiken as the same players honestly. Brown is exactly what you say he isn't, a playmaker. He's much more explosive in and out of his breaks and after the catch then Aiken. Everybody that plays with Flacco gets those jump ball opportunities, not sure how it's a knock on Brown. Aiken to me is the guy who gets schemed open more often then not, but that's not a bad thing. I can see both Camp and Carter being a break from the tree, I just don't see a need for a break seeing as how each tree brings a different skill set imo. Honestly I see those two guy are in competition with each other. I can't see either one being relied upon as a WR only, so they'll have to contribute as ST guys. But who knows, I could be way off, that's why i'm so excited to see how this competition shakes out.

Tbh, I don't know much about Trestman outside of what he did with the Bears. So my opinions on what the offense will look like comes from that. Trestman has also spoke. Just looking at the Bears roster over the last 2 seasons, it featured those big bodies at WR. If you just look at 2013 when Trestman first took over, a guy like Devin Hester, who isn't as good a WR as Camp imo, went from having a decent role craved out with the Bears as a slot type to having no role at all in Trestman's offense. He went from being targeted 40 times in 2012 to being targeted 0 times in 2013. He was the teams primary returner that year, much like guys like Camp or Carter would be imo but no targets in the pass game. Again i'm not saying you don't keep 3 smaller guys because they are similar, it's all about how they fit into "this offense". We can talk about the big WR talk all day but at the end of the day, we really don't know what Trestman has planned. But just looking at what Trestman had in Chicago and what he has now, I don't think he's worried about being 1 dimensional. His leading targets in 2013 were Marshall, Jeffery, Bennett and Forte. None of those guys are really open field type guys, he just found creative ways to get them open and favorable match ups. He basically turned Jeffery into that all around WR, but that definitely wasn't what he was coming out of SC. He had more rushing attempts in his rookie season then he had his entire collegiate career. You mention someone taking over for Steve Smith next season but who's to say they are looking for a Steve Smith clone? I've said many times before I think Marlon Brown is that guy to take over that role moving forward and he's clearly not that same body type. I think once the preseason starts we'll have a better idea of what the Ravens offense will look like moving forward. But right now all i can see is what Trestman did with the Bears and because of that I can't see both Camp and Carter making the active roster.

why?

I have no doubt that they aren't the same type of player, I just think they'll serve the same purpose to "this team". I think the "big WR" thing is real. Over the last 2 years, Trestman only had 3 WRs listed under 6'1" Holmes, Weems and Bennett. Only Bennett in 2013 had more then 10 catches. So i'm not sure that small shifty WR is a "need", i think it'd be a great luxury to have if we already had one of those type guys established, but we don't. I definitely agree with the Carter and Smith comparison, but I don't see Carter being used as anything more then a slot guy who get the occasional deep shot. He'll be a ST guy and you pointing out his gunner potential is why I'd rank him over Camp from a ST standpoint. If they both make the roster, i can't see both being active together. You keep both these guys and only carry 6, you're talking about Trestman having 3 WRs listed 5'11" or shorter. I really can't see that happening. I know height doesn't mean everything, but I think it means a good deal to "this offense". Plus Trestman spoke about using a lot of 2TE sets to get away from the complex nickle packages. Obviously that won't be a formation the offense is in 100% of the time, but they'll be in it a good deal. So you look at Williams, Gilmore/Boyle/Pitta(not sure), Juice, Smitty, Perriman and Brown that's 6 options in the pass game not even mentioning the RBs. I just don't see a Welker like slot role in the offense because it wasn't one in Trestman's offense the last 2 years. Without that slot role being present I think that's where the comment of "he'll have to compete to get on the field" but when asked about guys like Waller and Brown, Harbs had a clear vision of what to expect from those guys this year.

so you have both Carter and Camp making the team? I can't see a case for keeping both guys to fill seemingly the same role. Agree with Waller. Harbs spoke about lining him up at TE and moving him all around the field to create matchup problems. Again it could be viewed as just coach speak but like I said before, this is the time of year when coaches start having plans on how each guy will fit into the offense. Obviously Harbs won't give away too much, but I think it doesn't take a genius to see the ways the Ravens can use the size and speed of Waller in this offense. Also i can see a really strong scenario where Aiken is not apart of this team, but ultimately I think he makes it. But i don't see him carrying over the success of last season. I think he can have that Laquan Williams thing happen where you really don't see a reason to why his role diminished to just ST and he'll be a fan favorite, but I think he's the odd man out while staying on the roster.

my connection was poor so the call was fading in and out for me, so I missed a few questions and answers. I don't recall Harbs saying that on the call, he may have spoke highly of him at another point this offseason. The couple times I heard Harbs speak of Campanaro on this call he just basically said he's a good player and the talent is there but he'll have to earn it. Even with the returner role who many seem to think Camp is a lock for, Harbs only mentioned him, along with Carter and Webb, then followed up by saying Ozzie is working on some other options. Wasn't really a ringing endorsement. I'm not saying the mood is sour on Camp, I was just pointing out that Brown draw a lot of excitement from Harbs about the prospects of a big season. I've seen many in this thread suggest that Brown has regressed and is seemingly on his way out.

Honestly I think that was the plan dating back to last season but a rough training camp kind of stopped that. Even Smitty didn't expect to have as large a role as he did last season, but Torrey starting slow and Brown not being ready focused him to be #1. I definitely think the play is to have Brown platoon with Smitty a lot this year. If Brown can put it together, i see him in that mold of a TJ Housh in that #2 spot going forward. I definitely think he'll have the same type of season he had his rookie year, maybe not as many TDs.

So listening to the teleconference with Ozzie and Harbs, I'd definitely say that Marlon Brown is as close to a lock to make this team as anyone not named Smith or Perriman. Harbs was asked about Marlon and he basically lit up with excitement over what the plans for Marlon is this year. He basically confirmed that injury was the biggest thing that stopped a huge season from Marlon last season, was happy how he finished the season and expects him to have a huge season this year. Now I know many will say well Harbs speaks with excitement about every player. However on the same call when a caller raved about the potential of Camparano, Harbs simply responded with, "we'll he'll have to earn playing time". That might not say much to anyone else, but it speaks volumes to me, simply because this is the time of year when coaches really start to lock in on where they see each player fitting in the offense. If Harbs is publicly saying he has big plans for Brown, i'm sure Trestman has probably raved about him behind closed doors. I think it's safe to say, Marlon Brown will not be the odd man out, unless he just completely tanks.

Not true at all imo. All a concentration drop is, is a player breaking the process of making the catch. Be it poor hand placement, not seeing the ball into his hands, not having the right angles etc. That's an consistency issue and that is exactly what the juggs machine helps you with. Consistency. now let me be clear, I don't think Perriman's hands are bad and I was just poking fun with the juggs machine comment. I just think his issue is a consistency issue, and i'm sure Engram will have him on the juggs machine often at the castle. I said before that I feel the consistency issues that Perriman have can be cleared up really quickly.

very true, but Perriman doesn't appear to be the type of guy who would choose to hang out on Party buses and dance with the stars instead of working to perfect his craft in the offseason. No but seriously without taking shots at Coby, Perriman seems like a really hard working no nonsense type of guy. I think he'll have a Steve Smith Sr like work ethic and that's great for this offense.

I remember when Jacoby signed here, he said his first major purchase was a juggs machine. Might not be a bad purchase for Perriman. Even though I don't think his hands are as bad as people make them out to be, he definitely could be more consistent with his catching ability. I'm glad he's signed now with nothing else to think about except being a pro.

Looking at the WR competition I'm looking at guys who may have similar roles for this offense. Of course most of my opinion comes from what I saw from the Bears the last two seasons and how that might translate here. The Ravens have a total of 9 WRs who will be fighting for a roles on this team(not Smitty). 6 of those WRs are listed at 6'2" or better. That doesn't bode well for guys like Camp, Carter nor Robinson. I only see 1 of those guys making the cut and it'll come down to who ever can be relied upon to be a return guy. I'd give the edge to Camp right now just because the coaches are familiar with him and his skill set, but I think Carter will be right on his heels from OTAs to the final cuts and if Camp misses any time with injury, it may just be over for him, regardless of the talent. The remaining 6 WRs will have a very interesting battle imo. No need to add Perriman in because we already know he already has a role. It's just a matter of how early he'll be a big contributor for the offense. That leaves Brown, Aiken, Bulter, Waller and Worthy. This battle will be one of the best we've seen imo. Brown and Waller clearly stands apart from the group with their height, but it'll take more then that to lock down a spot. I think Brown is at the top of the group right now, but he'll need a strong camp because I think all these guys will show their potential. If just comparing this to what Trestman did with the Bears, I can clearly see Brown having a big role for this team. Now of course he will have to continue to improve under the teaching of Engram and prove he can be what Trestman wants, but I think he'll be that first guy Trestman looks to be that move the chains possession guy that can make things happen after the catch. Waller is raw, but so was Brown in his rookie year and look at the production he had. The biggest thing he'll have working for him is opportunity. He'll be given chances which is the best thing any young player can ask for. I think both he and Perriman develop really quickly and contribute this year. With Aiken, Worthy and Butler, I think all those guys bring a lot of the same qualities. Big physical possession type guys, in the similar mold to Marlon Brown, without the extra couple inches. Imo Brown is an more explosive WR of the others. But of these 3 i think obviously Aiken is ahead of this class, but I think it'll be closer then many think. As good a season as Aiken had he's not as safe as people think. He definitely is in the driver seat to making this team but it's not a lock. So looking at the depth chart with an eye towards the future, I have it like this. 2015 1. Perriman 2. Smith Sr/Brown 3. Brown/Smith Sr. 4. Waller 5. Aiken 6. Camp PS: Carter and Worthy I think after about 4 weeks of the season, Sr and Brown will start to platoon as the #2 guy opposite Perriman in attempts to keep Sr fresh.

Nobody knows way any of these kids will do until they do it. A lot of what i see in Perriman that need work should be things that Engram can hash out early imo. A lot of times we look at guys who aren't as polished coming into the NFL and say oh well they'll ne dealing with NFL players now and it'll be a struggle, but we forget that Perriman will now be getting NFL coaching and working around a professional schedule. It's all football all the time. Perriman shows some great traits but he lacks consistency in a lot of areas, which is probably the most important part of being a pro in anything. Once he starts to develop muscle memory in certain areas i think he'll be a guy who can not only contribute early but really be a major factor in the offense.

My post draft expectations are for this team to be highly competitive as always, but take that next step in the regular season to not only compete for one of the top seeds but to actually lock it down. AFC Championship game will be played in Baltimore in 2016. I expect Joe to be the same old Joe but more consistent this year. I think he and Trestman will really hit it off with both having an aggressive style. I think that's the major cause to most of his inconsistency. When the offense stays aggressive, Joe is at his best and I think Trestman will be very aggressive while mixing in just enough run game to keep the defense off balance and everyone in Baltimore happy. Joe has done a great job with less talent for years and now I think he has the talent around him to really dominate this year. my biggest questions coming out of the draft is how do you find a way to keep all these talented Defensive lineman and Wide Receivers on this team. For the first time I really see where the talent of the WRs we have can all fit into this team but how. I could even see a guy like Aldrick Robinson making the team if he flashes in camp and that has as much to do with the way Flacco develops these guys. Then I look at the dline and it's amazing how Ozzie has stocked that up. I think we have 4 guys alone who could make up a dominant Dline in Williams, Timmy, Davis and Urban. But then you add in the guys who can and will rotate in. It' gonna be a great summer watching these guys compete. I think the coaches will have a lot of tough decisions.