Ravensfan23

I honestly think it's the opposite. I think so many people are looking at the increased cap space and the situation that played out with KO last year and over blowing things. Yes there is a real possibility that Wagner sets the market, but where's the evidence that there are teams willing to set that market way over the 6.7M it's at other than increased cap space? For me until proven other wise, RT just isn't a position of "great need" for any team in terms of setting the market much higher above where it is. Why because it hasn't been proven to be. We can say the market was different or the FA class was better last year, but the fact is, there were about 8-10 teams reportedly interested in not only the best RT of that FA class but arguably the best RT in all the NFL. If ever you had a chance to bet on yourself and drive your price up it's then. However not a single team was willing to match the 7M per the Browns offered him to stay. So even if he would have set the market above Bulaga's 6.7M per, it would have only been by a whopping $300,000. So we're talking about the best RT in the NFL arguably and out of the 8-10 teams reportedly interested nobody was willing to increase their offer by 300K to lock him down and i'm supposed to believe that teams now will start a bidding war for Wagner or anyone else at RT to blow the lid off the market? Now I know it's bonus money and other things tied in, but if we're talking about Wagner setting the market in terms of guaranteed money that's a different ball game because the Ravens would have a ton of flexibility. I've seen Von Miller used as a reason teams will be so desperate for RT help. Well the NFL is a knee jerk reaction league and if ever you'd overpay for the RT position it would be just weeks after watching Von Miller destroy the Panthers oline in the Super Bowl, but again no RT needy team was willing to match a 7M per year price tag for a guy who was ranked the 2nd best RT and 6th best overall tackle that season. rmw10 you know me well enough to know i'm not attacking your opinion here, but more so the report itself. I agree 100% that Wagner could and probably will set the market for RTs, but I'll have to be proven wrong with the whole blowing the lid off the market part because I just don't see it right now.

I could agree with that. But Timmy is the exact guy we'd allow to walk because the market would overpay for him. Art Jones comes to mind. I actually think Timmy can and will turn into a monster, but i do agree that his value right now is lower than the others. I think he's capable of being a every down player and a really good one. But the inconsistency factor is an big deal and as a FSU fan it's not surprising to me. Timmy could be as great as he wants to be if he improves his conditioning imo.

I'd rather lock them all up lol. But if it came down to overpaying someone to stay, it'd be CJ for me. But guys like Wagner, Williams and Timmy are those borderline Pro Bowl players who could easily be among the best of their position if they hit their prime full speed. If we can keep all 4 of those guys and they stay healthy, it'll go a long way to getting this team back to being a perennial Super Bowl contender. I think all those guys fit what the Ravens are about, both on the field and out in the community. What all of them on the field and they fit "Play Like a Raven" imo.

Everyone is talking about how deep and strong this draft class is at CB and S. I think the Ravens are more likely to save that big money if they can't sign Williams and stick with Webb at Safety while looking to attack the Safety position in the 3rd or 4th round of the draft. If Williams isn't signed, I think that money is saved for guys like CJ and Timmy who will be next in line for nice deals.

Steve Smith Sr, said Marshall reached out to him about playing with Baltimore a couple days ago, so there is certainly interest there. I think the only question is numbers. What type of deal will Marshall command. I'm going higher than 65% because much like Sr, being able to be yourself in Baltimore will be a selling point for BMarsh over some other teams who might have a better shot at winning like the Pats. Sr said Marshall would be a great fit in Baltimore because he's a playmaker. Well that's exactly what the Ravens said they needed to compete with the likes of Steelers, Bengals and Pats consistently so go make it happen.

people do every year

I honestly don' think that's a huge problem for him. Even the best Centers get overpowered by big NTs from time to time, but as a former wrestler, he uses his hands and leverage very well. Won't act as if i've seen every snap, but I've never seen him get overpowered or play off balance which is usually things that show up when you're playing with high pad level. The 22 reps don't "look good" but the bench doesn't always show how strong a guy is. Again he plays with really good leverage and balance which adds to his strength. Also he has a chance to improve that number at his pro-day. He had a really good day imo, but i also caution against expecting a prospect to be flawless. Everyone will have something to improve upon and by all reports i've seen he's a hard worker who craves coaching. I think he's a day 1 starter and could really help the Ravens, but we'll see.

Pat Elflein seems to be checking off all the necessary boxes, except the bench press which he can easily improve at his Pro day. I'm seeing a lot of 2nd round grades on him and I think he'd be a nice add for the Ravens. Also Sr looks good in his new job. Not as good as lining up at WR for the Ravens, but I think he'll be a great asset to the NFL Network.

I think he's a great fit. Vets like that are set in their ways and they like a coach that allows them to be who they are. Harbs wouldn't stop Marshall from doing media gigs, or from being outspoken in the locker room. His a high energy, high passion guy who plays with a ton of emotion much like Sr. He still has a lot left in the tank so he'd definitely be a #1. I also think he's a great fit for Perriman as well. Marshall could really help Perriman with certain facets of the game like route running, using his big frame, attack the ball, but more importantly BMarsh is a guy who also deals with drops and it'd be great for Perriman to see how he doesn't allow that to stop him from taking over a game.

I think that's true, but a conversation is certainly being had imo.

I think Wallace stays no doubt. I still think market and value wise, Britt would be a solid add and will probably be less than Garcon but i'm happy either way. With Marshall, Ozzie said it would be hard to add a player with domestic violence in his past but he didn't say they would never add that player. Marshall has been incident free for about 7 years and I'm a believer that any person can redeem themselves. In terms of the backlash, I don't think Marshall is a big enough name to really be a distraction in that area. The only reason his domestic violence past would be brought up is because the Ravens took such a hard stance against Ray and the situation all together. I think the Ravens are far enough removed from the Ray Rice incident and Marshall short term past has not only been clear, he's done enough great things off the field that the Ravens should be able to make it work. If i had a vote, i'd say bring him in.

I agree Marshall would be a strong add. But I saw the question asked this morning of........Will Marshall be the player that makes the Ravens overlook the Domestic Violence stand? BMarsh has never been convicted of DV to my knowledge but he's been involved in like 7 different instances where he's been arrested for violence against a women. So this is not to say he's guilty of it but where there is a smoke, fire is certainly present. I think the Ravens have to have a real conversation about the stance on Domestic Violence in terms of Marshall because if they sign him I think the Ray Rice situation will certainly be revisited and you don't want that to be a distraction.

Teams have been looking for a second pass rusher since the turn of the century. Just look at the Ravens as an example, how long have they been looking for a bookend to pair up with Suggs. Being able to get Doom was a rarity. Teams just don't allow great pass rushers to hit the market and you'll only find maybe 1 or 2 in each draft. So while teams are looking for them, the supply of great pass rusher just aren't there. As for Miller. Dominant pass rushers have been rushing from the right side for years. Miller isn't starting something new or bucking a trend. Watch any highlight tape of Matthews or Watt you'll see them rush from the right side often. Guys like Charles Johnson and Cam Wake pretty much rush from the right side exclusively, so I don't think QBs getting pressured from the right side will place anymore value on RT then it has been in previous years. Teams have always wanted to have bookend rushers. The issue is, it's rare to have two dominant rusher on one team. So until that consistently starts to happening, I don't think much will change with the RT position. If you have a really good one, hold on to him. If you don't find a way to make it work, but I doubt we start seeing mega contracts in FA and RT only prospects getting drafted high because there are a handful of dominate pass rusher that teams want to attack the right side of the line with. There is no doubt that RTs will start to get paid more, it's natural that with more money for teams to spend higher contract values will follow. However that doesn't mean teams will get crazy for the RT position. Much like the stock market, the NFL FA market will eventually correct itself. RTs will start getting paid more, but that just means every other position will get paid more as well. So that position will still be one of the lowest paid on the Oline.

While teams having more money means they can offer more, there is still a market value that is set for each position. Right Tackle is just not the type of position to see the market set much higher then it's previous year. Just take Mitchell Schwartz last year for example. Here's a snippet from an article last year. So basically what happened in that situation was that Schwartz people got greedy and turned down a better offer because just like your thinking, they felt it was more money to be had in the market. Turns out teams just don't really value the RT position as much. Even though there were several teams interested there was no bidding war because people don't shell big money out to that position, especially for a RT only. I'm willing to bet that much like Schwartz, Wagner's crew will find that the competitive offer the Ravens had is either the best they'll find or it's gonna be so competitive to other teams that it'll probably be best for Wagner to stay put. Of course you might be right because some teams do crazy things with lots of money to spend. But 8Mil per would be an explosion for the RT market and I don't see it happening. Max is 7Mil I think.

Yea i know. I was agreeing with you Not sure how popular of a pick he is right now, but I currently have the Ravens taking Fabian Moreau in the 2nd round. But that'll probably change in the coming days with the combine

This is one of the biggest things at Safety for me. You can have all the talent in the world but when you have veteran QBs on the opposite side, you need that smart Safety as the QB of the defense. I think Webb can still get it done for the 17' season or at least to start it, but having that young pup nipping at him would be a win win for everyone.

I'd rather stick with Webb for another year, add young guy like Jordan Poyer who could be the 3rd safety and compete to push Webb and also draft a guy like Lorenzo Jerome on day 3.

I think the key is separating the LT position from the RT position. Guards don't usually get paid as much as LTs but RT tackles just don't get big deals. Now if Wagner was an option at LT than maybe I could see that big payday that many others do. But I just don't see it. He'll be among the highest paid RTs no doubt but I don't think that number goes higher than 7M per year and 16M guaranteed at signing. Those numbers wouldn't even place Wagner among top 10 LT contracts. So if Wagner gets LT money, i'd be really surprised.

I may be too optimistic, I just can't see a RT only getting huge money. Even if Wagner sets the market it won't be much higher than Schwartz at 6.6M per and 15M guaranteed at signing. I also think Wagner will sign a cap friendly deal as well.

I think the biggest difference with KO is that Oak signed him to be their long term LT, which he'll move into that role this year. Wagner is a RT only. Now that doesn't mean some team won't throw crazy money at him, i just don't see it. But until his name is signed we just don't know. I don't know what Lewis can do at RT either. I don't think anyone does. I just know that Wagner is probably the best RT we've had outside of Yanda who isn't an option. We need keep him and allow this young oline to grow together. The only change i want to see is Mangold at Center. I think he'd do for Lewis what Yanda did for Stanley towards the end of the season last year.

The Ravens need to follow suit. I'd much rather go younger and faster at the CB position. We've had some success with older vets and we've been screwed by some as well, but I'd rather draft that position and look for guys to step up. Both Price and Canady had strong moments last year. Tavon should definitely take the next step.

I would have no issue with 7M either. Don't think that 1.5M will make much of a difference if Wagner's people insist on it, I think the key will be that guaranteed money. If the Ravens are willing to go anywhere above 18.5M I think Wagner stays. Just don't think he's the make me the highest paid type. I think the Ravens would like to keep the guaranteed money between 14-17M and Wagner's people will aim for the 20M Schwartz got last year. Wagner might end up signing for less with the Ravens just because I don't see the market going crazy for him. Marcus Cannon just got a 5yr 32.4M deal with 6.4 average and 14.5 guaranteed for the Pats. By comparison Cannon has played both the Left and Right side, as well as Guard for the Pats and he was rated among the top RT last year. Wagner is a RT only and while he's really important to what the Ravens want to do, his position isn't viewed as a priority position for most teams. Now I believe Wagner outside of 2015 has been among the better RTs in the NFL and I think the Ravens will see it that way to. But I don't think the Ravens or anyone else will see Wagner anywhere near the 10M per that NFL.com said earlier this month and because of that no offer Wagner gets will be that far off of what the Ravens are offering and he stays.

I don't really think it will. Although it's the oline, Guard and Tackles are two very different positions in terms of compensation. I think Wagner's price has always been between 6M and 7M per year. The Ravens probably offered Wagner around 4yr 24.5Mil and Wagner's people probably feel he can get close to 35Mil over 5yrs. I wouldn't be surprised to see both Wagner and Juice signed next week at the combine. Once Wagner's agent gets around other teams and gets a sense of what his client is really worth, he and the Ravens will go back to the table. Wagner's agent will probably find out that Right Tackles just don't get paid like that regardless of the huge cap space some teams have. Wagner will probably get a handful of offers but none will be much higher than the 6.6M that Schwartz got last year imo. I could see some team going to 7M for Wagner but I'm not sure that'll be enough to get him to leave Baltimore. I think the biggest issue will be the bonus money. Schwartz set the market at 20.7M guaranteed last year. Will the Ravens be willing to approach that number? My guess on Wagner is that he stays and gets a 5yr 33.5M

I think he just made a mistake. Kiper's name is so common when talking about the draft that i think he just wrote Kiper but meant Mayock.

I agree with this. Right now i'm going between Cook and Barnett as the 16th pick. Cook would do wonders for this offense. This might not be a popular thought but the Ravens structure their team a lot like the Steelers do. If Cook is there i promise you everyone inside the Ravens war room will be thinking about the impact that Bell has in that Steelers offense. Cook is a homerun hitter in every since of the word and would really open the Ravens offense up. I don't think he's a work horse nor should he be. Cook and Dixon would be a great 1-2 punch. 10-15 carries per game for those guys would provide a night thunder and lighting style of running to this offense. Then of course that would just open up the play action game for guys like Perriman and Moore on the outside. The offense will operate off the run game and be built through the TEs. Having a guy like Cook who the defense will have to respect every play would be huge. Same goes for Fournette. I think Barnett might just be the best pass rusher in this draft. He's a complete edge player and reminds me so much of Suggs coming to the Ravens from ASU. I don't think he'll test well as the combine and slide down the board as a result. There are some that don't like him and feel his production won't translate to the NFL but I don't share those concerns. I think he comes in day 1 and starts on the opposite of Suggs, learning the Ravens Way from Suggs before taking over as the top dog in 2018. He's the type of pass rusher that will make other guys better because he'll command double teams and for olines to account for him. The same way the Ravens were able to quickly replace Ray in the middle with CJ, I think they're able to replace Suggs with Barnett. He's gonna be a nightmare for QBs, I just hope he does it in a Ravens uniform.